Chess - Game Thread [Concluded]

[Fredwood]

Yea, never gonna use the term lock clear anymore. At times I think I just said it to sell a point I saw as very towny... rip me I guess on that front, and well learned.

Regarding Monty: I didnt like Monty D1 thats true. But now that Zack has flipped this looks alot better in my eyes... He is not locked by any means, except chox (and I guess pizza, cuz that would be some srsly disgusting play if he was ^^) noone is. Having now reached well into D2 in my reread I've gotten concerned again because he has GH/Zack as 'only one of them can be mafia, they are never partners' or somesuch.... and then goes after GH over Zack even though he sussed Zack on D1 rather strongly.. at this point I'm just trying to make an ordered list of ppl from least scummy to most scummy and hope to get ppl to vote with me on the most scummy ppl. There arent any obvious slam dunk scum cases for anyone around, at least not that I can see so I have to deal in shades of grey and obviously figuring this it out is hard. Which is to no suprise since anyone on me is wrong and outside of that no one seems to be sure about much so yea. Maybe me bringing up town points on ppl I prev looks scummy looks bad from youru perspective or the other way around but I'm not going to tunnel any read at this juncture...

Regarding Winston: iirc I even said in the post where I put him as one of my top points that pizza's case on him was good so I'm good with the read... and before pizza made that case I even said that I'm still pretty null on Winston if I'm not mistaken... can't look it up rn because I want to be through with my reread before the day is over (obviously) and I have to still do some grocery shopping + EoD/night is coming up in game I'm hosting so yea..

This is where he addresses all 3. With Monty he just says he changed his mind on his suss of him, but he never really progressed that much on him leading up to yesterday when he lock cleared Monty. Which again, is part of the lock clearing problem, but he also used the F5 phrasing which was clunky.

[Askthepizzaguy]

This is where he addresses all 3. With Monty he just says he changed his mind on his suss of him, but he never really progressed that much on him leading up to yesterday when he lock cleared Monty. Which again, is part of the lock clearing problem, but he also used the F5 phrasing which was clunky.

There needs to be an adequate progression from null to lock clear, or even if Monty was suspect.

Instead it appears more like pocketing Monty.

[Fredwood]

There needs to be an adequate progression from null to lock clear, or even if Monty was suspect.

Instead it appears more like pocketing Monty.

Yeah this is what I said at the time, it felt more like appeasing a WIM Monty then a legitimate read. It's why I keep nitpicking his Monty read to death to the detriment of the thread I think. Day 1 where Monty suggest the Tie, Slaan pounces the fuck out of him for it, but with little difference in the game state wrt Monty he final 5's him during day 4.

[Fredwood]

Either way I think a town Slaan just accepts the lynch and scum or town Csargo pushes the Slaan lynch.

The interesting thing is that they're both pushing Xia. I mean Monty is contesting the read as well so (shrug)

[Montmorency]

Before you proceed, listen here.

I am lovers with @Csargo. He can confirm. We have been lovers from the start; if one of us dies, we both die.

Choxorn assigned me a protect last round, which I used on him overnight. @Choxorn can confirm.

This, among other reasons, was why I strongly opposed your crumbing case on Slaan, and why you don't push Csargo: 3x+ Inventor* and Mafia with 1x strongman. You don't add a Mafia lover to that setup. Lynch Csargo and you lose two townies, and the only toss-up there is that you won't lose a round with an even number of players.

*We don't need to know unless Choxorn wants us to

[Csargo]

Before you proceed, listen here.

I am lovers with @Csargo. He can confirm. We have been lovers from the start; if one of us dies, we both die.

Choxorn assigned me a protect last round, which I used on him overnight. @Choxorn can confirm.

This, among other reasons, was why I strongly opposed your crumbing case on Slaan, and why you don't push Csargo: 3x+ Inventor* and Mafia with 1x strongman. You don't add a Mafia lover to that setup. Lynch Csargo and you lose two townies, and the only toss-up there is that you won't lose a round with an even number of players.

*We don't need to know unless Choxorn wants us to

Can confirm, am Monty's lover

[Csargo]

I think we broke him Monty...

[Askthepizzaguy]

Before you proceed, listen here.

I am lovers with @Csargo. He can confirm. We have been lovers from the start; if one of us dies, we both die.

Choxorn assigned me a protect last round, which I used on him overnight. @Choxorn can confirm.

This, among other reasons, was why I strongly opposed your crumbing case on Slaan, and why you don't push Csargo: 3x+ Inventor* and Mafia with 1x strongman. You don't add a Mafia lover to that setup. Lynch Csargo and you lose two townies, and the only toss-up there is that you won't lose a round with an even number of players.

*We don't need to know unless Choxorn wants us to

Lovers or Masons?

Lovers can be guilty-innocent.

[Montmorency]

Lovers or Masons?

Lovers can be guilty-innocent.

Look at what we know about game mechanics.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Look at what we know about game mechanics.

You and the Csargo form a symbiant circle. What vig shot lands on one of you will affect the other.

Hmm.

I think that weakens town if he's mafia. Gives them an extra kill if the scum dies.... but then again, makes it even more likely a vig shot will kill a mafia.

But I'd still like to know if you guys actually know each other is town, or if you're just told the other dies when you do and that you're lovers.

That's an important clarification.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Monty, Csargo, do you know mechanically that the other is town or not?

[Slaan]

Now I got a question: Isnt a lover pair of town/mafia considered 3p here that only wins together and not with their respective alignments? That how it works where I'm from

[Montmorency]

Uhm, why wouldnt there be mafia lover in that setup? It seems highly likely to me from the simple that fact that the rules state 'There is no cult', not 'there is no 3p' which town/mafia lovers are essentially.

Think about the game balance.

We know Choxorn is an inventor with at least 1x Vig and 2x Doctor/protect. We know the Mafia had 1x Strongman. Without speculating on roles for the final Mafia, which is almost certainly not a killing role at this point, attaching one of four scum to a lover is a serious handicap.

Monty, Csargo, do you know mechanically that the other is town or not?

It is not host-confirmed.

[Csargo]

Monty, Csargo, do you know mechanically that the other is town or not?

No it doesn't specifically say he's town. It says blah blah blah town lover.

[Csargo]

Lovers or Masons?

Lovers can be guilty-innocent.

We're lovers.

[Slaan]

Before you proceed, listen here.

I am lovers with @Csargo. He can confirm. We have been lovers from the start; if one of us dies, we both die.

Choxorn assigned me a protect last round, which I used on him overnight. @Choxorn can confirm.

This, among other reasons, was why I strongly opposed your crumbing case on Slaan, and why you don't push Csargo: 3x+ Inventor* and Mafia with 1x strongman. You don't add a Mafia lover to that setup. Lynch Csargo and you lose two townies, and the only toss-up there is that you won't lose a round with an even number of players.

*We don't need to know unless Choxorn wants us to

Uhm, why wouldnt there be mafia lover in that setup? It seems highly likely to me from the simple that fact that the rules state 'There is no cult', not 'there is no 3p' which town/mafia lovers are essentially.

[Choxorn]

Before you proceed, listen here.

I am lovers with @Csargo. He can confirm. We have been lovers from the start; if one of us dies, we both die.

Choxorn assigned me a protect last round, which I used on him overnight. @Choxorn can confirm.

This, among other reasons, was why I strongly opposed your crumbing case on Slaan, and why you don't push Csargo: 3x+ Inventor* and Mafia with 1x strongman. You don't add a Mafia lover to that setup. Lynch Csargo and you lose two townies, and the only toss-up there is that you won't lose a round with an even number of players.

*We don't need to know unless Choxorn wants us to

Can confirm, gave Monty a protection N3.