Mass Effect 17er [Game Thread]

[Cuthillius]

I guess the main issue I would have with the prior is that... I'd lowkey expect a town!GH to be more ready to meme first and ease into the thread more slowly, I suppose? As in to not tryhard, especially how the extremely high expectations were put on him in the team game that just ended; I know that's not necessarily the case though, because different situations and stuff that I might not be accounting for!!

I am so relieved that team game ended earlier today as a note, as it would have been so awkward to think about this stuff without that game!!!

I do think that he played up the "high expectations" a ton, while he absolutely does have a Reputation it was more a defense against "we know we're not going to survive that long so let's try to dunk on as many villagers as we can first and oh damn people are catching on". So while there's a grain of truth in there, I don't think that the specifics of this read hold up entirely? That said it is somewhat more aggressive than I'd expect, though I could see that coming from either side, so shrug.

[Cuthillius]

eph
sunbae
dolby
ara

lettuce alliance

I like your reads, so I'll ignore you posting the otter after what you said last game and v-read you, ok?

pls let me in

[Cuthillius]

Vote: Ephemeral

Trust him the least, by far, out of the consensus core/alliance/whatever have you that seems to be forming in the general [Ephemeral/Hally/Ara] triad that's dominated the last hour or so. His posts are too blendy for my liking, don't think he's done anything remotely townie, kinda reminds me of some of his scum games (in mashes especially) where he's just kind of looked good on surface level and skated by and that's been good enough for a lot of people's first passes (and in mashes, first passes are a lot of the times all that's happened). Notably, I do not have this issue with Hally or Ara and think that both of them have posted well enough so far in terms of solving sentiment + general townie thoughts etc where I don't see myself seriously considering either of them today.

As for Dolby, I've been kind of tossing his posts around in my head for the past hour+ and I do agree with the sentiment that others have expressed that his sort of doubling down is townie, but I also thought his one take on exactly me where he went with the super surface-level read of my posts reminding him of my hyperaggressive approach in the just-finished teamgame was, well, super surface-level.

This is not an incorrect take, but it's, like, worst case scenario in my head? The conclusion is reasonable based on the logic but I... don't think it follows naturally and I'm not a huge fan of the reads.

I'm actively trying to make sure I don't just v-read eph for having more WIM and obvious thought ITT than the last few games, but I do actually think he's been villagery independently of that and it's not quite his default mode as a wolf, which I think he'd tend towards more in this sort of list.

[Cuthillius]

looooool

it’s not my fault he always rands wolf

This is the cherry on top of Hally's push on GH in terms of how good it looks for them.

[Cuthillius]

There is also a post from Montmorency where they ended with "4 mafia among us" and i wanted to reply to and quote that part but then repeating the phrase in various colors to emphasize that I think it reads as awkward and therefore mafia(not because it's mafia indicative but more because I've arbitrarily deemed it so) but since I have already screwed up posting a picture I don't feel like attempting and failing at this task so instead I've opted to describe it using 70 more words than necessary.



Now everyone knows i'm an eagles fan but I'd just like to give it up to the Dallas Cowboys. I know in the past I've hated them but I think they've really shown something admirable this past season and I just wish that my Eagles could show the same grit.




Now let me talk to you about the transatlantic pipeline and how it affects the migratory herding of the Sudanese mountain goat. Now let me explain the previous statement. People are going to skim this and think it is GH because of the avatar similarity. It tickles me to think that someone will skim this, read the above paragraph because I've spaced it out far from the others so the eye naturally catches it, and just the idea that for a brief moment someone will think this is GH praising the Dallas Cowboys tickles me to no end. What does this have to do with the first sentence of this paragraph you may ask? Why would anyone want to keep reading after that sentence and the fact that the first and last paragraphs are long enough for people to not read, prolongs the chance that people will keep thinking it is GH.
'

haha you fool I started on the third paragraph

i'd Actually be v-reading gh if he was posting from both accounts

[Cuthillius]

that's definitely towny considering wolf fatigue tho lol

Wolf!GH, from my limited experience, tends to double down on the stuff he knows he's good at-- making reasonable posts and cases and generating reads, rather than just flipping over into shiptoasting. To put it a different way, I think his lackingness as a wolf and a villager exist on two different axes, which isn't always the case for people.

[Cuthillius]

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

I reread Ephemeral's posts. While I get Hally's point that his points w/r/t Manti and Dolby aren't as blendy as I thought earlier, they still just don't feel particularly townie to me. They didn't jump out at me (in a good way) when I was following along live last night in the flow like the posts of certain others such as Ara, Esooa, and Hally, and they're kind of a big meh for me now looking back as well. They could be correct, sure, and they could also come from town, but that's as far as I'm willing to go and I don't think he should be picking up as many townreads as he has given his output. Don't really feel the need to move my vote atm (was this 70 words too many?).

The "home Orgahs" - Monty, Csargo, (kinda) Visor: It's too early to tell with all of them imo. I could lie and say that I have a slight inclination in one direction or the other with Monty's posts, but really I just need a little bit more time and content from them. I think I'll be able to get there on the former two eventually and would prefer to keep them around past D1 for that reason. Visor, let's be real, I'm probably not going there anyway, so there's not much point in discussing this. He's seemed ~ok. I liked the steamed hams exchange with Amy but thought he'd end up in a different direction with it rather than just finishing the reference. I felt it would have been more natural for Visor to suspect Amy a little bit there but he just kind of wrote it off. Maybe it's still just early D1, who knows.

Don't really have an opinion on Amy or dya yet. Sunbae's vote on dya seemed decent enough in the moment, but I think it was just a vote more than anything indicative. Dolby, still thinking about, no new content since last night so that read's kind of spinning its wheels right now.

I guess overall I'm at around:

[Hally/Esooa/Ara]
[Pzelda]

[Sunbae, kinda?]
[everyone else]
[Dolby/Ephemeral]

But I'm not really ready to go to war over any of these reads save for maybe the top 3/4. Everyone else is clustered right around the null/idk zone.

i actually thought this was ColonelLubriderm posting smh

[Cuthillius]

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

visor’s interactions with amy felt off

particularly the v read on amy felt undeserved given i don’t think amy’s entrance was villagery at all and i don’t get how visor got there. as i was reading it felt like he was building up to a wolf read but then decided to reverse course once amy v read him. makes me feel like he wanted to throw shade on amy but then decided to go for a pocket instead once he saw amy was the only person v reading him so far

it reminds me of something he said in rocks inv about how newcomb v read lissa and amy early because they’re the kind of villagers you wanna get in on the ground floor with as a wolf. something like that they tend to make themselves obv as villagers and are easy pockets so if you v read them early you can pocket them and not lose much since they probably won’t get mislimed anyway (or that’s how i understood it at least)

buuuuut i also didn’t like amy’s posts either and am not sure they make sense as w/w. if they’re v/v i never made this post

i

didn't read that as visor saying amy was v?

[ColonelLubriderm]

all good, I'm binging money heist and its gotten me sleep deprived so I'll probably be pretty inconsistent with my response time too :p

Talk to me about manti

And I'd appreciate more on Dolby because I really don't see what you're seeing there

im also binging money heist, on season 2 episode 4

[Maple]

Vote: cuthalion

[Maple]

im also binging money heist, on season 2 episode 4

I intend on watching that at some point, haven't gotten to it yet

[Sunbae]

I think I misunderstood the Visor/Ampharos interaction because I see multiple people speaking as if Visor gave Ampharos a town read when I read it as Visor just finishing a meme while saying her read is correct. A few me-centered comments would be that:

1.) Apologies to Dya. I thought it was a hype-remodel that was happening while you were exhausted and not the thing that was causing your exhaustion.

2.) I felt like I wrote the most words on GH - including the most skepticism - and seeing him just skip over a read on me while reading everyone else that talked about him felt weird at first but after thinking about it I thought it was villagery for him specifically. Last game we played he spent a fair amount of time trying to talk me off my wolf read of him/explain how my take made sense but was mistaken whereas this time he just shrugged and focused on more interesting things. I think the way he was approaching me as a wolf last game while trying - successfully right before getting outed! - to engage me in depth on it feels pretty different to this one.

3.) On a similar note I feel as if Ampharos discrediting town reads of me because I can just be saying things nicely is very different to our interactions in the last game where she just didn't really worry about me/how others were talking about me. I don't necessarily think it's scummy. I'm more just expressing confusion on that take because I thought we worked pretty well last game (I especially thought out Alette conversations were really helpful) so I'm unsure why there's a shift there.

4.) I have mild concerns about Visor because I am not used to him giving me villa reads easily/early and I think his knowledge of how much I'd enjoy getting to townbro out with him makes me a pretty good pocket attempt for him. I mean last game he mentioned how he kept trying to find ways I could be a wolf because he thought (correctly!) that if I randed scum I'd be really amped up for it and wanting to do well after losing the last couple of these games as scum. So seeing him throw a bit of shade at Ampharos for not wanting to townread me (the mildly snarky "too early for villagers to be reading villagers correctly" post directed at her after she expressed concern about my being town read) felt really weird to me. These concerns are not that strong and it's possible I'm just overrating the previous game dynamics, but it's what I thought.

I'll try to refrain from doing too many more me-centric postings but I thought these were all somewhat noteworthy


brain not found

[Sunbae]

I've got pZelda as my most likely town at the moment

[Cuthillius]

The "amusingly self-deprecating" tier:

Cuthillius

The "seems very villagery and if so will be painfully obvious by EoD2 at the latest" tier:

Esooa
Hally
Sunbae

The "feel familiarly villagery in a way that makes me happy but isn't actually very coherent in my mind" tier:

Arapocalypse
Ephemeral

The "makes me question if I have a microchip implanted in my mind to sponge thoughts from my future self so he can pocket me" tier:

Visor

The "my friends are v-reading him so I feel like I should too" tier:

Dolby

The "if they're wolves they're doing a great job of hiding it, but the same applies to them if v" tier:

Csargo
Montmorency
pzelda
Manasi
ColonelLubriderm
dyachei
Maple

The "prepare to be spitroasted" tier:

GeneralHankerchief
Ampharos

[Cuthillius]

Vote: cuthalion

use the avatar i made for you you goon

[Arapocalypse]

My apologies I may have nearly forgotten about the game; catching up, will not be here until EoD though!!!


Have a meme in the meantime:

[Cuthillius]

My apologies I may have nearly forgotten about the game; catching up, will not be here until EoD though!!!


Have a meme in the meantime:

I've never seen an image more accurately describe Low Effort Invitational.

[Cuthillius]

vote: Ampharos

[ColonelLubriderm]

0-1 mafia:
hally
dolby


0-2 mafia
sunbae
gh
visor
cuth

1-4 mafia
ephemeral
pzelda
maple
arapocalypse
esooa

2-4 mafia
dyachei
ampharos
csargo
montmorency
manasi

[Sunbae]

Vote: Csargo

I think some of their posting has been a bit awkward in its construction.

I just remember him yeeting khaan for a similar sort of read from what I remember, something along those lines. This is a lot more tame in comparison and from 3+ years ago. That's basically how I remember it.

Is the most notable example. The "i just remember thing from what I remember" section reads to me like they were looking to add a qualifier and ended up getting turned around and added it twice.

I also thought the repetitive usage of the word "weird" as a qualifier a few times in a short span about GH's postings was, well, weird in a "wanted to shade the person getting a bit of heat without actually calling them out hard" way.

This read is thin, I know.

[Arapocalypse]

I did not realize Maple already had 2 votes on him already, I thought I was being unique!!!!!

Thanks Ephemeral for the thoughts on Hally; that's mostly what I thought it was, was mostly just wondering if I'd missed anything for them being at the tom!!

Wow, is the solving bar for me really that low, GH? :P

The dyachei push feels boring with them having left so early and actually having a traditional sleeping schedule!!!

I do not have rocks in my brain, more like... lava!!!!!! Hot, bubbling lava!!!!! That being said, Amy's entrance to the thread seems... okay? #letSunbaehavetownreads2k21!!!!! (Yes I have acknowledged that I'm being pocketed regardless of his alignment, no I don't care right now because it is warm and cozy in here, and it's -93 outside!!!)

Visor is, hmm...

pzelda is Capage? I'm shrug about him but may dig up my Capage metaread as that was halfway decent; I don't really get why people are townreading him? Feels sort of overdefensive in a few places that is sort of ???

Liking generally Hally's flow of stuff, Ephemeral has been okay!!!!

GH/Bop are [redacted]!!! I've been staring at #449 for a few minutes now though and I feel like I should have thoughts on this, but just don't? Weird things; think I'm leaning towards not liking it, but Hally's post was good!!

What on earth am I missing on Capage!!!!!!!!!!! Someone here is the problem, and I feel like it's me!!!!

[ColonelLubriderm]

here is what my list would look like in a quantum snapshot:

VV
hally
dolby

V
hally
dolby
sunbae
cuth
visor
gh
ephemeral

?
sunbae
cuth
visor
gh
ephemeral
pzelda
maple
arapocalypse
esooa
dyachei
ampharos
csargo
montmorency
manasi

W
pzelda
maple
manasi
montmorency
csargo
dyachei
arapocalypse
ampharos

[Ampharos]

the townread on visor was primarily because i think he was wolfreading me for a not entirely absurd reason, and that i thought he was treating this read with about exactly the level of casualness that i expected out of a visorslash read on the first night of the game

I'm a little surprised that the steamed hams exchange was the end of it but i DID go to bed right after that so shrug

[Arapocalypse]

I do think that he played up the "high expectations" a ton, while he absolutely does have a Reputation it was more a defense against "we know we're not going to survive that long so let's try to dunk on as many villagers as we can first and oh damn people are catching on". So while there's a grain of truth in there, I don't think that the specifics of this read hold up entirely? That said it is somewhat more aggressive than I'd expect, though I could see that coming from either side, so shrug.

Yeah no, I realized that it was being overplayed a bit, which is usually the case in team mafia anyway; I was moreso referring to that pile-on him that happened at SoD 2!!!!!

(Which I still find to be overly !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!)

Anyways I have to actually ISO him now because I got half of his/Bop's posts mixed up and now I have no idea!!!!

[Ampharos]

vote: Ampharos

spitroast me if you dare, bird boy

[ColonelLubriderm]

Yeah no, I realized that it was being overplayed a bit, which is usually the case in team mafia anyway; I was moreso referring to that pile-on him that happened at SoD 2!!!!!

(Which I still find to be overly !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!)

Anyways I have to actually ISO him now because I got half of his/Bop's posts mixed up and now I have no idea!!!!

mine are the towny ones

[GeneralHankerchief]

re: Capage/pzelda reads:

The last two specific games I was in with him, he was mafia in both:
- Generic Fantasy Mafia (as pzelda, December 2019, the .Org)
- Red John Mafia (as Capage (I was hypnotoad), September 2020, CFC section of MU)

Note that I haven't iso'd him in those games myself today, but from memory his posting here is noticeably better than in the two I linked where I feel pretty good about him.

[Sunbae]

Oh, that's two lists in a row with pZelda down pretty low so let me try and vibe check this one:

I think pZelda has been thinking about the game in a way that makes it extremely likely to be town. Their comments are not just talking the surface level of whats being said but rather are using what's being said, critically thinking about them, and applying them to different situations in a way that scum just rarely do. My largest example is this one:

Dya made this post:

i'm not sure. I wish I could stay up late like other people but I can't

I feel like i missed so much threadflow overnight and the only one consistently posting through the day is GH

i thought sunbae was a little weird

and pZelda responded with this:

This isn't really a post abou Dya, but them mentioning the word flow got me thinking about GH's read on Eph. The thing is that Eph's posts feel good enough for me to put him in town, but there's also GH's case, which is fairly compelling. And flow is what possibly makes Eph scum. He's only reacting to the flow, asking questions and such and I haven't seen any conclusions or independent solving from him. He's active but I lack posts, in which he would go back and evaluate players. That kinda removes him from my town.

I think the way they read dya's post, see her talking about threadflow, and then take off in a different direction with the threadflow concept to talk about two entirely different people and adjust reads is a progression that scum rarely do. It requires a player to actually to be thinking about the game and how different threads connect which I've found town to be doing way more often whereas scum will be keeping the responses more narrowly focused on the people making the comment to who the people making the comment are discussing.


Secondly, I think pZelda has also show fluidity in their reads. In the already given example they are using the threadflow dya mentioned to understand GH's case better and remove Ephemeral from the towncore after putting him there earlier. There are other examples like how they went from "don't like sunbae's post about being out of the wolf rage" into liking me for my dya vote.

Anyways, I feel rather good about this one but see that others have pZelda lower so seems like a good spot to discuss it.

[Arapocalypse]

Vote: pzelda

Does anyone want to talk about why they townread this guy please?! There are about fifty zillion townreads of him in the thread and I seem to be missing the memo, as usual!!

He has given takes on things and such, that I don't find overly towny necessarily; felt a bit more like he was more !!!!!!!!!! about the stuff on him versus reads and things in a way that felt overly self-conscious in a way that I didn't like!!!!

[Ampharos]

mine are the towny ones

tbh this is a very odd officers' academy you've all graduated from