Casual 9er Game Thread

[nebjiamn]

sometimes it can feel a bit cliquey when its a bunch of people that play with each other all the time and you're coming in once in a blue moon, so when you get pushed a lot you have this lingering thought like "would this be happening if i was part of the normal turbo crew", at least thats what happens to me sometimes. so i totally get it

I mentioned to Zack earlier that I think ppl have unreal expectations of KGPs when they play in a format they rarely/seldomly play in that they expect you to match the activity level they have projected onto you which manifested itself from how excited they are to be playing with you, and if/when you don’t match that level of activity/hype, it’s cause you probably randed wolf and aren’t just chilling as a villager

my best guess

[EnderWiggin]

Why Monty?

Idk guv felt towny.

[nebjiamn]

I think the vulgard interaction was a softball to just look like they were trying to figure out vulgards alignment and backed off as soon as that checkbox was checked

i think their entire take on me - from initial push, to holding firm in their read on me for things they were calling others villagers for, to backing off because "im calling strong players wolfy" while also hedging on it like "or maybe its some 500iq strategy to get the thread to think he's wolfy, push strong villagers, and get us all to think he's villagery because a wolf wouldnt do that!" - just isn't someone who is wondering if good friend sunbae randed wolf or not and is instead someone that wants to just ride the momentum on me.

i think their posts are also projecting wolfy mindframes that seep into post when wolfing (either because it's what they are doing or because they think it's villagery to be saying that even when its not)

This is about hally right

[EnderWiggin]

the sassy "wolfy pop in hehehehe" after the unexplained vote just rustled my jimmies after getting railroaded for no real reason as soon as the game started in the two turbos i played this week after not playing any mafia for months (one of which ended right before your push)

i just want to play more relaxed and not get my bum relentlessly roasted for not tryharding

you normally this trolly as town? it's reminding me of how you played the sorc game

That's fair.

I direct you to any of the other town games I've had recently where Hally herself has noted that I have been killed early due to my general low-seriousness I've been putting out.

[Hally]

I think the vulgard interaction was a softball to just look like they were trying to figure out vulgards alignment and backed off as soon as that checkbox was checked

i mean, what am i supposed to do when i ask someone a few basic questions and they straight up don’t know how to answer any of them? again, it just didn’t seem productive to keep hounding him at that moment

i think their entire take on me - from initial push, to holding firm in their read on me for things they were calling others villagers for, to backing off because "im calling strong players wolfy" while also hedging on it like "or maybe its some 500iq strategy to get the thread to think he's wolfy, push strong villagers, and get us all to think he's villagery because a wolf wouldnt do that!" - just isn't someone who is wondering if good friend sunbae randed wolf or not and is instead someone that wants to just ride the momentum on me.

i think you interpret the bolded as being more serious than it was and want to make it clear i’m currently leaning v on you

also, i was the first person to give any sort of town read on you and stop the momentum going against you. me making that post about how your approach seemed weird as a wolf is what prompted people to talk about other things, so if anything i did the opposite of riding it out.

i think their posts are also projecting wolfy mindframes that seep into post when wolfing (either because it's what they are doing or because they think it's villagery to be saying that even when its not)

idk what this is referring to

[EnderWiggin]

how is that alignment-indicative?

Pointing out a LHF is a LHF and why isn't usually pro-active work that wolves do.

That being said it's not a strong reason and I can't promise it sticks.

But it is what it is.

[Hally]

i dont have an issue with you?

i just am playing werewoofs and dont think you're a villager so far

i meant your issue with my posts, not me personally

[EnderWiggin]

I mentioned to Zack earlier that I think ppl have unreal expectations of KGPs when they play in a format they rarely/seldomly play in that they expect you to match the activity level they have projected onto you which manifested itself from how excited they are to be playing with you, and if/when you don’t match that level of activity/hype, it’s cause you probably randed wolf and aren’t just chilling as a villager

my best guess

I have a huge problem with people who think great villager players playing lowkey means they're wolf. It's just annoying and hardly representative of true player-state usually.

[Zack]

not really seeing sunbae's agenda here if wolf. he would have to be like, intentionally digging himself into a hole and denying himself easy outs out of pure stubbornness which seems like an odd way to go about it

[Hally]

not really seeing sunbae's agenda here if wolf. he would have to be like, intentionally digging himself into a hole and denying himself easy outs out of pure stubbornness which seems like an odd way to go about it

i agree

[Sunbae]

So I'll try to organize it better:

With you, I saw you wolf read Hally. I had independently wolf read Hally. I thought "Oh, this is a good time to vibe with Zack" and asked if you wanted to talk about your stuff to see if we were noticing the same things. You brushed it off and I went ahead and gave my takes. That was the extend of our interaction there and I made a mental note of it. We've bounced ideas off each other before but that doesn't necessarily mean much.

Later, Benneh expressed a wolf read on me for memeing too long and followed it up with a villa read on you. I made the mental note of this too because, well, wolfreading me for memeing is a bit odd. I recognized that the thread consensus on me was kind of unhappy with my posting so far and there were quite a few people that expressed suspicions on me. So seeing specifically you and benneh not really doing much to try and work/vibe/clearup with me in that game state made me say "huh, that's odd. Wonder why". I looked at Benneh's defense of you - specifically for me trying to pocket you - and wondered if it could be a thing where you randed wolves together. That would explain neither of you wanting to really do anything about people wolf reading me (especially people that might not know me and not know im a bit of a goofy dumb dumb!) and the defenses. Then I looked at the opening section of yall hamming it up about randing w/w and getting the notification early/how great it was in there and thought that's how you two might handle randing wolves together (just having a lot of fun with it). So I expressed the possibility that you/benneh could be w/w because a lot of different things could line up that way.

But it's not my only concerns or threads. I also talked about not really liking Vulgard's drop in that read like a perfect spot for a wolf to drop a vote on me. I talked about not liking Hally's approach to Vulgard and how that interaction set off my spidey senses. I talked about Barto's posts towards me and not knowing what to make of them. Or Rask's inactivity and whether it's wolf indicative.

So like, what reaches the thread is this jumbled mess of "benneh/zack w/w! vulgard w! hally vulgard w/w!" but like, in my head it all makes sense because I know how I got to all of these points. Maybe that can like, clear things up a bit.

[Zack]

That's fair.

I direct you to any of the other town games I've had recently where Hally herself has noted that I have been killed early due to my general low-seriousness I've been putting out.

I will pretend to read those and give a made up answer that reflects however I feel about your in-thread posts when the time is appropriate.

[EnderWiggin]

not really seeing sunbae's agenda here if wolf. he would have to be like, intentionally digging himself into a hole and denying himself easy outs out of pure stubbornness which seems like an odd way to go about it

I'll third this sentiment tbh

[Sunbae]

I mentioned to Zack earlier that I think ppl have unreal expectations of KGPs when they play in a format they rarely/seldomly play in that they expect you to match the activity level they have projected onto you which manifested itself from how excited they are to be playing with you, and if/when you don’t match that level of activity/hype, it’s cause you probably randed wolf and aren’t just chilling as a villager

my best guess

im not sure what KGP stands for but i really like your interpretation a lot more than what was in my head lmao

[EnderWiggin]

I will pretend to read those and give a made up answer that reflects however I feel about your in-thread posts when the time is appropriate.

Excellent.

I look forward to your vote.

...

Wait, we aren't running for a seat here?

[Zack]

So I'll try to organize it better:

With you, I saw you wolf read Hally. I had independently wolf read Hally. I thought "Oh, this is a good time to vibe with Zack" and asked if you wanted to talk about your stuff to see if we were noticing the same things. You brushed it off and I went ahead and gave my takes. That was the extend of our interaction there and I made a mental note of it. We've bounced ideas off each other before but that doesn't necessarily mean much.

Later, Benneh expressed a wolf read on me for memeing too long and followed it up with a villa read on you. I made the mental note of this too because, well, wolfreading me for memeing is a bit odd. I recognized that the thread consensus on me was kind of unhappy with my posting so far and there were quite a few people that expressed suspicions on me. So seeing specifically you and benneh not really doing much to try and work/vibe/clearup with me in that game state made me say "huh, that's odd. Wonder why". I looked at Benneh's defense of you - specifically for me trying to pocket you - and wondered if it could be a thing where you randed wolves together. That would explain neither of you wanting to really do anything about people wolf reading me (especially people that might not know me and not know im a bit of a goofy dumb dumb!) and the defenses. Then I looked at the opening section of yall hamming it up about randing w/w and getting the notification early/how great it was in there and thought that's how you two might handle randing wolves together (just having a lot of fun with it). So I expressed the possibility that you/benneh could be w/w because a lot of different things could line up that way.

But it's not my only concerns or threads. I also talked about not really liking Vulgard's drop in that read like a perfect spot for a wolf to drop a vote on me. I talked about not liking Hally's approach to Vulgard and how that interaction set off my spidey senses. I talked about Barto's posts towards me and not knowing what to make of them. Or Rask's inactivity and whether it's wolf indicative.

So like, what reaches the thread is this jumbled mess of "benneh/zack w/w! vulgard w! hally vulgard w/w!" but like, in my head it all makes sense because I know how I got to all of these points. Maybe that can like, clear things up a bit.

ah sorry didn't mean to brush you off, I just didn't want to guess your reason for wolfreading hally and give a mistaken impression that I believed they were wolfy when internally I'd moved on and didn't want to push there anymore (or give you the answers to the test to use if you were bullshitting / trying to pocket me etc).

fair enough, thanks for the breakdown. I've intentionally been trying to give you some space to work and not jump down your throat despite some concern after uh, mislunching you d1 in the last mountainous 9er we played and feeling really bad about it

[Zack]

im not sure what KGP stands for but i really like your interpretation a lot more than what was in my head lmao

I think it's Known Good Players

that was what benneh said when i asked him wolfchat my best guess given context clues

[Sunbae]

This is about hally right

ya (i have to add a third character because "ya" doesnt have enough to be posted)

[Sunbae]

I think it's Known Good Players

that was what benneh said when i asked him wolfchat my best guess given context clues

[Zack]

Excellent.

I look forward to your vote.

...

Wait, we aren't running for a seat here?

I've tried to vote in Australian elections before and every time they told me, "Sir, you live in the US and have literally never even been here, Macdougall inviting you to the ANZAC game does not qualify you for citizenship."

[Zack]

gotta say thread is feeling villagy

zomg and so forth

[Hally]

gotta say thread is feeling villagy

zomg and so forth

cuz rask is a wolf

[Zack]

cuz rask is a wolf

and i got in on the ground floor

[Sunbae]

i mean, what am i supposed to do when i ask someone a few basic questions and they straight up don’t know how to answer any of them? again, it just didn’t seem productive to keep hounding him at that moment


i think you interpret the bolded as being more serious than it was and want to make it clear i’m currently leaning v on you

also, i was the first person to give any sort of town read on you and stop the momentum going against you. me making that post about how your approach seemed weird as a wolf is what prompted people to talk about other things, so if anything i did the opposite of riding it out.


idk what this is referring to

1. but like, thats the thing right? "they dont know how to answer it so I dont want to hound" is totally fine. I get that. But you actively switched from a vote to a villa read off of it. That's *why* I don't think you were actually caring about the alignment. I looked at that interaction and thought "hally doesn't care about Vulgard's alignment, they knew they were unvoting at the start of that line of questioning".

2. Note on that being a joke, I did take it seriously

3. That's kind of like the whole "viewing people in terms of pushable vs not as the basis for the reads you're making" thing. Like I'm not sitting here breaking people into pushable or not categories, im just trying to figure out who is being wolfy or villagery. But you've got multiple instances where the lhf/pushability of people is at the forefront of your reads and i think its entirely possible its a mindstate issue where you *are* breaking people into that because you're trying to position yourself properly in the macro sense and it just bleeds through as logic for your other reads (like the one on me!).

[Hally]

OK, here's my case for today:

First your try to pocket me.

Bunday is tomorrow.

You post a bunch of nonsense but also you go on and on about elite intellectual capacity, which you imply is necessary for understanding jokes, and then misspell ?personal? as ?personnel?, which is both a crime against grammar and just unfunny.

tl;dr your tone is very much off to me.

vote: Sunbae

That said, I am now reading that Vulgard made a post in which he actually tried to post some reads and itnerpret the threads and voted for Sunbae.
To which Sunbae replies with what mafiawiki says is an OMGUS vote: ?I vote you because you're voting me?.

And then on the next page Hally, who was the leader until then, switched her vote to both take herself off the lead and put the accuser Vulgard into the #1 (n?mero uno) place.
So I'm happy to make it a tie between you two, because I'm sure that between you, Hally and Vulgard there must be one mafiat.

Now I'm off to play videogames. Byeeee!

this bart post keeps nagging at me

afaict he?s wolf reading sunbae for his tone being off in a meme post? and then he describes the interactions between me/sunbae/vul and seems to arbitrarily decide there?s a wolf in us three but i don?t see what about the stuff he?s describing would lead him to think we can?t all be villagers

it just seems like kind of a nonsense reason for a vote, and this was after me/benneh/vul all wolf read sunbae in succession so it?s a good spot for a wolf to pile on with some half-baked reasoning thinking they?re unlikely to be looked at too hard for it

[Sunbae]

not really seeing sunbae's agenda here if wolf. he would have to be like, intentionally digging himself into a hole and denying himself easy outs out of pure stubbornness which seems like an odd way to go about it

am i really being super stubborn here?

ive been trying my best to recognize issues and present them differently

[Zack]

am i really being super stubborn here?

ive been trying my best to recognize issues and present them differently

i meant in the sense that your v-reads were two of what would probably be prime mislunch candidates for you as a wolf (which hally talked about earlier) and then coming back to double down on pushing hally again when 1) it's very unlikely to gain any traction and 2) it's what got you into hot water in the first place

and I saw that and figured, sunbae is probably just a villa doing his thing and not giving much thought to how it comes across

[Sunbae]

See, my thing with not knowing what to do about the Barto post is this:

If you didn't know that post about Hally was a copypasta mocking Rick and Morty fans, and you thought that I was saying that stuff with any semblance of sincerity, then I think voting me is well within your right - nay, your duty - because it's awful

[Zack]

i also don't understand why he seems to suspect vulgard (mentioned wanting to make it vul v. sunbae in a subsequent post) because the line in that post hally quoted seemingly implies he thinks vul is villagy and one of the reasons he suspects sunbae is disliking sunbae's vote on vulgard

i'm curious to see what monty thinks of barto's posts when he returns to the thread, as an aside

[Hally]

1. but like, thats the thing right? "they dont know how to answer it so I dont want to hound" is totally fine. I get that. But you actively switched from a vote to a villa read off of it. That's *why* I don't think you were actually caring about the alignment. I looked at that interaction and thought "hally doesn't care about Vulgard's alignment, they knew they were unvoting at the start of that line of questioning".

i don’t know why you assume i knew i was unvoting him? i was actually surprised he responded the way he did and thought it was less likely to come from him as wolf because i remember him being a really good wolf who was able to fake good explanations for stuff, so i felt it would be an odd choice for w!him to completely punt on answering simple questions instead of trying to win me over by answering them

it’s not an ironclad read or anything but it gave me enough pause to feel it wasn’t worth pursuing more at that moment

2. Note on that being a joke, I did take it seriously

it wasn’t entirely a joke or entirely serious, more like half serious

3. That's kind of like the whole "viewing people in terms of pushable vs not as the basis for the reads you're making" thing. Like I'm not sitting here breaking people into pushable or not categories, im just trying to figure out who is being wolfy or villagery. But you've got multiple instances where the lhf/pushability of people is at the forefront of your reads and i think its entirely possible its a mindstate issue where you *are* breaking people into that because you're trying to position yourself properly in the macro sense and it just bleeds through as logic for your other reads (like the one on me!).

you really don’t sort people like that as a villager? i do it all the time because i feel like evaluating whether someone is making easy or hard pushes helps me see possible motivation or agenda behind their posts. for example, i think pushing on strong players early on is generally a pretty reliable town tell (just recently in the thing game on MU i used it to correctly clear three villagers D1). it’s obviously player dependent but generally i think it works pretty well and have seen others use it also (i know ladd does for example).

and on the flip side, you saw zack vote me for “shading” monty early on because he views monty as an easy push so he was wary of my focus there. it was the first thing i found villagery about zack, though not sure i said it. i make reads like that all the time i.e. “so and so seems like mislunch bait and it’s wolfy that X is going after them.”

so i dunno, i understand what you’re saying but i think it’s something villagers do a lot and i personally find it helpful