17er Saints and Martyrs

[Hally]

did i miss where gemma explained why there hasn’t been any extra deaths?

[Vanta Black]

Vanta Black sap, talk to me about your read on syn d1. You said you were gonna iso them but never did


--20

i'll bbl later to read d2

I did ISO Syn but found nothing to really help me find him either town or scum. I'd say half the posts were joke-phase type nothingburgers. I think I said I was relying more on other peoples' assessments, i.e., meta. My takeaway was probably not w/w with Ender, because tone-reading I thought that sounded sincere (but if you can fake sincerity you've got it made, right?), and early on, without many posts, said Wisdom could be town.

I really think I was stuck in the Logic tunnel pretty hard at that point.

[Logic]

For being the designated misyeet today, people don't seem to give a fuck about what I've got to say.

[Hally]

For being the designated misyeet today, people don't seem to give a fuck about what I've got to say.

ok, let’s talk

who is the other wolf besides vanta iyo? you keep harping on why they are wolf (which i still don’t get) but you aren’t really making an effort to sort anyone else afaict?

[ladd]

did i miss where gemma explained why there hasn’t been any extra deaths?

No


Logic, i have been reading your posts but idt you have said who you think the wolves are so i just didnt see much to interact with. Fwiw i am willing to consider the world where you are a villager

[Wisdom]

Wisdom, explain why you are reading against the grain here

I'm not encouraging a maj on me, but Vanta is on my shortlist, I'm consensus wolf, and you agreeing with me here is bold

Um
That's a perspective I guess?
If Vanta is wolf then it's good that more people wolf read him, yes? I don't have him in my PoE because you do!^^'

[Wisdom]

i don’t think we should lunch vanta

they aren’t w/w with logic who should always be dying before them and their posts are almost too wild to come from a wolf imo? like, what wolf is gonna post a rask/murska solve lol

i’m not really seeing it?

Personally still think Logic is town but won't protest if you're gonna policy/shrug yeet him by now. I tried following the pack on gh, didn't work, now I'll go back doing thing my way for a bit!

[Logic]

ok, let’s talk

who is the other wolf besides vanta iyo? you keep harping on why they are wolf (which i still don’t get) but you aren’t really making an effort to sort anyone else afaict?

I've been tinfoiling you, and dya, but I have more reasons to townread them over you.

I've got a tiny inkling it's benneh and we are all being dumb, as some of his posts on D1 were pinging me on a reread. I don't put much stock into this, and have been assuming that my reads are still garbo.

Ender doesn't seem good, but at least there (as opposed to Vanta) I can see some logic behind the posts.

Gemma softing and then not dying is eyebrow raising. Murska not dying is eyebrow raising. The fact that I agree with Vanta slightly concerns me, so for murska to be real, that means that both Jan and Ladd are more of a threat than a living doc claimant.

I've not sorted Rask at all. I've been treating them like most of you did with syn, and just let people sort them.

Wisdom, on this page, is setting off some alarm bells, but I think she's a villager.

[Logic]

No


Logic, i have been reading your posts but idt you have said who you think the wolves are so i just didnt see much to interact with. Fwiw i am willing to consider the world where you are a villager

Town 100% needs me to die, BEFORE LYLO to win this game. I don't mind going down, I just want people to interact with my posts as of they don't think I'm just auto-outted wolf.

As for my reads, I just dropped a small readslist that probably skipped someone still unconfirmed.

[Vanta Black]

I've been tinfoiling you, and dya, but I have more reasons to townread them over you.

I've got a tiny inkling it's benneh and we are all being dumb, as some of his posts on D1 were pinging me on a reread. I don't put much stock into this, and have been assuming that my reads are still garbo.

Ender doesn't seem good, but at least there (as opposed to Vanta) I can see some logic behind the posts.

Gemma softing and then not dying is eyebrow raising. Murska not dying is eyebrow raising. The fact that I agree with Vanta slightly concerns me, so for murska to be real, that means that both Jan and Ladd are more of a threat than a living doc claimant.

I've not sorted Rask at all. I've been treating them like most of you did with syn, and just let people sort them.

Wisdom, on this page, is setting off some alarm bells, but I think she's a villager.

I bet it concerns you that there's no logic behind my posts, yet you agree with some of them! Lol.

Wisdom has set off a lot of alarm bells for me, I've listed some of them.

I'd like to see which Benneh posts you thought were wolfy.

[Murska]

I think it's about time to stop purely protecting Rask since the wolves are avoiding them, and start picking my target out of the shortlist [Rask, Wisdom, Benneh, Arctic].

[dyachei]

I think it's about time to stop purely protecting Rask since the wolves are avoiding them, and start picking my target out of the shortlist [Rask, Wisdom, Benneh, Arctic].

Why wisdom

[Murska]

Why not? Even if they're bad, it's a low enough chance it doesn't help the wolves' targeting too much.

[nebjiamn]

please don't protect me

[Murska]

ok then

[Arctic]

hi
wow message too short

[Arctic]

Rask rarely hardbusses out of the gate unless a partner has teed themselves up for it.

It's not impossible but usually his busses come in later.

Am i the only person concerned that they are doing literally nothing since day 1

If wolves felt like they were gonna get boxed then i dunno maybe it could be a thing

[Arctic]

Tbh I kinda think wisdom is mafia

I know they had the thing about visor on day 1. which is throwing me off a bit. but iirc they have a history of doing pointless distancing with partners and the read is based on visor's treatment of her which is a thing wolves love to do (ladd article something something). And I still don't really buy what she was doing at eod2. Like somebody else who tried to kill benneh is a wolf, right? right??? she said it was for pressure or to test visor but did nothing to actually test visor and went afk at eod

And I generally agree with benneh vanta thoughts from 1696 to 1701

I don't understand her read list either but I'm trying not to confbias this cuz hally's correct that wisdom is pretty unique in their solving so reads not making sense isn't really condemning for them but I think the point stands that they aren't really playing like a villager who has majorly different reads to everyone else and trying to do anything about that

I think the gamestate argument for Logic being wolf makes sense and we prob need to flip him. but if I went by his posts, I kind of just believe some of his stuff on day 2. i dunno if it would be weird for zack to die n1 if his main susses gh/logic/ender/dya contain 0 and it makes sense to kill logic the first ouf of these so i'm just gonna let it happen and if he flips v you can all wolfread me for this lol

i've felt like ender's posts today are p bad but my thoughts on the eod2 stuff haven't really changed

[Arctic]

Okay, here it is. Note that I consider this world very unlikely, but possible.

Murska and Rask are the deep wolves.

They agreed in wolfchat to sacrifice Syn and Visor. They killed Zack (instead of claimed protector) to set up Visor and darken Logic. Murska hit the "I'm on Rask forevah" thing pretty hard D2, so there's a good reason for a player who has outed two wolves to keep being alive. Murska survives to D4 which is kind of amazing for a doc who claims D1 IME. Murska's survival explains Rask's survival. Claimed doc even survives a jugg kill, if I'm reading Visor's flip correctly.

The only other explanation I can think of is that whoever they are, they are leavng Murska alive so the rest of us will think that. Although nobody thinks that but me, apparently. I mean, I don't exactlly think that, but it explains some things. It doesn't look like anyone else thinks that. Please feel free to refute it if you can and set my mind at ease.

There. I said it. Mock me, tell me I'm silly, call it antispew, whatever.

ok but visor pretty clearly tried killing murska at eod1 (see the post where they pinged people to get them to vote murska), while syn was top wagon and looking like they were tgonna die and clearly in a worse position than murska so why would he try to run up another wolf there instead of bussing syn or voting the cw logic (if logic is town, but the fact he didn't is a point of why logic is wolf - and in that world visor would still vote syn if all 3 of these were mafia)

and why would visor's role exist if there was no town protective role

i did townread this from you before but it kinda feels like you're trying to play towards the fact people are townreading you for this when it's pretty nonsensical
and the last line is funny cuz ur clearly aware it's nonsense

i still think ur prob v gth but i need to actually do some isos so that could change

[Arctic]

We had no death overnight, so I'm inclined to clear both of them.

Lmao what

[Hally]

i think it’s 2 in logic/dya/gemma/ender

i just don’t think anyone else can be a wolf, sue me

[Hally]

i think it’s 2 in logic/dya/gemma/ender

i just don’t think anyone else can be a wolf, sue me

if i’m wrong then i guess it’s like vanta? but tbh i just don’t see what’s wolfy about them even though i admit there’s not a lot there

i’m trusting ladd it’s never wisdom and will blame him if wrong

[Arctic]

i fell asleep and dreamed that i had shit my pants and woke up scared but was quickly relieved that no i had not shat my pants

same except i wasn't dreaming

[Vanta Black]

ok but visor pretty clearly tried killing murska at eod1 (see the post where they pinged people to get them to vote murska), while syn was top wagon and looking like they were tgonna die and clearly in a worse position than murska so why would he try to run up another wolf there instead of bussing syn or voting the cw logic (if logic is town, but the fact he didn't is a point of why logic is wolf - and in that world visor would still vote syn if all 3 of these were mafia)

and why would visor's role exist if there was no town protective role

i did townread this from you before but it kinda feels like you're trying to play towards the fact people are townreading you for this when it's pretty nonsensical
and the last line is funny cuz ur clearly aware it's nonsense

i still think ur prob v gth but i need to actually do some isos so that could change

I started it off saying it was a wild-ass theory. This is kind of what happens to me on D4, I get crazy conspiracy theories in my head. Because for that scenario to work they'd have had to agree on it pretty early, or else just all be real gambiters.

But I can't deny my shock that a doc who claimed D1 is still here, and the partner doesn't have to be Rask but has Rask even posted today? He seemed to be donig great solving D1 and D2 and then dipped.

[Arctic]

I can't really point to any dya post and say "wow this exudes massive town energy" even though I've felt like their direction has been mostly fine this game

They tried to kill Logic over GH yesterday so this is worth keeping in mind if Logic flips wolf

I kind of laid off on them on D1 cuz when the AtE stuff was going on and I said to Hally they do this as mafia, they said "nah i don't" which I kinda interpreted as them just telling the truth about what they do as town/mafia otherwise they wouldn't be cleared for this sort of thing in future, even tho this sounds dumb i'll admit

when somebody reads my posts eventually they'll see i've said like nothing about hally this entire game and it's true that based on interactions or anything i don't really have a reason to call them town so i'll make this a priority reread but from memory her posts and level of depth (limestone wall etc) are good and nothing has actually pinged me from her. like i feel like she would probably be casable as a wolf here but there's not actually any reason for me to think it's her, pending reread

if i did a trust fall exercise i suspect i would probably have the weakest reasons to townread wisdom, dya, hally, vanta and logic. strangely not even ender because he has the syn push going for him as well as his eod2 posts

but even so i still think rask could be mafia lol

[Hally]

ladd can you town case wisdom so arctic doesn’t vote her in F3?

[Hally]

I can't really point to any dya post and say "wow this exudes massive town energy" even though I've felt like their direction has been mostly fine this game

They tried to kill Logic over GH yesterday so this is worth keeping in mind if Logic flips wolf

I kind of laid off on them on D1 cuz when the AtE stuff was going on and I said to Hally they do this as mafia, they said "nah i don't" which I kinda interpreted as them just telling the truth about what they do as town/mafia otherwise they wouldn't be cleared for this sort of thing in future, even tho this sounds dumb i'll admit

when somebody reads my posts eventually they'll see i've said like nothing about hally this entire game and it's true that based on interactions or anything i don't really have a reason to call them town so i'll make this a priority reread but from memory her posts and level of depth (limestone wall etc) are good and nothing has actually pinged me from her. like i feel like she would probably be casable as a wolf here but there's not actually any reason for me to think it's her, pending reread

if i did a trust fall exercise i suspect i would probably have the weakest reasons to townread wisdom, dya, hally, vanta and logic. strangely not even ender because he has the syn push going for him as well as his eod2 posts

but even so i still think rask could be mafia lol

i have noticed you haven’t really talked about me at all lol

i even voted you D1 half to get you to give a read on me and iirc you didn’t even then!

[Hally]

I can't really point to any dya post and say "wow this exudes massive town energy" even though I've felt like their direction has been mostly fine this game

They tried to kill Logic over GH yesterday so this is worth keeping in mind if Logic flips wolf

I kind of laid off on them on D1 cuz when the AtE stuff was going on and I said to Hally they do this as mafia, they said "nah i don't" which I kinda interpreted as them just telling the truth about what they do as town/mafia otherwise they wouldn't be cleared for this sort of thing in future, even tho this sounds dumb i'll admit

when somebody reads my posts eventually they'll see i've said like nothing about hally this entire game and it's true that based on interactions or anything i don't really have a reason to call them town so i'll make this a priority reread but from memory her posts and level of depth (limestone wall etc) are good and nothing has actually pinged me from her. like i feel like she would probably be casable as a wolf here but there's not actually any reason for me to think it's her, pending reread

if i did a trust fall exercise i suspect i would probably have the weakest reasons to townread wisdom, dya, hally, vanta and logic. strangely not even ender because he has the syn push going for him as well as his eod2 posts

but even so i still think rask could be mafia lol

dya absolutely AtE’s as mafia, i’ve literally seen them do it lol

also rask is not a wolf brah

[Arctic]

my 2 cents is that i don't think he truly believed benneh would ever go over regardless of his (benneh's) alignment

but i guess we'll find out only in postgame

you got the whole squad tinfoiling (including me) (not actually) (well kinda but not even bc of this but bc benneh's posts at eod2 kinda spooked me) (why did i say nothing about this before? idk, i'm mentally unstable)

[Arctic]

if you guys are so sure rask is town i will just believe you and say it's probably in wisdom/logic/dya/vanta/ender

this only works if u don't vote me out tho