Tarot Mafia

[Gemma]

Why did Vanta and neb simultaneously save Wisdom at EOD3? It's at least a little anti-pairing, isn't it?

bc its too wolfy?

[grr]

i'd say my bad about my ladd read, but honestly it was both my bad and his bad. >.<



nice shot on benneh dya, i was 100% gonna push him for his very tentative vote on ladd at the EOD only when it was likely to push him over.

blame vanta much less for their vote because they showed hesitancy to voting with me and picked a different wagon first.

glad i got there on jan, but i'm surprised that @Maple is alive ? did he give reasoning for not killing you?

my initial thought is that maybe jan got roleblocked and couldn't execute maple? (afaik thats how it works in TOS, if the jailer gets roleblocked they can't execute)



gonna read benneh for spew, probably a fairly good amount there, gonna read specifically for his reads on wisdom/maple/vanta/monty/enderwiggen as those are my most unsure atm

so i have never done an actual ISO of the guy after d1.

i just read sentences like this once in a while and they feel like a villa coping to me, if you know what i mean, but then newcomb said semisus, ladd said sus, dya said they were confident on knights and im like. in normal worlds i should be the one who is wrong here and not everyone else. and i defo joined this game as a side character and not to tell every mafia goat on the planet they are wrong so, shrug.

[Montmorency]

OK, seriously, everyone understands that if Wisdom is scum, she spews 3 players clear. Look at the votes and interactions. She has the weakest PR claim, has been saved under fishy circumstances every day (once by flipped mafia), has been pushed by a string of townies and town-cred individuals, and has a lot of textual arguments against her. Also, a pretty atrocious POE, not that that's very AI right now.

Maple remains self-clearing.

Insomnia has offered better town-type play and votes than anyone alive btw. I don't know how people can compare themselves to Insomnia tbh.

@grr plz do more complete vote histories

If Wisdom is town, the POE is completely open and the team could kind of be anyone. Could be some stupid team like grr-vanta-sunbae. We flatly lose, no chance, if Wisdom is town. We probably box Mafia out and win if she's scum. So...

[Montmorency]

bc its too wolfy?

You mean they wanted to seem wolfy?

[insomnia]

Aren't you just saying that out of French solidarity?



Here's how I see this EOD.

Knights convinced me he's not a good candidate for today.

Syn's wagon seems relatively trustworthy. Syn does have a history of getting outed quick by meta-havers. But the Rask note (I haven't reached it?) is troubling.

Gemma is the player I have the strongest negative opinion on, but it's almost like low-null. I can't think of anything worthy about the voters.

Few thoughts about anyone else.

I'll do the right thing.

which note was this? iirc rask said syn is a villager, why would it be troubling? the people who voted him didn't have meta

[Gemma]

Yeah well maybe it's just gunna be Wisdom and knights and my vibe radar has been completely off the rocker this game. Bye.

i apologize for snapping at you

im a little on edge after village keeps refusing to yeet anyone i want to yeet and yeets my villagers instead

do whatever you like with your reads / vote

follow your heart

dont let your dreams be dreams

[grr]

@grr plz do more complete vote histories

yeah in ~20 minutes

[Gemma]

You mean they wanted to seem wolfy?

nah sry was response to ur 2nd part, like do u think its unaligned because twtbaw or is there some other logic at play

[insomnia]

i re-read EoD1 specifically aiming to read mont and it just makes me wanna vote knights so much harder

idk if im gonna vote anyone that is not him. let's see what answers he comes up with though to my questions

[insomnia]

IF there should be a wolf in gemma / knights, i feel like it's always knights

specifically looking at that EoD, gemma was a lot more passive and reactionary than knights and they were both susceptible to dying. knights was posting a lot more like a wolf

also i reminded myself of his terrible pass to benneh while he was saying sunbae wasn't doing much, but what do you know, out of the 4 prolific names he pushed, the one he defended for terrible reasons was a wolf, who woulda guessed

yeah, he just looks really really bad. hopefully he can clear himself once he explains how he can possibly be voting me, but i predict just a massive fumble on his explanation and it being something thoughtless when he said we'd be losing here

[insomnia]

queue the "i voted you cuz we're obviously off on someone"

[Gemma]

Insomnia has offered better town-type play and votes than anyone alive btw.

im fine voting dolby

[insomnia]

ofc i was fine voting someone who was lying, before his claim i was defending him

my vote was on wisdom though, i think. didn't end up moving

[Gemma]

IF there should be a wolf in gemma / knights, i feel like it's always knights

now this was the dichotomy we really needed all along

[Montmorency]

which note was this? iirc rask said syn is a villager, why would it be troubling? the people who voted him didn't have meta

I had read <10 posts by Syn at this time, as I was up to date through early day. So I had few thoughts. Syn often gets outed early because of meta. But people were claiming Rask was more-or-less townreading Syn, so that made me hesitant (troubled) on the wagon, as he and syn go back the furthest. Syn getting dogpiled D1/D2 is often a hit, but Rask's alleged opinion was throwing me.

nah sry was response to ur 2nd part, like do u think its unaligned because twtbaw or is there some other logic at play

It's not overwhelmingly AI, but if Vanta and neb are in WC at the same time, they would presumably be coordinating privately, not openly on how to approach EOD.

So is the explanation that they:

1. Decided to both last-minute vote to flip t/t wagons for no reason
2. Decided to both last-minute vote to save their partner Wisdom in a way that immediately calls attention to almost the whole surviving team

[insomnia]

vvv
insomnia
grr
ender
gemma (for dya)

vv
vanta black (also peek equity from bop, i just don't think they are a wolf)

if he's wolf then y'all can take it on the chin, im no longer lunching him. when i say y'all, you should know who you are, dead or alive
maple

meh
sunbae
wisdom
montmorency

wolf
knights

[Gemma]

my vote was on wisdom though, i think

they always get away on technicalities

[insomnia]

they always get away on technicalities

gimme my cred yo, i was defending him before his totally unnecessary fake claim

if he didn't lie about all those things i prob have no issue with him, but i obv can't still defend him when his claim was poorly planned out. at least if it did anything /shrug

[Montmorency]

I'll repeat for anyone with sus on Ender, Gemma, or Insomnia.

Based on votes, if Wisdom is scum those players have excellent voting records, being Wisdom pushers and voters (I think all of them would also have pushed at least one other confirmed scum). Other players have layed out that their posting patterns, tone, and interactions with neb et al. are towny. If Wisdom is town, we're already on the road to defeat. If Wisdom is scum, it's our game to lose.

It would be sad to lose the game because we just kept fumbling the ouster of the player more of the player list has suspected than any other but, like, syn.

[grr]

Vote Histories d1-d4:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

d1: (i missed all ladd votes d1 cause they didnt have the space after the colon just fyi, should be fixed)

Voter	Voted for	Post
Gemma	Raskol	#7
theknightsofneeee	dyachei	#16
sheepsaysmeep	theknightsofneeee	#63
didistetter	C0balt	#65
didistetter	sheepsaysmeep	#68
didistetter	C0balt	#80
Wisdom	Raskolnikov	#95
sheepsaysmeep	Wisdom	#142
grr	Newcomb	#197
Enderwiggin	Jan	#211
Enderwiggin	theknightsofneeee	#228
didistetter	nebjiamn	#248
Syn	sheepsaysmeep	#386
Raskolnikov	theknightsofneeee	#435
theknightsofneeee	Jan	#486
insomnia	dyachei	#620
Gemma	Vanta	#636
Newcomb	theknightsofneeee	#659
nebjiamn	enderwiggin	#668
didistetter	C0balt	#673
ladd	sheepsaysmeep	#686
ladd	gemma	#710
sheepsaysmeep	Gemma	#715
Wisdom	Gemma	#716
Vanta_Black	ColonelLubriderm	#725
Gemma	insomnia	#767
dyachei	enderwiggin	#792
Gemma	theknightsofneeee	#822
ColonelLubriderm	Wisdom	#824
didistetter	ladd	#828
Maple	Gemma	#858
Jan	Sunbae	#868
grr	Sunbae	#870
grr	Raskolnikov	#906
insomnia	Gemma	#1005
didistetter	Syn	#1047
Newcomb	Syn	#1053
ColonelLubriderm	Syn	#1066
dyachei	Syn	#1079
didistetter	theknightsofneeee	#1110
ColonelLubriderm	Raskolnikov	#1112
Jan	Raskolnikov	#1115
MontMorency	Raskolnikov	#1170
Gemma	Syn	#1173
dyachei	sheepsaysmeep	#1174
ladd	sheepsaysmeep	#1177
insomnia	Syn	#1186
theknightsofneeee	Syn	#1193
didistetter	Syn	#1195
Maple	Raskolnikov	#1196
Arctic	Syn	#1204
Jan	Gemma	#1206
Maple	Syn	#1207

d2:

Voter	Voted for	Post
didistetter	Maple	#1246
nebjiamn	Enderwiggin	#1272
theknightsofneeee	Jan	#1278
Wisdom	Vanta_Black	#1364
ladd	Maple	#1378
insomnia	nebjiamn	#1467
Gemma	nebjiamn	#1471
Wisdom	nebjiamn	#1473
EnderWiggin	Raskolnikov	#1488
Dolby	Maple	#1506
grr	Sunbae	#1514
didistetter	Dolby	#1522
ColonelLubriderm	Dolby	#1559
Wisdom	Gemma	#1581
didistetter	Wisdom	#1586
Raskolnikov	theknightsofneeee	#1645
grr	Unvote	#1653
didistetter	Maple	#1697
didistetter	EnderWiggin	#1742
Dolby	EnderWiggin	#1746
Gemma	Maple	#1817
Raskolnikov	Maple	#1857
nebjiamn	Raskolnikov	#1873
Maple	Dolby	#1892
didistetter	Unvote	#1900
ladd	nebjiamn	#1920
dyachei	ladd	#1929
ladd	Montmorency	#1932
insomnia	ladd	#1945
insomnia	Maple	#1964
nebjiamn	Maple	#1981
Dolby	Wisdom	#1991
Montmorency	ladd	#2003
dyachei	Raskolnikov	#2028
Dolby	Raskolnikov	#2032
didistetter	Raskolnikov	#2059
Vanta_Black	dyachei	#2063
Raskolnikov	dyachei	#2075
Wisdom	Raskolnikov	#2095
didistetter	Unvote	#2098
ColonelLubriderm	Wisdom	#2109
didistetter	Sleep	#2115
grr	Raskolnikov	#2121
nebjiamn	Raskolnikov	#2127
didistetter	Raskolnikov	#2133
ColonelLubriderm	Raskolnikov	#2141
ColonelLubriderm	Wisdom	#2143
Dolby	Wisdom	#2144
MontMorency	Wisdom	#2147
theknightsofneeee	ladd	#2164
MontMorency	ladd	#2176
Arctic	Raskolnikov	#2215

d3:

Voter	Voted for	Post
Gemma	Wisdom	#2236
nebjiamn	Maple	#2240
Montmorency	ladd	#2262
theknightsofneeee	Jan	#2292
Dolby	Maple	#2301
insomnia	Maple	#2303
dyachei	ladd	#2316
Gemma	Maple	#2317
Dolby	Wisdom	#2331
Gemma	Wisdom	#2333
Wisdom	Sunbae	#2417
Wisdom	grr	#2420
Wisdom	Unvote	#2423
EnderWiggin	Maple	#2463
Wisdom	Maple	#2517
ladd	Wisdom	#2581
Dolby	Maple	#2582
grr	ladd	#2585
grr	Wisdom	#2718
Enderwiggin	Wisdom	#2733
nebjiamn	Wisdom	#2822
dyachei	Wisdom	#2825
grr	ladd	#2854
Jan	Wisdom	#2855
Sunbae	nebjiamn	#2856
Dolby	Ladd	#2858
theknightsofneeee	Ladd	#2874
Vanta_Black	Maple	#2877
Vanta_Black	Unvote	#2887
Vanta_Black	Wisdom	#2894
dyachei	ladd	#2903
Vanta_Black	ladd	#2944
nebjiamn	Ladd	#2946

d4:

Voter	Voted for	Post
Maple	Dolby	#2954
Dolby	Wisdom	#2956
insomnia	Wisdom	#3005
grr	Wisdom	#3033
EnderWiggin	Dolby	#3034
Gemma	theknightsofneeee	#3054
Wisdom	Maple	#3075
grr	Maple	#3100
grr	Wisdom	#3106
Gemma	Maple	#3147
dyachei	theknightsofneeee	#3147
grr	Dolby	#3223
Maple	Unvote	#3231
Sunbae	Dolby	#3238
Sunbae	Unvote	#3247
Dolby	theknightsofneeee	#3266
Wisdom	Unvote	#3279
Sunbae	Dolby	#3301
Dolby	Wisdom	#3316
dyachei	Dolby	#3346
Enderwiggin	Unvote	#3361
theknightsofneeee	Dolby	#3368
EnderWiggin	Dolby	#3379

Note: dya changed to Maple last sec but I believe it was after hammer so I didn't put it in

(if everyone can search if their own vote is on would probs easiest check to see if there are errors you can ping me with it if there is one if u want)

[Montmorency]

Moreover, if Wisdom is scum, then knights has strong partner equity with them anyway, and we can move up that POE.

[insomnia]

I'll repeat for anyone with sus on Ender, Gemma, or Insomnia.

Based on votes, if Wisdom is scum those players have excellent voting records, being Wisdom pushers and voters (I think all of them would also have pushed at least one other confirmed scum). Other players have layed out that their posting patterns, tone, and interactions with neb et al. are towny. If Wisdom is town, we're already on the road to defeat. If Wisdom is scum, it's our game to lose.

It would be sad to lose the game because we just kept fumbling the ouster of the player more of the player list has suspected than any other but, like, syn.

i think it would be 10x more sad to lose to knights personally after seeing his gameplay

[Gemma]

gemma (for dya)

no idea why this qualification exists

also dya has basically no experience reading me so not rly someone you'd want to cite for a gemma read

[insomnia]

no idea why this qualification exists

also dya has basically no experience reading me so not rly someone you'd want to cite for a gemma read

in case it's wrong i have all bases covered and can blame it on dya

[Montmorency]

i think it would be 10x more sad to lose to knights personally after seeing his gameplay

*taps sign*

Moreover, if Wisdom is scum, then knights has strong partner equity with them anyway, and we can move up that POE.

[grr]

i apologize for snapping at you

im a little on edge after village keeps refusing to yeet anyone i want to yeet and yeets my villagers instead

do whatever you like with your reads / vote

follow your heart

dont let your dreams be dreams

I think I have a vastly different range of things I find annoying than others so there is no reason to apologize. People calling my reads crazy doesnt mean much to me lol (at least not on this table). I have made no secret of basically having no complete view of the game at all and just catching a few things here and there.

[Gemma]

yeah whatever

Vote: Wisdom

lowkey hope this is v and game just ends

[Gemma]

I think I have a vastly different range of things I find annoying than others so there is no reason to apologize. People calling my reads crazy doesnt mean much to me lol (at least not on this table). I have made no secret of basically having no complete view of the game at all and just catching a few things here and there.

i basically havent read half of anything since day 2

welcome to the club

[Wisdom]

They claimed to have given a doc not a vigshot?

wrt dolby I can only speculate but note that he flipped Emperor while Jan flipped Empress or something. So if I had a wild guess I would say there probably was some wiretapping stuff going on, so Dolby had some info what Jan was doing specifically (maybe he could observe his actions? or his chat?)

anyhow its just guessing he was clear the only info he gave out is that Jan specifally chose to spare Manti.

Doc? But wasn't the fuss about Jan choosing to not kill Maple?

[EnderWiggin]

I can't wait for post-game to find out wtf Dolby was doing there.