Palestinians in Gaza blaming ... Hamas?

**Philippus Flavius Homovallumus** · 01-25-2009, 18:58

So, just like our other two Mid-East ventures, then?

I don't think Hamas would go quietly, either.

**LittleGrizzly** · 01-25-2009, 19:06

Im sure there were some israeli's who blamed the israeli goverment for the rocket attacks of Hamas as well, unfortunately such people are minoritys in israel as well as palestine and they will blame the foriegn enemy over thier own bad goverments...

**Crazed Rabbit** · 01-25-2009, 19:29

I'm sorry, but I see any possible US led invasion of Gaza as a huge debacle. Think of the press that would get - and the fact that we'd be getting ourselves into a very thorny situation.

CR

**Furunculus** · 01-25-2009, 19:30

Originally Posted by LittleGrizzly

Im sure there were some israeli's who blamed the israeli goverment for the rocket attacks of Hamas as well, unfortunately such people are minoritys in israel as well as palestine and they will blame the foriegn enemy over thier own bad goverments...

let me get this straight:

not enough palestinians stood up to denounce hamas for launching rockets from their homes.
and
not enough israelies stood up to denounce Kadima for letting Hamas lauch rockets at their homes.

have i got that right?

**Pannonian** · 01-25-2009, 19:39

Originally Posted by Philipvs Vallindervs Calicvla

So, just like our other two Mid-East ventures, then?

I don't think Hamas would go quietly, either.

Too bad, but nothing that a police lockdown wouldn't be able to solve. Hold out the carrot of eventual integration into the EU, if this is an EU undertaking, or the US, if this is a US undertaking. This isn't a democratic adventure, to liberate the Palestinians from their tyrannical rulers. This is actual integration into the western world. Given what they've experienced so far, wouldn't this be a substantial enough carrot?

**Fragony** · 01-25-2009, 19:50

Originally Posted by Pannonian

Too bad, but nothing that a police lockdown wouldn't be able to solve. Hold out the carrot of eventual integration into the EU, if this is an EU undertaking, or the US, if this is a US undertaking. This isn't a democratic adventure, to liberate the Palestinians from their tyrannical rulers. This is actual integration into the western world. Given what they've experienced so far, wouldn't this be a substantial enough carrot?

What the hell? This is about integrating Hamas in the western world????

**Pannonian** · 01-25-2009, 19:57

Originally Posted by Fragony

What the hell? This is about integrating Hamas in the western world????

Palestine. The people of Hamas can go along with it, or they can be purged. If they care about the Palestinian people and the Palestinian land that much, this is a chance to ensure the integrity of Palestinian land, the functionality of Palestinian institutions, and the prosperity of the Palestinian people. If the EU takes over direct control, the interests of the Palestinian people will be guaranteed by the EU. So any more Israeli incursions will be met by EU militaries, and EU measures.

People moan about how the Palestinians never make a decision that satisfies them. So take direct control, so you make their decisions for them. In exchange, you also take responsibility for their wellbeing.

**Fragony** · 01-25-2009, 20:08

Originally Posted by Pannonian

Palestine. The people of Hamas can go along with it, or they can be purged. If they care about the Palestinian people and the Palestinian land that much, this is a chance to ensure the integrity of Palestinian land, the functionality of Palestinian institutions, and the prosperity of the Palestinian people. If the EU takes over direct control, the interests of the Palestinian people will be guaranteed by the EU. So any more Israeli incursions will be met by EU militaries, and EU measures.

People moan about how the Palestinians never make a decision that satisfies them. So take direct control, so you make their decisions for them. In exchange, you also take responsibility for their wellbeing.

So that all europeans on top of the Israeli's are to blame, no thanks. They already could have had everything.

edit, bit much

**Pannonian** · 01-25-2009, 20:38

Originally Posted by Fragony

So that all europeans on top of the Israeli's are to blame, no thanks. They already could have had everything.

edit, bit much

If we don't want to involve ourselves fully, and we're not satisfied with what we're getting for what we're investing, then why not pull out fully, and leave them to their own devices, and stop moaning about what they do? If they decide to blow up Israelis, that's none of our business, and we should leave them to it. If the Israelis decide to blow up Palestinians, that's also none of our business, and we should leave them to it. If we're not going to do anything about it, stop the moral outrage, and just let them sort things out for themselves. As I've said before, I'd be quite happy with locking in everything and everyone to do with that region, save for those whom we actually need (ie. the oil countries), and letting them live with the consequences of their actions, away from us.

**Sarmatian** · 01-25-2009, 21:01

What legal or moral authority do EU and US have to do that? It would be seen as occupation and rightfully so.

**Fragony** · 01-26-2009, 10:27

Originally Posted by Pannonian

If we don't want to involve ourselves fully, and we're not satisfied with what we're getting for what we're investing, then why not pull out fully, and leave them to their own devices, and stop moaning about what they do?

I am not moaning they are being dealt with properly, it's the only way. It's the only way for the Taliban, it's the only way for Al Quaida, and it's the only way with Hamas. Some people just want to see the world burn. So burn.

**LittleGrizzly** · 01-26-2009, 03:54

have i got that right?

I was saying most people don't blame thier own goverments for actions leading to the attacks but rather blame the attacker (of them) which is true for almost all countries...