Gaza again

[Fragony]

If the idea behind the invasion was to destroy Hamas as an institution, then Israel's plans have completely backfired.

So they have to use their war-chest that is filled with the money that was meant for aid to actually at least appear to give a crap, and you call that backfiring at Israel?

[CountArach]

So they have to use their war-chest that is filled with the money that was meant for aid to actually at least appear to give a crap, and you call that backfiring at Israel?

Think about it:
1) Your house is destroyed
2) Your family is killed
3) Hamas comes up to and says "Here's 4000 Euroes, no strings attached"
4) Israel invades again

Who do you support?

[Strike For The South]

Well if a Euroes is anything like an Oreo than them!

[Hooahguy]

Five mortar shells fired from northern Gaza landed in Sha'ar Hanegev Regional Council limits. Two people suffered mild injuries.

[Fragony]

Think about it:
1) Your house is destroyed
2) Your family is killed
3) Hamas comes up to and says "Here's 4000 Euroes, no strings attached"
4) Israel invades again

Who do you support?

Israel loses nothing here, those who made up their mind have made up their mind. All that money for rebuilding would normally go to rockets, so less money for rockets. Hamas is the moral victor in this for those who already felt they are the moral victor, the only thing that changes is that Hamas has less money to do their thing.

[CountArach]

Israel loses nothing here, those who made up their mind have made up their mind. All that money for rebuilding would normally go to rockets, so less money for rockets. Hamas is the moral victor in this for those who already felt they are the moral victor, the only thing that changes is that Hamas has less money to do their thing.

You honestly don't think that the invasion will turn Moderates into Radicals? If not there is obviously no point arguing with you.

[Tribesman]

Israel loses nothing here

Actually Frag Israel lost plenty , they showed that they are both weak and stupid .
They also showed that despite blocking the media there the new improved intensive propoganda program couldn't put out stories without them falling apart within hours which seriously lost them credibility .

I'd be amazed if it took any more than 10%.

I'd be amazed if they even spent that , I would have thought their overseas sponsors supplied all that crap for free .

[Fragony]

You honestly don't think that the invasion will turn Moderates into Radicals? If not there is obviously no point arguing with you.

Probably. But Hamas already hurts what it can hurt so what difference does it make if there are more radicals?

[rasoforos]

Probably. But Hamas already hurts what it can hurt so what difference does it make if there are more radicals?

Its a 'final solution' isnt it? Radicalize people so you have an excuse to kill them...

But of course these people are of a different colour and religion so why should you care...

[Fragony]

Its a 'final solution' isnt it? Radicalize people so you have an excuse to kill them...

But of course these people are of a different colour and religion so why should you care...

YEAH. Well no. Just pointing out that this backfiring to Israel like CountArach seems to think it is somewhat silly, it's not going to change anyone's mind, the only effect is less money for Hamas if actually spend the cash on rebuilding.

[Idaho]

All that money for rebuilding would normally go to rockets...

You just start bashing away at that keyboard whether your brain is switched on or not. Do you really believe that home made rockets take up nearly all Hamas expediture? I'd be amazed if it took any more than 10%.

[Seamus Fermanagh]

You just start baching away at that keyboard....

Typing in fugue?

[ELITEofWARMANGINGERYBREADMEN88]

Think about it:
1) Your house is destroyed
2) Your family is killed
3) Hamas comes up to and says "Here's 4000 Euroes, no strings attached"
4) Israel invades again

Who do you support?

Do you support Hamas killing Israel people? It's ok if they fire rockets in Israel and kill their people, but if Israel bombs the Palentines and kill the Hamas, it's not ok?

Besides, if more civilans die, maybe the Palinetines would wake up and realize if they keeping supporting terroists, they will suffer.


Sounds cruel, but it's the truth.

[CountArach]

Do you support Hamas killing Israel people? It's ok if they fire rockets in Israel and kill their people, but if Israel bombs the Palentines and kill the Hamas, it's not ok?

... what? Seriously? I am opposed to violence of all kinds, which comes from being a pacifist. REGARDLESS of who does it, it is still murder. However, Israel is responsible for the deaths of more people and their reasons for doing so are less sound. Never once did I say that Hamas should kill Israelis...

Besides, if more civilans die, maybe the Palinetines would wake up and realize if they keeping supporting terroists, they will suffer.

Orrrrrrrrrrr, the far more likely response would be the situation I laid out - they become more radical themselves due to the loss of family members and support from the Hamas institution. Besides the majority of Palestinians do not support Terrorist acts, they are quite moderate - punishing the greater majority for the actions of the minority is in fact a breach of International law.

Sounds cruel, but it's the truth.

Its certainly one of those things.

[Hooahguy]

Orrrrrrrrrrr, the far more likely response would be the situation I laid out - they become more radical themselves due to the loss of family members and support from the Hamas institution. Besides the majority of Palestinians do not support Terrorist acts, they are quite moderate - punishing the greater majority for the actions of the minority is in fact a breach of International law.

its a 50-50 chance.
if israel doesnt do anything theres a big chance that more radicals will emerge. hamas will see it as a victory and will strengthen their cause. people will see that israel is weak, so they will begin to think that israel can be defeated.

it can go both ways.

[Hooahguy]

A Grad rocket fired from the Gaza Strip landed in an open area in central Ashkelon today. There were no reports of injuries or damage.

[CountArach]

its a 50-50 chance.
if israel doesnt do anything theres a big chance that more radicals will emerge. hamas will see it as a victory and will strengthen their cause. people will see that israel is weak, so they will begin to think that israel can be defeated.

it can go both ways.

No. Just no. Think about it - why would people become radicals WITHOUT ANY REASON?

[Evil_Maniac From Mars]

No. Just no. Think about it - why would people become radicals WITHOUT ANY REASON?

They don't without any reason. But if they finally see they can win, Hamas may well see a boost from those who want to see Israel destroyed, but weren't keen on joining a futile cause. Hence, boosted recruitment for Hamas. I can certainly see Hooah's point.

[Hooahguy]

No. Just no. Think about it - why would people become radicals WITHOUT ANY REASON?

yes. just yes.
my answer to you: indoctrination.
there will be a reason. israel is the reason behind all this. even if israel didnt launch the attacks, they would still hate israel.
hamas hates israel- well known.
put yourself in the mind of a hamas fighter, fighting to get rid of israel.
you hear that israel is giving in to hamas demands. is there less of a will to fight, or are you energized to keep going?

lets put it in western terms:
its color war in your school. your team has suffered two defeats in a row. but then the other team goes lax. are you energized to fight harder, or do you weaken or do you have less of a will to fight?

and btw, people dont always need reasons to do things.

[Tribesman]

no, not that. you may not agree now, but if there were terrorist attacks in your area, you would demand your government to do something.

I would demand they do something that might work , not demand they do the same things again that they already know don't work .

its a 50-50 chance.

No it isn't , its a 100% chance that carrying on doing the things that don't work won't work .

if israel doesnt do anything theres a big chance that more radicals will emerge.

Who on earth said anything about not doing anything ?
Can't you understand that there are more options than just following the failed process of escalation?

people will see that israel is weak

People have already seen that , it has been evident for a long time

[Adrian II]

Can't you understand that there are more options than just following the failed process of escalation?

Oh my, that must be your 356th attempt to introduce some reason. I admire your Irish pluck, but don't you ever get weary of the irrelevant answers you get?

Hold on to that fox hat.

[CountArach]

Can't you understand that there are more options than just following the failed process of escalation?

Succinctly put

[Hooahguy]

Who on earth said anything about not doing anything ?
Can't you understand that there are more options than just following the failed process of escalation?

once again, were back to this.
i see two options:

1) diplomacy, and hope to high heaven that hamas keeps its word. about this cease-fire in effect right now, hamas isnt holding it. so i guess that isnt so effective, is it?
2)military- israel uses force.

i keep asking you that is military force isnt working, and nor is diplomacy, what should israel do?
you still havent answered it.