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Thread: The right of self-determination

  1. #31
    Iron Fist Senior Member Husar's Avatar
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    Default Re: The right of self-determination

    Quote Originally Posted by Strike For The South View Post
    The nation has allowed for more equality and advances than any other form of human society.
    So democracy had nothing to do with it? That would mean nations like Iran have more equality and advances than uhm, Texas.


    "Topic is tired and needs a nap." - Tosa Inu

  2. #32
    BrownWings: AirViceMarshall Senior Member Furunculus's Avatar
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    Default Re: The right of self-determination

    Quote Originally Posted by Subotan View Post
    Nationalism is brutish and despicable. It's not something you can chose, and it's therefore not something you should be proud off, certainly not enough to be prepared to declare war to seperate from another state. Unless that minority is actively being repressed by a majority, in which case since the oppressors aren't playing by the rules, it may be nessecary for you to fight back. But of course, since the root of any such conflict would be nationalism, then it all comes back to the central fact that nationalism sowes only death and destruction.
    That's a very broad brush you use to paint a diverse concept:

    I am proud to consider myself a Liberal Nationalist:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberal_nationalism

    Precisely because i believe in demos-cratos, i.e their needs to be a "we" if their is to be consent to be "governed" by others.

    [edit1]
    And it must be pointed out that that "we" is often the result of classical nationalism, i.e. a sense to shared culture and values forged from a millenia of shared history, and if that seems too esoteric for you then just look at English Common Law as merely one example.

    [edit2] inspired by Husars entrance:
    And this is why i oppose the political integration of the UK into the EU, because I believe i am handing over the power of governance (cratos) to those with whom i share insufficient culture and values (demos). In summary; I do not trust that the decisions taken in my name will be those with which i can agree with.
    Last edited by Furunculus; 02-17-2009 at 16:56.
    Furunculus Maneuver: Adopt a highly logical position on a controversial subject where you cannot disagree with the merits of the proposal, only disagree with an opinion based on fundamental values. - Beskar

  3. #33
    Old Town Road Senior Member Strike For The South's Avatar
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    Default Re: The right of self-determination

    Quote Originally Posted by Husar View Post
    So democracy had nothing to do with it? That would mean nations like Iran have more equality and advances than uhm, Texas.
    Iran is a still a democracy sweetheart. I would argue that Iran has more freedoms and has a better SOL than any tribe or fiefdom ever did.
    There, but for the grace of God, goes John Bradford

    My aim, then, was to whip the rebels, to humble their pride, to follow them to their inmost recesses, and make them fear and dread us. Fear is the beginning of wisdom.

    I am tired and sick of war. Its glory is all moonshine. It is only those who have neither fired a shot nor heard the shrieks and groans of the wounded who cry aloud for blood, for vengeance, for desolation.

  4. #34
    Iron Fist Senior Member Husar's Avatar
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    Default Re: The right of self-determination

    Quote Originally Posted by Strike For The South View Post
    Iran is a still a democracy sweetheart. I would argue that Iran has more freedoms and has a better SOL than any tribe or fiefdom ever did.
    So that must mean under the world government we could finally each the epitome of progress.


    "Topic is tired and needs a nap." - Tosa Inu

  5. #35
    Old Town Road Senior Member Strike For The South's Avatar
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    Default Re: The right of self-determination

    A balance must be struck between to big and to small
    There, but for the grace of God, goes John Bradford

    My aim, then, was to whip the rebels, to humble their pride, to follow them to their inmost recesses, and make them fear and dread us. Fear is the beginning of wisdom.

    I am tired and sick of war. Its glory is all moonshine. It is only those who have neither fired a shot nor heard the shrieks and groans of the wounded who cry aloud for blood, for vengeance, for desolation.

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