Results 1 to 30 of 30

Thread: First Mexico... now Argentina

  1. #1
    The Usual Member Ice's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Northville, Michigan
    Posts
    4,259

    Default First Mexico... now Argentina

    We can only hope the United States follows suit.

    http://www.cnn.com/2009/WORLD/americ...ion/index.html

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    Argentina court ruling would allow personal use of pot


    (CNN) -- Argentina's Supreme Court ruled Tuesday it is unconstitutional to punish an adult for private use of marijuana as long as it doesn't harm anyone else.

    The unanimous ruling makes Argentina the second Latin American country in the past four days to allow personal use of a formerly illegal drug.

    The case in question involved five young men who were arrested for having a few marijuana cigarettes in their pockets.

    Supreme Court Justice Carlos Fayt, who at one time supported laws that make personal use of marijuana illegal, told the state-run Telam news agency that "reality" changed his mind.

    Argentina's action came amid growing momentum in Latin America toward decriminalization of possessing small amounts of certain drugs.

    Mexico enacted a law Friday that decriminalizes possessing low quantities of most drugs, including marijuana, heroin, cocaine and LSD.

    Earlier this year, a Brazilian appeals court ruled that possession of drugs for personal use is not illegal.

    Analysts see the shift in attitude as recognition that current methods in the war on drugs are not working.

    "It seems quite clear that drug policy based primarily on interdiction and enforcement has failed," said Robert Pastor, a Latin America national security adviser for President Jimmy Carter in the late 1970s. "Therefore, it's natural for people to stand back and ask, 'Is there a better way?' "

    Pastor noted that some recent research has shown that handling drug use as a health challenge and focusing on treatment may be more efficient.

    "What Argentina and Mexico are doing in many ways is blazing a new path," Pastor said.

    Peter Hakim, president of the Inter-American Dialogue policy institute in Washington, sees a trend at work.

    "It's all part of a harm-reduction approach," Hakim said, noting that policymakers are shifting away from getting rid of drugs and toward figuring out how to reduce harm to users and society.

    Mexico has been considering decriminalization for several years, particularly under the administration of former President Vicente Fox, who held office from 2000-2006. But efforts by the Mexican congress toward decriminalization met with strong resistance from the administration of U.S. President George W. Bush.

    "Mexico tried it under Fox and the U.S. got so snippety that they had to back down," Hakim said.

    President Obama's inauguration in January may have changed the calculus, analysts said. The Mexican congress passed the measure in April and President Felipe Calderon quietly signed it into law.

    In a visit to the United States, Fox said in May a new approach is needed.

    "I believe it's time to open the debate over legalizing drugs," he told CNN. "It must be done in conjunction with the United States, but it is time to open the debate."

    Earlier this year, Fox's predecessor and two other former leaders of Latin American nations also called for the decriminalization of marijuana for personal use and a change in strategy in the war on drugs.

    The three ex-presidents were members of the 17-nation Latin American Commission on Drugs and Democracy, which issued its recommendations in February after studying the issue for a year.

    "The problem is that current policies are based on prejudices and fears and not on results," former Colombian President Cesar Gaviria said at a news conference in which the commission's recommendations were presented.

    Former President Fernando Henrique Cardoso of Brazil said the group called for only the decriminalization of marijuana and not other illicit drugs because "you have to start somewhere."

    Fox's predecessor, Ernesto Zedillo, was president of Mexico from 1994 to 2000. Gaviria was president of Colombia from 1990 to 1994. And Cardoso led Brazil from 1995 to 2002.

    In his swing through the United States, Fox said any change in drug laws must be accompanied by an education campaign in schools and homes. And because the United States is a large consumer of marijuana that comes from Latin America, any steps toward legalization must be supported in Washington, he said.

    Gaviria had said in February that the time was right to start a debate on the subject because of the new administration in Washington.

    "In many states in the United States, as is the case in California, they have begun to change federal policies with regard to tolerating marijuana for therapeutic purposes. And in Washington there's some consensus that the current policy is failing," Gaviria said.

    The Inter-American Dialogue's Hakim said one recent poll showed that 29 percent of Americans think the best way to deal with marijuana is to legalize it.

    Pastor, the former Carter official, wondered whether anyone in Washington is paying attention.

    "The question," he said Tuesday, "is whether the United States will be open to this new path."


    Edit:

    I just caught this... I wonder if it was intentional :lol:
    "It seems quite clear that drug policy based primarily on interdiction and enforcement has failed," said Robert Pastor, a Latin America national security adviser for President Jimmy Carter in the late 1970s. "Therefore, it's natural for people to stand back and ask, 'Is there a better way?' "

    Pastor noted that some recent research has shown that handling drug use as a health challenge and focusing on treatment may be more efficient.

    "What Argentina and Mexico are doing in many ways is blazing a new path," Pastor said.
    Last edited by Ice; 08-26-2009 at 05:58.



  2. #2
    Banned Kadagar_AV's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    In average 2000m above sea level.
    Posts
    4,176

    Default Re: First Mexico... now Argentina


  3. #3
    The Dam Dog Senior Member Sheogorath's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    1,330

    Default Re: First Mexico... now Argentina

    Suddenly, Argentina's tourism industry booms.
    Tallyho lads, rape the houses and burn the women! Leave not a single potted plant alive! Full speed ahead and damn the cheesemongers!

  4. #4
    This comment is witty! Senior Member LittleGrizzly's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    The wilderness...
    Posts
    9,215

    Default Re: First Mexico... now Argentina

    My congratulations to these forward thinking countries able to see the truth staring them in the face... let us hope other more backwards countries can one day reach such a level of understanding on the issues....
    In remembrance of our great Admin Tosa Inu, A tireless worker with the patience of a saint. As long as I live I will not forget you. Thank you for everything!

  5. #5
    White Panther (Legalize Weed!) Member AlexanderSextus's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    THIS! IS! JERSEY!
    Posts
    613

    Default Re: First Mexico... now Argentina

    C'mon obama! Everyone else is doing it!
    Do you hate Drug Cartels? Do You believe that the Drug War is basically a failure? Do you think that if we Legalized the Cannabis market, that use rates would drop, we could put age limits on cannabis, tax it, and other wise regulate it? Join The ORG Marijuana Policy Project!

    In American politics, similar to British politics, we have a choice between being shot in our left testicle or the right testicle. Both parties advocate pissing on the little guys, only in different ways and to a different little guy.

  6. #6

    Default Re: First Mexico... now Argentina

    Looks the like central and south american states are realizing that legalization of marijuana will cripple the drug cartels that probably consist of most of their crime.


  7. #7
    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    The EUSSR
    Posts
    30,680

    Default Re: First Mexico... now Argentina

    Quote Originally Posted by AlexanderSextus View Post
    C'mon obama! Everyone else is doing it!
    A long way to go https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cwbw...eature=related

    People believe this crap lol

  8. #8
    has a Senior Member HoreTore's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Norway
    Posts
    12,014

    Default Re: First Mexico... now Argentina

    Why people bother with such things is beyond me, really...

    @Frags: Bwhahahaha, greatest video ever!
    Last edited by HoreTore; 08-26-2009 at 09:04.
    Still maintain that crying on the pitch should warrant a 3 match ban

  9. #9
    Poll Smoker Senior Member CountArach's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Sydney, Australia
    Posts
    9,029

    Default Re: First Mexico... now Argentina

    Sounds good to me
    Rest in Peace TosaInu, the Org will be your legacy
    Quote Originally Posted by Leon Blum - For All Mankind
    Nothing established by violence and maintained by force, nothing that degrades humanity and is based on contempt for human personality, can endure.

  10. #10
    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    The EUSSR
    Posts
    30,680

    Default Re: First Mexico... now Argentina

    Quote Originally Posted by HoreTore View Post
    Why people bother with such things is beyond me, really...

    @Frags: Bwhahahaha, greatest video ever!
    Oh it gets better, a response was made https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sTPsFIsxM3w

    And it gets even better, a response from Billyboy https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ucJwh0CRopQ

    Our statistics are supposedly different because are a smaller country

  11. #11
    Clan Clan InsaneApache's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    Grand Duchy of Yorkshire
    Posts
    8,636

    Default Re: First Mexico... now Argentina

    Quote Originally Posted by LittleGrizzly View Post
    My congratulations to these forward thinking countries able to see the truth staring them in the face... let us hope other more backwards countries can one day reach such a level of understanding on the issues....
    In other news those well known 'progressives' New Labour are about to criminalise a whole new raft of legal highs. A crude name for a vagina springs to mind.
    There are times I wish they’d just ban everything- baccy and beer, burgers and bangers, and all the rest- once and for all. Instead, they creep forward one apparently tiny step at a time. It’s like being executed with a bacon slicer.

    “Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it whether it exists or not, diagnosing it incorrectly, and applying the wrong remedy.”

    To learn who rules over you, simply find out who you are not allowed to criticise.

    "The purpose of a university education for Left / Liberals is to attain all the politically correct attitudes towards minorties, and the financial means to live as far away from them as possible."

  12. #12
    Poll Smoker Senior Member CountArach's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Sydney, Australia
    Posts
    9,029

    Default Re: First Mexico... now Argentina

    Quote Originally Posted by InsaneApache View Post
    In other news those well known 'progressives' New Labour are about to criminalise a whole new raft of legal highs. A crude name for a vagina springs to mind.
    I stopped there.
    Last edited by CountArach; 08-26-2009 at 11:32.
    Rest in Peace TosaInu, the Org will be your legacy
    Quote Originally Posted by Leon Blum - For All Mankind
    Nothing established by violence and maintained by force, nothing that degrades humanity and is based on contempt for human personality, can endure.

  13. #13
    has a Senior Member HoreTore's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Norway
    Posts
    12,014

    Default Re: First Mexico... now Argentina

    Quote Originally Posted by Fragony View Post
    Oh it gets better, a response was made https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sTPsFIsxM3w

    And it gets even better, a response from Billyboy https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ucJwh0CRopQ

    Our statistics are supposedly different because are a smaller country
    Bwhahahaha!

    Can't blame that womans sources though, she read plenty of..... TRAVEL GUIDES!



    And people still claim Fox News to be a reliable source of information?
    Still maintain that crying on the pitch should warrant a 3 match ban

  14. #14
    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    The EUSSR
    Posts
    30,680

    Default Re: First Mexico... now Argentina

    Quote Originally Posted by HoreTore View Post
    Bwhahahaha!

    Can't blame that womans sources though, she read plenty of..... TRAVEL GUIDES!
    Makes perfect sense, that is how we lure tourists, Amsterdam being a cesspool of corruption and organised crime, who can stay away after that?

  15. #15
    kumquattor Member Riedquat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    34° 36' Sur
    Posts
    1,428

    Default Re: First Mexico... now Argentina

    Gah!

    Nothing changed, now you are allowed to use marihuana in private... good, problem is everybody was using it in public from years now. That was illegal and is illegal still. The law was needed just to regulate the police internal normative, because the "intern laws" they were using for years now were a bit in contradiction with the national laws about marihuana and drugs consumption.

    The true breakthrough was a year ago (IIRC), when they legalized drugs cultivation for personal use, of course it was a complete useless law, you could cultivate it for your personal consumption but unable to consume because it was illegal... doh!

    Possession as far as I know is still illegal and doesn't matter if its for personal use (as far as police is concerned), do you want to guess what law will change next year?

    Dont know about Mexico, but naming my country as a leading example is so wrong...
    Last edited by Riedquat; 08-26-2009 at 18:28.
    returning to the shadows.....

  16. #16
    Senior Member Senior Member naut's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Posts
    9,103

    Default Re: First Mexico... now Argentina

    Quote Originally Posted by a completely inoffensive name View Post
    Looks the like central and south american states are realizing that legalization of marijuana will cripple the drug cartels that probably consist of most of their crime.
    Hmm. Not really. Pot is not an international drug. Most of it is grown in the country or city of it's distribution. 45% of the US's pot comes from the US itself, for example. Drugs that are transported are always C, Opiates and the ingredients to create Amphetamines.
    #Hillary4prism

    BD:TW

    Some piously affirm: "The truth is such and such. I know! I see!"
    And hold that everything depends upon having the “right” religion.
    But when one really knows, one has no need of religion. - Mahavyuha Sutra

    Freedom necessarily involves risk. - Alan Watts

  17. #17
    has a Senior Member HoreTore's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Norway
    Posts
    12,014

    Default Re: First Mexico... now Argentina

    Quote Originally Posted by Psychonaut View Post
    Hmm. Not really. Pot is not an international drug. Most of it is grown in the country or city of it's distribution. 45% of the US's pot comes from the US itself, for example. Drugs that are transported are always C, Opiates and the ingredients to create Amphetamines.
    .....And the various pill-delights.
    Still maintain that crying on the pitch should warrant a 3 match ban

  18. #18
    Senior Member Senior Member naut's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Posts
    9,103

    Default Re: First Mexico... now Argentina

    Quote Originally Posted by HoreTore View Post
    .....And the various pill-delights.
    Most pills are Amphetamines, of varying strength....
    #Hillary4prism

    BD:TW

    Some piously affirm: "The truth is such and such. I know! I see!"
    And hold that everything depends upon having the “right” religion.
    But when one really knows, one has no need of religion. - Mahavyuha Sutra

    Freedom necessarily involves risk. - Alan Watts

  19. #19
    has a Senior Member HoreTore's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Norway
    Posts
    12,014

    Default Re: First Mexico... now Argentina

    Quote Originally Posted by Psychonaut View Post
    Most pills are Amphetamines, of varying strength....
    I'll take your word for that, my knowledge is quite limited...
    Still maintain that crying on the pitch should warrant a 3 match ban

  20. #20
    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    The EUSSR
    Posts
    30,680

    Default Re: First Mexico... now Argentina

    Mine isn't, most exported pills are MDMA or MDA certainly not amphetamins that is readily availlable everywhere.

  21. #21
    Senior Member Senior Member naut's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Posts
    9,103

    Default Re: First Mexico... now Argentina

    Quote Originally Posted by Fragony View Post
    Mine isn't, most exported pills are MDMA or MDA certainly not amphetamins that is readily availlable everywhere.
    Frag. E is your pretty bog standard amphetamine. Afterall MDMA stands for, 3,4-Methylenedioxymethamphetamine. Usually cut with detergent or other nasties. Although you'll find Piperazine is actually what the dealer is selling, not E.
    #Hillary4prism

    BD:TW

    Some piously affirm: "The truth is such and such. I know! I see!"
    And hold that everything depends upon having the “right” religion.
    But when one really knows, one has no need of religion. - Mahavyuha Sutra

    Freedom necessarily involves risk. - Alan Watts

  22. #22
    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    The EUSSR
    Posts
    30,680

    Default Re: First Mexico... now Argentina

    amphetamine = speed. Yes it's an ingredient but MDMA and MDA don't have the same effects as speed.

  23. #23
    Senior Member Senior Member naut's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Posts
    9,103

    Default Re: First Mexico... now Argentina

    Quote Originally Posted by Fragony View Post
    amphetamine = speed. Yes it's an ingredient but MDMA and MDA don't have the same effects as speed.
    Yes. I know, I am a Uni student afterall. Plus I'm a chemist at heart so I always classify the varying forms under the term: amphetamine(s). It's simpler that way. Why anyone would want to get into the stuff I have no idea. Dealer's are not nice people, and amphetamines are easy to cut with all kinds of rubbish.
    #Hillary4prism

    BD:TW

    Some piously affirm: "The truth is such and such. I know! I see!"
    And hold that everything depends upon having the “right” religion.
    But when one really knows, one has no need of religion. - Mahavyuha Sutra

    Freedom necessarily involves risk. - Alan Watts

  24. #24
    Clan Clan InsaneApache's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    Grand Duchy of Yorkshire
    Posts
    8,636

    Default Re: First Mexico... now Argentina

    I'll say. Not that I'd know of course, never having taken an illegal drug in my life but I do believe you can get your kip the same day. Not two days later. So I've heard.
    There are times I wish they’d just ban everything- baccy and beer, burgers and bangers, and all the rest- once and for all. Instead, they creep forward one apparently tiny step at a time. It’s like being executed with a bacon slicer.

    “Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it whether it exists or not, diagnosing it incorrectly, and applying the wrong remedy.”

    To learn who rules over you, simply find out who you are not allowed to criticise.

    "The purpose of a university education for Left / Liberals is to attain all the politically correct attitudes towards minorties, and the financial means to live as far away from them as possible."

  25. #25
    has a Senior Member HoreTore's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Norway
    Posts
    12,014

    Default Re: First Mexico... now Argentina

    Quote Originally Posted by Psychonaut View Post
    Yes. I know, I am a Uni student afterall. Plus I'm a chemist at heart
    Dutch trumps uni student chemist.
    Still maintain that crying on the pitch should warrant a 3 match ban

  26. #26

    Default Re: First Mexico... now Argentina

    Quote Originally Posted by Psychonaut View Post
    Hmm. Not really. Pot is not an international drug. Most of it is grown in the country or city of it's distribution. 45% of the US's pot comes from the US itself, for example. Drugs that are transported are always C, Opiates and the ingredients to create Amphetamines.
    Nevertheless as pot becomes legal, companies will sprout to capture the market, cutting profits from the drug lords.

    And since when is reducing the amount of pot the drug lords are making down to 45% of what it once was, bad? From my math that means 55% of pot is imported which seems like a majority to me.


  27. #27
    Clan Clan InsaneApache's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    Grand Duchy of Yorkshire
    Posts
    8,636

    Default Re: First Mexico... now Argentina

    If alcohol was discovered tommorow, it'd be a class A drug.
    There are times I wish they’d just ban everything- baccy and beer, burgers and bangers, and all the rest- once and for all. Instead, they creep forward one apparently tiny step at a time. It’s like being executed with a bacon slicer.

    “Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it whether it exists or not, diagnosing it incorrectly, and applying the wrong remedy.”

    To learn who rules over you, simply find out who you are not allowed to criticise.

    "The purpose of a university education for Left / Liberals is to attain all the politically correct attitudes towards minorties, and the financial means to live as far away from them as possible."

  28. #28
    Friend of Lady Luck Member Mooks's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    1,290

    Default Re: First Mexico... now Argentina

    Quote Originally Posted by a completely inoffensive name View Post
    Nevertheless as pot becomes legal, companies will sprout to capture the market, cutting profits from the drug lords.
    And that my friend, is every pothead's wet dream. Not having to deal with the usual ******** of "Ya ill be there in 20" and having to wait close to a hour, or having to weigh out the bag and finding out it was skimped. Or the already outrageous price (I think it is, 1.5 grams of weed for 10 dollars? WTF!). Instead of all that just going up to the corner store for a pack of ciggerates and a couple of spliffs (Which would cost half of what it is today once the market gets settled).

    Itd be a druglords worst nightmare though, as he would have to move to harder drugs or get....*gasp* a real job.

    Not that I know any of this from real experience though, purely 2nd hand experience.
    Last edited by Banquo's Ghost; 08-27-2009 at 07:26. Reason: All letters of a profanity to be asterisked out, please
    Quote Originally Posted by Furunculus View Post
    i love the idea that angsty-teens can get so spazzed out by computer games that they try to rage-rape themselves with a remote.

  29. #29
    Honorary Argentinian Senior Member Gyroball Champion, Karts Champion Caius's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    I live in my home, don't you?
    Posts
    8,114

    Default Re: First Mexico... now Argentina

    Please smokers don't celebrate yet. There is misunderstanding about the issue, it is illegal but you can't be arrested. It is called "ensurance of the Liberty Right."

    Oh yes, it is illegal. Except that they can't get you when you are smoking. Besides, if you get caught, you are not suspect of possesion of drugs, you are WITNESS of it, hence you have to point out to the drug dealer. I think that being a witness in a judicial case forces you to tell the truth, else you go to jail for giving a "False Testimony".

    My congratulations to these forward thinking countries able to see the truth staring them in the face... let us hope other more backwards countries can one day reach such a level of understanding on the issues....
    You do realize that we fight against drugs, yet some people celebrate.

    And if you call a forward thinking country Argentina, a country that nationalized the country flag Airline when almost NO COUNTRY has a State Airline, and tries to bring the Keynesian model when everyone opts for the Liberal model, then that is damn forward thinking country!




    Names, secret names
    But never in my favour
    But when all is said and done
    It's you I love

  30. #30
    Mr Self Important Senior Member Beskar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Albion
    Posts
    15,930
    Blog Entries
    1

    Default Re: First Mexico... now Argentina

    I think the Portugal system works best. Makes drugs legal to use, but illegal to supply.

    The bigger market it brings, the more it lures the drug dealers out of hiding and it saves more on taxes as you are only targeting the suppliers. Plus, you can do a service where users can "submit" who their dealer is, busting them that way as well.
    Last edited by Beskar; 08-29-2009 at 06:09.
    Days since the Apocalypse began
    "We are living in space-age times but there's too many of us thinking with stone-age minds" | How to spot a Humanist
    "Men of Quality do not fear Equality." | "Belief doesn't change facts. Facts, if you are reasonable, should change your beliefs."

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO