Pirate Ship Mafia [Concluded]

[scotchedpommes]

Regarding investigations, is Andres claiming to have access to the results of two first-time investigations of are there two first-time investigations Sigurd? As we know, a second investigation by the same watchman wouldn't provide details of activity.

[White_eyes:D]

You just jumped off one bandwagon... and jumped on another... and still question me calling you on wanting to bandwagon?

I get 3 GOLD for voting.......So that means somebody is going to be lynched...

Suddenly, I am Mafia for going on a bandwagon on somebody and then going on another??
I guess the Mafia have taken over the ship....Good game

[TinCow]

Did I miss a detective result being published in this thread - or is Andres revealing himself to be privy to detective results that we lowly crewmen don't have? If so, does that make him a Brit agent?

To be fair to Andres, CR said he had seen results here. The First Mate can either investigate or kill solo. Since we haven't seen any solo kills, Louis has obviously been spending him time investigating. It is not surprising that CR would have access to these results, nor that Louis would investigate his fellow officers right at the start.

[CountArach]

I get 3 GOLD for voting.......So that means somebody is going to be lynched...

Yes, but putting thought into your vote is the far better option at this point when there are no clear l

ynch targets screaming out (With concrete evidence to back it up).
Suddenly, I am Mafia for going on a bandwagon on somebody and then going on another??
I guess the Mafia have taken over the ship....Good game

You aren't scummy for bandwagoning people... you are scummy for doing so thoughtlessly. There is no case against pever nor one against Sigurd.

[Andres]

Here:

He's someone to consider: Sigurd.

I've heard of some investigations of him. Now, this was the second investigation, which meant it had more info than the first investigation. But it didn't say he was protecting anybody, as his first investigation did.

And what do we have this night? A killing by the maven crew members, which didn't happen the first night. Maybe he was busy killing and not investigating.

That leads me to wonder just what the Quartermaster was up to last night. Perhaps he can explain it to us.

CR

Followed by:

If this is a question of mechanics, the three-tiered investigation systems works like so, with a few wrinkles:

1. What you were doing that night
2. Susceptibility (and only that)
3. True affiliation

And then CR concluding this:

Ah, I see. Still, I am suspicious. Sigurd, excellent mafia player that he is, would know those rules. He'd also be likely to know that he would most likely be investigated starting the first night, so that he could participate in evil mafioso activities on night two.

What have you been up to, Sigurd? You've been rather non-talkative through PMs and in the thread. Something in my gut makes me rather suspicious of you.

CR

And then this:

Ahoy there, me hearties!

I be askin again because it seems ye not be hearin me.

Will a couple of ye vote for Sigurd? I be havin' a bad feeling about him, and I think a little pressure would do the crew good.

I be askin' not for a bandwagon or even a lynch at this time, just some votes to put him near the top of the lynch list.

CR

Ergo, the case (CR's case, CR who first mentioned detective results to give his case more credibility) against Sigurd is:

Investigation on N2 didn't say anything about Sigurd's night actions. This is perfectly normal. But, Sigurd is a good player and would now that and there for probably was involved in scummy activities.

And based on that "case", you guys started a bandwagon on Sigurd??



a) My gut feeling is better than that; pevergreen is a better lynch.
b) Captain CR mentions detective results, but those results prove nada, because they're not conclusive -> scummy. Scummy person in a position to order town -> not good. If Sigurd is innocent -> remove CR.
c) If the detective results come from Louis: FoS : Louis; why sharing with CR? Get yourself protection (top priority; get two groups to be sure) and share with nobody until you have a conclusive third investigation. Why so careless with valuable info?

[KukriKhan]

TinCow's interpretation of the rules is correct.

So, on any given day-phase, any player could type:

vote: mutiny
vote: George Bush

and, if successful, both the Cap'n and George would walk the plank. Interesting.

To be fair to Andres, CR said he had seen results here. The First Mate can either investigate or kill solo. Since we haven't seen any solo kills, Louis has obviously been spending him time investigating. It is not surprising that CR would have access to these results, nor that Louis would investigate his fellow officers right at the start.

OK, I'll grant that. I looked back in the thread and have come to the same conclusion, i.e. CR started the mention of det results. I concede my case v. Andres is weaker now. I'm still bugged by his inconsistency, though. Not like him at all.

[scotchedpommes]

Captain CR mentions detective results, but those results prove nada, because they're not conclusive -> scummy. Scummy person in a position to order town -> not good. If Sigurd is innocent -> remove CR.

*sigh*

Doubtless there are those already at work clarifying the loyalties of the rabbit. Removing him will be straightforward if we need to, but you continue on your mutinous bent.

This one could do with a fry-up.

[TinCow]

c) If the detective results come from Louis: FoS : Louis; why sharing with CR? Get yourself protection (top priority; get two groups to be sure) and share with nobody until you have a conclusive third investigation. Why so careless with valuable info?

Speaking from my perspective, if I was Captain, I'd demand to see the results every night or I'd kick the person out of office. What's the point of appointing a First Officer if he won't cooperate with you?

[pevergreen]

unvote, Vote: Andres
Ten to midnight, up at 6am again. I need to sleep.

[Andres]

Speaking from my perspective, if I was Captain, I'd demand to see the results every night or I'd kick the person out of office. What's the point of appointing a First Officer if he won't cooperate with you?

Then I, as a First Officer, would tell him to leave me alone or face a mutiny.

Captain can wait until he has been thoroughly investigated.

[DisgruntledGoat]

Back from a brief respite and I still see Andres pushing for that Mutiny. Andres, if we remove the good capt'n who would you suggest we replace him with?

Until I get an answer, Vote: Andres

You're seemingly desperate to get rid of CR as captain. Personally, the argument that if someone proposes a lynch and is wrong they are guilty to be weak at best and a good way to knock out townies. Two days, two attempts to discredit CR. You've clearly got an agenda and that agenda has to do with the position of captain.

[Andres]

*sigh*

Doubtless there are those already at work clarifying the loyalties of the rabbit. Removing him will be straightforward if we need to, but you continue on your mutinous bent.

This one could do with a fry-up.

Well, he's not "clarified" yet, is he? Why blindly follow him when he makes a bad case? The sole fact of him being captain doesn't make the case against Sigurd good, does it? Yet many of you just bandwagoned Sigurd because the Captain said so. Sigurd can't even defend himself because of RL.

If CR wishes to wield so much power, then he must agree to accept the responsability that comes with such power. Failure = mutiny.

[TinCow]

Then I, as a First Officer, would tell him to leave me alone or face a mutiny.

Captain can wait until he has been thoroughly investigated.

If there is one thing that others have said about you that does stick: you seem hugely keen on encouraging mutiny. Why should the Captain even trust his First Officer? The Captain has no way of knowing whether the First Officer is scum, so why shouldn't he demand results from the First Officer, if only to ensure that his officer is actually doing his job every night and isn't off recruiting people? The Captain in this game is far more powerful than any normal 'Director' position. If he's not using that power, why is he in that position?

[Andres]

Back from a brief respite and I still see Andres pushing for that Mutiny. Andres, if we remove the good capt'n who would you suggest we replace him with?

Until I get an answer, Vote: Andres

You're seemingly desperate to get rid of CR as captain. Personally, the argument that if someone proposes a lynch and is wrong they are guilty to be weak at best and a good way to knock out townies. Two days, two attempts to discredit CR. You've clearly got an agenda and that agenda has to do with the position of captain.

I'm a pirate. Screw up and face mutiny. If the Rabbit is correct or if he just stops being a dictator giving orders and let the pirates think for themselves, then no mutiny.

If CR gets removed, then the most manly of all pirates should take his place: Sasaki Kojiro.

[DisgruntledGoat]

I
If CR gets removed, then the most manly of all pirates should take his place: Sasaki Kojiro.

At least you had the balls to state the obvious. I take it you'd be First Officer and head hunting every night right?

[Beskar]

I been susipicious of Andres ever since he tried to use me in a false protection to hide himself doing a Vig kill.

vote:Andres

[Yaropolk]

Unvote Sigurd

Andres - you have me convinced, Sigurd is not that suspicious

Vote Andres

[Andres]

I been susipicious of Andres ever since he tried to use me in a false protection to hide himself doing a Vig kill.

vote:Andres

I beg you pardon

[Sasaki Kojiro]

Sigurd should not be lynched. Has two investigations on him already, just needs one more to clear/condemn him.

The case on pevergreen has some merit.

Andres, your making yourself an easy target...

I'm not too convinced that the hit on taka was indeed made by an undermanned town vig group. As far as I know, the rules don't say anything about if newly recruited members of the maven or the british might not be able to perform an action for their new masters the same night they were recruited. Also the cause of it's failure might lie with other causes, the write-up at least doesn't say anything about some persons missing. I know the chronology of the write up speaks against it, but maybe that is something to consider.

When it comes to voting I'm not content with the way it is going right now. We already lost two phases with wrong actions, so might I ask for some focus of the town here. Even if it is unpiraty.

Anyway, from what I've heard of Sigurd I don't think the suspicion on him is in order, I of course don't know for fact, but it is just a feeling I have. The case against A1 Unit seems to have a bit basis, but I'm not sure either.
All in all IMHO we have some real reasons to be suspicious about the people Diana presented, not say anything might be caused by a lack of time, but has also a scummy feel about it.
So I'll Vote: Khazaar.

If anybody has a better case against someone of those 5 or anybody else, let me know.

Suspiciousness overload. This is the classic "I'm mafia and want to be active but don't want to commit to anything" post. Joooray really doesn't want to be criticized for his vote on khazaar the way a few other people have drawn flak for their votes today.

For scientific reference (anecdotes are proof obviously):

https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showp...&postcount=284

Centurion was indeed guilty.

[Andres]

Andres, your making yourself an easy target...

I know. Somebody has to stir up discussion.

This is good for me as a wake-up call; I almost forgot how frustrating playing mafia can be, being at risk of getting lynched instead of Sigurd because I stated that the case against that same Sigurd () is rubbish.

[Crazed Rabbit]

So Andres, you say the evidence on Sigurd isn't strong. I'll admit that it isn't that strong. But you and Sasaki killed LG and then got woad lynched, and I'll bet they're going to turn out innocent.

And then you try to start a bandwagon on pevergreen, with evidence no stronger than that on Sigurd? Rather odd, to me.

CR

[ricera10]

Vote: Abstain

The premises for voting are too flimsy. :-/

[Beskar]

I beg you pardon

You tried to put a protection group together last minute with me and YLC involved, however, you was involved with a Vig kill, and with the time that would have been remaining, it I very doubt that was put together afterwards.

So in total, you tried to us a protection group with me and YLC (plus one other, I deleted the pm so can't check now >.<) so it looks like you was part of a protection, to cover your behind as you vig killed some one.

In otherwords, you was actually being dishonest with people.

[Andres]

You tried to put a protection group together last minute with me and YLC involved, however, you was involved with a Vig kill, and with the time that would have been remaining, it I very doubt that was put together afterwards.

So in total, you tried to us a protection group with me and YLC (plus one other, I deleted the pm so can't check now >.<) so it looks like you was part of a protection, to cover your behind as you vig killed some one.

In otherwords, you was actually being dishonest with people.

That's a straight lie.

I was not trying to do a protection with YLC and you.

I contacted you, YLC and SSNeo to see if the four of us could make a group; you replied that you were already grouped.

EDIT: and that was night 1.
EDIT 2: and I did not "hide" that I did a vig kill as you stated in your previous post. Did you already forget that I almost got lynched the previous day, because I told in public, in this very same thread, that I had vig killed; that's not exactly "hiding" is it?

[Beskar]

That is not a straight lie, especially as you just admitted to trying to form the said group. How can I lie and saying the truth at the same time?

Also, why were you trying to set up this protection last minute, when you was already going to conduct the said vig kill.

Also, you told in public as there was a chance you was going to get exposed anyway.

[Andres]

That is not a straight lie, especially as you just admitted to trying to form the said group. How can I lie and saying the truth at the same time?

Also, why were you trying to set up this protection last minute, when you was already going to conduct the said vig kill.

Also, you told in public as there was a chance you was going to get exposed anyway.

I got your reply at 13.34 (GMT+2); I went with the vigilante after that reply. My N1 pm'ing has been explained and analysed in the previous round.

[Andres]

That is not a straight lie, especially as you just admitted to trying to form the said group. How can I lie and saying the truth at the same time?

Also, why were you trying to set up this protection last minute, when you was already going to conduct the said vig kill.

Also, you told in public as there was a chance you was going to get exposed anyway.

It was not "last minute". That's the lie. You make it sound as if I contacted you when I had already committed myself to another group, as if I wanted to confuse you or make you waste your night ability. That's simply not true.

Either you were very unfortunate in your wording or you are telling the town a lie.

[Beskar]

See? You just had to explain it, opposed to calling me a liar, which I wasn't.

Bad Andres.

Edit: As for Last Minute, that is a subjective expression, in my opinion, it was near the end of the phase and with the different timezones, etc, it was quite "Last Minute" in my opinion.

[Andres]

See? You just had to explain it, opposed to calling me a liar, which I wasn't.

Bad Andres.

Whatever.

[Subotan]

The tally currently stands at
8 - Andres
5 - Sigurd