My Russian Horse-Archer Blues

[Empirate]

I have serious problems getting decent results in mediaval 2 tw. Where as in rome tw: bi I was relying in cavarly and got insane results with them.

I'm pretty sure that this is because there is no physics (no momentum, no weight) in the game. Because of this my super heavy sock charge cavarly doesnt charge trought the enemy town guards leaving body parts after. It just charges and kills some with the bonus and then begins brawl and isnt able to come out whitout heavy casualties.

Another thing is that the cavarly units have turning rate and they get stuck between each other. So they act like they where on horse first time and keep on brawling since there no way out. Where as trained horse unit would just turn right, keep shield to left and give out overhead punishment with weapon.

The horse units seem to walk instead of run most of the time too. You really dont do that when theres someone hanging from ur horses tail and another hanging from your shield.

Mostly agree with the above post, only the quoted part wants refutation. Cavalry charges are absolutely devastating if done right. You can basically expect to obliterate any single unit in your tech class when you pull off a full charge with heavy cav/knights, even head on. Obvious exceptions are pike units, of course.

On physics: Rome was the game with no (realistic) physics, whereas Medieval II has it all: mass, momentum, acceleration, and so on. Regardless of obstacles, Rome always let you run your horse full speed, meaning it was basically impossible to stop them once they were at "cruise speed". Even Triarii couldn't easily catch and hold an enemy horse unit. Generals were impossible to stop with infantry - with the exception of phalanx units, naturally.

In Medieval II, many things can stop your horses cold, and it is a little bit harder to pull out of (not to mention through, as was all too common in Rome) engaged enemy units. This means you must carefully maneuver your cavalry. They can win the battle for you, but they're not the "I win" button they were in Rome. In Medieval II, you need a more balanced army than the typical all cavalry armies of Rome. Hell, in Rome I conquered the map with Roundshield Cavalry. You won't see me doing the same using Mounted Sergeants in Medieval II. This is as it should be IMO.

The recipe for pulling off a successful charge is as follows:

0. Don't charge up a steep hill, or in areas with lots of obstacles, or against a pike unit.
1. Walk or run up your heavy cav/knights, then wait. Let them reform before charging.
2. Make sure your heavy cav/knights is aligned as parallel or as much at right angles to the target unit as possible. Make sure you have sufficient space to reach full gallop (ca. 100 meters or so).
3. Order the charge with a single right click. Lean back and watch the carnage.

Obviously it can be a little hard to pull this off perfectly in a big involved fight. Still, try to be as close as you come to this ideal charge, and you'll see much better results. Try it in small rebel clearing battles at first, to get the hang of it. Also, cavalry is very good for running down missile troops and attacking an enemy's rear (even without charging, which is often difficult against a unit already engaged in melee). They have a tactical role, but they're not unstoppable behemoths.

And forget all Rome supposedly taught you about the "physics" of heavy horse.

[_Tristan_]

The recipe for pulling off a successful charge is as follows:

0. Don't charge up a steep hill, or in areas with lots of obstacles, or against a pike unit.
1. Walk or run up your heavy cav/knights, then wait. Let them reform before charging.
2. Make sure your heavy cav/knights is aligned as parallel or as much at right angles to the target unit as possible. Make sure you have sufficient space to reach full gallop (ca. 100 meters or so).
3. Order the charge with a single right click. Lean back and watch the carnage.

Not much to add to this

0 - Perfectly right.
1 - Depends whether or not you cav starts aligned and facing your desired target. If so do not bother with this.
2 - Works better but even at 45° angle you should obtain good results. Might be particularly useful if your targeting the captain/general unit as he will bear the brunt of the charge.
3 - Order the charge with a signle right click. Then type "R" for run and watch the carnage. Gains time.

I'll add a 4 - When using heavy cav against the enemy line, if the enemy has missile units arrayed in front of his infantry, target the infantry unit directly behind the missile one as per (3) and watch as the missileers are trampled to death while the charge scores against the infantry.

I often managed to kill one unit of missiles (leaving often less than 10 soldiers) and maim severely either one of spears or foot knights (killing about half of them) in a single charge done as above.

[Sebastian Seth]

I got little better results now with the heavy lancers. (I followed the instructions in posts above. Thank you.) The units where so expencive so I used them to take out enemy archers at first. (By making a big half circle and then hitting them form sides.) But then they got some silver marks on them and I started charging the enemy infantry quite freely. Even italian spear militias seemed to go down nicely.

I still havent found way to use unarmored horse archers in any good way. I tought I play bysantines next and see if I can come up with some use to them. In open battles I manage to pull some use out of them but in sieges they are suffering 100% casualty rate at my hands.

[Old Geezer]

I agree that Russia is perhaps the most difficult faction primarily because of the position and the widely spaced settlements with relatively poor economic potential. If I ever try to play as them again I will increase unit movement points and move west and south asap (i.e. Kiev and the Baltic). Why bother going for Bulgar, Sarkel, or Helsinki? Well, Helsinki can be used to get some troops some experience and maybe if you convert it to a city it will eventually make a little money.