Swords and D20's Minimafia: The City of Doors [Concluded]

[Yaropolk]

+ =
Woe is me!

[Double A]

Good job Reonk!

[Askthepizzaguy]

Always trust your instincts.

Diamondeye, you were guilty and your claimed role was fake fake fake. I told you it was, I knew it was, I said that I should just trust my instincts and lynch you. Remember? Remember how much leeway and benefit of the doubt I gave you? Oh I was very nice to you and I played this little game with you, but your time is at an end.

I conclusively found you out to be the doppelganger last night. I saw you killing Imasu. Goodbye, foul wraith.

Vote: Diamondeye

[Diamondeye]

You Think this is over, Roy? Finally I stand unmasked, yet it will take more than you to stop me! The trap has been sprung, and you will all die! You were a fool for trusssting me. Good guys always make the same mistake.

Haley, at last your will be done. Roy must tumble into his grave! Vote: AskThePizzaGuy

[Askthepizzaguy]

You Think this is over, Roy? Finally I stand unmasked, yet it will take more than you to stop me! The trap has been sprung, and you will all die! You were a fool for trusssting me. Good guys always make the same mistake.

Haley, at last your will be done. Roy must tumble into his grave! Vote: AskThePizzaGuy

Heh, you'd think that you'd at least lie a little bit to try to confuse atheotes.



The thing that bothers me... why didn't you guys actually kill anyone for all those nights?



edit: as an aside, I consider this a moral victory for you because I went with CCRunner over you, when I KNEW I should have gone with the "other detective" in the game. Especially after you claimed that atheotes was innocent.

Come to think of it, claiming that atheotes was innocent = even bigger mistake. I don't think you thought that one through.

[Diamondeye]

Heh, you'd think that you'd at least lie a little bit to try to confuse atheotes.



The thing that bothers me... why didn't you guys actually kill anyone for all those nights?



edit: as an aside, I consider this a moral victory for you because I went with CCRunner over you, when I KNEW I should have gone with the "other detective" in the game. Especially after you claimed that atheotes was innocent.

Come to think of it, claiming that atheotes was innocent = even bigger mistake. I don't think you thought that one through.

I love how that smile is called "Mellow".

I suspect I can tell you we only had one kill all game. AA was saving it for Roy and thus failed to use it.

I can't remember why I wanted to claim Atheotes innocent. I think I was going along with being naïve/reverse. Also, finally, my revenge over CC for the Netherworld kill :|

This game isn't over yet (and Atheotes hasn't even voted )

[Askthepizzaguy]

Not to worry, I've politely reminded him.

Although I could see this game going to a coin-toss due to the CCRunner lynch. You guys certainly played a good game even though I played a better one. Hiding my Roy-ness from you was teh correct move.

JUUUUUULES THE SWASHBUCKLER!!! = lawl

[atheotes]

Vote: Diamondeye

3 AM in the morning = time

[Diamondeye]

You sound so much like you've already won, ATPG.

[Askthepizzaguy]

You sound so much like you've already won, ATPG.

Well look, mister Diamondeye, if there were two of you left, you would have already won. So there would be no point in this.

And if you had some ability which could protect you from the lynch, that's petty overpowered, since you could also defend yourself from investigation and you knew who your partner was. Since we know who you are and we have the votes to lynch you, the game is basically over. If you can win under these circumstances, then I'm not sure why CDF is allowing there to even be a vote.

In my book, two votes versus one against the last mafia is a win.

[Diamondeye]

I wasn't immune to investigations, I just had a chance to resist (like 60%, I believe). The kill was AA's originally.

I am looking forward to the update... Nothing is certain yet.
*crosses fingers*

[Double A]

That is pretty fun.

[Askthepizzaguy]

So how about the update already?

[Cultured Drizzt fan]

So how about the update already?

I am begining to write it now

[Cultured Drizzt fan]

Last day:




It was finally down to the last stretch. The Barman Argued his case, but when Jules brought out his own evidence and Blackadder backed him, he stopped trying.

The Board read simply:
Roy: 2
Barman: 2

Roy looked peeved “wait a minute, how is there 4 votes when there is only 3 of us?”
Blackadder Coughed “it’s a game mechanic, just pretend it makes sense.”
“ohhh….. Sorry. Well regardless, Its over Reonk! Prepare to die!” Roy took out his sword, while Blackadder tried to huddle behind him. “Also, Blackadder, Do you think maybe you could, you know HELP!!!! This entire time you have been sitting back and letting us PC’s take the brunt of things, you think you could Contribute?”
Blackadder Layughed “yeah right, I am as you say an NPC, I have absolutely no stake in this! I am pretty sure as soon as you are dead me and reonk can have a good long laugh at your expense!” He nodded, believeing every word “I have had enough of you PC’s, and I just want to go home!”

Reonk reverted to his normal guise, and his blank face looked bemused (yeah, it works. Just think about it.) “uhhhh, actually man, as soon as Roy is dead, so are you.”

“……. Ohhhh……. So……. “ Blackadder took out a small rod, a angered look in his eye. Reonk grabbed a dagger from his bandoleer, and readied himself for a fight.

Roy rushed in, his sword above his head. It slashed down, but Reonk’s form seemed to melt to the side, molding itself to miss the attack. He slashed back with his dagger, the blade skittering off of Roy’s mail armor. The two moved back, squaring off.
“Its over Reonk. Just let yourself die already! Haleys plan has failed!”
Reonk Laughed “Its not over yet Roy. Not over yet.” He lunged forward dagger outstretched, only to have a blast of flame hit him in the side. He was thrown bodily into the wall, screeching.

Blackadder wooped, the rod at his side glowing red hot “BOOOYAY! Head shot!” He raised his amrs
“Iiiiiii aaammmm the champion, my friend! I’llll keep on Fighting to the eeeennnnddd!” He started singing, doing a victory dance. Roy stood in stunned silence, mouth agape.

Blackadder moved over to the downed doppelganger, thrusting his butt into the creatures face, “that’s right baby, take it. That’s how we do it NPC style!”

Needless to say, Reonks punch hit a very vulnerable area. Blackadder flew away, eyes crossed and his girly scream hardly more than a dog whistle.
Roy sighed “Halo players. So amateur.” He ran forward, hoping to overwhelm Reonk as he tried to stand. His sword stuck deep into Reonks charred left side, who writhed in pain before lashing out with his fist. Roy staggered, and the doppelganger arose, his skin blackened and cracking with every move.

“….o….kkkaaay thhhat was pretty good. But I am still alive.” The creature wobbled, walking forward. Roy just shook his head, his sword exploding forward and decapitating the creature. Reonk fell in two pieces, and Roy fell heavily to the ground.

His sword stuck into the bars floor, and he sighed. “Finally over. Finally.”

Blackadder groaned, rolling onto his knees “is he dead? Did we win?”

“Yeah, we won.” Roy rose, looking into his pocket, sighing.
“whats up?”
“I was just thinking how many years it’s going to take to pay off the loan I need to take out to get the gang resurrected.” He stood and walked out of the bar, the door having been disenchanted when Reonk died.
“hey man, where you going?”

“to get a cleric, you can go and do whatever, this nightmare is over.”

Blackadder sighed “Yeah, I am going home. I am sick of being back in the center of attention.”



It was all over, finally and truly. Well, Gesundheit was still trapped, but other than that it’s all over.
Daimondeye has been lynched (random org determined.)



Living:
ATPG
Atheotes


Dead: 4
White_eyes:D
DoubleA
CCrunner
Yaropolk
Diamondeye


----------------------------------------------------



Victory Chart:

Total Victory:
Yaropolk, PC Isamu
ATPG, PC Roy (or Jules if you prefer )
Atheotes, NPC Blackadder
White_eyes:D, NPC Vicky


Minor Victory:
CCrunner, PC A Very Strong Fighter


Cold Taste of Defeat:
DiamondEye, Mafia Doppelganger
DoubleA, Mafia Haley

[Cultured Drizzt fan]

Role PM's



DoubleA, Haley the Wraith

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

You are……
Schism the Cleric
Alignment: Lawful Good, PC. Townie
Level: 11th level Cleric

Well Schism, looks like things are turning out pretty well for you. Your group (aptly named Gesundheits Delvers) has been searching for years to free Gesundheit, hunting down every lead they can. As the groups cleric you have been the healer and main spell caster for now, what with your wizard incapacitated (AVSF’s Bard levels don’t count), as the spell caster you have a big deal of burden on you to make sure everyone gets out of this alive, but you manage to stay up beat in spite of that! And now you have made your way to Sigil, City of Doors. The lead you were trying to get was a lie however, perpetrated by Haley in a twisted attempt at getting vengeance on you and your friends. Man, she needs to get a life! Might have to do an exorcism to get this whole thing over with!

Abilities:
Voting, self explanatory

Protect: During the night, you can use your abilities to protect someone from harm, making sure that if that person is attacked then it will fail to kill its target.

Victory Conditions: Get one you get a minor victory, two you get a major victory
1. Eliminate Haley and her doppelganger friend
2. Make sure at least one PC aligned player lives to get everyone else rezzed.

Just kidding. This is your cover role



You are….
Haley The Wraith
Alignment: Chaotic Evil, Big Bad, Mafia
Level: 5th level Rogue/ 3rd level Wizard/ 4th level spellthief

Haley…. The ultimate symbol of obsession. You have spent the last 20 years of your unlife in a dark and unholy quest for vengeance against your former friend, Roy the fighter. You were torn from your place in the upper planes by your twisted rage, and became an ethereal wraith, able to only partially touch the corporal world. Normally you could not be tangible enough to impersonate anyone, but you managed to have a special belt constructed to make your form physical. Using magic you have mastered over your long quest, you have managed to impersonate one of the fools in the tavern. They all have to die anyway. You look around yourself with a grin, many familiar faces are here. You have tried hundreds of times to kill Roy, but even you can tell this will be the last. People ARE going to die here, you will see sure to that. You will be victorious, you must be or it will have all been for naught. You have brought along the only person you have any close relationship with, Reonk the doppelganger. He has been your only companion for many years. The two of you work well together, and you think that together you can finally win your revenge, and your peace.

Reonk is…… Diamondeye

You have already killed Schism while the bar was darkened, his body is stashed in a portable hole on your hip. You have impersonated him perfectly!


Abilities:
Vote: self explanatory
Massacre: once during the game you are able to call upon all your rage and anger, using it to overwhelm and destroy one of your opponents. 1 time kill ability used during the night.
Finding Roy: every night you can perform a special investigation on 1 person to see if they are Roy. That is all you can determine by it, only if the target is Roy.

Victory Conditions: Get one you get a minor victory, two you get a major victory
1. Kill everyone, get to a point where mafia outnumbers Townies
2. Roy must die by your hand. Personally kill Roy.

Diamondeye, Reonk the Doppelganger

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

You are….
The Bartender
Alignment: Neutral. NPC. Townie
Level: 4th level Expert

Nine hells…… These PC’s are going to be the end of you, you can already tell. Honestly, you have years without a bar fight and are having a wonderful profit margin, and BAM, pc’s pop out of nowhere and bring with them a ton of trouble. Honestly, how is a man supposed to make a honets living when he has to deal with PC’s? Ahh well, live and let live you always say, no reason to cry over spilt milk. All you can do is simply help this bunch clean up the mess they have set in motion, and stop this wraith. Haley was it?



Abilities:
Vote: self explanatory
Barman: During the night phase you can choose one person to investigate and find their alignment. By selling them drinks and creating a proxy lie detector you can learn all sorts of things!

Victory Conditions: Get one you get a minor victory, two you get a major victory
1. Get rid of these strange Creatures threatening to destroy your bar! Eliminate all anti town roles.
2. Live through this horrible experience…

Just kidding, this is your cover Role.


You are….
Reonk, the Doppelganger.
Alignment: Neutral Evil. The Dragon. Mafia
Level: 9th level Fighter/ 3rd level rogue

Ahhhh, life is a strange thing, even for a ruthless hit man Doppelganger. You have been in Haleys employ for a long time now, always with the same goal. Killing Roy and anyone he is friends with. And for all this time they have managed to stay alive. But things are different now. This is the biggest plan Haley has ever put in motion, and the stakes have never been higher. It’s time to do this, and finally do the job you were called on to do…… Thigns are complicated between you and haley. She is a single-minded, stoic, shrewish, jerk. And yet…. You have come to realize something. You love her. Never have you felt so close to someone (other than when you eat their brain of course, that does not count) and wanted them to feel the same way about you….. You’re a doppelganger for god sake, when has a doppelganger ever been in love? But you are, you have accepted that, and you think that maybe when she has finally accomplished her task, the two of you can leave behind all of this, and finally be truly together!

Haley is….. DoubleA


Abilities:
Vote: self explanatory
Sneaky Vote: because you have impersonated the person who is making the tallies on the magic bard, and devoured all of the man’s memories, you knew how to cheat the system. You can add an extra vote to the result, on anyone you want to.

Victory Conditions: Get one you get a minor victory, two you get a major victory
1. Kill everyone, get to a point where mafia outnumbers Townies
2. Make sure your reluctant beloved lives (or her version of living at least)

Yaropolk, Isamu the rogue

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

You are……
Isamu, Rogue Extraordinare!
Alignment: Neutral Good, PC. Townie
Level: 10th level Rogue

These years have been kind to you Isamu, and you and your buddies (now aptly called Gesundheits Delvers) have been on some major adventures, all with the purpose of finding a way to free you friend from the stone he was trapped in years ago. The rogue of the group you are often called upon to handle the more shadier aspects of the group’s business, but even so their good cheer and attitude has worn off on you. Things are looking good to say the least. Here you are in sigil, hoping to find some way to save your friend in the largest city in the outer planes. But of course Nothing is ever easy, Haley wants her revenge on Roy for her death, and on you and your other friends for stopping her first attempt at revenge in the first place! Well, Might as well do what you have to, time for some good old fashioned fun.

Abilities:
Voting, self explanatory
Role block: During the night you can sneak into someone’s room and show them exactly how you Use rope skill work! Stopping them from going or doing anything.


Victory Conditions: 1 and you snag a minor victory, 2 and you have a major Victory
1. Defeat Haley and her doppelganger friends, and eliminate all anti town roles.
2. Make sure at least one PC lives through this mess to resurrect the others when it’s over!

CCrunner, AVSF

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

You are…..

A Very Strong Fighter! The meat shield of the group
Alignment: Chaotic Good. PC. Townie
Level: 10th level Fighter/ 3rd Level Bard (were you on crack when you took those levels?)


A very Strong Fighter, that’s your name as it were. You tinkered with the idea of changing it to Thog, but A very strong fighter just seemed to roll off the tongue better. Here you on in sigil, a walking tank, along with a stereo of course! You decided to become a bard as well as a fighter, and although you were mocked and ridiculed at every corner for it, your new class has seemed to grow on your party. You have a few minor spells, and you have learned a lot of things about plot, music, art, all that stuff. Of course you never forgot your true role in the party, which is of course a meat shield. So you are here with Gesundheits Delvers (your party’s name) in Sigil, city of Doors, to hunt down a new lead to save your old friend. Haley is a problem, and one you plan on tasking out! Go out there and show the might of your sword and lute!



Abilities:
Voting, self explanatory

Power Ballad: Once during the game you may use your almost superhuman melee ability to kill one of the people in the tavern. Your level is compared to your opponents, and a dice is rolled to determine if the attack succeeds. Also, You are expected to provide me with a Power Ballad and a attack type with your kill order. (Tell me a song, and how you want to kill them, I will do the rest )


Victory Conditions: Get one you get a minor victory, two you get a major victory
1. Eliminate Haley and her doppelganger friend, as well as any other anti town roles
2. Make sure you get to show your use to the rest of the PC’s! (use your ability during the game)

ATPG, Roy the fighter

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

You are….

Roy the Fighter
Alignment: Neutral Good. PC. Townie
Level: 7th level fighter/ 3rd Level Rogue

Just when you think you’re out she pulls you back in! Haley had been quiet for a few years leading up to this of course…. That should have tipped you off that you were due a visit from your favorite vengeful spirit…. You have been traveling with Gesundheits Delvers (name of your party, in homage to your everlasting quest, to save Gesundheit from his stony prison) for a while now, finally becoming a PC once again. So your back in a way! Now you just need to tie up old loose ends…. And finally make peace with Haley. The Hit squads and assassination attempts were fun for the first few years, but now you are starting to get tired of them. Nothing left to do but end this then! For your new parties sake at least! You came here looking for a way to save Gesundheit, but you just have to settle with stopping Haley once and for all.


Abilities:
Vote: self explanatory
Investigate: Every night you can go out and snoop around another player, checking their room and other stuff. Your level plays a part in the investigations success, and an investigation may not be entirely clear. (or accurate)

Victory Conditions: Get one you get a minor victory, two you get a major victory
1. Lynch Haley. Finally put an end to this mad feud that has been raging for years…..
2. Make sure at least one PC lives through this mess to resurrect the others.

Atheotes, Blackadder

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

You are….
Blackadder, the one who got away
Alignment: Neutral Good. NPC. Townie
Level: 3rd level rogue/ 3rd level Sorcerer

Blackadder, the one who got away. That’s pretty much become who you are ever since you became the only prisoner to escape from the prison camp years ago. Well… escape seems a bit of a misnomer, you were let out after most of the camp was massacred fighting against spies and all sorts of other nasties. After leaving for the eastern continent you got yourself mixes up in the famed colonial wars. You lost…… And found yourself without a home once again. You set up your new house in Sigil, and in this city of magic the inherent sorcerers blood you had leapt to the foreground. You have learned much about your new skills, and through experimentation you have managed to snag quite a few levels in Sorcerer! Take that PC’s!
… But as has been said, some people have no luck whatsoever. Here you are, back in the same old mess, with the same old people….. The gods honestly have no respect for you….. Geez. Well, nothing to do but try and live through another nightmare.


Abilities:
Vote: self explanatory
Defense magic: the first time someone tries to kill your character, you can use your magic to escape. 1 time kill defense basically.

Victory Conditions: Get one you get a minor victory, two you get a major victory
1. Eliminate all anti town roles
2. Live through this mess. Your too awesome to die in this tavern

White_eyes:D, Vicky the sorceress .

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

You are…
Vicky the Sorceress. Halfling
Alignment: Chaotic Neutral. NPC. Townie
Level: 10th level Sorcerer

Vicky the witch, that’s your nickname. You have lived in Sigil for the last 5 years of your life, peddling your magical skills to those who require it. Today you had a appointment with someone called Blackadder…. Something about learning some new spells. Meh, you weren’t really paying attention. You had sensed that wraith come in from the beginning, although you did nothing to stop it. Now you are in the same boat as everyone else, although your skill as a sorceress gives you abilities far beyond most other peoples abilities. A little fun and adventure might be interesting however! You have not had this much excitement in years. So might as well make the most of it! And you better hope no one makes a crack about your size, or you might just blow someone’s face out! No one has ever taken you seriously due to your race, but that might change when you start causing the tavern to explode in fireballs!



Abilities:
Vote: self explanatory
Offensive Magic’s: Every night you can use your magic to stop a person from leaving there room. You can have your choice of what magic you use Illusion, Conjuration, Enchantment, Abjuration, or Evocation. (Tell me who you are blocking and how, I will do the rest. Also, there is reason to pick different schools of magic; they could possibly have greater effects than a role block. What effect depends on the school chosen.)

Victory Conditions: Get one you get a minor victory, two you get a major victory
1. Eliminate all Antitown roles
2. Make sure either yourself or your new pupil live through this. (Blackadder or you have to live)

[Cultured Drizzt fan]

Well there you all go, this is finally over. I am sorry for my own inactivity and all around mediocre performance, but Life is making me very tired lately. I hope you all had fun, and I hope my game setup was Ok.


have any questions don't hesitate to ask.


it all game down to a coin flip. Heads ATPG dies, tails Diamondeye. And so the townie win streak continues......

[Double A]

Diamondeye, you liar! You said you had an auto lynch, not a double vote!

[Askthepizzaguy]

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Well there you all go, this is finally over. I am sorry for my own inactivity and all around mediocre performance, but Life is making me very tired lately. I hope you all had fun, and I hope my game setup was Ok.


have any questions don't hesitate to ask.


it all game down to a coin flip. Heads ATPG dies, tails Diamondeye. And so the townie win streak continues......

Okay, so this is three straight games of Swords and D20's where I've helped lynch at least two scumbags and been on the winning townie team.

I officially declare that I own this game.


Yaropolk: You rock, once again, man.

Thanx for trusting me eventually, atheotes!

Thanks for the excellent games, Cultured Drizzt Fan.

[Double A]

I wanna rematch!

[White_eyes:D]

ATPG you lynched me right away.....I dislike you greatly....even if i won a total victory
(And the first Mini-Mafia I have won ever)

[Methos]

Excellent game! It was a lot of fun to lurk.

[Yaropolk]

How did Reonk kill me if he didn't have kill powers?

[atheotes]

Good game town and thanks for hosting another enjoyable game CDF.
I got a major victory without doing anything
the game got sorted out when i was busy in RL... except for my conversations with pizza, i didnt do much.

@ Pizza - good game. your PM exchanges with me were very scummy...with the carelessly modified role pm and you expecting me to trust you rather than you showing the trust inspite of having investigated and found me innocent. I dont think i will ever act differently in those circumstances

[Diamondeye]

How did Reonk kill me if he didn't have kill powers?

His powers were transferred. Actually, I sent a kill order on you in the previous night but CDf misread it which is why the entire game went odd there. Luckily we lynched CCRunner and I slipped past your block (you did block me, right?) and killed you.

'Twas close, Pizza. Thanks for a fascinating duel - I wish I had saved some of our IM convs, I was under heavy fire the entire time yet I ended up with a 50-50 shot at victory.

[Yaropolk]

2 nights ago I blocked CC, and ATPG was supposed to investigate you, but he forgot to do that. If your kill went through on me, then CC would have also killed ATPG, and cinched the win for you. My block is not supposed to fail, but I think CDF let you slip through to make up for previous night.

[Askthepizzaguy]

His powers were transferred. Actually, I sent a kill order on you in the previous night but CDf misread it which is why the entire game went odd there. Luckily we lynched CCRunner and I slipped past your block (you did block me, right?) and killed you.

'Twas close, Pizza. Thanks for a fascinating duel - I wish I had saved some of our IM convs, I was under heavy fire the entire time yet I ended up with a 50-50 shot at victory.

Indeed the only reason I relented on you, Diamondeye, was because I spotted your role as most probably fake. Two investigators? I don't think so. And I said over and over again that the best move was to lynch you there and then. However, being spotted based on the fact that I'd seen the format of other role PMs and deciding yours was different is a bit game breaking and kind of unfair. Especially in a game this small where I could point out all the inconsistencies. And when CCRunner used his murder on me, that's when I decided he must die first. And, I wanted to have conclusive proof on you. Having a very very strong hunch isn't enough; I didn't want to miss. When I was attacked by CCRunner I suspected treachery, and for a moment I actually had two suspects instead of just you.

Remember this, for next time I won't relent, no matter how unfair it seems.

[Diamondeye]

Indeed the only reason I relented on you, Diamondeye, was because I spotted your role as most probably fake. Two investigators? I don't think so. And I said over and over again that the best move was to lynch you there and then. However, being spotted based on the fact that I'd seen the format of other role PMs and deciding yours was different is a bit game breaking and kind of unfair. Especially in a game this small where I could point out all the inconsistencies. And when CCRunner used his murder on me, that's when I decided he must die first. And, I wanted to have conclusive proof on you. Having a very very strong hunch isn't enough; I didn't want to miss. When I was attacked by CCRunner I suspected treachery, and for a moment I actually had two suspects instead of just you.

Remember this, for next time I won't relent, no matter how unfair it seems.

I wouldn't want it otherwise.

CDf, I'm sorry if it sounds like a complaint, but as you see, ATPG easily saw through my fake PM provided by you. I don't want to claim that this is the reason for my loss, because it probably isn't, just direct your attention to it for future games

[Askthepizzaguy]

I'd like it very much if we posted that PM.

I would like the others to take a look at it; it was not clearly fake.... perhaps not to anyone but me, I'd reckon.

The thing which made me look closer was the claimed "detective" aspect. That was bad because I was a detective. That's when I started looking for other inconsistencies, and I wouldn't have spotted those without the first red flag.

[Diamondeye]

I'd like it very much if we posted that PM.

I would like the others to take a look at it; it was not clearly fake.... perhaps not to anyone but me, I'd reckon.

The thing which made me look closer was the claimed "detective" aspect. That was bad because I was a detective. That's when I started looking for other inconsistencies, and I wouldn't have spotted those without the first red flag.

It was posted earlier on this page in spoilers.