Friend's niece has gone missing

[KukriKhan]

Dreadful, just dreadful. I can only imagine what the parents are going through. As someone who lost a daughter fifteen years ago I'll say this. You never get over the death of your child, you just get used to the pain. To have your child murdered must be even worse by several magnitudes.

I hope they catch the bastard who did this. If I had my way, piano wire and meathooks spring to mind. An awful business.

Our local cops have spilled the beans that the fella currently in custody for another, more recent disappearance-abduction-murder, is also the primary suspect in Amber's case. To not jeopardize their court case, they're not saying where the "tip" on where Ms DuBois' remains might be came from... it's pretty clear to all here locally who the source is. They have to scrupulously protect that info so the guy can get tried in San Diego, not shipped off to Nebraska or Massachusetts or some other State to obtain a "fair trial". Ya gotta wonder how many more disappearances will surface.

Maybe we ought to ship this thread off to the Backroom, since we've gone through the "save Amber" stage, onto the "discovery" stage, and now into the investigation/prosecution stage. Just a thought.

[KukriKhan]

Double-posting:

I want to personally thank all of you for your efforts, thoughts and prayers over the past 13 months. A girl you never met, in a town you've never been to, went missing. Together we scoured the internet to the best of our ability to find some kinda clue that would be useful. Philipvs Vallindervs Calicvla started the original "find Amber" Facebook page. I spent a couple of Sunday afternoons trudging through local creeks and lakeshores. We all stayed in contact, and interest.

As the Father of 3 (now adult) daughters, if my girl was missing, I can't think of a better crew to help me find her virtual self. Thanks guys. yer awesome.

[edyzmedieval]

R.I.P. for the poor girl.

Meathooks and piano strings is not enough for these bastards. Medieval torture methods maybe, but for the pain they inflict even that is not enough.

[Subotan]

Meathooks and piano strings is not enough for these bastards. Medieval torture methods maybe, but for the pain they inflict even that is not enough.

That would make us no better than him.

[Fragony]

And tongs

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

Double-posting:

I want to personally thank all of you for your efforts, thoughts and prayers over the past 13 months. A girl you never met, in a town you've never been to, went missing. Together we scoured the internet to the best of our ability to find some kinda clue that would be useful. Philipvs Vallindervs Calicvla started the original "find Amber" Facebook page. I spent a couple of Sunday afternoons trudging through local creeks and lakeshores. We all stayed in contact, and interest.

As the Father of 3 (now adult) daughters, if my girl was missing, I can't think of a better crew to help me find her virtual self. Thanks guys. yer awesome.

Thank you for the mention Kukri, but it was really nothing more than five minutes work to set up, and then some maintainance until an extended family member took over.

[Fragony]

Still the only one of us who dedicated those 5 minutes, hope it means something to the family that someone from the other side of the ocean cared to do so. It would to me.

[Major Robert Dump]

This is tough indeed

[Louis VI the Fat]

Thank you for the mention Kukri, but it was really nothing more than five minutes work to set up, and then some maintainance until an extended family member took over.

I so truly respect this.

[Fragony]

Looks like we have another sad case



Missing for a week, they found something an hour ago, forensics are there which means it's bad. I can get so angry over things like this my chest almost explodes.

edit: gah, she's dead, half burried, the rest was in a whatsitcalled these things on the street that lead to the sewers. They got who did it. If it's another case of a psycholoco who thought his patient was ready be be reintroduced into society I want his head.

Rip Milly Boele.

edit: what the hell the guy's a cop

[edyzmedieval]

That would make us no better than him.

He killed a poor innocent girl who had nothing to do with him. Coin for coin revenge is suitable in this case no matter what you say.

EDIT:

Subotan, I rest my case. Look at Fragony's post.
Another innocent girl killed for what? Because the guy's a lunatic? Public dangers.

[Subotan]

He killed a poor innocent girl who had nothing to do with him. Coin for coin revenge is suitable in this case no matter what you say.

And what if the wrong guy was picked up? Torture itself is a moral abomination, just as these crimes are, and the possibility of doing what you are advocating to an innocent man is far too high for such a severe punishment to be justifiable.

The state and the justice system are meant to punish people like this. How can state justifiably say "What this man did was wrong", if we resort to his own methods to punish him?

I know what I'm saying is unpopular, but I do not care. Populist baying for blood is wrong and akin to lynch mobs, and something that I am just as strongly opposed to as the sick crimes of this individual.

EDIT: Because torture will magically turn the clock back? Torturing him will not make that neighbourhood a safer place.

[Lemur]

To the Backroom, away!

[Fragony]

While tempting torture is a bit much. But proven child-killers need to be put down. I wouldn't call it death penalty.

[Subotan]

The death penalty is flawed for two reasons, the inability to correct mistakes, and moral ickiness of the state taking the life of one of it's own citizens. A life sentence solves both of these.

That said, I'm not a namby-pamby worshipper of the idea of rehabilitation. There are some people who are just too dangerous to ever be released from prison, and the criminal detailed above is almost certainly one of them.

[Kagemusha]

These kind of crimes you dont need death penalty. Just throw the guilty one in jail for rest of his life to think about what he has done and throw the key away.. If at some point its found out that someone else was guilty the first one can be released. Life sentence without possibility of parol is what these sickoes deserve. Ofcourse incase police catches the perpetrator in act of committing this kind of horrible crime, the officer should not think twice to put couple bullets in the perpetrator just to make sure he /she doesnt escape.

[Beskar]

These kind of crimes you dont need death penalty. Just throw the guilty one in jail for rest of his life to think about what he has done and throw the key away.. If at some point its found out that someone else was guilty the first one can be released. Life sentence without possibility of parol is what these sickoes deserve. Ofcourse incase police catches the perpetrator in act of committing this kind of horrible crime, the officer should not think twice to put couple bullets in the perpetrator just to make sure he /she doesnt escape.

I would like to see it if you got arrested now for those crimes even though you are (hopefully) innocent of them. It would soon make you change your opinion on the subject.

[Kagemusha]

I would like to see it if you got arrested now for those crimes even though you are (hopefully) innocent of them. It would soon make you change your opinion on the subject.

If i would be arrested in act of commiitting such crime i would deserve death. My opinion wheather i should live or die would be irrelevant.

[Beskar]

If i would be arrested in act of commiitting such crime i would deserve death. My opinion wheather i should live or die would be irrelevant.

If you was arrested and you just happened to be next to where the crime took place, and therefore you are number 1 suspect, but you are actually innocent and know nothing of the crime, but simply "wrong place at the wrong time" and when up being arrested and charged for it.

[Kagemusha]

If you was arrested and you just happened to be next to where the crime took place, and therefore you are number 1 suspect, but you are actually innocent and know nothing of the crime, but simply "wrong place at the wrong time" and when up being arrested and charged for it.

Dont start twisting my words. My words were caught in the act.

[Beskar]

Dont start twisting my words. My words were caught in the act.

That was the 2nd part of your post, I was replying to the first part about locking them up and throwing away the key, etc.

[Kagemusha]

Well i already explained that in my original post. Ofcourse courts decesion is needed for them to be sentenced..While they maintain alive in jail if any new evidence springs up, their case can be reconsidered in court of law. What is your problem exactly with harsh penalties over such heinious crimes?

[johnhughthom]

If i would be arrested in act of commiitting such crime i would deserve death. My opinion wheather i should live or die would be irrelevant.

Fair enough then, you could commit suicide. If you wish to decide that you deserve death that's up to you, personally I don't think anybody, or group of people, has the right to say anybody else deserves to die, no matter what they have done.

[Kagemusha]

Fair enough then, you could commit suicide. If you wish to decide that you deserve death that's up to you, personally I don't think anybody, or group of people, has the right to say anybody else deserves to die, no matter what they have done.

That is completely matter of point of view. By that logic you should also reject killing in war and for example death sentences given out by court marshalls in times of war. It is a nice ideal that no man or group of men should not take lives of others, but thats all what it is. Ideal.

[Fragony]

The death penalty is flawed for two reasons, the inability to correct mistakes, and moral ickiness of the state taking the life of one of it's own citizens. A life sentence solves both of these.

It's true that a mistake would be irreversable, but when guilt is beyond reasonable doubt, confession, forensic evidence, I really see no reason to keep them alive.

[johnhughthom]

That is completely matter of point of view. By that logic you should also reject killing in war and for example death sentences given out by court marshalls in times of war. It is a nice ideal that no man or group of men should not take lives of others, but thats all what it is. Ideal.

When you join the military you know what you are siging up for, and killing in war is totally different. The other side is trying to kill you too...

[Kagemusha]

When you join the military you know what you are siging up for, and killing in war is totally different. The other side is trying to kill you too...

You forget that most countries still today have mandatory military service, which means you dont get to choose. If you are citizen you are egliglible for military service. Now you can serve time in prison to evade service during peace time, but that doesnt apply to wartime, when you will be shot for desertion if you dont follow orders given to you.

In the end human societies are based on violence of majority which is given to them by constitutions of our Nations. Ultimately if you dont follow the rules of society, thus rebel against the government which draws its power from constitution you are eglible for death sentence in any country.

When i said i would not mind killing off criminals caught in act of most heinious crimes. That was practical advice as the situation can be resolved without benefit of doubt. If there is any doubt, death sentence becomes impractical because innocents will be executed sooner or later.

[Subotan]

It's true that a mistake would be irreversable, but when guilt is beyond reasonable doubt, confession, forensic evidence, I really see no reason to keep them alive.

The death penalty has always been assumed to be like that. And yet there are many instances, such as poor Timothy Evans, where all the evidence at first appears to point towards an innocent man for a crime deserving the death penalty. You can never be 100% sure that someone is guilty, which is why the death penalty is unjustifiable.

[Beskar]

Also, punishment isn't that good of a deterrent. Anyone who commits a crime goes in thinking they will not get caught anyway.

[Fragony]

Also, punishment isn't that good of a deterrent. Anyone who commits a crime goes in thinking they will not get caught anyway.

That is true, it's of no use for discouraging criminals especially child-killers. But there is also the element of retribution. They deserve to die.