Greece Campaign advice

[oz_wwjd]

Ok thanks for the advice guys, I was kinda hoping that the Selucid Empire would make life difficult for them so they'd be forced to stop attacking me but it looks like I'll have to take the time and deal with them. Will I have to take there whole Empire,or just the cities nearest me? I'm worried about getting into conflict with the Egyptians if I go too far down. Also where is aI a good place to recruit Cretan Archers? I can grab a few near Halicarnassus but not all the time. I've been looking for Crete as it would make sense they'd be there in larger numbers, but I can't seem to find a city called "crete" on the map,unless it's under a different name...

[Guyus Germanicus]

Hello again Oz_

Cretan archers . .. Crete is the elongated island south of Greece. The city is Kydonia. One unit of Cretan archers is available sometime around 262 BC near the city of Appolonia in Epirus (Albania), or Corinth or Athens. Two units of Cretan archers should be available for purchase on Crete in 261 BC, 251 BC, 241 BC, and likely 231 BC. The game refreshes this periodically as you can see by the ten-year cycle. However, if you buy Cretan archers in Anatolia, around your city of Pergamum, what you purchase there reduces what is available on the island of Crete. The same is true if you purchase your Cretan archers on the island of Rhodes. (They can become available there as well.) But again, if you buy one @ Rhodes, it will diminish what is available to purchase on Crete or near Pergamum. Archers are not availble around Larissa, Sparta, or Thessalonica. I can't remember if they are available in the region of Thermon. I'm thinking 'no'. But I can't remember at the moment. Cretan archers are also available in the region of Sardis.

When I play the Roman factions, I usually send a general to western Greece around 261 BC to purchase one unit of Cretans there, then sail him down to Crete to buy the other two available on Crete. Then I repeat the mission ten years later, etc. Beware, however, of the rebels in ambush around Kydonia. They like to hide just west of the city. So if you disembark your general west of Kydonia, he could be ambushed. I usually sail my fleet underneath Crete (the southern shore) and disembark him east of Kydonia to recruit my archers. That way he avoids ambush.

Occasionally I have been able to bribe the rebel Cretan archers around Halicarnasus into my faction. Also, some factions are able to bribe the rebel Cretan archers around Kydonia into their faction. It's good when you can do that because they have two experience chevrons. I think when I've played the Scipii and even the Greeks, I have been able to bribe these rebel archers into my faction. But bribing doesn't work that way for every faction.

Good luck and good hunting!

[Guyus Germanicus]

. . . I was kinda hoping that the Selucid Empire would make life difficult for them so they'd be forced to stop attacking me but it looks like I'll have to take the time and deal with them. Will I have to take there whole Empire,or just the cities nearest me? I'm worried about getting into conflict with the Egyptians if I go too far down. ...

Just a Postscript, oz_ - As one of our colleagues above mentioned, Pontus is ruthlessly determined to expand. Very true statement. You will have to crush them eventually. If you leave them alive at Sinope and Mazaka, they will come back to haunt you. The Seleucid Empire is what might be referred to (to borrow a term from the Old Testament) as a broken reed. I have very seldom seen the AI do anything with the Seleucid Empire but have it devoured by its neighbors. If you've played the Seleucids, you'll know from experience that they can easily find themselves in a four front war right from the get-go. The Armenians go for Hastra, the Parthians try to grab Seleucia, Pontus as you know makes for Sardis and Tarsus, and the Egyptians like to push early for Antioch. The bottomline is there is very little you can depend on from the Seleucids. Its pretty much determined by the game that they are one of the 'expendable' factions and are often one of the first to be eleminated.

I've found when I play the Greeks that the Egyptians usually don't become a problem until they've taken Tarsus. Then they start pushing deeper into Anatolia, usually going for Sardis. Sometimes they will actually try to land an expedtionary force on Rhodes. But I haven't seen that often. Try to keep a couple small fleets posted in the waters east and south of Rhodes so you can see what's coming. (Hint: I like to position a spy on the southern Anatolian beach north of Cyprus (Salamis) and just west of the mountains that are west of Tarsus. He 'lights up' the area so you can see who's hanging around Tarsus and at what strength. He also lets you see how large is the garrison @ Salamis.)

Another hint - if and when war breaks out with Egypt, don't push into their strength by fighting through their armies starting at Tarsus, then Antioch, then Sidon, etc. Hit them from several directions at once. Distract them with a push toward Tarsus, but land an expeditionary force on Cyprus to take Salamis. That army can them jump ashore potentially at Sidon. Divide and conquer, steal their profits, take their ports. Hit 'em where they ain't. Also, hit Alexandria with a second expeditionary force. I've found that the Egyptians like to build up their forces in the eastern Mediteranean in neglect of Egypt proper. Taking Alexandria and Memphis will take the wind out of their economy's sails. Their most advanced military buildings are usually in the three cities of Egypt - Alexandria, Memphis, and Thebes. Take those cities and you can deprive them of recruiting their best units - Pharoah's bowmen and their elite hoplites.

I've found that one of the things that makes the Egyptians such annoying opponents is their variety of missile troops. Pharoah's bowman are good long range archers who also can double as infantry. They are not the pushover for cavalry that Greek archers are. Tough hombres. Their generals start out as chariot archers. In the late game their generals convert to more conventional heavy cavalry.

I'm getting long-winded, so I'll stop now. :)

[gollum]

Just hold on in Asia Minor and Sicily until you blitz the Macs and the Brutii out of Greece proper asap. This should take only a few turns. Then you should be quickly rich enough to destroy the Bruttii in southern Italy and, at the same time, smash Pontus in the Asia Minor coast. Once Greece proper is yours together with Rhodes, Pergamum and say Crete you can rake in millions (and more by taking Sardeis, Halicarnassos and eventually Byzantium and Nicomedia), especially since you start with the Collossus trade bonus. By getting Greece proper and Asia minor you also get the Zeus statue at Olympia and its loyalty bonus, the Artemis temple and the Mausoleum at Hallicarnassos and their respective bonuses. After that the Greeks are hard to beat, even if we are talking about long wars of attrition with Egypt.

Armored hoplites, peltasts and militia cavalry make a very good field army combo that is hard to beat. Hoplites (like most phalanxes) of all kinds are very very hard to break in sieges by fighting in city streets. Abandon the walls and fight in the streets against enemies that have strong melee infantry like the Romans.

[Centurion1]

guyus as to mercs you are not really right. they refresh with a percentage possibility per turn. the numbers ar elow for example the war elephant mercs you can get are like .005 percent. you can alter those values if you want to . i do for certain mercs especially cretans.......

and crete and ALL of asia minor south of nicomedia and west of galatia are in one big pool.

[Ibn-Khaldun]

Just hold on in Asia Minor and Sicily until you blitz the Macs and the Brutii out of Greece proper asap. This should take only a few turns. Then you should be quickly rich enough to destroy the Bruttii in southern Italy and, at the same time, smash Pontus in the Asia Minor coast. Once Greece proper is yours together with Rhodes, Pergamum and say Crete you can rake in millions (and more by taking Sardeis, Halicarnassos and eventually Byzantium and Nicomedia), especially since you start with the Collossus trade bonus. By getting Greece proper and Asia minor you also get the Zeus statue at Olympia and its loyalty bonus, the Artemis temple and the Mausoleum at Hallicarnassos and their respective bonuses. After that the Greeks are hard to beat, even if we are talking about long wars of attrition with Egypt.

Armored hoplites, peltasts and militia cavalry make a very good field army combo that is hard to beat. Hoplites (like most phalanxes) of all kinds are very very hard to break in sieges by fighting in city streets. Abandon the walls and fight in the streets against enemies that have strong melee infantry like the Romans.

I remember someone conquered 50 settlements in 38-39 turns. So, their units are quite capable!

[Lord Reid of Britannica]

I remember someone conquered 50 settlements in 38-39 turns. So, their units are quite capable!

38-39 turns? I find that hard to believe, that would require immense "auto_win"ing and money cheating.

[Ibn-Khaldun]

No. He actually put it up on his webpage with all the pics and where to go/what to do. If you take 1-2 cities per turn then it's not that hard actually. Especially for the Greeks who start in a place where many cities are so close. Also, Greeks have good economy and buying mercs or using Greek hoplites makes this very easy.

Anyone up to try this challenge? Winning "Conquest" campaign(50 settlements) in 40 turns?

[Rome shall Burn]

Greece is one of the strongest (if not the single strongest) factions economically, at least in my experience. In the early game I build up slowly keeping unit upkeep costs fairly low and driving Rome and the offspring of Alexander the Great out of the area. Taking Kydonia and the other small islands has been very profitable for me because the cities are easy to take, have relatively good financial benefits (since they obviously can build ports) and they are great cities to have just because they give you more settlements overall and the islands I find are rarely attacked.

What I have done on the Eastern front is play fairly defensive, breaking the Pontic advances by crushing them in the streets of my cities and then I keep spies in the nearby Pontic settlements, when I see that a Pontic city has a low or weak garrison I rush the garrisons from my cities over and take those weak Pontic towns then I ward off the Pontic attacks in those towns and advance again. Great experience for your phalanx units. Boring tactics but extremely effective. And its not too painfully dull because while I am fighting slowly in the East it frees up most of my military for advances in Sicily, Italy, and in island hopping.