Roman Polanski- No Justice Needed

[Andres]

Yes it is. But as long as nobody wants to start a trial for it in Switzerland, then he's free. Since the girl said she dropped the charge, I can't see why the Swiss would hurt their business by doing it.

Because he's a child rapist.

Now, since it's mostly Americans who've answered to the topic so far, I think I should warn you that the public opinion is quite torn about Polanski. He received almost unanimous support from the intelligentsia and he still has his aura of excellent movie maker. That certainly doesn't excuse anything, but this is to be taken into account. You all are getting mad over it on the other side of the pond. Here things aren't so clear cut.

He's a child rapist. I, for one, don't care if he made good movies or not. He's a child rapist.

Secondly, it's quite funny to see you all getting mad about it, when the US have repeatedly refused to abide to international law a few billion times. Now, you want to put some hollywood phoney in jail to look tough, Switzerland refuses and you get all crazy about it.

Schoolyard rhetoric. "You did something wrong too, so you can't be outraged now!" Meh. He's a child rapist. No matter how many times the US have "refused to abid international law", that doesn't take away that we're talking about a child rapist. There's no excuse to protect the scumbag.

What the hell man? The US supported and defended a bunch of dictators all over the world and it's alright.

No, it's not allright, far from it. Next to that, what crimes the US have or have not committed is completely irrelevant. Polanski is a child rapist and hasn't served his sentence.

The Swiss defend a dude who's admited to have sex with an underage girl decades ago and it means Switzerland should dig itself into the ground? It's time to make a reality check.

The "dude" is a child rapist. There is no reason for protecting such scum. There are also no excuses.

The same applies to Don's comment. A large part of the Swiss population wanted the country to join France and UK in the war, and the country also became a heaven for people who fled and opposed the Nazis, at least until late 1943.

I certainly don't like Switzerland and its banking policies. But the amount of Switzerland-hate displayed in this topic is laughable.

Your amount of US-hate in this thread is totally misplaced and completely unnecessary. We're talking about a country protecting a child rapist. I fail to see how one can defend that.

[Rhyfelwyr]

All this country bashing is irrelevant. Sure the USA is far from perfect when it comes to abiding international law and protecting nasty figures. But this guy isn't some third word dictator, there's no politics involved, so why can't two western, developed nations work together to put a child rapist and escaped felon behind bars?

[rory_20_uk]

On a personal level the child rapist should go to jail. I don't care what he does with 100 nude, nubile 18 year olds - paid or otherwise, male or female. I'd even have some sympathy with 16-17 as yes, sexual development is not a switch at 18. BUT 13 is even for a drug soaked letch too far.

But as has been pointed out, the underlying message again appears to be that in the USA there is a price on justice. If you can afford the price, you can buy it off, whether George Bush's drugs / alcohol or Paris's drugs charges and of course dear old Roman.

Let's face it, what chance would any non-famous escaped kiddie-****** in running to Europe?

The girl dropped the case. So what? It is still a criminal matter as he broke the law, her likely payoff notwithstanding.

He's lived most of his life in France since this event. They never even bothered to arrest him and wriggle out of doing anything.

[Slyspy]

Everyone I know believes he is a scumbag paedo who happens to have more than a little skill in making movies. Unsurprisingly they think the former outweighs the latter. In the rarified air of the film industry (and to some extent the arts in general) the balance appears to have swung the other way. How anyone can justify this fugitive's continuing liberty is beyond me. Frankly even the original sentence seems bizarre, let alone the current situation.

[Husar]

Well, if the USA care so much about locking him up, why did they set him free, allowing him to escape in the first place? A flaw in the US justice system, unfortunate circumstances or maybe they didn't care as much back then?

[Andres]

Well, if the USA care so much about locking him up, why did they set him free, allowing him to escape in the first place? A flaw in the US justice system, unfortunate circumstances or maybe they didn't care as much back then?

He fled.

It may come as a surprise to you, but convicted criminals sometimes run away! Bad criminals, running away just like that Well, they are criminals for something, I guess.

But when such fleeing convicted criminals who still have to serve their sentence are spotted in another country, they can be arrested by that country and send back to the country they ran away from! Wonderful!

And then you have spoil sports like Switzerland, who refuse to send such a criminal back!

With Polanski, we're talking about a child rapist. Most civilised people consider child rape as one of the lowest and despicable crimes, if not thé lowest and despicable crime, one can commit.

Therefore, it is perfectly understandable that people are outraged by the refusal of Switzerland to send Polanski back to the US, so that he can serve his time in jail.

What all the country bashing in this thread has to do with it, is something I, for one, do not understand. How the fact that this particular child rapist has a talent for making movies is relevant, I do not understand either.

And if Switzerland just wanted to show the world that its' penis is larger than the American one, then they picked about the worst possible case to demonstrate it.

[tibilicus]

I will be first to support the idea that the US has pretty odd ideas of extradition deals. For example, the current extradition deal with the UK is pretty bizarre, whereby it is extremely hard for us to get permission to extradite from the US but the process of extraditing from the UK is relatively straight forward.

This, however, isn't the point. We're not talking about a criminal who may have done something but one who has been found guilty of one charge and fled the court date for the more serious charges brought against him. The argument about the USA and it's concept of sovereignty and perceived "bullying" nature is also irrelevant. This guy raped a child, a crime recognised as severe in every single western nation and in most non-western nations. The Swiss should have a moral duty to extradite, not just because it's wrong, but because they are harbouring a criminal they would otherwise condemn by their own legal system. If any one else living in Switzerland raped a child they would be arrested and imprisoned. Just because the crime was committed in another country doesn't mean this man should be considered free.

[Skullheadhq]

The victim was okay with it, repeatadly stated that the charges should be dropped, compensation has been payed, well then, nothing to see here, move along.

[Husar]

He fled.

It may come as a surprise to you, but convicted criminals sometimes run away! Bad criminals, running away just like that Well, they are criminals for something, I guess.

You cannot run away with four walls around you, neither can you run away if your guards stop you, that's why I asked how he could run away in the first place.
The article says he was locked up, then released, and left the country. So why was he released and then not locked up again before he could leave the country if he hadn't served his sentence yet?

[TinCow]

You cannot run away with four walls around you, neither can you run away if your guards stop you, that's why I asked how he could run away in the first place.
The article says he was locked up, then released, and left the country. So why was he released and then not locked up again before he could leave the country if he hadn't served his sentence yet?

He was out on bail pending sentencing.

[Hosakawa Tito]

Well, if the USA care so much about locking him up, why did they set him free, allowing him to escape in the first place? A flaw in the US justice system, unfortunate circumstances or maybe they didn't care as much back then?

He jumped bail and has been living in France ever since. Apparently the French government feel that serving 42 days for raping a child is punishment enough, and besides he's an artist and famous and all that...

So, after all this time, why did the Swiss government decide to arrest him? You don't suppose that maybe they wanted to use him as a bargaining chip in their legal dispute with the US over their banking system abetting tax evaders...nah, probably not.

To celebrate such a triumph over the mean old US I think all his supporters should send their teenage daughters over to Pedolanski's chalet for a sleep over party.

[Andres]

Playing the Devil's advocate.

Switzerland-US extradition treaty.

Didn't read all of it, but article 2, 1, paragraph 2 seems clear enough:

When the request to extradition relates to a person who has been convicted, extradition shall be granted only if the duration of the penalty or detention order, or their aggregate, still to be served amounts to at least six months.

I believe it was already said in this thread that Polanski was convicted to 90 days (less than 6 months, how did that scumbag get away with a sentence of only 90 days?) ?

Are there still charges against him for which there hasn't been a trial yet?

[TinCow]

I believe it was already said in this thread that Polanski was convicted to 90 days (less than 6 months, how did that scumbag get away with a sentence of only 90 days?) ?

Are there still charges against him for which there hasn't been a trial yet?

Polanski was never sentenced. The time he served in jail was for psychiatric evaluation prior to the trial. He was released after the evaluation was over but before the sentencing hearing. He heard a rumor that he was going to be given a long sentence (he expected only probation), so he fled the country. As of today, he has been convicted but hasn't had his sentencing hearing yet because he fled the country.

[Andres]

Polanski was never sentenced. The time he served in jail was for psychiatric evaluation prior to the trial. He was released after the evaluation was over but before the sentencing hearing. He heard a rumor that he was going to be given a long sentence (he expected only probation), so he fled the country. As of today, he has been convicted but hasn't had his sentencing hearing yet because he fled the country.

Aha. I take it that the crimes he committed are punishable with deprivation of liberty for more than a year. Which means that, according to the treaty, Switzerland is obliged to extradite Mr. Polanski.

[Hosakawa Tito]

Polanski extradition rejected.

Mr. Polanski's lawyers have argued that the judge in charge of the case in 1977 assured them that the 42 days of detention their client had served in the psychiatric unit of a California jail was all the time he should expect to spend incarcerated. Instead, suspecting that he would receive a longer term at sentencing, Mr. Polanski fled the country.
In recent months, Mr. Polanski's lawyers asked a State Superior Court in Los Angeles to sentence Mr. Polanski in absentia, in order to determine whether he had in fact already served out his sentence. But the court denied the request as long as Mr. Polanski was a fugitive.

He did 42 days in a psychiatric unit, was let out on bail till his sentencing trial date and fled the country. Jumping bail is an additional offence, and in this case would be considered a felony.

[Meneldil]

Your amount of US-hate in this thread is totally misplaced and completely unnecessary. We're talking about a country protecting a child rapist. I fail to see how one can defend that.

Yada yada. He's a child rapist, fine. And then?

I don't give a damn about Roman Polanski. I'm actually in favor of him being sent to the US to face a trial and find the people who protect him quite disgusting.

But I'm certainly not in favor of Americans going all "ZOMGWTFBBQ" and starting some Swiss-hate madness because Switzerland refuses to extradites one person who's not even guilty of murder.
How many dictators have been supported by the US? How many criminals have been protected by the US? How many people have been killed because of your the US, France, Belgium?
Take back your "morally bankrupt nation" and other similar nation bashing, have a drink, cool down and then I might agree with you all.
Bash Polanski and the people who protect him (that includes most of the french intelligentsia) all you want, but bashing Switzerland isn't going to help your cause.

And yes, people who don't play by the rules have no right to feel outraged when someone else does the same. It's called (not) having a moral high ground.

Actually, what's going on here is quite silly and disgusting. Nobody cares about his victim or even about justice. The main issue here is trying to look tough on the international scene. Since Polanski is kind of a big-deal, it's all about either:
- showing that none can escape the almighty, fair but blind US justice
or
- showing that the Switzerland will stand for freedom and resist the tyrannical US

I say forget Polanski and start bothering about war criminals and dictators. That will be so much more useful.

[InsaneApache]

I don't blame the septics for being upset.

The man drugged and raped a child. If it doesn't make all right minded people angry, then I'm flummoxed as to what will.

[KukriKhan]

Imagine this guy's inner-life: parents in concentration camps, living under a false name as a catholic, married to a succession of actresses - one of whom, pregnant, gets murdered by the Manson cult, middle-aged "boyfriend" of several juvenile females, acclaimed film-maker, fugitive from justice, millionaire...

no one would believe the details of such a life were it written as a character in one of his stories. I don't know how he faces himself in the mirror when it's time to shave in the morning. The demons that must plague him.

For a finale, at age 80 he should fly to LA and turn himself in for the final 48 days of his sentence, serving the time with Manson and my own local serial girl-killer John Gardner at Corcoran State Prison.

[InsaneApache]

No one is denying that he had a terrible life, however, and I feel very strongly about this, that's no daisying excuse for daisying up a young lasses life. Things like this don't go away for a lass. He gets 48 days and 30 odd years living the highlife.

She gets a life sentence. Nuff said.

I'll paraphrase you when you once said to me: "Bud, I agree with almost everything you say....but in this case you're wrong"

[KukriKhan]

Then I have communicated badly, and led you to believe I harbour even a scintilla of sympathy for this coward.

I merely wanted to look at the case from another angle, the lads here having beaten the "filthy-paedo" drum loudly (and rightly) so far.