Religious intolerance or freedom of speech.

[Sigurd]

Those who have been following the news here in the North of Europe haven’t missed the latest events in Palestine. I am not talking about the elections, but the latest play by extremists and religious leaders.
To sum up for the uninitiated; A Danish newspaper published some time ago a few caricature comic strips depicting Mohammed the prophet. Last year a Norwegian Christian magazine did the same.
The extremists in Palestine burned earlier this week a Danish flag and a Norwegian one in protest and gave warnings about violence and death. Danes and other Scandinavians has been beaten up in Muslim nations and Danish goods has been boycotted in stores in Muslim nations.
The threats against Scandinavians have escalated, the extremists promise swift deaths and terror upon the northern infidels. Messages like Death to you all have been painted on Scandinavian flags and burned. Leaders of Middle East nations demand apologies from Denmark and Norway. The Danes have publicly apologised to every Muslim they might have offended. The Norwegian government will not make a formal apology.
Bomb threats have been given several Danish embassies in the world and even the newspaper that first printed the caricatures has been given a bomb threat.
Today several European newspapers including Die Welt, France Soir, Corriere della Serra, La Stampa and El Periodico published the pictures. Tomorrow papers in Switzerland, Holland and others will publish them…

The Islamic extremists cries religious intolerance, the western extremists cries freedom of speech. Us normal people caught in the middle suddenly have a work day with a slighter worsened security.

Oh, the caricatures that will possibly put the org on the “must terrorise list” of the extremists can be found in today’s Die Welt online paper…

[Leet Eriksson]

Check "A good reminder" thread.

Its been talked about there.

[Sigurd]

Check "A good reminder" thread.

Its been talked about there.

Damn... that is what you get for not being here to often... and I did a quick look to see if somebody had posted something... "A good reminder" seemed slightly unlikely to hide this particular topic...

[Leet Eriksson]

Damn... that is what you get for not being here to often... and I did a quick look to see if somebody had posted something... "A good reminder" seemed slightly unlikely to hide this particular topic...

I have to say, they should merge this thread, becuase you do provide important points in your first post, so lets hope a mod does it quick.

[Ice]

These guys really need to ligthen up.

[Louis VI the Fat]

Alternatively, you can set 15000 cars ablaze:



How many flags do these people have anyway? It's the same picture, same story all the time.


Who has any beef with the Danes or Norwegians? Nobody else on the whole planet. Because that's pretty hard. It's bloody hard to find a reason to pick a fight with those perfectly peaceful, most reasonable societies.

Are they determined to fight the entire world? Are they not satisfied 'till they've set the whole world ablaze?
Get a life. The Americans, Europeans and Asians have got one. Get one too. Or don't. Whatever. Just don't take your frustration out on everybody else.

[drone]

Looks like a good time to buy stock in flag manufacturers...

[Papewaio]

Drone-san I was just thinking that. Supply flags and zippos to the middle east... maybe make a BBQ that uses flags for fuel or flag fired pizzas?

[Crazed Rabbit]

I do wonder where they get all their flags. I should start up a flag making company in the middle east. You could make shoddy products that aren't in the least even flame resistant (and even advertise that point! "Our Flags Burn Best!") and charge a good deal. Accuse them of not being faithful enough if they don't want to pay too much for a flag.

Crazed Rabbit

[Leet Eriksson]

you guys got beat...

then again the palestinians knew first hand, and started burning home-made flags..

[KukriKhan]

Funny how the 20-foot wide "Boycott Denmark Products" banner in Sigurd's first foto is in neither Danish nor Arabic, but English.

'Made for TV', I guess.

[Devastatin Dave]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20060203...ropemediaislam

Very tasteless cartoons but at the same moment calling for riots and killing seem a little over the top over cartoons. With "art" of the Virgin Mary smeared in feces and other anti-religious and disrespectful displays such as the cartoons depicting Muhammad in a bad light, should free speech also show a little more curtesy. Not a dig on Islam, but when Christians and Jews are potrayed in this sort of disgusting way, you don't see so much violence as you do when Muslims are disrespected by secular media and society. Can someone explain to me why the phenomenom of violence in the Islamic Faith seems more prevalent in these sort of issues?

[Devastatin Dave]

https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=60620
Sorry a thread is already discussing this issue, could a mod combine my thread to it? Thanks

[Proletariat]

[Devastatin Dave]

https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=60536

https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=60637

https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=60620

Where would i be without you my Dear Friend!!!

[Navaros]

Not a dig on Islam, but when Christians and Jews are potrayed in this sort of disgusting way, you don't see so much violence as you do when Muslims are disrespected by secular media and society. Can someone explain to me why the phenomenom of violence in the Islamic Faith seems more prevalent in these sort of issues?

Because generally speaking, Christians these days do not believe in the Bible with all of their hearts. And they usually somehow have the misconception that they are supposed to act like pansies and tolerate disgusting depictions of their holy figures. Which of course, they are not. Christians have allowed their hearts and minds to be beaten into submission by decades of biased media indoctrination.

Muslims on the other hands, take their faith much more seriously, believe it with all of their hearts, and hence will defend it with ample vigor. They will not backdown or have their spirits broken just because some idiotic newspapers tell them to en masse.

I applaud the Muslims for this conviction.

[Adrian II]

Because generally speaking, Christians these days do not believe in the Bible with all of their hearts. And they usually somehow have the misconception that they are supposed to act like pansies and tolerate disgusting depictions of their holy figures. Which of course, they are not. Christians have allowed their hearts and minds to be beaten into submission by decades of biased media indoctrination.

Muslims on the other hands, take their faith much more seriously, believe it with all of their hearts, and hence will defend it with ample vigor. They will not backdown or have their spirits broken just because some idiotic newspapers tell them to en masse.

I applaud the Muslims for this conviction.

Congrats, you have managed to write a post that is deeply offensive to Muslims and Christians all at the same time.

[Red Peasant]

Lol.
Bigoted Religionistas always stick together on this kind of issue (before they go back to killing each other). They think they have a right to be beyond criticism and mockery. Think again sonny.

[drone]

Because generally speaking, Christians these days do not believe in the Bible with all of their hearts. And they usually somehow have the misconception that they are supposed to act like pansies and tolerate disgusting depictions of their holy figures. Which of course, they are not. Christians have allowed their hearts and minds to be beaten into submission by decades of biased media indoctrination.

Muslims on the other hands, take their faith much more seriously, believe it with all of their hearts, and hence will defend it with ample vigor. They will not backdown or have their spirits broken just because some idiotic newspapers tell them to en masse.

I applaud the Muslims for this conviction.

There was a time when Christians did believe in the Bible with all their hearts. During this time, we had wonderful things called crusades, inquisitions, witch trials, various holy wars, etc.

There were a few posts early in this thread about Islam growing up. It doesn't have to mean Muslims renouncing the tenets of their religion, it just means accepting that not everyone will or must believe as they do.

[Devastatin Dave]

Because generally speaking, Christians these days do not believe in the Bible with all of their hearts. And they usually somehow have the misconception that they are supposed to act like pansies and tolerate disgusting depictions of their holy figures. Which of course, they are not. Christians have allowed their hearts and minds to be beaten into submission by decades of biased media indoctrination.

Muslims on the other hands, take their faith much more seriously, believe it with all of their hearts, and hence will defend it with ample vigor. They will not backdown or have their spirits broken just because some idiotic newspapers tell them to en masse.

I applaud the Muslims for this conviction.

Let the Lord, not the mob or man's sinful desire for violence judge the offenses my Brother in Christ. I choose to turn the other cheek when my faith is mocked although I may fight with words which really most of the time doesn't matter or work. What is happening here is not to be applauded and i do pray that you can see and understand why.

[Louis VI the Fat]

You're scary when you talk like that, Dave.

[Devastatin Dave]

You're scary when you talk like that, Dave.

How's that? Is it better to riot, burn, and kill when offended by someone?

[Goofball]

Not a dig on Islam, but when Christians and Jews are potrayed in this sort of disgusting way, you don't see so much violence as you do when Muslims are disrespected by secular media and society. Can someone explain to me why the phenomenom of violence in the Islamic Faith seems more prevalent in these sort of issues?

Because generally speaking, Christians these days do not believe in the Bible with all of their hearts. And they usually somehow have the misconception that they are supposed to act like pansies and tolerate disgusting depictions of their holy figures.

Or (and I'm just throwing this out there; if you like it you can keep it, if you don't like it you can send it right back) it could be that Christians actually pay attention to the teachings of Jesus, who said a lot of things (IIRC) along the lines of "love your enemy" and "turn the other cheek."

Now Nav, I understand that it is very presumptious for me (somebody whom Jesus would refer to as "a very naughty boy" at best) to question you (a self-proclaimed expert Christian moralist) on matters of Christian scripture and dogma, but I really have to ask:

Do you honestly think that Jesus would have been happy with his followers attacking people because a newspaper printed a picture of him wearing a funny hat?

[Watchman]

Ole Jesus would have a heart attack if He saw just what has been done in His name over the millenia anyway.

Islam has far fever pacifistic pretensions (likely due to the historical contexts of its birth; Roman overlordship and a failed major uprising a few decades ago don't exactly encourage a terribly fierce attitude, unlike the decidedly more warlike and overlord-less seminomadic Arab culture of the comparable period), and thus a whole lot less schizophrenia over the use of violence. The Prophet, praise be and all, would nonetheless no doubt gape in abject disbelief at some of the stuff his followers have been up to.

[Devastatin Dave]

Do you honestly think that Jesus would have been happy with his followers attacking people because a newspaper printed a picture of him wearing a funny hat?

He would not. In fact, the Lord would forgive them if they asked for forgiveness. At no time would I think Jesus would promote any violence for the mochery of Himself. Nav might have a different interpretation than I do. The Lord did get angry about money lenders in the Temple and turned over their tables but He never called for violence against those that hated Him. Give unto Ceaser what is Ceaser's if you will. Stuff like the abortion clinic bombings, Crusades, and other such events, I'm sure, the Lord would not have approved of.

[Ice]

No apology over Mohammad images, says Denmark

http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/europe....ap/index.html

Early Friday, Palestinian militants threw a bomb at a French cultural center in Gaza City, and many Palestinians began boycotting European goods, especially those from Denmark.

"Whoever defames our prophet should be executed," said Ismail Hassan, 37, a tailor who marched through the pouring rain along with hundreds of others in the West Bank city of Ramallah.

[QUOTE]

"Bin Laden our beloved, Denmark must be blown up," protesters in Ramallah chanted.

An imam at the Omari Mosque in Gaza City told 9,000 worshippers that those behind them should have their heads cut off.

And so on..

I know there is already threads on this, but since this was a new Article, I felt the need to start another one. This is getting way out of hand. Over one stupid cartoon drawing in Europe, these guys are flipping out.

[Divinus Arma]

Here we go again. Islamofacism once again. Screw these fanatics. I'll do what I want.

/edit: image removed.

[Ice]

haha..

[Alexanderofmacedon]

Yes, that is a bit amusing...

[KafirChobee]

Religion is religion. If a Muslim cartoon depicted Jesus screwing a donkey - would christians be upset?

It is a game ... and it is being played by the powerful against those that actually believe in a God (regardless of name). It is the old: play the good against the good and they may not understand the evil spreading it.

Truth is, the teachings of Mohamad areas worthy as those of Jesus - both were supressive of women - but, said honor them (because we alls gots mothers).

To villafial (sp) one persons aspect of a "political cartoon" (while those employing it knowingly realise they are violating a religious precept) is in itself "bullshit".

To create a premise that we must all be equal in religion is of course the hope of Christians - especially since 60-70% is Moslim. Still, hope spring eternal and the big lie always wins (or so some Christians hope, rather than face the reality that ... GOD is God, regardless of what one wants to call him.

Someone once said the best way to divert the attention of "the people" from the realities of the "STATE" was to use religion. Religion can always be a proving factor for the state .... if 20% believe it.

Personally? I find it offensive that anyone would degrade religion. Or, justify the actions against one.

Call me open minded >>>> or liberal ..... or open toother perceptions of GOD (call the prick Zeus, but acknowledge we created him). Period. But, take in mind the offensive nature of the toons depicting Mohamad and those printing them (knowing they would offend half the world) and then one can see the truth of the offense. That it was initiated by the Dutch (whom, I always felt a bit a kin because of their liberalism - they have legalized prostitutions, got to love that?) is almost offensive, Especially since their own "terrorist ATTACKS". It almost seems that it is OK for a nations press to close its' mind to reality - if its government has.

Doesn't it?

Proves a point though. That in the supposed democratic societies - the truely wealthy hold the balance of what democracy is. They define it. They have learned to live with it and now control; it.