Red Flood

[AggonyDuck]

1 - and lets hope for the best! :yes:

[DemonArchangel]

Game on.

1.

[Franconicus]

Chapter 38– Operation ‘Südsee’
Malta, 8th February 1941

Sergeant Tom O’Connor steps out of the barracks at Hal air field, Malta, and takes a deep breath. He is waiting for the first light of day, the birth of a new day. After each night in waiting he enjoys this moment of peace, before the company awakes.

O’Connor looks into the sky. It looks like rain. Weather reports say that the clouds will break up today. Maybe the German will attack the airfield today. This has been expected since their first appearance, but until now they have only attacked the harbour.

While he is still looking into the sky, he sees a flitting over the airfield. Almost simultaneously, he hears the hammering of machine guns. Seconds later, the first bombs explode.

Alarms resound as soldiers run out of the barracks to disappear in trenches. At the southern edge a medium Flak fires into the sky, but it is over almost as soon as it started. Nevertheless, the air defence must have hit some planes. Sergeant O’Connor sees parachutes in the sky. In fact, there are quite a lot. The invasion of Malta has begun.

While Sergeant O’Connor is still watching the landing of the 3rd Fj.Reg., five transport planes appear over the airfield. At the same time a group of Stukas uses the first light of the day to bomb British air defence batteries. In the accompanying chaos, nobody notices that the transport planes touch down. In the twilight, one misses the runway and makes a crush. The transport planes spit Major Stentzler and his soldiers of the 2nd Battalion of the Sturmregiment.

Their mission is to clear and protect the runways for the reinforcements. They spread and make themselves ready for combat, while they hear paratroopers of the 3rd regiment already involved in combat.

From the barracks, a British company is sent to support the soldiers at the southern side of the airfield. They run across the airfield, straight into the fire of the soldiers of the Sturmregiment. The British retreat. Fifteen minutes later, they are back, this time with the numbers and determination to defeat the Germans. The British garrison is much stronger than expected. Major Stentzler has to accept that he cannot hold the fort with just a handful of soldiers. He leaves the airfield and retreats to the southern side, to unite with the paratroopers. Hauptmann von der Heyde, the commander of the 1st Battalion, is glad to see reinforcements. So far, his mission has been more difficult than expected.

In the beginning, the British were too surprised to react. Von der Heyde and his men managed to touch down without casualties. However, as soon as they tried to gather and to collect the containers, they were powdered with heavy machine gun fire. They tried to assault the air defence positions at the southern side of the field, but they were stopped by barricades and gunfire. The British positions are stronger than expected.

Now, together with Major Stentzler’s platoon, he orders to assault the British positions again. Three Stukas observe the struggle on the ground and screamingly launch into the defenders. The airborne troops manage to drive the British away. To their surprise they find that most of the air defence bunkers are empty. Von der Heyde and Stentzler prepare themselves for a British counter strike. However, at the moment, the British are satisfied to control the airfield.

Further north, the 2nd Fj.Reg. lands at about the same time. Their mission is to take the village Luqa, to block the road from Veletta and to attack Luqa airfield from the north. In the beginning, everything works fine. The bombing of the airfield attracts the attention of the British soldiers, which camp at Luqa village. They immediately reinforce the airfield. So, the paratroopers can get down and take Luqa village without resistance.

Hauptmann Pietzonka and his men have the mission to block the road from Veletta. They reach ground at the right place and collect their equipment. Then they lay a mine barrier on the road and hide behind the stones that border the road. Ten minutes later a column approaches from Veletta. The front vehicle is armoured, followed by five trucks and about thirty soldiers on bicycles.

When the armoured crosses the barrier, a mine explodes and makes the car sliding. It is stopped by the rocks that border the road. At the same moment, Pietzonka and his men open fire. The trucks start to burn and some well place hand grenades destroy the armoured vehicle, too. The rest of the British infantry retreats. Now the road from Valetta is blocked.

In the eastern area the 1st Regiment gets down. Gusts welcome the paratroopers as they leave the planes. On the ground, Oberst Bräuer sees that the regiment is dispersed and that it is hard to find all containers.

Although there is no sign of Brits, it takes long until the regiment is ready for combat. Then it occupies the villages of Siggiewi, Mqabba and Zurieq. Still no signs of the enemy! Bräuer sends a reconnaissance troops to the airfield of Luqa. When they return, they report that there is a hard combat between the Britsh forces and the platoon of the Sturmregiment, that landed straight on the runway.

It is 10 o’clock in the morning when Ramcke receives the first report. The first wave of paratroopers landed. The second wave is on the way. Casualties are low, but the two airfields are still occupied by the British.

He receives another message from the navy liaison-officer. U47, a German submarine, attacked convoy HG.53 west of Gibraltar. The commander reports that the convoy is guarded by a half a dozen destroyers and corvettes. Ramcke gives the officer a questioning look. “Well, Sir, I thought you would like to know that. There is no word about battleships and the carrier. Of course they can follow the convoy in some distance. Then the submarine would not have spotted them. However, …”

The young navy officer is right. Where is Force H? Has it left the convoy? Did it return to the Mediterranean? If yes, where are they now? Ramcke hurries to a map at the wall. Last time Force H was at Gibraltar during the night of February 6th to 7th. Their course was west. If they had returned and passed Gibraltar unseen during night? The distance from Gibraltar is about 1,000 km. With a speed of 50 km/h, the battle force could be …? Hell, it could be anywhere. It could be straight at the shores of Valetta.

Ramcke immediately calls Geisler, to ask for more air patrols over the sea.
Then he has to call the airfield at Sicily. The second wave of paratroopers is in the air. He has to decide:

1) To call them back. The troops at Malta have to hold the fort until the British battle group is found and eliminated.

2) To send them. The invasion is at a critical point.

3) Order all troops at Malta to take Hal airfield. From there they can be evacuated.

[Stig]

2

We should go on now, they can use every man now. It's not the time for decisions as they were made at Arnhem in just go on with the attack. Every man is needed. If the Airlanding Division was here I would even say that they should be flown in, as the 52nd should have been flown in at Arnhem, every man is off use now.

[AggonyDuck]

Number 2. No point in turning back now.

[SwordsMaster]

Number 2. IT's too late to have doubts.

[Kagemusha]

Yes.Number 2 it is.No turning back now.

[DemonArchangel]

#2, and get every airplane we have into the air RIGHT NOW. We can't afford to have British carrier borne fighters and flak units shoot down our Ju-52s. We need to find the British battle group and eliminate it immediately.

Look at the barricades, barricades take time to set up, they knew we were going to come knocking, they predicted the invasion of Malta was going to take place, the ships are probably already in Malta harbor, ready to nail our FSJ with naval artillery. We need to hit those ships hard with our aerial assets while our FSJ secure landing zones.

[DemonArchangel]

Whoops, doubled post.

[Rodion Romanovich]

Great chapter! I think I'll have to go for no. 2.

[AggonyDuck]

#2, and get every airplane we have into the air RIGHT NOW. We can't afford to have British carrier borne fighters and flak units shoot down our Ju-52s. We need to find the British battle group and eliminate it immediately.


The Skuas/Fulmars from the Ark Royal are no match for the Bf109, so as long as we escort the transports properly, there should be no larger problems. The question though is do we have enough fighters to both hold off the Skuas/Fulmars and the Hurricanes?

[Lord Winter]

2.
If we abandon now we'll never get another chance. Malta will be heavily guarded and the british on high alert. We have to hope that our airpower can keep the Brits at bay or at least slow them down so we have enough time.

[Franconicus]

Chapter 39– The Royal Navy

Ramcke spends the rest of the morning at the phone. He calls Student and they agree to continue the airborne operation. Then he contacts Geisler, to tell him to keep more bombers in reserve. He also contacts the Italian Navy and Air Force. The Navy promised to send a force from La Spezia, consisting of the battleships Vittorio Veneto, Andrea Doria und Giulio Cesare and 8 destroyers to a position east of Malta. Commander is Admiral Iachino. A second force with the heavy cruisers Trieste, Trento and Bolzano as well as two destroyers coming from Messina will bypass Malta on the southern route and then join the force coming from La Spezia.

The air force agrees to send reconnaissance patrols to screen the area east of Malta.

Ramcke also calls Rommel to tell that there might soon be a naval battle at the shores of Malta. Rommel decides to stop the convoy bound for Tunis.

Then Ramcke is sitting at the phone, waiting for news. Is there anything else he can do? Should he call Roatta? No, the Special Forces can do nothing against a moving target that has not even been pinpointed. He calls the airport, only to hear that there is no news. The clouds make it difficult for the planes to find anything. Furthermore, fog is coming. This is almost the worst thing that could happen. Fog will nullify the German airpower. Fog – who could be more familiar with fog than the English? Maybe this is just an illusion. Maybe the English group is on the way to the Southern Atlantic, far away from Malta.

Finally, at 10:30 comes news from the English battleships. Force H was spotted this morning at Genoa. Not only spotted. The English fleet shelled the town and harbour. There were also air strikes against Livorno. English planes laid mines at the entrance of La Spezia. Then they bombed the refinery of Livorno. Two Italian reconnaissance planes tried to shadow them, but were picked off. Now the English are gone without a trace. Fog is getting denser. If the English turn south, they will reach Malta in the evening. Then they would be able to shell the island during night.

Ramcke contacts the Italian Navy. Admiral Iachino’s force is already informed and turns north and to intercept the English.

After redeployment and reinforcements on both sides, the battle of Malta continues. The British overcome their first shock. The British commander regains control of his forces.

At Hal airport, more paratroopers touch down. However, they are immediately under fire from the British infantry lying in the facilities of the airport and in trenches all around the runways. Casualties are high. Major Stentzler decides to assault the airfield, even though the support of the air force is much thinner than expected. The Germans have minor numbers, but superior firepower. They manage to attack the British position from two sides. In the crossfire the English retreat. At noon the German displace the British from the airfield. However, the buildings of the airport are still occupied by the British and Major Stentzler is killed.

At Luqa airfield, the British manage to defeat the landed soldiers of the Sturmregiment. Most of the German soldiers are killed in actions. Half an hour later, the 1st Fj.Reg. attacks the airfield from the west, while the 2nd Fj.Reg. attacks from the north. The assault is supported by several Stukas. A group of Stukas dives through the low cloud cover. However, the leading plane has misjudged the height. Five divers drill themselves into the ground.

Nevertheless, the paratroopers break the resistance of the defenders and control the first airport.

The British forces at Valetta make another attempt to re-establish the connection to Luqa. They manage to push Hauptmann Pietzonka’s battalion to the edge of Luqa airfield. When the English find out that Luqa is occupied by the Germans, they break up and retreat to Valetta.

Although the victory at Hal is not completed, German transporter land at both airports. English artillery from Valetta shells both runways and many transporters are damaged while they bring reinforcements and supply. The new arriving troops reinforce the paratroopers on the island and advance to take Valetta.

At noon the Italian Air force makes a massive bombardment of Valetta.
It is 14:00 when Ramcke finally gets an overview of the current state. Although the airfields were better protected than expected, the operation goes according plan. If everything goes right, the fate of the island will soon be decided.

If everything goes right! Ramcke gets information from an Italian pilot. He spotted several ships near the eastern coast of Corsica, northward bound. He could only watch them only for minutes, and then they disappeared in the fog, again. The Italian fleet is immediately changing its course to attack the English.

At 15:25 there is another contact. However, this time it is between Italy and Sardinia, far south of the Italian battle group. In fact, there is nothing between Force H and Malta. Geisler is determined to change that. He orders all reserves to get up immediately, even if there a risk that they will not find the ships. At 16:05 they are lucky. There is a gap in the clouds and the German pilots can see British ships. There is a battleship, a heavy cruiser, and a light cruiser, and five, six, no seven destroyers. 40 Ju87 and 60 bombers, He111 and Ju88 pounce from the sky to attack the British ships. Those raise their speed. The combined air defense of the10 warships yarns a deadly net into the sky. Despite of that, and although the weather is anything but ideal, the German pilots execute their mission with defiance of death. Although many planes were torn up, some manage to drop their bombs into the target.

The raid lasts only half an hour. When they return, 27 German planes are missing. The English have there share, too. The battleship was hit three times, the heavy cruiser once, one destroyer is sunk another one crippled.
Geisler welcomes the pilots. The mechanics refuel and reload the planes, and then Geisler urges the crews to make another sortie.

This time the weather is even worse. Nevertheless, 8 German pilots find the English ships and attack them. This time they concentrate only on the battleship. It takes two hits before the Germans fly back home. At least 5 of them! This was the last mission for the pilots this evening.

On Malta, the paratroopers have reached the suburbs of Valetta. They have artillery, now, as well as the machine gun battalion. Platoons attack the costal bunkers on both side of the bay.

Night fall, but the British defenders still show no sign of resignation. They still fight for every house, every inch. But the advantage is clearly on the side of the Germans. Every minute another plane brings more soldiers to the island.
Oberst Bräuer, now commanding the joined airborne forces, prepares his troops to assault the town during night. He has a long conversation with Ramcke about the British naval forces. The result is disillusioning. There is nothing that could stop the British vessels from sailing to Malta and shelling the island during night. Oberst Bräuer has no illusions about what will happen if the battleship and the heavy cruiser shell the little island. The result would be disastrous.

Ramcke gives Bräuer free hand to decide what to do. In fact, there are only two options.

1) Ignore the threat and assault Valetta during night. Although a night battle will be risky, the paratroopers are strong enough to break the English resistance.
2) Halt the assault. Give order to all troops to entrench. The deeper the better. Next morning, when the sun comes, the German planes will rule again and Valetta will fall.

[Cataphract_Of_The_City]

1. But some troops should occupy coastal guns and use them against the British ships. After all there are only two ships.

[Stig]

I go for 1, Valetta should fall


CofC these are Airborne troops, they can't control coastal guns, they've never seen them

[Kagemusha]

Number. 1. Get yourself in touch with British troops everywhere you can leave no empty space.This should limit the effect of Naval artillery or atleast devastate the British aswell as our troops.

[Rodion Romanovich]

Nice chapter! I'd like to pick a combination between no. 1 and no. 2 - a controlled advance as far as we can get without wasting troops, but it isn't necessary that they take all of Valetta before morning.

[AggonyDuck]

I'm going to favour the "safe" option and order the FJ to dig in.
So it's number 2 for me.

[DemonArchangel]

Option 1, and I agree with Kagemusha, hug the British troops as tightly as possible, go hand to hand if necessary.

[Lord Winter]

I agree with 1. If we let the British dig in while already in the city the results of the next assault could be devasting. Lets not make a picket's charge against a dug in and possibly navaly supported enemy.

[JimBob]

Number 1. And as has been said, Russian air defense.

[King Kurt]

Well you paratroopers obviously know nothing about naval matters!! The best option is to dig in, wait for day and let our planes deal with the ships. The airfields are inland and, if in range at all, will be at the limit of the range of the naval guns. More importantly, who is going to observe the fall of shot to bring down accurate fire on the airfields? - I doubt there will be the skilled, correctly trained observers conviently sitting in the right place with a radio set that works. At best, it will be blind firing against map references - admittingly big shells, so the most likely effect will be disruption of the use of the airfield. Ironically, by attacking, our troops will expose their actual positions and make themselves more open to bombardment. A night attack is frought with potential problems - a couple of things going wrong could leave us with little or no reserves.
Finally, one aspect does not appear to have any effect - the population of Malta - i would have thought that their tradition would have lead them to resist the invasion quite firecely - similar things happened in Crete - their resistance during the actual seige of Malta during the war was very stubborn - hence the George cross for the population - so I would imagine that they would be resisting the paratroopers in any way they could.
Finally - sorry I have not been active this week - blame family illness!!

[JimBob]

Kurt makes sense. They'll be as likely to hit their own as to hit ours. In the day our planes can drive the ships off and support the FJs into the city.

Change my vote to #2

[Stig]

Good point I agree:
Change vote to 2

[DemonArchangel]

Kurt, the thing is, Malta's quite small, big naval guns can hit our troops at any point on the island, and we can't quite dig in quickly enough to get enough protection from heavy caliber naval artillery.

Better to fight at night and up close to the British, where our superior training, coordination and numbers will make a difference, and where the British won't be willing to fire upon their own troops. Also, if we dig in, the British fortify their positions in Valletta as well, making the town much more difficult to capture. As soon as the second wave lands and collects their equipment, our Fallschirmjaeger will have to move out and attack.

[King Kurt]

Kurt, the thing is, Malta's quite small, big naval guns can hit our troops at any point on the island, and we can't quite dig in quickly enough to get enough protection from heavy caliber naval artillery.

Better to fight at night and up close to the British, where our superior training, coordination and numbers will make a difference, and where the British won't be willing to fire upon their own troops. Also, if we dig in, the British fortify their positions in Valletta as well, making the town much more difficult to capture. As soon as the second wave lands and collects their equipment, our Fallschirmjaeger will have to move out and attack.
Demon, as a person who lives on an Island - admittedly not Malta!! - the difficulty I see is getting accurate observation - this is 1941, so no fancy radios etc. Come 1944 the Allies had complete airsuperiority, better radios etc and naval gunfire was more accurate - but this is a different situation. Observers of naval bombardments were usually naval officers so I just can't see one of those being able to observe fall of shot and have a means of communicating with the ships. Also, how far inland are the airfields? - if they are say 5 miles inland then with the ships having to be a mile or 2 offshore they will be firing at 8 - 10 miles range. it is not so much that they can't reach our positions, it is more that the fire will be so blind as to be uneffective. Now the runway may take some stick, but that is soon repaired. a night attack may work, but does have the potential to go horribly wrong and we have no reserves to shore up our position if that happens.

[Kagemusha]

If we compare our strongpoints and weaknesses to the British Garrison,its the superior quality of our fallschirmjägers that gives us the advantage. By few hours of digging up will get our men to fox holes and those wont protect the men much at all from the large calibre naval guns. But each hour we use on digging in the English will be doing that also. And when we dont have much of traditional support,that will hurt us more then them. So lets use our advantages and deny our enemies the use of theirs.

[DemonArchangel]

Also, nobody's going to be calling down inaccurate naval fire at night anyway. We have to fight, besides, if we wait until day, it might take a while for our planes to find and sink the British task group, during which time, they can damage our forces on Malta (which by the way, can't throw up concrete fortifications to defend against heavy naval gunfire). The British can't have any more time to dig in, so as soon as the second wave lands, we have to attack, JimBob, Legio, Stig, change your votes back.

Trust me, my way is the only way, even if the naval fire is accurate, digging in won't help. We're trained to fight with limited communications, the British aren't. We move quick, we clinch this, otherwise we get caught in the open against the big guns.

[Franconicus]

... Finally - sorry I have not been active this week - blame family illness!!
Kurt, so glad you're back. I have feared that you left the story (and the org - maybe), because of my unprofessional use of the Royal Navy.

Good luck to you and your family. It seems like the flu is here, now. :sweatdrop:


This is the intermediate result:

After a strong start of option 1 (6:1) the return of KK changed everything and now it is 4:4.

[King Kurt]

Kurt, so glad you're back. I have feared that you left the story (and the org - maybe), because of my unprofessional use of the Royal Navy.

Good luck to you and your family. It seems like the flu is here, now. :sweatdrop:


This is the intermediate result:

After a strong start of option 1 (6:1) the return of KK changed everything and now it is 4:4.
Franc - thanks for the kind words - my family are all on the mend - I hope your's recover soon.

Finally - sorry for causing such confusion in the voting - there you were a nice 6-1 clear decision, along I come and it is a 4-4 tie!!
I do think it is a finely balanced decision to make - 1 is the agressive, daring choice, but has the potential to go seriously wrong - 2 is, in my view, the safer option, but if we are caught by a serious naval bombardment then that is serious too. In all likelyhood, the naval task force is about evacuation as opposed to attack, or at least to have the option to do that. There was a lot of naval forces off Crete and they took severe casualties, but they were there to evacuate the british troops, not to attack the paras.

[SwordsMaster]

I'll break the tie. 2 it is

[Rodion Romanovich]

Wait, which options was I counted as? I took a combination of both... My option should probably be counted as 2 if it has to be counted as either, but I would prefer to count it as a third option! Anyway, it matters little now as SwordsMaster broke the tie! :shrug:

[Franconicus]

Chapter 40 – Decision

Malta, 9th February 1941

Bräuer decides to take no risks. Assaulting a town at night is always difficult, but the presence of British ships makes it hazardous.
Before night falls, he gives his orders. The machine gun battalion and the pioneer battalion prepare themselves to attack the town and to clear the costal bunkers next morning. They will spy out the British positions and make some prisoners over night. The rest of the infantry will spread out and entrench. Bräuer gives the order to avoid any light. The airports will not be operating and the artillery is interdicted to fire. Bräuer even phones with the X. Corps. The air force promises to keep some bombers circulating over the island.

Now, everything that can be done is done. Night is falling and fog is probably getting even denser. The Fallschirmjäger notice several position lights at the bay of Grand Harbor. Obviously, the British garrison is waiting for the ships, too. From time to time the British artillery at Valleta sends its greetings to the two air ports, but the fire is weak and inaccurate.

The British soldiers at Valetta are quiet. More bothering than the British fire are raids in the rear of the German positions, especially at the western part of the island. Dark silhouettes kill German watches and disappear in the fog. Bräuer increases the numbers of patrols, but without any effect.

At 19:20 there is again artillery fire on Hal airfield. However, this time, the shells are coming from southern direction, from the sea. They are only medium caliber and are inaccurate. However, they make the German soldiers disappear in the trenches.

The German bombers see the lights of the shooting and try to bomb the ships. Expectedly, they miss the targets, but the British ships stop firing at least and disappear in the fog.

Bräuer agonizes. This has certainly not been the bombardment of the British battleship and cruisers. Is there another formation? Will the big ships come later? He gives the order that every soldiers should stay in defilade. There is no need to accept any risk.

At 1:05 the outposts report about movements on the other side.

Immediately, Bräuer sends some companies from the Sturmregiment to reinforce the German positions. However, the British infantry does not come. Neither do the British ships. This uncertainty and enforced idleness makes Bräuer mad. He gives the order to send patrols into town. At 2:00 several platoons try to infiltrate the British positions. At several places they come across the British outposts and close combat takes place. Two patrols manage to get into the town and cause some chaos there.

At 2:30 the patrols return. They report that the British take out and that they started to embark. Bräuer gives the order to assault, but the British trenches are still occupied. After a short close combat the German soldiers manage to break into the positions of their enemies. They take prisoners, all members of the militia. Bräuer orders to advance and to take the harbor.

From several directions the Germans try to reach this target. It is still night, and although the fog is lifting, it is almost impossible to coordinate the activities of the different platoons. At some places German soldiers shoot at each others, but the British defenders are disoriented just the same. Then, near the harbor, resistance is getting stiffer. The British infantry is now supported by artillery, coming from the port basin. The German assault platoons break this barrier, too, and soon they reach the quays only to see several ships leaving the harbor. They take several hundred prisoners. However, the victory is still incomplete and big areas are still occupied by the British.

Finally, there is a new morning. In the soft morning breeze, the clouds of fog disappear and the sun breaks through. With the beams of the sun, the German aero planes appear and control the sky. Whiningly, Stukas attack their targets and German Fallschirmjäger start to clear block after block. At 8:00 a British peace envoy crosses the lines and offers the capitulation of the island. At 11:00 Italian ships arrive. Italian infantry takes possession of Malta. They scour the town and the rest of the island. Dirty and exhausted German soldiers gather at the air fields, glad that this long day is over now.
However, what has happened to the British ships? This question does not only keep Bräuer busy. Ramcke and his staff are asking this question as well as Geisler’s X. Korps. And of course Geisler sends out his planes to look for the British force.

First message comes from the western area. A battleship and two cruisers are heading for Gibraltar. The battleship and one cruiser are damaged and running only at low speed. The ships have an escort of four destroyers.
They are already out of range for the Stukas, but the twin-engines might get them. Geisler sends out his He111 and Ju88. They manage to reach Force H and attack the battleship. The British concentrate their fire to protect the battleship and the first wave of He111 is not able to hit the ship. However, the following Ju88 dive through the deadly curtain of exploding air defense shells and hit the ship seven times. Then they return to their bases.
SS AMBRA, an Italian submarine near the coats of Crete spots a small British convoy coming from Malta, heading for Crete. It consists of 9 destroyers and four transport ships. SS AMBRA manages to torpedo a transport ship. Then the battle is over.

Two days later, the British admiralty announces the loss of the battleship “HMS Malaya”.

Now it is time to draw up the account. Slowly, the reports from the battalions reach Ramcke’s headquarter.

Casualties are high. 152 Fallschirmjäger are lost or missed; 683 wounded. Ramcke sees a lot of familiar names on the list. Among them are comrades that had just passed their training – together with Ramcke. The most prominent victim, however, is Major Stentzler.

The air force paid her toll of blood, too. After only four weeks of action the X. Luftkorps has already lost more than one third of its planes. The pilots of these planes were either killed or are missed; in total about 300 skilled men. Additionally, more than 40 transport planes are ruined.

The Fallschirmjäger made 2,500 POWs. About 80 British soldiers were killed. Additionally, many civilians were killed.

Once again Ramcke asks himself if the victory was worth the price.

Ramcke also receives the reports about the battle itself. Obviously, the British anticipated an airborne operation. The garrisons of the airfields were unusually strong. Fortunately, the air defense was concentrated around Grand Harbor. All told, the German operation was executed quite well. During the first hour the enemy was confused and not able to start coordinated countermeasures. The control of the skies compensated the lack of heavy arms and the weakness of the navy. The German bombers always broke through the air defense of the British ships and placed their bombs.

[Stig]

Only 152 dead and 683 wounded, that's pretty good for an unsupported Airborne operation

[King Kurt]

A good result I think - but the losses within the airforce is serious though - Who was it who mentioned evacuation??? - oh yes, it was me!!!!:laugh4:

[Stig]

Ah well we have Malta now, rebuild the Airborne forces and they can be used again, now with support

[DemonArchangel]

Hey. This wasn't as bad as Crete.

Anyway, try to convince Hitler that the capture of Malta more than makes up for the loss in airplanes, then try to revise training schedules, procure better equipment and take aim for Crete.

[Franconicus]

A good result I think - but the losses within the airforce is serious though - Who was it who mentioned evacuation??? - oh yes, it was me!!!!:laugh4:
Yes, the RN would not leave the army in the lurch, would she?

[King Kurt]

Yes, the RN would not leave the army in the lurch, would she?
Sadly, during the early years of the war, the RN had a lot of practise at that sort of operation!! - Still, reverse the flow and it becomes practice for D-Day!:laugh4:

[Kagemusha]

Sadly, during the early years of the war, the RN had a lot of practise at that sort of operation!! - Still, reverse the flow and it becomes practice for D-Day!:laugh4:

Kurt my friend. What are your thoughts now that if we would have taken Gibraltar.Would it had made any difference in this battle of Malta?

[DemonArchangel]

We would have failed utterly at taking Gibraltar.

I'll say that much.

[Kagemusha]

Failed by using the Wermacht forces from the Historicall plan? That case we should better withdraw back inside our borders if two Corps of elite troops,couldnt have taken that Rock.

[King Kurt]

Kage

I still feel that Gib is a far harder nut to crack than Malta. It is much smaller, so concentration of force is far easier - on Malta the British forces were deployed to meet a sea invasion and so to concentrate for a counter attack on the airfields was much more difficult, especially in the face of overwhelming air superiority. If we had attacked Gib, the English would have been sitting on the high ground, in superb fortifications with a clear view of the airfield. Any navy forces would have been sitting there able to fire over open sights at anything on the airfield. It would have been a slaughter - and our air support would have been greatly reduced unless they could operate from spanish airfields - highly unlikely due to the stuborness of Franco and certainly not on the timescale with which we were able to invade Malta. I think it it not unreasonable to assume that our airforce would have had to operate from Italy or Sardina, so the impact of the airforce - the deciding factor in our assault on Malta - would have been neutered. Also the air defences would have been concentrated on a small area - on Malta most were around the harbour defending the carrier - so our transport planes and air support would have been hammered.
The other aspect is the strategic one. Our attack on Malta , despite a favourable set of circumstances, was quite costly - 10% casualties on the FJ and a third of our aircraft. But the cost is worth it as Malta is the base which was used to disrupt the convoys from Italy to North Africa, so now our forces should be better supplied. Gib's strategic value - for the Med - is as a base to supply Malta - so why take the far heavier casualties to take Gib when you can take Malta for far less. Gib is still an important base - for operations in the Atlantic and making it difficult for U-boats to get into the Med - but its strategic value in the Med has been greatly reduced with the fall of Malta. Force H is unlikely to operate in the western Med now due to the air threat.
So I remain convinced we have made the right decision.:yes:

[AggonyDuck]

Actually Gibraltar has a weakness; its water supply. Gibraltar has limited fresh water resources and relies on rainwater catchments for water supply. Foul the water and stop supply convoys and suddenly the British will be running out of drinkable water. It would be doable to drop something in the rainwater catchments with dive bombers. But that would only soften the defences up; the Rock would still be nigh impossible to take without first neutralising Force H and as Kurt said, its importance has dropped considerably.

[Stig]

If we want to attack Gibraltar we should bring Spain into the war. We need their bases to be succesfull imo

[Kagemusha]

Kurt and others.Thanks for the answers.:bow: I agree that Gibraltar is not a priority at the moment. I was thinking about if it had been taken before Malta and what that could have chanced in our reacent mission on Malta. What the denial of British navy to enter mediterranian from there could have chanced? Just an what if scenario. Now our priority is at Africa and to defeat of the British forces in there.

[Rodion Romanovich]

I agree - Gibraltar is probably very easy if we have free troops passage through Spain, especially passage of heavy artillery - even railguns, as well as borrowing Spanish airfields. On the other hand without Spanish support the only alternatives are naval or airborne operations, which I believe to not come with a great risk of slaugther, but with a 100% risk of becoming a total failure. Gibraltar is purely a diplomatical issue.

Apart from securing our supply to North Africa better than before, we have also created an interesting dilemma for the British. We can basically block any British attempts of passage through the Med by holding Malta unless the British redistribute their forces a bit. This means the British have to choose one of the following:
1. keeping things as they are, in which case we are probably capable of almost entirely blocking British passage through the Med, forcing them to take the long way around Africa, even for emergency convoys. This will be very useful for our forces in North Africa
2. weaken the Gibraltar naval force and concentrating their naval forces at Alexandria. In this case, we might get a good chance of later taking Gibraltar, or succeed in moving subs into and out of the Med
3. strengthen the Gibraltar force to be capable of breaking through the Med for emergency convoys to north Africa, at the expense of weakening their naval forces at Alexandria. This will open up a lot of options for us to the east. Probably enable us to reach the Middle east oil fields more easily.

[Stig]

Once we take Egypt Gibraltar has only one use for the Brits, as a naval harbour for rampaging ships against our transport ships in the Med.

BTW it's impossible to attack Gibraltar with a Airborne assault, it's a rock, you can't land on it. Ofcourse there are some flat zones, but these can be easely protected by the Brits.

[Lord Winter]

Once we take Egypt Gibraltar has only one use for the Brits, as a naval harbour for rampaging ships against our transport ships in the Med.

BTW it's impossible to attack Gibraltar with a Airborne assault, it's a rock, you can't land on it. Ofcourse there are some flat zones, but these can be easely protected by the Brits.
Well you could always land around it then attack.

I agree with the others Gibraltar is less important now. What we should focus on is the Suez. With the cut the British situation in the Med. grows very bad. With this done we can gain the oil that historically Germany was never able to get.

[Franconicus]

Chapter 41 – To Africa
Naples, 1st March 1941

All in all the staff is pleased with the results of operation ‘Südsee’. Hitler is pleased that the Germans defeated the British another time and supported the Italians, Göring is pleased that the success was entered completely for the Luftwaffe and Goebbels celebrates this victory to increase moral.
Only thing that bothers Ramcke is the fact that the British anticipated an airborne operation. Prisoners reported that there had been a warning two weeks before. Also there is the fact that Force H had been out just the day the operation had taken place. Coincidence? Or treachery?

Ramcke and Student do not have a lot of time to analyse the battle of Malta. The first convoys of the Panzergruppe Africa leave Naples on February 9th and from this day on troops and material is carried across the ocean. It takes a lot of coordination and patience to ship entire divisions from Germany to Naples and then to Africa. Nothing comes in time and most of the time important things are missing.

At least the passage to Africa is safe. End of the month the British navy is getting more active. The Italian light cruiser Diaz is sunk by a British submarine while forming part of the escort for a Naples-Tripoli convoy. There is also the information from intelligence that the Sues Channel has been opened again and that the carrier ‘Formidable’ has entered the Mediterranean, now.

One day after the seizure of Malta, the British advance comes to a halt at El Agheila. There is little Italian opposition to prevent a further move, so there must be another reason for this. Maybe the British ran out of supply.

On February 12th a new Italian Commander in Chief for Libya is appointed, General Gariboldi. Field Marshal Kesselring is in Rome as the German representative. Gariboldi promises to transfer a tank division and a motorized division to Africa.

Luftflotte 2 decides to withdraw the X. Air Corps during March and to refill it near Vienna. It will be replaced by the II. Air Corps of General Lörzer. The IX. Air Corps is still engaged in operations against the British islands and will arrive later.

At February 14th the first units of what will become the Panzergruppe Afrika arrive at Tripoli. The advance guard is a battalion of light infantry and an antitank unit.

Six days later the German patrols make a first contact with a British patrol. At Monday, 24th, there is a first engagement, where the Germans destroy several British vehicles.

End of February the German commanders receive a report from intelligence that tells them that the British will transfer several divisions from Africa to Greece. All generals agree that this offers some opportunities. Additionally, they receive the information from Rommel that the British lines near El Agheila are very thin. Rommel urges the Panzergruppe to transfer the 5. Leichte Division and the Italian divisions to the front near El Agheila and to give him plenty of rope.

Ramcke invites to a meeting at Naples, with Hoth, Student and Geisler as well as Stosch from the Navy.

Stosch makes a proposal to attack the British fleet located near Crete. The Royal Navy already suffered severe casualties, including a carrier and a battleship. Roatta’s Special Forces are ready to strike near Crete. Operational planning and training are almost finished. Then the Italian Navy should attack. German air reconnaissance could support them very effectively. Once the Royal Navy is defeated, the convoys to Greece could be intercepted. This would not only support operation ‘Marita’; it would weaken the British significantly and also encourage the Italians.

A1) Accept the plan! This means that the air force is ordered to sound out the situation around Crete and the Peloponnesus that the Special Forces execute their operations and that Ramcke will try to convince the Italian Navy to send the big ships.

A2) Reject the idea! Leave the Italian Navy where it is.

Regarding the operations at Libya:
B1) Accept Rommel’s request, transfer the divisions to the front and give him plenty of rope.

B2) Disallow Rommel’s request and stay to the original plan. There will be no operation until at least one army corps is ready.

[DemonArchangel]

1.) The Italian fleet cannot defeat the British fleet. We'll need air bases in Greece to directly support the operation if it's to succeed. Hold the Italians (except for the Special Forces) back for now, at least until we get airbases closer to Crete.

2.) Give the 5th Leichte Division to Rommel. Rommel is a very capable commander, I'm sure he can reverse some of the British gains within the past few months. We can transfer the rest of the Panzergruppe to the front later.

I also have a few proposals to make regarding well.... everything.

Special Forces: We should use the Brandenburgers and FSJ to seize British held airfields in North Africa (in order to deny them air cover).

Also, XaMas and Rgt. San Marco could form the nucleus of an Axis Marine Corps for the purpose of raiding British held seaports in North Africa and the Middle East (might come in handy in the marshes north of Leningrad as well).

That will come later though. First, we have to use the FSJ and Brandenburgers to seize the bridge on the Corinth canal, so that the British can't escape to Crete as easily.

FSJ Equipment: If possible, try to find a way to get more FSJs to drop with their weapons, instead of their weapons in containers, and adopt the double strap parachute. The folding stock K98 should be coming out right about now, and our boys should be getting their hands on it. Also, try to see how the FG-42 and the G-43 are doing.

Another thing to try for is the possibility of air dropped tanks and other vehicles.

Future FSJ Operations: Assuming we can get our hands on the Luftlande Division, attack Crete as soon as possible. Crete is vital to our future operational success.

[Stig]

The Airborne forces will have to recover first, ofcourse 1,000 casualties aren't that much for an airborne attack, but it will take some months to recover

[Rodion Romanovich]

I think I'll wait with my choice for A until there has been some more discussion on what the Italians have, and what the British can be expected to get to the area. My gut feeling is however to reject the plan...

B1 - no risk of outrunning supplies so close to our landing spot, but a good chance for Rommel to defeat advance British forces in a quick surprise operation. This is a type of strategical decision Rommel is good at making, and I don't think he'll have made an incorrect judgement on the strength of the British position. So: :charge:

[Lord Winter]

A2: The Italian navy is not in any shape to attack the British navy. It will be better to wait until we have sized the Suez or Crete then support them with an air corps or two.

B1: Let Rommel go, he has good judgement and is by far one of our best offensive commanders.

[Cataphract_Of_The_City]

I would choose A1 but the Italian navy should be help back until the last possible moment and when maximum damage from the airforce and the special forces is done.

B1. Rommel's aggresiveness is probably his major advantage.

[Franconicus]

DemonArchangel:

Special Forces: We should use the Brandenburgers and FSJ to seize British held airfields in North Africa (in order to deny them air cover).
Right now? Which ones?


FSJ Equipment: If possible, try to find a way to get more FSJs to drop with their weapons, instead of their weapons in containers, and adopt the double strap parachute. The folding stock K98 should be coming out right about now, and our boys should be getting their hands on it. Also, try to see how the FG-42 and the G-43 are doing.
It is understood that the dropping without weapons is a major disadvantage. However, as long as we have to use the old transport planes, there is not a lot that can be done. Student will try to increase the numbers of gliders! Regarding weapons: He will get the best guns for the paras. Even at Malta, the fire power of the FJs was superior.



Another thing to try for is the possibility of air dropped tanks and other vehicles.
There is a research program for airdropped tanks. And there is a small half track vehicle that can be dropped.

All:
Decision A) is only to decide whether to prepare such an operation or not. The Special Forces will do their business anyway, the Italian big ships will only enter the battle after reconnaisance and another decision.

[SwordsMaster]

A1: The brits must be dealt with. There is no other choice, and the fact that they are rebasing to Greece is a great opportunity to reduce significantly their ability to fight by destroying them helpless. Meaning destroying the troop transports to the Peninsula.

I agree though that no action should be taken without thorough recon, and if the brits are superior, the operation could be posponed until a suitable opportunity presents itself.

B1: If Rommel thinks he can do it, we have no reason to doubt his ability. Of course we must continue the shipping og troops and equipment to the area. Maybe a well placed FSJ operation to take Alexandria could be organised? That would stir up the brits

[DemonArchangel]

Franc: For North Africa, I was about to suggest mixed teams of both, but Brandenburgers mounted in Kubelwagens, motorcycles and light halftracks should suffice in raiding British airfields (and maybe artillery positions).

Also, start preparing for an operation like A1, but make sure to keep extensive German air cover near the deploying Italian fleet. I get this feeling that the British have relatively good intelligence, and thus know what we're trying to do. They did anticipate the airborne attack on Malta. If the British launch a raid on an Italian harbor full of ships, our planes can destroy their taskforce as it withdraws. The Italians will still be responsible for anti-submarine and anti-Commando security though.

Lastly: What about the single strap parachute design? It needs to be replaced immediately. Our paratroopers need to be able to maneuver to selected landing zones.

SwordsMaster: No, we cannot take Alexandria with the FSJ (we'll just get cut off), we can take Crete and the Corinth Canal with the FSJ, thus cutting off and destroying many British forces.

To All: I suggest the next FSJ Operation be the seizure of the Corinth Canal in support of the invasion of Greece. This will prevent the bulk of British forces from retreating into the Peloponnesos and thus make the seizure of Crete much easier.

[Stig]

A2 and B1


To All: I suggest the next FSJ Operation be the seizure of the Corinth Canal in support of the invasion of Greece. This will prevent the bulk of British forces from retreating into the Peloponnesos and thus make the seizure of Crete much easier.

Don't really agree. I think we can use them again when it's about June/July, before that they aren't ready yet. Besides we still need the Luftlande division.
I suggest we see what happens in Africa, if we win there we can use them to take Nile bridges, or maybe drop them on the Seuz Canal. Once we manage to take Alexandria we should push through to Palestina as fast as the tanks can run.

[SwordsMaster]

SwordsMaster: No, we cannot take Alexandria with the FSJ (we'll just get cut off), we can take Crete and the Corinth Canal with the FSJ, thus cutting off and destroying many British forces.

I meant as a part of Rommel's offensive. The brits can be caught between Alexandria and attacking Rommel, thus accelerating the process.
Besides, if we control the harbour in Alexandria and succeed in destroying the brits at Crete, the italian navy will be able to supply them with no problem. And it'll give us the control of the skies pretty close to Suez and another base to give air support to Rommel's advance.

Think about it. The way I see it, our best bet in Greece is to cut off supplies and troops, and then let the italians or slovakians or other allies use their regular forces. The british presence in Greece will be small, and I don't see the point of diverting valuable FSJ or planes to the peninsula that has a fairly low strategic value... The control of Suez and Alexandria will do much more for us than the control of Greece.

[Stig]

I agree with Swordsmaster, we should leave the FJ for Alexandria and Rommel. By the time Rommel has pushed the Brits back the FJ should be ready to be used again. If we use them in Greece we might not be able to use them to assist Rommel.

[Rodion Romanovich]

I think the FJs would best be deployed as a small elite formation to help the Italians in East Africa for the moment being. We should also send a decent general there to assist them and organize them better. We really want to control points south of the Suez, maybe the Red Sea at the height of Aden, for example. Not having the Italians losing badly in East Africa would IMO improve our capabilities at defeating the British forces in Egypt, and reaching the Suez. Second operation I had in mind for the FJs would be to raid enemy airfields. I'd suggest inserting a few airborne tanks, halftracks or fast jeeps with machineguns a long distance south of some important British airfields, then attack them and try to destroy as many planes as possible. Whoever controls the air has a huge advantage.

For an operation to capture Alexandria, we would first need to capture airfields almost as far east as El Alamein to get a transport distance comparable to that we had in Operation Südsee. I think that attempting such an operation from about as far east as Tobruk would be the absolute maximum range and mean extreme difficulties in getting fighter and dive bomber support. Secondly, Alexandria can be expected to have a very large garrison, and it's much larger than Valetta and would take a long time to capture. I'd rather use the FJs for small but important targets that are useful to capture by the element of surprise but doesn't necessarily require surprise to succeed, than for large-scale operations that rely on so many factors to grant success.

[Rodion Romanovich]

triple post

[Rodion Romanovich]

triple post

[Franconicus]

If I understand right:

A) still uncertain if an attack against the British navy and convoys are suitable.

B) let Rommel do what he wants to do. This is clear statement, although against the strategy chosen before.

[King Kurt]

Back from hols!!
I would go for A1 - we should grab every opportunity to attack the Royal Navy - if it is sucessful, then we are better off tacticly. If it is unsuccessful then we will have gain a strategic advantage in that the weakness of the Italian forces will be even more exposed and this will help us in gaining complete control of all the forces in the med.
I would go for B2 - Rommel was good, but supply is the key - no point in attacking early, only to run out of supplies and not being able to complete the job - moreover, the english will have little or no supplies to capture as they have exhausted theirs in the last offensive and resupply will be slow due to the Greece operation. Let's build up our forces for a few months then attack properly. Also, we have made the decision to put Hoth in control - why should we give his rival - Rommel - an opportunity to grab a few headlines before his half baked offensive runs out of steam.
I know B2 is a bit against the tide - but look what happened last time - I posted and everybody changed their minds!!!:laugh4:

[Kagemusha]

I agree with Kurt. A1 and B2. We dont have to concern whether the Italians win or loose.Each sunk British ship works in our favour. About Rommel. We shouldnt start the attack untill our force is fully in Africa. Its better to strike with the fist,then poke the enemy with one finger at the time.

[JimBob]

Its all been said. A1 and B2

[Franconicus]

The decisions are:

Prepare the attack against the British ships (5:3 votes)
Let Rommel attack (6:3)

[Franconicus]

Chapter 41 – Who rules the waves?
Naples, 26th March 1941

The overall situation is in favour of the Germans. The Luftwaffe increases the raids against convoys near the British islands and also keeps on bombing the British harbours. Portsmouth, Liverpool, and Glasgow, Plymouth – the British towns are burning. The Luftwaffe also drops thousands of sea mines, especially in the Thames River and Mouth. The British losses of shipping space are disastrous. The harbours are filled with wrecks.

The situation on the Balkans is getting more explosive. German troops enter Bulgaria as preparation of the coming offensive. Yugoslavia agrees to support the Germans too.

Only in Eastern Africa the British are gaining ground. The end of the Italian resistance is conceivable. Hitler forbids any attempt to support the Italians there.

The activities of the so called Free French forces are annoying. Kuffra in southeast Libya is taken from Chad. Colonel Leclerc is in command. The French force has received some help from units of the British Long Rage Desert Group.

Hitler is enthused about the operation ‘Südsee’. He orders to put up another airborne division until fall. Student has the mission to execute this. The current division has never reached full strength, casualties after Malta are hard to replace and now another division? Student has no other chance but to divide the existing division in two and then to fill up both halves as soon as possible. The introduction of new equipment or new tactics is postponed. Student only promises to accelerate the introduction of new machine and submachine guns.

At the moment the Hitler’s attention is attracted by Greece and everyone has to support this operation. The transport squadrons have been sent to Austria and the Sturmregiment of the Fallschirmjäger is under direct control of the Führer too. The X. Fliegerkorps, although waiting for its displacement, has the order to intercept the British convoys to Africa. Hitler would certainly be pleased if the Italian Navy would fight the RN, too.

After the defeat of the British Malta garrison, the shipping of fresh German and Italian forces to Libya starts.

March 1st: A convoy to Tripoli and another one back to Italy pass without casualties.

March 5th: Another Africa bound convoy passes the sea and another one returns; no casualties.

March 7th: Another convoy leaves Naples for Tripoli. This one ships the first tanks to Africa. They are part of the equipment of the Pz.Rgt.5. There is also a homebound convoy. No assault.

March 12th: A convoy with Italian troops and another one with German troops are heading for Africa. Another convoy is on the way to Italy. No casualties.

March 9th: A convoy brings German troops to Tripoli. Another supply convoy is attacked by British submarines. One ship sinks. A northbound convoy passes the sea without problems.

March 14th: Two convoys pass the sea without any casualties.

March 16th: A convoy from Italy and another one from Africa cross the sea. No casualties.

It really looks as if the assault of Malta has broken the force of the English in this area. There have been some submarines, but they operated without success. Slowly the Panzergruppe Africa is getting stronger and Rommel starts thinking about offensive operations.

The British are convoying, too. They started to send troops to Greece. Italian submarines try to intercept the transports, in vane! The X. Corps is reconnoitring the sea west of Crete to detect the British convoys and the displacement of the British fleet. Due to the fact that the X. Corps will soon be pulled off the front, he receives new planes but no new pilots. Highlights are brand new He111 torpedo bombers. Geisler has not enough planes to control this large area. He would need a lot of luck to make a decisive strike against the Royal Navy.

On March 16, he has the luck he has been praying for. 2 He 111-torpedo planes (Hptm. Kowalewski, Lt. Bock) on a reconnaissance patrol come across parts of the British Mediterranean force 30 sea miles west of Crete. After their return they report of torpedo hits at two big ships, probably battleships. Both ships were sinking. This is another hard bunch for the Royal Navy.
On March 25 the Italian destroyers Crispi and Sella leave Leros harbour at night for a special mission, each carrying 3 MTMs (Motoscafo da turismo modificato), small motor assault boats (2 tons), each with its forecastles laden with a 300 kg charge of TNT. These one pilot crafts (commanded by Captain Faggioni) are transported and directed by the destroyers some 10 miles off Suda Bay, Crete. There are lying at anchor several Royal Navy units and auxiliary ships. The MTMs or barchini, are specially fitted to remove obstacles and fences; then the pilot aim the assault craft at his motionless victim and launch it in a collision course against the selected ship, and eject from his boat before ramming the target. After the impact, the warhead explodes at contact. Once inside the Bay, the 6 boats pinpoint their targets, the heavy cruiser York, a large tanker, the Norwegian Pericles (8300 tons), and another cargo ship. Two MTMs hit the York amidships, flooding her aft boilers and magazines. The Pericles is also hit and broken in two. The other barchini apparently miss their intended targets, one of them finishing stranded in the beach. The daring Italian sailors are taken prisoners.

The Royal Navy is struck. During the last weeks they lost one carrier, three battleships (one sunk and two damaged) and several cruisers. Intelligence reports tell that Cunningham fleet has a main body of one battleship, one carrier. Additionally there are about 8 cruisers, twenty to twenty five destroyers and a dozen submarines, but they are distributed over the whole eastern Med. Cunningham’s main force is currently is at the harbour of Alexandria.

After the successful operations of the German planes and the Italian Special Forces and with the promise of German air support and reconnaissance, Admiral Iachino agrees to lead the Italian Fleet on a sortie into the Aegean to disrupt the British convoys to Greece. He has one battleship, six heavy cruisers, two light cruisers and 13 destroyers.

A1) Make the Italian Navy attack! There will not be a better chance.
A2) Call it off! The Italians will not be able to defeat the RN and the German air cover is far too thin.

Rommel calls to inform Ramcke that he is ready to strike. He needs air support and asks for the transfer of the X. Corps to Libya. The X. Fliegerkorps has currently

Recon group 121,
Bomber squad 26
Bomber squad 30
Destroyer Squad 76
Fighter Squad 77

B1) No, all planes are needed to support the operation at sea.
B2) Yes. Specify which units will cross the ocean.

[SwordsMaster]

A1, B1: Obviously if we need the planes for the italians, we can't use them elsewhere.... If we manage to finish this operation quickly, Rommel can have them after.

Continue shipping equipment and personnel to Africa though.

[Kagemusha]

A1 and B2. Let the Italian take care of their own airsupport,so in order to support both Africa and Greece.Split the Fliegerkorps by sending the Recon group 121,Bomber squad 26 and Fighter Squad 77 to Africa and the rest can support Greece for now, if OKW orders them to help there.

[Stig]

I agree with Kage, if Rommel wants to succeed he needs airsupport. A1 and B2

About the FJ-divisions, can't we just train more men. Ofcourse a full training takes 2 years, but can't we take one Light Infantry division and give them jumping training (and some other Para only training). That would make sure we have a new and good division in 6 months. And I think we can reinforce the Division we already have with 1 battalion of Light Infantry.

[DemonArchangel]

Italian fleet and aerial assets can't seem to handle themselves properly. I don't trust the Italians to do much of anything except maybe intimidate the British. I think we need to support the Italian fleet as much as we can. But at the same time we need to transfer more aerial assets to North Africa:

So my decision:
Recon group 121: North Africa (because we already know where the British Fleet is, and dissemination of information is critical in Blitzkrieg.)
Bomber squad 26: Italians
Bomber squad 30: North Africa
Destroyer Squad 76: Italians (Bf-110s are crap in air combat, but have enough of a bomb load to do a night strike against the British fleet)
Fighter Squad 77: North Africa (Something has to handle British bombers)

I don't believe the current FSJ division should be split. The new division should be raised, but only as an auxiliary force/second wave to the more highly trained 7th Flieger Divsion. Also, I believe that the 2nd FSJ divsion should be recruited from light infantry or even Gebirgsjaegers, because the most difficult part of airborne operations is independent operation, and light infantry and GeBs have that already.

[Stig]

I'm wondering, can we use the two Italian Airborne Divisions? (http://www.pegasusarchive.org/origins1.htm)

[DemonArchangel]

In due time. They will be used to seize airfields in Russia and/or the Middle East.

[Stig]

Since we have troubles with our own divisions (one at half strength, one not formed yet) why not transfer them to the Med and pull the 7th back for reinforcements. When that's fully ready transfer it to the Med again and pull one Italian back.

[Franconicus]

Chapter 42 – Battleship!
Naples, 26th – 29th March 1941

General Geisler is not glad that he has to support a naval operation, relocate several squadrons to Africa, and that all while he is waiting to be replaced.
Reluctantly he agrees to transfer Reconnaissance Group 121, Bomber Squad. 26 and Fighter Squad 77 to Africa. Therefore, one bomber squadron and the Me110 squadron remain in Italy to secure the passage between Europe and Africa and to support the Italian fleet.

March 26th: Driven by the recent reports of casualties of the Royal Navy and under pressure of their German allies the Italian Navy sets sail to attack the British convoys bound for Greece. The X. Air Corps has to support the operation with an air screen.

The Italian fleet consists of the Battleship Vittorio Veneto (Kpt.z.S. Sparzani), the 13. Destroyer Flotilla with Alpino, Bersagliere, Fuciliere, Granatiere from Naples, the 1. Division (DivAdm. Cattaneo) with the Heavy Cruisers Zara, Pola, Fiume, the 9. Zerstörer-Flottille mit Gioberti, Alfieri, Oriani, Carducci from Tarent. — 8. Division (DivAdm. Legnani) Light Cruisers Luigi di Savoia Duca degli Abruzzi und Giuseppe Garibaldi, 16. Destroyer Flotilla with Da Recco, Pessagno from Brindisi and the 3. Division (DivAdm. Sansonetti) with the Heavy Cruisers Trieste, Trento, Bolzano, as well as the 12. Destroyer Flotilla with Corazziere, Carabiniere, Ascari from Messina.
The formation is led by Admiral Iachino.

March 27th: The Italian divisions join south of Messina. At noon the Italian fleet is spotted by a British reconnaissance plane. The German air support is missing completely. Admiral Iachino abandons the intention to penetrate the Aegean, because he cannot expect to take the British by surprise any longer.
March 28th: In the morning an Italian ship plane notices a British cruiser squadron with four light cruisers and four destroyers. The 3. Division attacks the British force, which withdraws. At noon Iachino orders the 3. Division to return to the main body. Now, the British ships are following the Italian ships. In the afternoon the British cruisers are suddenly between the 3. division and the Vittorio Veneto. Suddenly 6 torpedo planes come out of the clouds and attack the Italian ships. Although they do not damage any ship, the British ships use this opportunity to retreat. It is noon now and Iachino decides to return to the home bases.

In the afternoon carrier based Swordfish planes and bombers from Crete attack the Italian fleet. Torpedoes hit the Vittorio Veneto and the Heavy Cruiser Pola.The battleship can continue his way, Pola is disabled. In the evening Iachino sends the 1. Division to support Pola. It arrives at the same time as a British formation. In the following night battle several British battleships shoot the Italian ships in pieces. Zara (Kpt.z.S. Corsi †), Fiume (Kpt.z.S. Giorgis †) and the destroyers Alfieri and Carducci sink, Oriani escapes damaged, only Gioberti remains without hits. Pola (Kpt.z.S. Pisa) sinks in the morning.

March 29th: 16 Ju88 of the III./KG.30 attack the Britsh main body that includes three battleships without any success. The British try to catch the Vittorio Veneto during night, but Iachino manages to bring the ship back to Italy. In the morning the British commander interrupts the operation and the British ships return to their bases.
The Italians loose 2,303 sailors, including the commander of the 1. Division, Admiral Cattaneo.

Admiral Iachino blames the German for the disaster. The Italians had to fight against at least three battleships. If the German reconnaissance would have been right, the Italians would never have started such a suicide squad. Furthermore, the British had air superiority during the whole operation. In the most important first phase there had neither been any German reconnaissance planes not air cover for the battle force.

The result is frightening, in deed. Three cruisers and two destroyers sunk, one battleship and one cruiser damaged. Apparently, the British had no casualties at all. Now, all Italian battleships are out of service and the Axis has no single one in the whole Mediterranean Sea.
The relation between the Italian and German allies is stressed. The effect on the Italian public and their will to continue the war cannot be evaluated at the moment.

There is nothing that can be done to turn back the clock. Ramcke meets with Lörzer, the commander of the II. Luftkorps and with Geisler. Lörzer’s corps consists of one recon group, 2 bomber squadrons (3 and 53), one Stuka Group (II/1) and the Jagdgeschwader 51. Lörzer says that the first units will arrive next week. It will be the Bombergeschwader 53, the Stuka Group II/1 and parts of the Jagdgeschwader 51. The rest will follow within three weeks.
Geisler wants to send his squads home as soon as possible. He promises to leave the squadrons at Africa that are currently supporting Rommel; at least until the units of the II. Corps arrive.

Lörzer asks Ramcke, where he should send the first planes that arrive.

1) To Libya to support Rommel
2) To Sicily to protect the transfer of the 15. Panzerdivision
3) To Sicily to intercept the British convoys to Greece.

[King Kurt]

Ahhh - Cape Matapan - one of my favourite naval victories of the RN and "ABC". Cunnigham completely out thought the italians with his agressive moves. The night action was an early success for naval radar - the English used it to track the Italians and to get incredibly close. The battle began with the English illuminating the Italians with searchlights - they were so unprepared that their turrets were not even turned towards the english - they were just trained fore and aft. Warspite's first salvo of 8 shells was at such short range - 3-4,000 yards I think - that 6 hit. Being hit by 6 16 inch shells at once effectively put the Fiume out of action. for more info see
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Cape_Matapan
As for our aircraft - I would say Libya. We shouldn't worry about troops going to Greece, it makes our task in Libya easier. With the taking of Malta, our convoys are safe. So, the more support the army has in Libya the better.

[Stig]

Aye Libya it is for me too, let's get them out of the desert

[DemonArchangel]

To Sicily first. Somehow, I think the British might try a counterattack against Malta.

(If not, then Libya)

[AggonyDuck]

2) To Sicily to protect the transfer of the 15. Panzerdivision

With Italian naval power neutralised only German airpower will be able to protect our transports.

[Lord Winter]

1. This is a time were the british were ,moving men from africa to grecce. Let's take full advantage of this and let Rommel go into his offensive with airsuppority, something we lacked historicly. Who knows? Maybe with the extra help Rommel can take Tobruk.

[DemonArchangel]

Ok, I pick Option #1.

Britain needs to transfer troops to Greece, and thus cannot waste precious resources interdicting our Italy/NA convoys. And resources are precious because supply convoys can't get from the Western Med. to the Eastern Med. as easily due to the German control of Malta. The British troops in North Africa and Greece are probably under supplied, with comparatively minimal armored assets, possibly due to a lack of fuel and spare parts. Rommel needs to be given the resources to rapidly take Tobruk, and then Alexandria. Greece will fall anyway, even quicker than in real life due to the tenuous British supply situation.

Also, try to convince Hitler/Speer/Whatever to ramp up new equipment research and production. If this Mediterranean campaign hasn't shown it, Germany needs an aircraft carrier or two, and better FSJ equipment and more planes/better planes in the air.

In order to quickly recruit more FSJ, start looking at light infantry units in France that can fill up our ranks quickly.

[Lord Winter]

I don't think we should aim to our focus on any cpital ships right now. The Brits have to big of a lead on that for us to close in a year or two. The best would be to see if we could send more subs operaterating in wolf packs to damage the british shiping as much as possiable.

[discovery1]

What is the current strength of the forces deployed to protect the convoys, and how much of the RM is still in fighting shape?

[Franconicus]

Current Strength of the Italian Navy:

all battleships are either damaged or not finished.

There is the 1st Squadra Navale at Tarent with
7 cruisers and 21 destroyers
and the 2nd Squadra Navale with
8 cruisers and 12 destroyers.
Some of them damaged, too.

Of course there are still some units in the Red Sea.

There is still about 100 submarines. About 1/3 is currently based outside the Mediterranean Sea, to support the Germans in the Atlantic.

German carriers:
The German Navy Command realized that there is a weakness due to the lack of carriers. There is already one carrier in development/production. It will be able to carry Ju87 divers and will be much better than any allied counterpart.

However, it will take some time until the 'Graf Zeppelin' will be ready for combat. Even then it will be almost impossible to get it into the Med, at least as long as the Allies control Gibraltar.

[King Kurt]

I thought it appropiate that I made my 500th post here in my old friend Franc's wonderful interactive history!!:2thumbsup:
A possible German aircraft carrier is a real red herring - developing a naval air arm operating from carriers takes years. No doubt the graf Zepplin would be a super ship - well built, loads of compartments and well armoured - those usely come with a price of less planes - the english carriers were similar - armoured, tough etc but with a smaller plane complement. But the air arm to fly off it would take years to develop - you just can't use the land force with a bit of training. The English Fleet air arm had its roots in WW1 and the japanese and US forces were from the early 20's, so an effective German carrier force would be up to 10 years in the making. Throw in the fact that it could never get to the med makes it a non starter. If we want to hurry up any technology/ weapons etc we would be better served chasing the glider bombs which were deployed in 1943. These were very effective when deployed, despite the fact that the Allies had virtual air supremacy.

[Franconicus]

~:cheers: Kurt, congratulation!

Regarding the carrier: Talked with Raeder last night. The carrier is doing pretty fine! It is about 85% complete. Another year and it will be complete and maybe another year for sea trials and flight trainings.

The ship will be able to carry 10 Me 109 E fighters, 20 Ju87 B dive bombers and 20 Fi 167 torpedo bombers.

Additionally it has 16 15cm guns.

P.S.: Happy Birthday, STIG!!

[Stig]

Thanks m8

Would it be possible to send a couple of U-boats into the Med, I believe they can hunt down some British ships, I think they will do far better then the Italian ships.

[King Kurt]

Happy Birthday Stig - are you celebrating by driving incredably fast while listening to an obscure tape????:laugh4:
I see you are a mere slip of a boy - when I was your age a computer was a window where you handed a large pile of punched cards in and collected a printout the following day!!!! - how things have changed.

[Rodion Romanovich]

Happy Birthday Stig!

Too bad I've been too busy the last few weeks to stop by here, but now I finally got some time :2thumbsup: Sad about the Italian navy ~:(, this means our only way of scoring any larger victories at sea in the nearest future will have to be by air formations and subs destroying shipping. As for what to do now, option 1 and 2 seem like the best options. I'd say option 1, because the British won't be able to retake Malta at this time with their current resources, it's way too risky for them IMO. Hopefully it isn't too much of a risk to take.

[Stig]

are you celebrating by driving incredably fast while listening to an obscure tape????
You mean the Autobahn? ~D
I did that, don't have any obscure tapes tho ... damned

[Franconicus]

Hi gents,

I could use a little help.

Can you give information about:
- Which Italian divisions participated in Rommel's first invasion?
- Which British units were on the other side?
- Which units were transferred from Africa to Greece?
- Which RAF units where in the Med theatre at that time?

[Franconicus]

Thank you all for your help!

Chapter 43 – In the desert
30th March – 2nd April1941

Ramcke tries to get more resources for the operations in the Mediterranean Theatre. He calls Dönitz to ask for the presence of German submarines in the Med. In vane! Dönitz claims that he needs every boat for beating the Allies in the Battle of the Atlantic. There will be no free boats before fall. Ramcke calls the Luftwaffe for more support, especially fighters and transport planes. In vane! All available resources go to Greece.

Ramcke also calls the Italian Supreme Command to ask for the support of Italian paratroopers. However, these divisions are still in training and not available before fall.

In return Ramcke receives a call from the Abwehr. They tell him that the British are obviously trying to strengthen their positions in the Mediterranean Theatre. The garrison of Gibraltar has been increased, including Hawker Hurricane, Fairey Fulmar, Fairey Swordfish and Blackburn Skua planes. There are also army reinforcements on the way to Africa. There is a rumour that the British airlift a big number of planes from England to Egypt on a route through Northern Africa.

As in Italy all things went sour, Ramcke decides to fly to Libya. On the airfield he meets Hoth, who is on the way to Africa, too. They take a He111 to Tripoli. There they go straight to the residence of the Italian General Governor of Libya Gariboldi.

The Italian residence is festively decorated, with flags everywhere. In front of the building there is a guard of honour in her ceremonial uniform. The building itself is filled with officers, more than enough to win the war against the English. The German generals call on the secretary of the Italian commander. They have to wait for almost an hour until General Gariboldi is able to welcome them.

“Gentlemen, I have to complain about the German army.”

Ramcke: “What are your complaints, Excellency?”

Gariboldi: “There is no coordination between the German commander and the Italian staff. There is not even any information about the German plans. I personally agreed with Rommel to send the XX. Motorized Corps with the divisions “Ariete” and “Trento” to Surt to support the front there. I haven’t heard anything since. Ariete is the best Italian division with 6,949 men, 163 tanks, 36 field guns, 61 anti-tank guns. There is also the XXI. Army Corps with four divisions. Rommel has the command I wonder now if it wasn’t a big mistake to give it to him.”

Hoth: “Excellency, you know that Mussolini agreed that the German staff would have the overall command.”

Gariboldi: “Of course I know that. And I have to admit that I do not agree in this issue with the Duce. Rommel commands about 100,000 Italian soldiers, 7,000 trucks, 1,000 guns and 150 airplanes now. I do not even know what he plans to do. I told him not to use them for any offensive operation, not before he can deploy the 5th Light, Ariete, Trento, Trieste and the 15th Tank Division. Anything else would be suicidal. However, will he follow my advice? Or will he six Italian divisions into defeat like the Germans did with our fleet at Cape Matapan?”

Hoth: “Excellency, if I remember right, the Italians called us to stop the British advance – after they had almost lost Libya and after most of their armies had been defeated. However, I assure you, that the Germans will not start an operation without careful preparation.”

Gariboldi: “You have no clue about the desert. This is not France or Poland. This is not the terrain for your so-called “Blitz”. There is no chance to start an offensive right now. You may find yourself isolated in the desert. You are right; we already paid a high price for this war. Do you have an idea what will happen, if there is another defeat? This could mean the end of the Axis!”

Hoth: “General Gariboldi, I can tell you that Hitler interdicted any offensive at Africa as long as the Axis has not defeated the Allies at Greece. There will be no invasion during the next weeks.”

After this promise, the atmosphere is slightly better. There is some small talk and Gariboldi invites the Germans for lunch.

Hoth accepts. He wants to discuss the command structure. Ramcke takes his leave. He wants to discuss the supply situation with the Italian logistics Colonels Santamaria and Montemurro. Both agree that the supply situation is not capable to support any major invasion. Most of the convoys coming from Naples are filled with soldiers and equipment of the German and Italian army. Additionally, men and equipment of the Luftwaffe has to be shipped. The colonels are still waiting for the arrival of additionally trucks. Finally, there is a lack of transport planes, as most of these were pulled off to support the Balkan campaign.

Ramcke decides to get to the front as soon as possible. He has to find out what really is going on and what the plans of Rommel are. Next morning he finds a Fieseler Storch courier airplane that brings him to the front. The target is Surt, where Rommel set up his headquarter.
However, Rommel isn’t there. Ramcke only meets his adjutant. He has the order to send everything that arrives at Surt to the front.
Ramcke asks him what is going on.

“Well, on March 24th Rommel sent the AA3 (reconnaissance detachment 3) to El Agheila. There were no English so they occupied this town. We received information that the Brits where fortifying the positions near Marsa el Brega. There is a small gap between the sea and the salt like. You cannot bypass this position. Rommel ordered the Panzerregiment 5 to attack on March 30. The first assault was repelled. Rommel called the MG-Bat. 2 and gave the order to attack the British right flank, right at the sea during night. This operation was successful. As soon as the MG-Bat. had broken through and attacked the British from the side, the British gave ground. We captured 50 armoured personnel carriers and about 30 trucks.”

“So the front has stabilized at El Agheila?”

“Err, there is no clear front, I fear. Rommel ordered to continue the operation with three spearheads. One goes straight to Agedabia and further to Benghazi, another one goes via Msus to Mechili, the third one goes through the desert heading for Gazala and Tobruk.”

“Man, what are you telling me? This is not just an armed recon mission; this is a full scale invasion of Egypt!”

“Well, the Tommies started running away and we ran after them.”

“Some armies have been running to death, especially in the desert. What is the deployment right now?”

“The 5th Light Division, with the 5. Panzer Reg., the 104. Rifle Rgt. and the 155. Artillery Rgt., reached Gtafia on April 1st. That is here, 35 km east of Mersa el Brega. The 5. Panzer Rgt. is our armoured fist. It has in total 25 Panzer I, 45 Panzer II, 61 Panzer III, 17 Panzer IV and 7 commander tanks. Near Marsa el Brega there was a first combat with English tanks. In this combat with 19 Mark IVA cruiser 5 English tanks were destroyed and one captured. We lost 2 Panzer III and 1 Panzer IV. On April 2nd the 5th Light took Agedabia, while the bulk of the tanks was on a raid across the desert. They are heading straight to Tobruk. This southern group has no contact with the English. However, they have problems with supply as well as technical problems with the tanks. Today, on April 3rd, the 5th Panzer Reg. had to stop because it ran out of fuel.”

Ramcke shakes his head. “What about the rest?”

“The AA3 bypassed Agedabia and advanced north to Bengasi. The AA3 has about 25 armoured cars. They besiege this town together with the Italian divisions Trento. The Italian divisions Ariete and Brescia are currently on the way to Msus and Mechili.”

“Which units stand against us?”

“We faced some soldiers of the 6th Australian Division and the 2nd Armored Division. However, we think that there is only one regiment of each division so far.”

“One infantry regiment and one tank regiment?

“Yes, maybe one artillery regiment, too.”

“What is the supply situation about?”

“Nothing but trouble! We do not have enough fuel and even if we had, we do not know how to transport it through the desert. Many vehicles have engine failures. We do not have the resources to repair them quickly. The Luftwaffe has similar problems. Many planes cannot take off because of engine trouble. We have about thirty single-engined fighters, thirty twin-engined fighters, approximately eighty dive-bombers, and fifty to sixty long-range bombers. Of course we also get support of the Italian 5a SQUADRA AEREA General.”
Ramcke does not know how to judge these unexpected operations. On one hand it seems to be very risky to start an invasion of this size without proper preparation, reconnaissance and supply. On the other hand, Rommel seems to be successful. And if he keeps on being successful, he made the right decisions.

Ramcke has several options:

1) Stop all operations until the 15th Panzerdivision arrives and there are new orders from Berlin.
2) Let the three spearheads advance until they meet somewhere between Gazala and Tobruk. Then discuss the next steps with Rommel and Hoth.
3) Give Rommel plenty of rope. He knows what to do. Try to calm down the Italian and German Supreme Commands.

[Franconicus]

https://img220.imageshack.us/img220/2039/drnorthafricamapff1.jpg

[King Kurt]

My apologies for the lack of info from me Franc.
Yesterday I was wondering why nothing had happened on Red Flood for some time, so I looked at the last post again, only to see that you were looking for help. I intended to have a look for info myself today - and you go and post a new chapter!!!
Excellent chapter, by the way, especially the map.
As for my response - my inclination is to go for B. We have to temper Rommel's ambition with the restrictions Hitler has place on us. The secret is to take bite size chunks then stabilise our position not to keep chasing until we run out of supplies.:2thumbsup:

[SwordsMaster]

Agree with KK. Success is good to shut up the Italians, but an operation like this and the likely british counterattack would be disastrous if we are spread all over the desert...

[Rodion Romanovich]

I agree, B it is. Unfortunately, I can't see the map ~:(

[Kagemusha]

Agreed.Option B.We have to keep enemy contact after all.

[Stig]

I would go for save 1. But I'm on my own

[Lord Winter]

Attack, Attack and Attack!

If the british are bringing in reinforcements this is one of the best chances we are going to get to grab Tobruk. Historicly the Africa Corps were able to keep there suppplies at an acceptable level durring these mad dashes of prusuit which were relitivly effective, such a dash like this infact was what took Tobruk.
We should focus on immeditly taking toburk, this is a larger and closer port so it should stabilize our supply situation. It also is in a good postion for a further invasion of egypt.

So in conclusion, give rommel a free hand and bring up the 15th as fast as possiable before the british get there reinforcements. It's the best chance we've got so we might as well make the best out of it.

C

[DemonArchangel]

Option B. We're already having supply difficulties, and letting Rommel run wild would be OK assuming that we had plenty of fuel and spare parts for our tanks and airplanes. But we don't. We need to make a more limited advance while trying to secure more supplies and shipping for our divisions.

And also, how about shipping a regiment of Brandenburgers over to North Africa so that they can attack British supply lines and airfields. Sabotage from behind would help our advance greatly.

[SwordsMaster]

Option B. We're already having supply difficulties, and letting Rommel run wild would be OK assuming that we had plenty of fuel and spare parts for our tanks and airplanes. But we don't. We need to make a more limited advance while trying to secure more supplies and shipping for our divisions.

And also, how about shipping a regiment of Brandenburgers over to North Africa so that they can attack British supply lines and airfields. Sabotage from behind would help our advance greatly.

We could even help our advance with FJs once some kind of front is established... Or maybe to jump into Alexandria or Tobruk... Actually that could be fun to consider. Maybe if the FJ took Tobruk, Hitler would be more willing to consider our proposals considering prioritizing our equipment, recruitment, and retraining.

[Stig]

Our FJs won't be ready for atleast another month I think ... if Germany has the same resources as the Yanks had between June 1944 and September 1944, which I doubt.

[Rodion Romanovich]

Some suggestions for Rommel's current offensive:
Once he reaches the goal of the current offensive, he should concentrate on:
1. holding the line west of Tobruk and cut off the retreat of too slowly retreating British troops - taking plenty of prisoners
2. trying to seize and hold the harbor of Tobruk
3. making sure to capture one or more airfields as close to Tobruk as possible as soon as possible, so proper air support and supplies can reach closer to the front. If there aren't any suitable airfields, try to construct one - initially just a simple one to get some decent basic air support for a proper offensive at Tobruk, it doesn't need any fancy equipment for landing and takeoff in difficult conditions initially, just a bit off hard enough earth or something
4. get some FLAK up to the front ASAP. We want to make sure we don't lose more planes than the British so we are at increasing disadvantage the closer we get to Alexandria. Offensives tend to keep aircraft loss ratios in favor of the defender so some FLAK to damage British counter-attacks could improve the odds somewhat. Keeping strict discipline in getting FLAK close to the front quickly to accompany the offensives will matter in the long term.

[Lord Winter]

Somethoughts on the follow up offensive after the front stablizes and we bring the 15th panzer into to it.

1. Our ideal stoping point should be the easternmost fork between Sollum and Machilli. That would keep our supplys farily ballance and also allow for a two pronged advance on that road. However if we have the chance, I think we should give rommel the flexibillity to keep going if he thinks he can grab toburk.

2. A three prong attack IMHO would be the best. The northern most prong would follow the cost road and make an holding attack on the forces in Tobruk. The second prong should be the main thrust, supporting the third group to the south and striking at the british army along the two roads.
The third group would consist of the armor and would focus on a deep thurst towards Sollum aiming to cut off the britsh retreat. It will also support the advance of group center

After the center group forces the british back they should turn north and aim to attack Tobruk from the east hopefully taking it. If this fails the road running south of Sollum would be a good line to establish our forces on as we prepare for a second assult.

3. The FJ should be used in the attack on Tobruk succuring airfields and possiably going in as the first wave to blow any fortifications.

4. Tobruk is our most vital target in this phase and thus it's assult should be given the majority of our air power.

[Franconicus]

And also, how about shipping a regiment of Brandenburgers over to North Africa so that they can attack British supply lines and airfields. Sabotage from behind would help our advance greatly.
You have access on the Brandenburger. However, they have nor experience neither equipment for the desert.


making sure to capture one or more airfields as close to Tobruk as possible as soon as possible, so proper air support and supplies can reach closer to the front.

There is a large airfield at Benghazi, a smaler one at Derna and another one south of Tobruk (Adem). Tobruk itself has a small field for fighters.


We could even help our advance with FJs once some kind of front is established... Or maybe to jump into Alexandria or Tobruk... Actually that could be fun to consider. Maybe if the FJ took Tobruk, Hitler would be more willing to consider our proposals considering prioritizing our equipment, recruitment, and retraining.

At the moment you have neither enough transport planes nor any FJ for your airborne operation.

[Franconicus]

Chapter 44 – Lost and found
Cyrenaica, 3rd – 9th April 1941

Ramcke sends a message to Hoth about the current situation and makes a proposal to meet before the army reaches Tobruk. He also sends this information to Rommel.
Then he decides to visit the front to get a picture of what is really going on. He gets himself a driver and a jeep. His target is the southern route, where most of the tank forces. The adjutant had told him that this group was stranded because of lack of fuel. The adjudant also warns him. The Italians poisoned this route with thousands of mines during their retreat.
Before he starts he hears that Rommel told the Panzerregiment to take all the remaining fuel to mobilize the tanks and to continue the advance. It is almost evening when Ramcke and his drivers leave Sirte. It may be dangerous to drive across the desert at night. However, the Panzerregiment does it and so Ramcke decides to do it, too. Furthermore it will be very unlikely to meet any British soldiers there. At all hazards he takes a radio along with him.
The night-time ride through the desert is certainly a special event. However, soon they loose the road, or whatever they call road in the desert. They struggle through the sands. Many times the jeeps get stuck and they have to dig it out. Ramcke is glad when they finally reach the stony desert. The wheels find solid ground here, but sometimes this ground may be a bit too solid. In the middle of the night the ride comes to an abrupt end; the axle breaks.
Ramcke and his driver are stranded in the desert, all alone in the endless wilderness. Fortunately they have the radio and in the morning a German Storch comes to pick Ramcke up. The pilot lands near the vehicle. He promises that another plane will come to pick up the driver too. Then the plane starts again and they fly to the front close Mechili. From up above Ramcke has an excellent view on the desert. It seems to be endless, but it is not empty. Here and there are German vehicles. The pilot tells him, that many of the cars just broke down like Ramcke’s jeep, or that they had engine failures due to the sand, or that they simply run out of fuel. Or the drivers just lost the direction or the cars stuck in the sand. Anyway, most of the Luftwaffe planes are out to search for dispersed parts of the Panzerregiment and to supply them with water and fuel. The sight is harrowing and reminds Ramcke of an army on the run.
Near Mechili Ramcke has the first contact with the British. Two Hurricanes spot the Storch and try to pick it off. Ramcke thinks that his last hour has come, but the pilot knows how to defend himself. The Storch may be much slower than the hurricanes, but he can almost stand still and he can rise vertically like a lift. The Hurricanes attack several times, but every time the German plane can outmanoeuvre them. However, the Hurricanes do not loose heart and attack again and again. Then they suddenly surcease. They spot a more attractive target.
Four German transport planes are approaching a field with a group of German tanks. Obviously they want to land there. At the moment they touch ground the Hurricanes reach the field too. Four giant torches show that the transport planes had carried fuel for the tanks.
Ramcke’s pilot uses the opportunity to get down. Ramcke is so glad to stand on his own two feet again. He hurries to the commander of the ground forces. It is the Ariet and parts of the 5. Light Division. Here he stays to watch the advance of the Axis troops and to get the latest news.
That day Benghazi is taken by the Italian divisions Trento and Bologna together with the AA3. The force heading for Msus is making only slow progress but the third group, the most southerly, with part of the German 5th Light Division and the Italian Ariete Division, is going well toward Mechili.
On April 5., the Axis advance continues. On the coast Barce is taken while inland Tengeder falls and Mechili is threatened.
The next day, it is a Sunday, the attention is attracted by the events on the Balkans. German forces invade Yugoslavia and Greece. The attack begins with advances by List's Twelfth Army from Bulgaria and with bombing raids on Belgrade and targets in Greece. The main German attack on the first day falls on Greek troops in forward positions. The German 30th Corps attacks the center attacks the center and right of the Metaxas Line. A second corps attacks the left of the line but sends more of its force into Yugoslavia toward Strumica. The third corps moves into Yugoslavia farther north heading for Skopje. There is heavy fighting on the Greek border but the Yugoslav frontier is easily crossed by the Germans. During the night there is an important air raid on the port of the Piraeus in which a British ammunition ship blows up, sinking many other vessels and extensively damaging the port installations.
In North Africa the German and Italian advance is maintained. On the coast the Australian Division is beginning to pull back to Tobruk from Derna. On Monday, April 7, Derna is overrun in the continuing Axis advance. Inland near Mechili an armored battle begins between the German 5th Panzer Regiment and the remnants of the British 2nd Armored Division. April 8, Mechili falls to the German attacks in the morning and Rommel immediately begins to organize an advance to Tobruk.
In the evening of April 8, German officers meet at Derna. There is Hoth, the commander of the Panzergruppe Afrika, Rommel, commander of the 41. Korps, Kuhn, commander of the 15. PD, Cambara, commander of the Italian 20. Motorized Corps and Lörzer, commander of the II. Air Coprs and Ramcke.
Ramcke gives a short status report:
“Gentlemen, our advance has been very successful so far. Within two weeks we marched 300 km. Yesterday we captured important documents. They give us a clear picture of the situation of the British forces. The enemy had sent several divisions to Greece. The 9. Australian Division and the 2. Armoured Division remained at the front. The Australian are currently retreating to Tobruk while the 2. Armoured has cease to exist. Currently there are no armoured divisions against us. The enemy is desperately trying to reinforce his positions. The 6. Infantry Division and the 7. Australian Divisions are on the way west. Additionally the British are forming a new armoured unit with the core of the 7. Armoured Division. They have left the delta and will arrive soon. After the defeat of the Italians in East Africa another division is coming from there. Maybe there is another Australian Division, but information in uncertain. To make a long story short, today we have one division against us, but the enemy has called 4 to 5 new divisions, including an armoured one. Recon observed a lot of transport ships in the harbour of Tobruk.
On our side there is the 5. Light Division, currently approaching Tobruk and Sollumn from the south. There is also the Italian Divisions Bologna and Trento marching along the coast, currently moving to Gazala. Ariete and Brescia are coming from Mechili and march to Gazala too. They will arrive tomorrow. Division Pavia is still near El Agheila. The German 15. PD landed at Tripoli and will arrive at Tobruk in about a week. Trieste is on the way, too. In total we have three Tank Divisions and five Infantry Divisions. Supply situation has been tight sometimes, but as we have conquered British supply magazines, we have enough fuel. However, we are still not able to repair the damaged vehicles. The 5. Light Division has only about 20 tanks. I know that everybody did his best, that everybody is exhausted. However, now is not the time to relax. We have to push further and finish what we started. Otherwise, the British will enforce their positions and it will be much harder to break through then!”
After Rommel ended, General Lörzer gives a review of the situation in the air: “Gentlemen, the II. Air Corps arrived at Africa and entered the battle immediately. I have to say that neither our equipment, nor the organisation suited to the conditions here. Currently we have one Stuka Group, one Bomber Squadron and two Fighter Groups to support the operations. However, only a small percent of the planes is actually ready to fly. We too have problems with supply. Of course we are fighting together with our Italian comrades.
In the first phase of the operation there were not many contacts with British planes. Lately we meet them more frequently. They received reinforcements, especially bombers.”
Rommel: “Gentlemen, listen to the plan for the next operations. Bologna and Trento will approach Tobruk from the west. Ariete and Brescia will approach it from southwest. The 5. Light Division will give one battalion to support Ariete, the rest will attack Solumn, Fort Capuzzo and Bardia. They will cut off the British and secure our eastern flank. Then the Italian Divisions and the German battalion will attack Tobruk from several sides. If we succeed we will control this important harbour before the British reinforcements arrive. With the fresh divisions, especially the 15. and Trieste we will be able to push through and to invade Egypt.”
The Italian General Cambara has a different opinion: “I do not think that we should split our forces. The British are not able to attack us now and we should concentrate our forces on the main target, Tobruk. My proposal is that Bologna and Trento attack Tobruk from the west, Ariete and Brescia from the south and the 5. Light advances to the coast and the attacks Tobruk from the east. This concentric assault will manage to break through. Do not forget that Tobruk is well defended, with strong fortifications.”
Rommel: “Yes, that is exactly the reason why we should make a surprise attack rather than besiege the town,”
Hoth: “Well, to be honest, I do not see the need to act so carelessly. We have gained a good position. I suggest stopping in front of Tobruk and to wait until the 15.PD and Trieste arrived. Then we will have superior forces. In the meantime we can bomb the harbour and the fortification and improve our supply situation.”
Now it is time for Ramcke to tell what he wants to support.
A Rommel’s proposal
B Cambara’s plan
C Hoth’s suggestion

[SwordsMaster]

A. Rommel is right. It will be easier to take Tobruk with one division in it than 5. And we would still have numeric superiority. Then, when the british reinforcements arrive we will hold Tobruk against them.

[Kagemusha]

A) There is no point waiting when the odds are for us. I dont agree with Rommel in what to do after Tobruk has fallen,but i do agree with him how the taking of Tobruk should be handled. In best situation once the British reinforcements arrive our forward parts could engage them on delaying action,while they believe that our forces are insignificant. Then crush the British as they try to take back Tobruk.
EDIT:Swordsmaster it seems we have exactly the same idea.:2thumbsup:

[Stig]

B. Go with the Italian fellow. Don't split up and take Tobruk.

[DemonArchangel]

I trust Rommel in this instance: Option A.

Caveat: We need to get our supplies in order though. That should be our priority. The thing is, we simply lack the shipping to get all the supplies we want, despite the fact that we took Malta. We need to convince Italian industry to provide more cargo ships for the Mediterranean theater. I can already tell there are systemic deficiencies in German Industry that need to be addressed immediately.

[Rodion Romanovich]

B. We have done a good job in a rather careless operation. Our margins between victory and defeat were small, our losses unnecessarily high, despite the fact that we vastly outnumbered the British. It was a good thing to do this once, it got the British shocked but now it's time to change strategy both to be less predictable and to be successful against what is coming at us now - we can't trust the captured documents to be 100% accurate about the time when the enemy reinforcements will arrive. Taking Tobruk would be a nice way to end this offensive. The Italian general's plan is the one that gives us best chances of success in a quick surprise operation. Possibly Rommel should be given free hands to attempt a surprise attack with the forces currently at Tobruk even before the Italian support arrives if he think he can do it, but the reinforcements from the east should be brought just for safety. Once Tobruk is taken, my suggestion is to first of all get airfields going to the west of Tobruk and get FLAK to the front, then get our supplies to work properly and - also important - get our damaged vehicles repaired. If that takes time, so much better since it will only draw the British forward, opening a wider gap behind them for a renewed flanking movement from the armored divisions. No need to fear the British digging in a bit more to the east of Tobruk, we will still, no matter how we fight this campaign, sooner or later have to halt our advance long enough to allow the British to dig in, because we can advance the troops faster than we can advance the supply. It's better to slow down and regroup at a time like this, than after taking great casualties and being forced into retreat.

[Kagemusha]

Legio.Do you mean additional FLAK from reserves? Since the Divisions have their AA battalions with 88´s,Propably separated between the regiments and very close to the front lines. Also the two Corps should have therir AA regiments and the Grouppe should have its own.

[Lord Winter]

I vote A. I have worries about making a frontal assult on a well fortified postion even with numerical suppority, and we need to keep contact untill we can capture Tobruk thus stablizing our supply situaion. From their I agree with Legio and Kage, lets wait, dig in and solify our postion against the British counter attack. After that is repelled we can start looking towards attacking egypt.

[Rodion Romanovich]

Legio.Do you mean additional FLAK from reserves? Since the Divisions have their AA battalions with 88´s,Propably separated between the regiments and very close to the front lines. Also the two Corps should have therir AA regiments and the Grouppe should have its own.
Actually I meant both, in a sense. From what I understood most fuel etc. was given to the panzers, so possibly some of the other heavy stuff such as artillery, supplies and FLAK will not have accompanied them to a full extent. Moving in some from the reserve would also be a good idea, but only if there is any reserve to speak of available at the moment.

[King Kurt]

Against the tide - as usual!! - I reckon we should go for Hoth's proposal. A few episodes ago we opted for Hoth as a steadying hand - the first time he suggests something we ignore him!! By stabilising the front we will be in a better position to push on - and by letting the British troops come up to the front we may be able to ensnare more when we attack again. If we rush on a la Rommel we might surround Tobruk, but not capture it and end up stopped by the English reinforcements coming up a few more miles up the coast. Wouldn't it be better to let them come up, then defeat them with out strengthened and resupplied troops. Our aim should be to defeat the English army, not to capture Tobruk.:2thumbsup:

[Franconicus]

We finally received these sketches of the fortifications of Tobruk from our Italian allies:

http://www-cgsc.army.mil/carl/resources/csi/miller/Images/10a.JPG
http://www-cgsc.army.mil/carl/resources/csi/miller/Images/11a.JPG

[Franconicus]

Chapter 45 – Eastern
10th – 27th April 1941

The decision is made. The 5. Light will advance to the Egyptian border and protect the eastern flank. The rest will attack Tobruk, to take this important harbour as fast as possible.

Right now, there is little Ramcke can do. He decides to fly back to Berlin to get in touch with the supreme command. Information flow hasn’t been very good lately and this could impact the campaign.

Back in the capitol Ramcke tries to get an audience with Keitel. To his surprise, Keitel wants to see him immediately.

“Ramcke, good to see you! Hope you bring news from the African front!”
“Yes, that is why I am here.”

Ramcke gives a short status report.

Keitel: “Thank you! We haven’t received any clear information for quite a while. Honestly, we have been worried. I think I see clearer now.
Before we discuss the situation at Africa, I think I should give you some information about what is going on in the rest of the world.

Our Greece operation is going well. Even though the terrain is rough, our tank forces and our Blitz strategy work very well. Greek, Yugoslavia will be defeated soon. And so will be the British expedition corps.

The war against Britain and its supply is going on. Almost every night our Luftwaffe bombs another British harbour. Most of them are not worth bombing any longer. More and more submarines leave training and enter the battle. In May the number of operating ships will reach a maximum. However, the British convoy system is rather effective. It is getting harder to find the merchant ships.

We estimate that the British war production fell by 30 percent. However, there are still no signs that the British give in. Göring wants to burn down London. He says that this is the biggest commercial and industrial area in the world. He is sure that destroying it would force the English to surrender. Hitler hasn’t agreed so far, but this may change if the Brits bomb a German town.

The war enter of the Americans is looming. It is obvious that Roosevelt wants to lead them into the war. He does everything to support the British. He gave ships and produces weapons for them. Even though most of the numbers are pure propaganda, we have to bargain for the appearance of US made planes and tanks soon.

Roosevelt has also ordered that the US Navy will extend the American Defense Zone up to the line of 26 degrees West. This hampers our submarines warfare. The Red Sea is declared to be no longer a "combat zone" and under the terms of American law US ships may now carry cargos to ports there including supplies for the British in Egypt. This will soon affect the African campaign. We really have to hurry! Maybe we do not have time until the end of the year. The sooner we finish the campaign against Sues and the Arabian oil fields the better!”

Ramcke: “What about the Soviets?”

Keitel: “They are not pleased with our engagement on the Balkans. They stopped the delivery of oil and metal. The official reason is “technical and logistical problems”. Ribbentrop is currently at Moscow. He hopes to argue them into supporting us against the British. He will ask them to give our troops free passage to invade the oilfields from the Caucasus.”

Ramcke: “Do you think that is realistic?”

Keitel: “No! The Russians made an agreement with the Japanese. Didn’t I tell you that we have to hurry? We must end the war in the south as soon as possible! When do you think that we will be able to defeat the English?”

Ramcke: “Hard to say. This depends on how quickly we can deploy our divisions and how we can supply them. Right now the second German division is arriving. There are still two missing. We need more air support, fighter and stukas. And of course transport planes. Our first strategic goal is Tobruk. We need this harbour for the further advance to Egypt.”

Keitel: “I see. I will support you. As soon as the invasion of Greece comes to an end, you will get more transport squadrons and more fighters and divers. Regarding Tobruk, I agree that the seizure is a precondition for any more ambitious operation. I will order Hoth to halt any operations against Egypt until the town is ours. I think I can also send you a pioneer regiment. It is specialist in assaulting fortresses. I think they could reach Tobruk mid-May.
There is another issue I would like to hear your opinion about. Hitler is wondering how to press home the success at Greece. He thinks about an invasion of Crete. This is necessary to secure the Romanian oil fields. Further more the island will be an excellent airfield to control the eastern Med and to raid Cairo. However, the British still control the sea. We would have to do the major assault with our airborne units. After the battle of Malta, we have a maximum of 5,000 paratroopers. We think that the British garrison will have the same seize, however spread across the whole island. Additionally there may be a Greek division, about 10,000 men. Probably not the best units and maybe they will welcome our soldiers as liberators. What do you think?”

Ramcke: “Well, Crete is a tempting target, for sure. May I talk with Student about the current state of readiness of the airborne forces?”

Keitel: “Sure. Please give me your view within a week!”

After this meeting Ramcke also gets in contact with the Abwehr. They tell him that Churchill, the British Prime Minister, had franticness when he received the latest news from Greece and Libya. He asked his commanders why the British Army is unable to withstand the German forces. Everywhere the two armies had met, the outcome for the English had been disastrous; at France, at Greece, at Libya. He gave them the order to achieve a victory, either at Greece or at Africa. Therefore, the Abwehr expects a Britsh offensive within the next 6 weeks. The British are already sending reinforcements from the Indian Ocean and the Red Sea.

Ramcke has heard enough and flies back to Africa. He is curious to see what has been going on there. Along with him flies General Paulus. He is an emissary from the Headquarter. Keitel gave him the authority to release or stop any further operations.

Rommel is not at his HQ. Hoth informs Ramcke and Paulus about the latest operations:

“On Thursday, April 10, the first German tanks reaches Tobruk and begins to attack with a small improvised force but are beaten off. The isolation of Tobruk is then complete. The German attack on Tobruk continues but the combination of Australian infantry and British artillery defending proves too strong and they fail to break through. The AA3 and the PR5 start their advance against Bardia and Sollum. They manage to take the two towns until April 13th. They also take Fort Capuzzo.

The next day, the eastern detachment attacks Halfaja Pass. The assault is repelled by the 7. Australian Division.

The siege of Tobruk goes on. Ariete takes El Adem and defeats parts of the 2nd Armoured Division and one Indian brigade. Immediately, German divers land at the airport and start to raid Tobruk.

On April 16th the 7th Australian Division start a counter strike and takes Solum and Capuzzo. Rommel reinforces the western detachment with a machine gun battalion of the 15. PD, that has just arrived, and a regiment of Ariete.

On April 17th Rommel starts the assault of Tobruk. 32nd Tank Rgt, 8th Bersaglieri Rgt, and 132nd Artillery Regiment from Ariete and 19th, 20th Infantry Rgts and 55th Artillery Rgt of Brescia and the German MG Bat.8 try to break through the Australian lines. This operation lasts for four days, and then Rommel has to break up. Casualties are very high.

On April 19th the German and Italian forces manage to retake Solum and Capuzzo, but the Australian still hold Halfaja.

On April 24th the British start an operation against Solum and Bardia, supported by a small amphibious operation against Bardia. The German troops are able to repel these attacks. Rommel gives orders to the 5th Light and Ariete to advance further to Marsa Matruk, The German and Italian commanders refuse to advance. They claim that they do not have enough supply, that they have lost almost all of their tanks and that there is a threat that the British attack their flank from Fort Maddalena.”

Rommel: “How is the status of supply?”

Hoth: “Bad. We simply have not enough trucks, at least none that are running. We can hardly supply the units around Tobruk, the eastern detachment is almost cut off. The Luftwaffe is supporting the assault of Tobruk, but there is little more they can do. There is hardly any German plane east of Tobruk.

The British started to attack our supply chain. There are raids from the desert against convoys and stores and airfields.

Further more the British Navy started to raid our sea transports.”

Ramcke: “I haven’t heard that! Tell me more about it.”

Hoth: “Somehow the British managed to attack one of our convoys, that carried parts of the 15th. It consisted of 3 Italian destroyers Baleno, Lampo and Tarigo and 5 merchant ships Adana, Aegina, Arta, Iserlohn and Sabaudia. The British had four destroyers. In this battle, all 5 merchant ships were sunk as well as 2 of the Italian destroyers, the Luca Tarigo and Baleno. In an act of bravery, the Italian destroyer Luca Tarigo, attempted to take on the entire British Flotilla alone. A British shell eventually hit the Tarigo's bridge, blowing the leg off the captain, Commander Pietro de Cristofero. With his leg crudely bandaged, he continued to exchange fire with the British warships until he died of loss of blood. The crew continued to fight on without him and managed to place the Tarigo between the British ships and the convoy. An ensign of the Tarigo managed to launch 3 torpedoes, sinking one destroyer before getting her steering gear destroyed and having the deckhouses go up in flames. The Luca Tarigo finally settled to the bottom of the sea after being hit numerous times. About 1250 of the 3000 German troops are rescued by Axis forces.”

Ramcke: “Gosh! I haven’t expected this!”

Hoth: “It comes even worse! On April 22nd, three battleships from the Mediterranean Fleet shelled Tripoli. They damaged the harbour and the docks.”

Ramcke: “It seems like the British are not willing to let our convoys pass the strait any longer. Anything else?”

Hoth: Well, many soldiers are ill. We have trouble with dysentery. The medical care is disastrous. We were able to get some tanks from the garages. Our tank forces are slightly stronger than some weeks ago. The 15. PD is arriving at the front.”

Paulus: “How strong is the British garrison?”

Hoth: “There are four Australian brigades. They are supported by several tank regiments from the former 2nd Armoured Division. Additionally the British concentrate a lot of artillery and air defence guns. They also have Hurricanes fighters on an airfield inside the fortress. The Australian fortifications are strong. However, we believe that they suffer more than we do. Our Luftwaffe managed to cut off the supply from sea almost completely. We know that the British are sending destroyers in night missions to supply the town.”
Ramcke leaves the conference to visit some units that had been involved in the fighting. He meets some men of the MG Battalion 8.

“We attacked the British position at the first light of day. We managed to advance several hundred meters. Then there was machine gun fire from several sides that forced us to run for cover. The ground there is very hard and it was almost impossible to dig in. We laid there for maybe an hour and we could not raise our heads because there were snipers everywhere. Finally, Italian tanks came to support us. They got ahead of us and fired at the Australian positions. We followed them, hoping that we could make it then. However, the Australians did not give up. They fired from all sides and welcomed the tanks with heavy artillery bombardment. Nevertheless, we could advance another 200 meters. Then the Italian tanks stopped. They were held by a covered tank trench. They had to return and we run for cover again. On our left, a Bersaglieri Rgt. attacked. Despite the deadly fire from infantry guns and artillery they tried to cross the trench. They managed to reach the wire barricades and negotiated them. Then they were stopped by mines. We laid there for the rest of the day, tantalized by the heat and the presence of snipers. We had nothing to eat, nothing to drink. We only prayed for the night to come. Finally it came, along with it came the Australians. They drove us back. We had high casualties, the Italians had even higher. We renewed the attack at the next day, this time supported by about 20 German tanks. Several were shot by artillery. Then the British sent tanks, Mathildas! After 20 minutes our tanks retreated. There was only a handful left. Rommel sent us some 8,8s. They brought the guns into position and started to eliminate the Australian bunkers. The British replied with artillery fire and soon most of our guns were destroyed.
These attacks went on for several days. Then our battalion was annihilated. 18 comrades and I are all that is left. All of our commanders are dead.”
The man shook his head. “I cannot understand these Australians. I hardly understand what we are doing here. Good god, what are they doing here? You know at France, when the tanks came, the enemy gave up. Not so these Australians. They just keep on fighting. “


In the afternoon of April 27th the German and Italian commanders meet again. Rommel gives a short summary of the situation:

“Our eastern detachment, currently consisting of the 5 Tank Regiment, the AA3, one infantry battalion of the 15. PD and parts of Ariete has conquered the area around Solumn, Capuzzo and Bardia. The Australian succeeded in defending Halfaya. The enemy is trying to push our forces back and attacks Capuzzo and Solumn. Lately, he received more tanks. We suppose it is the 7. Armoured Division. We know that the British also increased their number of airplanes.

At Tobruk we haven’t managed to break through the Australian lines. However, we estimate that they run out of supply and hope to break the resistance soon. The 15.PD arrived almost completely.”

Then the generals discuss the situation.

A What is the right strategy at Africa?
1) Rommel plans to reinforce the eastern detachment with the rest of Ariete and Brescia and to assault Halfaya. There the divisions can repel any British invasion. In the meanwhile, the 15. PD together with Trieste, Trento and Bologna can go on with the siege of Tobruk. Rommel wants to make another assault as soon as possible.
2) Hoth thinks that the situation is alarming. He wants to retreat the divisions to Gazala. This is the right place to wait for more planes and the promised pioneer regiment. Here they should be able to repel a Britsh invasion and then assault Tobruk.
3) Cambara thinks that it is best to dig in where the divisions are. The Axis forces should be able to stop British invasions coming from the east and to keep besieging Tobruk. However, he thinks that it is not useful to make another assault.

B) What about the British activities against the supply for Africa? Make proposals!

C) What about Crete?

[Stig]

I would say A3, let the division stay where they are

I'll come back for the others. Tho I would say it's best to leave Crete for now, atleast untill we have Tobruk.

[Kagemusha]

May i ask,where is our own artillery? We should have enermous artillery compared to the British in Tobruk? We cant take the city,without necessary artillery support. If its stuck in the desert i suggest we use Hoth´s plan and lure the British out where we can destroy them by retreating a bit and gathering our forces and supplying them. So A:2

[Franconicus]

We have artillery, however, the Brits really concentrated a lot and have currently more shells to fire.

We have:

from the 5.Light: 155. Art.Reg
from the 15.PD: 33rd Art Reg.
and of course art from the Italian divisions

[SwordsMaster]

I have to agree with Stig, A3. We are uncapable of further advance, and retreating would mean a moral victory for the brits. What we should brush up on is urban attack and defence. For the future. Stalingrad and such.

Oh, and concentrate the artillery on antitank fortifications and minefields and such. If our tanks get to the streets, it'll all go smoother.

[Franconicus]

B) What about the British activities against the supply for Africa? Make proposals!

C) What about Crete?

[SwordsMaster]

B) What about the British activities against the supply for Africa? Make proposals!

C) What about Crete?

Crete should be considered, planned and charted for when the FJ finish their re-equipment, retraining and resupplying. But it should not happen yet, at least for as long as Greece and Tobruk are in enemy hands.

We must convince the italians to give us more escort. And increase our air presence in the area in both bombers and reconassaince planes to make sure we know whats'a crackin'

[King Kurt]

I would go for A2 - Rommel's head long dash has left us in a dangerious position. Let us fall back a little, dig in and wait for the counter-attack - that puts us at an advantage to hit them when they are worn down. Also Hoth needs to exhert his authority.

Our supply problems - more Italian naval support, bigger, better supported convoys and use all those Italian submarines to support our convoys. Finally what about bringing some German submariners to man the Italian boats - use the german commanded boats - with their more aggresssive tactics and better skill - to mount an aggressive submarine cordon around Alexandria.

Crete - is it worth the potenial casualties? Malta has shown our ability, so we do not need the Crete operation to prove our worth - let's wait for a better target. The only advantage that Crete will bring is the potential of inflicting casualties on the Royal Navy if they have to evacuate English troops - and we have to win for that to happen. Malta showed the strengths and weaknesses - we should not waste our valuable weapon of the airbourne arm.

[Stig]

Just leave Crete. Once we have Tobruk we will have a short supply route. Then with the FJ we can make a dash for Alexandria. We should convince the German high command that we need more troops in Africa, and since we're only here to help the Italians we should ask them as well for obvious reason (they might be insulted if we take over again).

Plus I think it might be well to send U-boats into the Med to support our convoys ... as I said before.

[Franconicus]

There are already two other German tank divisions on the way, the 3. and the 4.. Both are excelelent units. And you will get an extra pioneer regiment. I think your problem is not how to get more divisions, but how to ship them and how to supply them.

We already asked Dönitz about subs. He said he could not send some before fall.

[Stig]

Then visit Hitler himself, convince him that Africa is important for more then 1 reason.
1. Oil.
2. Palestine.
3. Possible new route into Russia.
4. Possibly Muslim allies once we get there.
5. Very possibly a route into India.

[King Kurt]

Getting U-boats to the med is difficult due to Gibraltar - strong currents as well as the British - that is why I suggested german crews for Italian subs - they have loads of boats, but they never performed well, so may be an injection of german skill - either as complete crews or cadres in boats - would be interesting.

[Stig]

The Italians won't accept that unless we buy the Italian subs.

[JimBob]

A3

Can we use Crete? A smaller scale Operation Fortitude. If we plan an invasion of Crete, and 'prepare' for it we could use it if conditions are right, or at least tie troops down on Crete so they aren't in Africa.

[DemonArchangel]

Firstly, the situation near the Egyptian border seems to be rather untenable. Retreat backwards, but keep the pressure on Tobruk up.

Supply: I told you all I wanted the Brandenburgers to stop this, you didn't listen to me.

Attack Crete. We're not dropping into Alexandria anyway because dropping into an urban zone is suicide. The British destroyers based in Crete won't attack our convoys anymore if we take the island, and we can base aircraft off Crete to raid Alexandria with. So we should take Crete with the FSJ and Luftlande, as well as other divisons.

[Stig]

We don't have any FJ and Luftlande at the moment, so it will be hard to deploy them against Crete

[AggonyDuck]

A What is the right strategy at Africa?

2) Hoth thinks that the situation is alarming. He wants to retreat the divisions to Gazala. This is the right place to wait for more planes and the promised pioneer regiment. Here they should be able to repel a Britsh invasion and then assault Tobruk.

The situation is alarming and I'd rather do a organised withdrawal than suffer a severe reverse. Additionally we shouldn't be caught up in costly sieges, we should stick to mobile battles and try to defeat the Brits in the open. But for now we need to pull back and reinforce our units, and secure our position for the next dash.



B) What about the British activities against the supply for Africa? Make proposals!

Get the Italian frogmen to concentrate their operations against British naval forces in Crete and Alexandria. If we can incapacitate some of the British ships in their ports, perhaps the Italians might build up the confidence to assign heavier escorts to the convoys.

As to the British desert raids. It would be useful to move supplies in large heavily escorted convoys. Maybe requesting an additional Panzer Reconnaisance battalion or two, who have the task of stopping outflanking maneuvers by British patrols, might be wise. Additionally it might be good to get a company or two of Brandenburgers to operate against British supplies.

But as it is, we might have to make do with what we have and come up with ways to utilise them properly. We have to come up with a way to counter British naval power with light naval forces and airpower.


C) What about Crete?

Start the planning for an eventual assault. It would be a good way to both damage British naval power and to acquire a decent base to strike against the RN. But that said, if we can seize Alexandria and the Suez, Crete will not be needed.

[Franconicus]

If I calculate right, we have 3 votes for a retreat and four votes for staying where we are. Is that correct?
https://img182.imageshack.us/img182/2360/1941apr151jy8.jpg
http://www.onwar.com/chrono/1941/may41/1941may/1941may02.jpghttps://img182.imageshack.us/img182/2400/1941apr141ye7.jpg

[Franconicus]

Chapter 46 – Calm Before The Storm
28th April - Mai 12th 1941

After a long discussion with Ramcke, Paulus decides to stop any offensive operations. All units receive the order to stop any advance and to defend their positions. At the same time, the Germans and their Italian allies are trying to get reinforcements as soon as possible and to improve the supply situation.

Ramcke contacts the Italian navy command to ask for better escorts of the convoys. The Italian admirals promise to send a cruiser with every convoy. This would reduce the threat from English destroyers. However, the Italian command is not able to do anything to protect the supply route against British battleships. Ramcke also gets the promise that the Italians will use small motorboats to ship supply. These small boats can discharge at the harbour of Benghazi.

Ramcke calls the commander of the II. Air Corps to ask for a better air cover. Lörzer agrees to have more air patrols now that the operations at Greece are coming to an end. Ramcke also discusses the problems with raids against supply convoys at Libya. Lörzer promises to send more air patrols along the southern flank, but he also says that the air force is already overused.
Hoth has the idea to set up a task force for special operations deep in the desert and behind the enemy lines. Now that mobile warfare has come to a halt, this may become an important factor. There are already some targets identified: Kufra, Jarabub, Siwa and Fort Maddalena.

Good news from Naples. The fist units of Model’s 3. Panzerdivision arrive. Additionally, 2 units of heavy artillery are shipped to Tripoli.

At Tobruk, the war cools down. German planes keep on attacking the harbour facilities, while the British are trying to supply the town with night time transports. The front solidifies in a static warfare. Only at night raiding patrols from both sides are trying to do harm. Slowly, all units of the 15. Panzerdivision arrive; Panzer Rgt 8, Rifle Rgt 104, Rifle Rgt. 115, Motorcycle Bat. 15, Art. Rgt 33, AA 33, Pioneers, ATGs and supply troops.
The Panzer Rgt. has its full strength: 4 command tanks, 22 Panzer II, 22 Panzer III, and 15 Panzer IV, in total 63 tanks.

At the front of Solum Hoth forms a combat detachment with the 5th Light Division, Ariete and Brescia. The commander is Generalleutnant Streich. The 5th Light has only 20 % of its tanks ready for combat, Ariete about 35%. Both divisions receive repaired tanks. This eastern front is threatened by constant raiding patrols of the 7. Australian Infantry Division. Reconnaissance planes spot British concentrations at Sid Barrani and Rabia. There are probably one infantry divisions and one or two armoured brigades. The English get also more planes, including Bristol Beaufighters and Blenheim bombers.

The RAF dominates the sky east of Tobruk.

End of April, the war at Greece comes to an end. The British forces have to leave the country, the Greek defence collapses.

Ramcke writes a report to Keitel. He suggests to prepare an airborne operation against Crete, but to wait until the airborne divisions have reached their full combat strength again.

At the beginning of May the situation of the 41. Army Corps is improved. Supply situation is much better, most of the tanks are repaired and the soldiers could regenerate. The mechanics order sand filters to prevent further engine failures.

On the opposite side, the Australian 9. Infantry Division is still holding the fort, doing everything to fortify its positions.

The British try to run a convoy through the Mediterranean from Gibraltar to Egypt. There are five transports. On May 6 they pass Gibraltar and are joined by one battleship, a carrier from Force H and another battleship which. With these heavy units are four cruisers and seven destroyers. Six more destroyers join the convoy from Gibraltar. Cunningham takes the whole of the Mediterranean Fleet out in support with three battleships, his single carrier, three cruisers and 19 destroyers.

The Italian surface ships don’t try to intercept, the Italian submarines are not capable getting into a good position. The Italian and German air forces fly some interception missions, but most of the bombers and all divers have been transferred to Libya. Bad weather prevents the bombers from being successful.

On the way, Cunningham’s ships shell Benghazi and sink two ships. Once again the British demonstrate that they do not accept the dominance of the Germans in this area of the sea. On May 12, the convoy reaches Alexandria.
After the event, German intelligence is able to give more details about the operation. The transports were carrying 238 tanks; 21 Mark VIC light tanks, 82 cruiser tanks (including many of the new Crusaders) and 135 Matilda infantry tanks, and 43 Hawker Hurricane fighters.

It is obviously, that the British are planning an operation to liberate Tobruk. The commanders meet for another briefing. After a short discussion there are three opinions – again!

1) Rommel wants to use the 15. Panzerdivision for a preventive strike. He wants to transfer it to the Solum front and then attack with 5. Light, 15. PD and Ariete. Trieste could be the strategic reserve. The goal of this operation would be an advance to Mersa Matruh and the distraction of the British forces west of this place. He says that it is crucial to beat the British before reinforcements come to the front.

2) Cambara suggests to use the time before the British are ready to strike for the assault of Tobruk. This town is still the main target. With the new divisions – the 15. and Trieste – together with the old ones – Trento and Bologna, it is possible to take this town. Arite, Brescia and 5. Light can secure the eastern flank.

3) Hoth is more sceptical. He sees that the detachment Streich at Solum has a very unfortunate position that can be bypassed easily. The British have already tank forces there and they constantly receive more units. Therefore he suggests withdrawing the complete tank group to the Gazala position. There, it would be easier to supply the troops and to repel any British invasion. Afterwards, Egypt would be easier to invade. With the pioneer regiment and the heavy artillery another assault against Tobruk would be successful.

https://img444.imageshack.us/img444/9817/prsentation1be8.jpg

[Stig]

2, the Italian is right again

[DemonArchangel]

D-l337

[DemonArchangel]

The British are properly supplied, because we don't have enough airplanes and enough ships. We don't have enough of everything, the 5th Light and Ariete are at serious risk of annihilation if they don't retreat, because they've already proven they can't defeat the current British forces in the East, and the 15th Panzer wouldn't really help in that regard because the half tanks would have broken down due to lack of spare parts or fuel by the time the tanks get to Solum.

I choose Option 3. Hoth (and King Kurt) is (are) correct We have plenty of depth and room to work with, it wouldn't hurt if we retreated a few miles now. Staying where we are would just result in the British boring a hole straight to Tobruk, leaving a trail of dead Germans and Italians in their wake.

Please, BEG Hitler for more airplanes and supplies, this theater is crucial to our future success. And maybe the Italians can adapt some German style production lines so they can crank out military hardware faster and more cheaply. Also, since the British can get carriers into the Mediterranean unopposed, we have to make sure they can defend their harbors as well. The supply situation in North Africa and the Mediterranean has made it clear that Germany must ramp itself up to total war production in order to compete with the British in terms of supply and manpower.

Here's what I want in Mediterranean Theater:

Divisions Needed in North Africa:
*5 Leichte Div.
*15 PzD
*3 PzD
*4 PzD

Additional Divisions that I want:
*A Panzergrenadier Division
*Two Italian mechanized/motorized divisions.

Auxiliary Units for North Africa:

Air:
*II Luftkorps in Libya to support operations there
*X Luftkorps in Sicily and Malta to maintain supply lines and intercept British ships

Land:
*A couple of independent Panzer Aufkl. Btns. for convoy escorts and rapid attack against British flanks and isolated outposts.
*Brandenburger companies for raiding and defense against the LRDG.
*The Pioneer Rgt. with additional mine clearing equipment
*A few extra regiments of heavy artillery.
*A few extra motorized flak regiments.

For Crete (this can wait a bit):

On the Ground:
*Both FSJ divisions
*The Luftlande Division
*The rest of the Brandenburger Rgt.

Air: Everything we've got and then some.

Naval: Everything the Italians can spare.

Edit: And Stig, don't even THINK of doing a run into Tobruk's minefields. Are you INSANE?

[Kagemusha]

Option 3. Let us give the Brits opportunity to attack us and see what will be left of them after that.

[AggonyDuck]

Hoth is correct here, so number 3 is my decision.

Btw, we should have a chat with Ernesto Forza and direct the activities of the Decima Flottiglia MAS against Alexandria and Crete. We need to get some of the British capital ships incapacitated.

[Franconicus]

... Please, BEG Hitler for more airplanes and supplies, this theater is crucial to our future success. And maybe the Italians can adapt some German style production lines so they can crank out military hardware faster and more cheaply. Also, since the British can get carriers into the Mediterranean unopposed, we have to make sure they can defend their harbors as well. The supply situation in North Africa and the Mediterranean has made it clear that Germany must ramp itself up to total war production in order to compete with the British in terms of supply and manpower.

- The Italians lack of natural resources and equipment, however, the Germans do not have enough to supply them properly.
- Now that Greece is finished you will get more planes and transport capacity.


Here's what I want in Mediterranean Theater:

Divisions Needed in North Africa:
*5 Leichte Div. deployed
*15 PzD deployed
*3 PzD coming from Naples
*4 PzD on the way from Germany

Additional Divisions that I want:
*A Panzergrenadier Division No
*Two Italian mechanized/motorized divisions. you have Ariete and Trieste

Auxiliary Units for North Africa:

Air:
*II Luftkorps in Libya to support operations there
*X Luftkorps in Sicily and Malta to maintain supply lines and intercept British ships
You have the II. and you will get the IX. the X. is currently refilled.
Land:
*A couple of independent Panzer Aufkl. Btns. for convoy escorts and rapid attack against British flanks and isolated outposts. You have to build these with your current troops
*Brandenburger companies for raiding and defense against the LRDG. (These are spared for special operations; make a proposal!)
*The Pioneer Rgt. with additional mine clearing equipment (you get one, however specialiued for fortresses)
*A few extra regiments of heavy artillery. You get some batteries
*A few extra motorized flak regiments. Have to see

For Crete (this can wait a bit):

On the Ground:
*Both FSJ divisions
*The Luftlande Division
*The rest of the Brandenburger Rgt.
Maybe in automn
Air: Everything we've got and then some.

Naval: Everything the Italians can spare.

Edit: And Stig, don't even THINK of doing a run into Tobruk's minefields. Are you INSANE?[/QUOTE]

[Csargo]

I think Option 3 would be the best choice.

[Franconicus]

May 13th – May 20th

Due to the exposed position of Detachment Streich and the deployment of the British near Solum Hoth decides to withdraw the German – Italian forces to the Gazala line. Rommel bursts of fury.

“You haven’t understood the rules of desert warfare. If the British are getting too strong, an offensive operation is the right thing to cross their plans. Waiting in defence is the way to disaster. Tobruk is ready to fall. If we give up the siege now, we will not be able to take the town this spring. How do you think we can reach Bagdad by the end of this year, if we cannot even take Tobruk this spring?”

Hoth does not reply. He gives his orders; Brescia will be the first division that turns west again, followed by the 5. Light. Ariete will be the last one, covering the retreat of the others. From the Tobruk front, Bologna and Trento will move back to Gazala immediately, while 15.PD and Trieste remain there to prevent the garrison from sallying.

The operation will starts on May 14th. As soon as Brescia starts retreating, British bombers attack it. Fiat CR. 42 fighters of the 14. Aviation Brigade “Rex” intercept them. The Italian pilots fight with high spirit and pick of some bombers. However, Hurricane fighters press them back. Brescia, guarded by just a couple of air defence guns, hurries to reach the siege ring around Tobruk, where the Axis has concentrated the air defence.

In the afternoon, Australian infantry attacks Solum, but the Italian soldiers of Ariete hold the lines.

On May 15th the situation is getting critical. While the 5. Light is leaving their positions the British attacks grow to a full scale invasion. A second infantry division joins the Australian attacks against Solum; it turns out to be the 4. Indian. Ariete still holds the line.

On May 16th reconnaissance planes spot British tank columns south of Solum, marching westwards. In total the British are able to deploy about 250 tanks. German Stukas bomb them, 5 German planes are shot. During night, SM.81 bombers of the 44. bomber group raid the British tanks, too. The British tanks, the 11. Husar Bat. and the 1. King’s Dragoon Guards, swivel into the direction of Fort Capuzzo. Hoth sees that Ariete is threatened to be cut off. He orders the Italian commander to pull back to Tobruk. He also calls 5. Panzerreg. and 8. Panzerreg. to stop the British advance.

On May 17th the Australians occupy Somun and Bardia. In the afternoon there is a tank battle near Fort Capuzzo. Tanks of the the 5. Panzerrg. and the 8. Panzerreg. fight the 11. Hussar Bat. and the 1. King’s Dragoon Guards. The Germans are able to stop the British. However, when night falls, they receive the message that parts of the garrison of Tobruk has sallied and is now attacking the rear positions of Ariete. Simultaneously, the Australian and Indian Divisions attack from the east.

During night the Axis’ units manage to escape. On May 19th Brescia, Trieste, Ariete, 5. Light and 15. PD arrive at the Gazala line. The British stop advancing and entrench west of Tobruk.

The Axis troops are receiving more supply and reinforcements. Air transport squads are transferred to southern Italy. They bring the pioneer regiment. The heavy artillery arrives, too. General Model arrives at Gazala and reports that first units of the 3. PD arrived at Libya. 3. PD will be deployed and ready for combat mid-June.

Intelligence reports that the expected reinforcements of the British will arrive mid-June.

1) Entrench at Gazal. The position is good for defence and the supply situation is fine. Prepare a ‘backhand drive’! (Please discuss the operational plan!)
2) We are able to launch a new invasion immediately. Initiative is essential in the desert. We do not have time to wait. If we cannot break through in June, it may be too hot for a big operation. And fall will be too late to achieve the strategic targets for this year. (Please discuss the operational plan!)

[Kagemusha]

Franc.Can you put the British and Axis forces on the map?:book:

[SwordsMaster]

This is terrible! After all the casualties at Tobruk, we give everything up! Option 2. We MUST get the brits on the back foot and hit them until they fall. Ariete has done a great job and should be exposed as an example for the other italian divs to follow.

Form that special desert ops group and study the possibility of getting into the british flank and cutting off their forward positions that we would then hit with our full force.

Rommel is right. If we don't get Tobruk before June, we're screwed. The oilfields must be reached by december, and Alexandria, Suez, Jerusalem, etc are still ahead. We must clear the Jerusalem line before October, otherwise this whole operation is useless...

[Franconicus]

Franc.Can you put the British and Axis forces on the map?:book:
At your service!:stupido:
https://img126.imageshack.us/img126/3594/prsentation1ko7.jpg

[Kagemusha]

Thanks!:bow:Here is what i suggest. We will use some Finnish military strategy and create an Motti. First we will take Trieste from the line and replace it with Brescia. We will anchor our front by placing 5.light and the Pioneer battalion behind the three Italian divisions as reserve to uphold the moral of Italians and counterattack any breaches,if the British attack. We will concentrate our new heavy artillery to support the main front and start counter firing first the British artillery and after destroying it, start destroying the British divisions with systematical concentrated fire. British will start loosing air planes,when they have to face both our FLAK positions and our fighters.

Rommel will take 15.pd,Arieste and Trieste and swings from the South,so we arrive on the flank of the British to Ft.Maddalena. Once we arive there.We have enough forces there to defend the position against any British counter attacks. Our operations based on Maddalena will aim on cutting the British supplies coming to their main force.
Once more of our divisions start arriving we will close the encirclement completely and destroy the depleted British force,which will be low on supplies,while our supplies are coming in without interference.
If the British start counter operations against our flanking force we can start a frontal attack on the weakened British positions.So if the British have any sense in them.They will stay put or withdraw completely. If they start withdrawing completely our situation turns only better,as we can strike the moving enemy.
I suggest we will use any means necessary to lay a mine field in the sea,which will deny the British from landing supplies into Tobruk.

[DemonArchangel]

Thanks for the supply report Franc. This just shows the massive, systemic supply and industrial deficiencies in the German armaments industry.

Option 2: In this era of mobile warfare, initiative is key. Currently, the British supply lines must be stretched out quite thinly. Our supply situation appears to be quite decent. Hit back now, hit back hard.

My Attack Plan: Trento, Bologna and Trieste will perform a frontal attack, while the 15 PzD supported by Brescia and Ariete goes around the southern flank and will hit the 7AD and 4th Indian in the flank. The 5th LAD and the elements of the 3 PzD will form our mobile reserve. The bulk of our aerial power should be concentrated on the 7th Armored, since most of their tank strength is concentrated in that formation, and since attacking the 7th AD with our air in conjunction with our land forces will make sure their bombers are going to be where our fighters are.

[Stig]

I suggest another tactic that will allow us to destroy the big part British army with a bit of luck. Everything will retreat to Mersa Brega (except for the 5. Light, which will hold Benghazi). Then as the British approach us they should be out of fuel, resources and everything. All we need to do is encircle them and destroy them while they can't do a thing. Then we make a run for Tobruk, we should be able to destroy the reinforcements with the new 3. Panzer.
All we need to look after is is that we fully destroy the British army. We also need to take their supply points undamaged and we shouldn't run out of supplies. Tobruk and the holding of Benghazi is the key.


Franc what is the current operational status of all divisions? (troop numbers, tank types, amount of art, vehicles, tanks, supplies, etc)

[Kagemusha]

DemonArchangel.Would it be wise to make a frontal assault with 3 Italian divisions against 3 British? In worst case our main line will collapse and our artillery and supporting parts will be over run by the British,which will mean end of our force in Strategig level.

[DemonArchangel]

Kage: It's BECAUSE the main line is vulnerable, that I want to take that risk. The main line would collapse anyway if we just stood there.

Anyway, I figured the layout a little bit better, so here's my revised strategy.

Now, I want the non-motorized divisions Trento and Bologna attacking the 5th and keeping them pinned in Tobruk, while Brescia guards their flank against the 7th Australian.

Meanwhile, the 5th LAD captures Fort Maddalena while the 15th PzD and Ariete wheels around and hits the 7th AD and 4th Indian in the flank.

Trieste is now our mobile reserve.

[DemonArchangel]

For the Brandenburgers, I suggest that we send them to Chad in order to convince them to join the Germans against the British. Thus, their long range patrols would have a place to run and hide and conduct raids from there.

[Rodion Romanovich]

We should have retreated to Gazala earlier, and even more so now. Retreat to Gazala and get proper air support, supplies, and reinforcements. We should be superior to the British forces if they're on the offensive, and we should keep a mobile reserve of tanks. Let them take the initiative, but once they've made their first moves we will respond by a clever counter-offensive, striking their weak spots and attempting to outflank them to the south while also trying to avoid being pushed back too far along the coast.

[Stig]

Whose the British commander atm Wavell or Auchinleck?

[Kagemusha]

As Franc wrote in the chapter.We are now supplied. We have no reason to withdraw further. If we start a general retreat the British will hit us on the move or they will just stay on their place and wire home that the Germans are running. We are re supplied and outnumber the British. But not enough for a simple assault.Thats why i suggested warfare based on manouver and by that denying British from their supplies. With large and heavily supported main line and three divisions on their flank,British can only choose to dig and die on atrition or retreat and in that case those two mechanized and panzer division on their flank will be their end.

[Stig]

If I'm correct our tanks outrun and outgun the British. We should use that (as Kage says). Draw the main body of Brits tanks into a trap and close it. Without tanks you're nowhere.

Kages plan makes sense, tho I would retreat further.

[Rodion Romanovich]

Yes, that's basically what I meant - manouver and careful movement, but not assault. :2thumbsup: What I fear about not retreating towards Gazala is however that our basic line to operate from will be more tricky there, than if we are at Gazala. If that isn't the case, then we should stay where we are, otherwise move back to Gazala. Casualty ratios are way more important than capturing dirt at this time IMO.

[DemonArchangel]

OK, with my plan, I'm hoping for a withdrawal, and not the destruction in place of the British forces, so the front line should just try to pin the British and prevent them from moving, not try to assault and destroy them. The 15th PzD, Ariete and 5th LAD will attack and cut off their retreat and cause them to lose men and materiel as they flee, but the primary purpose is to force a withdrawal.

This is a risk we have to take, but even if it fails, we can recover pretty easily from it. The main risks I see to my plan are the following.

1.) 7th Armored or 4 Indian can move further south to blocking the envelopment attempt: 15th PzD and Ariete can just cram themselves into the gaps they create when doing that, causing the blocking move to be split up, and thus able to be destroyed in detail.

2.) The Italian Divisions can be destroyed at the front: If the Italian divisions don't press too hard on the attack and keep a decent mobile reserve, they won't be destroyed, especially since the mobile elements to the south are much more of a threat.

3.) Airplanes: Keep our airplanes in support of the 15th PzD and Ariete and they should be fine. Distribute extra Flak evenly between the 15th PzD and the Italians.

[Stig]

OK, with my plan, I'm hoping for a withdrawal, and not the destruction in place of the British forces
Why? If they withdraw that means they get more supplies. If they get destroyed we win.

[DemonArchangel]

If they withdraw in haste and leave their equipment stranded in the desert, we can cut them down like fleeing game. Destruction is tiresome and takes time we don't have, and cornered men fight hard.

For Kage: Why keep the 5th LAD in reserve? It's a light armor formation, it's for flanking/scouting, not defense. Keep Trieste in reserve instead. And remember, what Legio said. We're doing maneuver and careful movement, not frontal WWI style assault.

[Kagemusha]

OK, with my plan, I'm hoping for a withdrawal, and not the destruction in place of the British forces, so the front line should just try to pin the British and prevent them from moving, not try to assault and destroy them. The 15th PzD, Ariete and 5th LAD will attack and cut off their retreat and cause them to lose men and materiel as they flee, but the primary purpose is to force a withdrawal.

This is a risk we have to take, but even if it fails, we can recover pretty easily from it. The main risks I see to my plan are the following.

1.) 7th Armored or 4 Indian can move further south to blocking the envelopment attempt: 15th PzD and Ariete can just cram themselves into the gaps they create when doing that, causing the blocking move to be split up, and thus able to be destroyed in detail.

2.) The Italian Divisions can be destroyed at the front: If the Italian divisions don't press too hard on the attack and keep a decent mobile reserve, they won't be destroyed, especially since the mobile elements to the south are much more of a threat.

3.) Airplanes: Keep our airplanes in support of the 15th PzD and Ariete and they should be fine. Distribute extra Flak evenly between the 15th PzD and the Italians.

Why should we use the Italian divisions in our main front offensively,when we now have artillery superiority? With our artillery support and 5th light and pioneers,they should be able to hold the line with ease.British would be only waisting their forces by attacking against our troops that are supported so well with artillery.
We should just dig in the Main line like i suggested and let the artillery to do its job. 5th light division is just light on its name. Its the second most powerfull Division we have in our forces.Basicly its highly motorized and has most tanks after the 15th Pzd.Ideal for mobile reserve.

Edit: DemonarchAngel did you even read my initial plan?https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1482317&postcount=650

WWI assault? Im suggesting using our mobility to outmanouver our enemy,while depleting his forces with our superior artillery.While you are suggesting a simple assault from front and flank,while our forces couldnt achive that to the single Australian division before.

[DemonArchangel]

The 5th Light is mobile, it's meant to move, not to be held in reserve. Trieste has enough motorized forces and armor anyway. If we just stand there, the British will retreat in an orderly fashion. If the Italians are moving forward with a rolling artillery barrage etc. at the same time that our forces are hitting the flanks, the British will panic, ditch their heavy equipment and run, which will allow us to cut them down more easily. I'm suggesting we use our artillery yes, to support the MOVING Italians, not the static ones. (i read your initial plan).

And WWI assault was in reference to you thinking what I was trying to do. I'm trying to keep proper pressure on the British at the front, which is what your plan lacks. The British won't just keep attacking once they figure out our strength of artillery at the front. And think about what would happen if the British find out the 5th LAD is in their rear.

[Kagemusha]

The 5th Light is mobile, it's meant to move, not to hold a position. Trieste has enough motorized forces and armor anyway. If we just stand there, the British will retreat in an orderly fashion. If the Italians are moving forward with a rolling artillery barrage etc. at the same time that our forces are hitting the flanks, the British will panic, ditch their heavy equipment and run, which will allow us to cut them down more easily. I'm suggesting we use our artillery yes, to support the MOVING Italians, not the static ones. (i read your initial plan).

And WWI assault was in reference to you thinking what I was trying to do. I'm trying to keep proper pressure on the British at the front, which is what your plan lacks.

5th light division was named light,becouse it was initially comprised from ad hoc units.It was not anykind of recon division as you are suggesting.Here is the division as its better known: http://www.answers.com/topic/21st-panzer-division

How will the British retreat in orderly way if we move panzer division and two motorized divisions in their flank just waiting for them to get up from their threnches.Our problem was that before we didnt have the artillery support to pound the British in to dust.Now we do. As i stated earlier.It will only benefit us if the British start withdrawing.Then we can destroy them completely.Australians showed already how much they panic under assault.By your plan we will just waist manpower unnecessarily and risk our center to collapse.

[DemonArchangel]

I'm not saying it was a Recon division. I'm saying it would be better if we used its mobility to strike deeply into the heart of the enemy, rather than keeping it as a reserve, which would free up the 15th Panzer to engage the 7th AD and thus deprive the British of a mobile strike force.

And if we don't keep up pressure, they would be much less likely to panic. Our center won't collapse if we don't press our attacks very hard in any case Kage.

[Kagemusha]

I think a mobile reserve is essential with that we can counter what nasty ideas the British armoured division may try.Well i guess here is where we disagree and what is the difference between our two plans. I suggest we create the pressure by using concentrated artillery against their forces and cutting the British of from their suply. While you want to create the pressure by frontal and flank attack supported by artillery. I think the arguments are layed out pretty much,lets see what others think.:yes:

[DemonArchangel]

No, I'm suggesting that the 5th Leichte attack the supply, while other formations handle the flank attack. And were you reading what I was writing? I suggested that Trieste be kept as a mobile reserve, not the 5th LAD.

[Kagemusha]

Well did i say that you suggested that 5th light was to be held in reserve? As far as im concerned i havent sayed a word what you are suggesting to be used as reserve,only answering why i feel that 5th light should be used as reserve. I was trying to show the general points where we disagree. But now that you mention it.I dont agree also sending an single division behind the enemy if you ask me about that,its lot better to have strong force that cant be removed by British counter attack.So i hope i have now stated everything i disagree with your plan.

[DemonArchangel]

Urgh... whatever, let's just wait until tomorrow.

[Franconicus]

Franc what is the current operational status of all divisions? (troop numbers, tank types, amount of art, vehicles, tanks, supplies, etc)

Italians divisions:

Trento (Infantry division): almost full combat strength
Bologna (Infantry division): almost full combat strength
Trieste (Mobile Division): almost full combat strength
Ariete (Tank Division): 30% combat strength
Brescia (Infantry Division - kind of elite): 80% combat strength
Pavia (Infantry Division): 60% combat stregth, almost completley immobile
(note that the Italian divisions have a nominal strenght that is only about 2/3 of a British or German division).

German Divisions

5. Light Division (reduced tank dvision): 20% combat strength
15. PD (Tank Division): 80 % combat strength
both German divisions have an extra recon det.
additionally some heavy artillery and pioneers

[King Kurt]

In broad terms, I agree with Kage. I think we should create a solid infantry front with a mobile reserve to deliver a "right hook" I think our only problem is this strategy relies on the British continuing to attack. If they just use it as an attack to relieve Tobrok then we will both just sit there glaring at each other. When we are stabilised and have our reserves in place we should probe with our extra recon with a view to launching the "right hook"

[Stig]

Italians divisions:

Trento (Infantry division): almost full combat strength
Bologna (Infantry division): almost full combat strength
Trieste (Mobile Division): almost full combat strength
Ariete (Tank Division): 30% combat strength
Brescia (Infantry Division - kind of elite): 80% combat strength
Pavia (Infantry Division): 60% combat stregth, almost completley immobile
(note that the Italian divisions have a nominal strenght that is only about 2/3 of a British or German division).

German Divisions

5. Light Division (reduced tank dvision): 20% combat strength
15. PD (Tank Division): 80 % combat strength
both German divisions have an extra recon det.
additionally some heavy artillery and pioneers

We can't attack with this. I suggest Trento, Bologna and Brescia form a defensive line at Gazala. We should retreat both Ariete and 5. Light to a point safe behind our lines. I suggest something like Mechili. Pavia stays where it is. 15. Panzer should be on our right flank ready to take out a possible British flanking movement. Trieste will be at the coast ready to do the same. But also both have to be in reserve. We should just let the Brits come, as they will.

[King Kurt]

Stig
Why should the Brits attack? - at best our strengths are even, in reality, we probably outnumber them and we are in a better supply position to them. I will not be surprised if they don't just dig in and wait.

[Stig]

Well myself I wanted to lure them into an attack. If we go all out retreating (the Italian divisions first) they might think they got the better hand. When we then reach the defensive line Pavia will be digging at Mersa Brega we can immediatly have good defensive positions, and the British because of their quick run following us will be immobile. All we need to do is aim and fire.

[Kagemusha]

I agree with Kurt on his assumption that the British wont attack. How ever if we place force strong enough on their flank harassing their supply, they have to take measures or start suffering from lack of supplies.

[Franconicus]

Maybe a word regarding the British supply situation:

The British base is Alexandria, of course. There is a railroad from Alexandria to Mersa Maruth. From there supply has to be carried by truck or plane. Additionally, the Brits can ship their supply. They have Tobruk, an excellent harbor, close to their front, at the moment.

Reinforcements for the RAF:
Bombers are transferred across Africa, fighters have to be shipped.

The German/Italian situation:

The base is Tripoli. There is one road along the coast (VIA BALBO), which all trucks have to use. There is also Benghazi, a harbor only suitable for small ships (unlike Tobruk). Of course the Axis is also using air transport.

There is a long leadtime. If you wish to get a new division or replacements from Germany it takes 8 weeks untils it is carried through Italy, shipped to Tripoli and transferred into the Cyreneika. If you have to reequip or train the units first, it takes even longer.

[Kagemusha]

Well i dont consider 8 weeks too long time to harass the British African army by blowing up trains cutting off railroads and destroying British supply convoys both at roads and sea,While pounding the British mainline with artillery.and destroying it after the panzer division from Naples arrives. Altough i find it pretty strange how fast British could bring more divisions and huge amount of tanks on the Africa front no matter of the situtation in Britain. For example where are these new British fighters and bombers coming from,when Battle of Britain is at full speed?
While we cant supply an attack of 100 kilometers,without getting our forces in disorder.
Somehow i see both the Strategical situation and tactical situation beeing lot more against the Germans,then it was in reality.

[Franconicus]

Sorry, Kage, I cannot agree! I am sure you know the 'real' history very well and remember the convoy 'Tiger'. This is exactly the same that came across the Med in our history. Those tanks and planes haven't arrived at the front, yet!

All divisions that are actually on the map were in Africa or close in the 'real' year 1941. There are no ghost divisions so far.

However, the invasion of Malta in our story was a bonfire. Haven't you expected that the British would react somehow. Churchill is still decided to fight until the bitter end. He will not give ground. After having lost Malta, he knows pretty good that the Axis is going to try to invade Egypt. Why do you think that the Brits did send the convoy across the Med, not the usual way around. So watch out!

[Kagemusha]

Im sorry Franc if i come up whining.:oops: But if the British stand has changed shouldnt the Germans also react by example sending us divisions from Greece? We should have two German corps in Africa,while in reality,we pretty much only have the forces Rommel had in reality plus a single panzer division,meaning two German divisions. If nothing else.Maybe Ramcke could ask for atleast a regiment of Nebelwerfer´s as our Grouppes artillery detachment?

[Franconicus]

You have four tank divisions, although only two have arrived. It takes some time to deploy four divisions at Libya. You could get more than 4, but as we discussed before. you cannot supply more than max. 4.

Keep on whining. Hitler did not understand where all those Australian, Indian, South African, Newsealndish and Canadian Forces came from, too. He thought that this was unfair, too.:laugh4:

[Kagemusha]

And now he is comparing me to Hitler.:wall: :laugh4: This is what you get when you choose the scenic route to the Arabian oilfields.:smash:Edit:Do we have a date,when the whole Panzer Grouppe Africa will be in the area of Operations?

[SwordsMaster]

So, to sum up, another 2 tank divs should arrive shortly (I'm guessing 1-2 weeks?) and when they do, we'll be able to pull back and reinforce the depleted divs that should be kept in reserve in the meantime.

And we don't have 8 weeks to wait for new troops to arrive from Germany. We should request them, but they should be arriving to Alexandria and the Suez channel, and not to Tripoli.

[Franconicus]

Kage: Maybe you should send Finish troops. Look what they did on the ice fields and imagine what they could do, if htey were getting really hot.:verycool:

However, it might take more than 8 weeks to get them into the desert.:oops:

SM: The 3. PD is already coming and will be at Gazala within 4 weeks. The 4. PD will arrive later, maybe 4 weeks later. (If you travel through Italy, time is relative.)
Of course there are also replacements for the German and Italian divisions on the way as well as sand filters for tanks, trucks and planes.

[Kagemusha]

Franc,We dont have icefields here,neither polar beers or penquins.:laugh4: In matter of fact after WWII there was a quite of few Finnish troops on Suez on a certain UN mission.Sitting between Israeli and Egyptian troops.:yes:Edit: So we keep bombarding and harassing the British army four a month and then destroy them after our two other panzer divisions arrive.:2thumbsup:

[Franconicus]

:dizzy2: You mean that you are no penquin?

Gentlemen, I think it is time to decide eiter:

1) to attack or
2) to wait

[SwordsMaster]

Definitely to attack! We can't wait until the brits pour on us another few dozen planes and tanks! We have to kick them off the airfields and away from the roads and supplies...

[Stig]

I'd say we wait, you can't attack with 2 almost destroyed divisions and 1 that is immobile far behind our own lines.

[Kagemusha]

1)To attack by manouver like Kage "The Penquin" has suggested.:clown:

[SwordsMaster]

I'd say we wait, you can't attack with 2 almost destroyed divisions and 1 that is immobile far behind our own lines.

Ah, ya know, You can take the dog out of the fight, but not take the fight out of the dog. I guess this is not how the original author meant it though....

Rommel can attack. He proved it when the italians in Tripoli were wondering where his HQ was and he was already on the march, 200km away...

[Stig]

Well the Brits have fresh divisions and a short supply line. We only have 3 divisions at full strenght (all Italian), next to that we have 2 more divisions to use.
5. Light and Ariete shouldn't be used but resupplied. You can't send in a depleted division, morale is gone.


Don't attack head on, if you want to attack follow Kage's plan.

[Franconicus]

Everybody is talking about the Kage Operational Plan. Kage-san, may I ask you to precise it a bit, so that even I can understand it?

What exactly are the goals? Do you want to involve the enemy into combat or avoid it? About Maddalena? I am sure that you may take the fort, but how many units do you want to have there. You cannot supply a lot there in the middle of nowhere! Which divisions are the hammer, which the anvil?

[Kagemusha]

Franc,the way of life is that all cant understand the marvellous plans of the "penquin Hitler" General.:clown:

Here is the plan:

Stage1

First we will take Trieste from the line and replace it with Brescia. We will anchor our front by placing 5.light and the Pioneer battalion behind the three Italian divisions as reserve to uphold the moral of Italians and counterattack any breaches,if the British attack. We will concentrate our new heavy artillery to support the main front and start counter firing first the British artillery and after destroying it, start destroying the British divisions with systematical concentrated fire. British will start loosing air planes,when they have to face both our FLAK positions and our fighters.The main line will dig in and will not start infantry attacks head on,unless the situation in front of them dramatically changes.

Stage2

Rommel will take 15.pd,Arieste and Trieste and swings from the South,so we arrive on the flank of the British to Ft.Maddalena. Once we arive there.We have enough forces there to defend the position against any British counter attacks. Our operations based on Maddalena will aim on cutting the British supplies coming to their main force, by sending task forces to the North and North East to destroy British supply convoys and to the North West to harass the British flank and protect our supply convoys to Ft.Maddalena.

Once more of our divisions start arriving we will close the encirclement completely and destroy the depleted British force,which will be low on supplies,while our supplies are coming in without interference.
If the British start counter operations against our flanking force we can start a frontal attack on the weakened British positions.So if the British have any sense in them.They will stay put or withdraw completely. If they start withdrawing completely our situation turns only better,as we can strike the moving enemy.
I suggest we will use any means necessary to lay a mine field in the sea,which will deny the British from landing supplies into Tobruk.

I hope that is clear enough.:yes:

[Franconicus]

Crystal clear. How will you supply the divisions at Maddalena? The only 'road' to this fort comes from Sollum, which you will not occupy. Right? Or is it just a short raid and the tanks will return soon?

[Kagemusha]

Since the Desert is hard ground we should be able to drive convoys straight from Mersa Brega and also from the air.The route is not that long.And we can plow roads in to the desert.Since our tanks are faster then British ones.we should be able to catch any British task forces who are trying to interfere our convoys. If they are using planes they have to fly over our positions,so it will be no suprise.

[King Kurt]

I'm with my Dutch Penguin friend - sorry 17th Century injoke!!!!:laugh4:

[Kagemusha]

Lol!:laugh4: I guess i should change my user name as DutchPenquinHitler.:smash:

[Franconicus]

I'm with my Dutch Penguin friend - sorry 17th Century injoke!!!!:laugh4:
Don#t forget to ask the Pope, before you start any operation at Africa!

[DemonArchangel]

Ok, given the state of the 5th LAD, Kage's plan suddenly begins making a lot more sense. I thought it was around 80% combat strength, which would have left it with enough supply/fighting strength to penetrate all the way to Fort Maddalena. With its current strength level, it's better to keep it in reserve. But I still believe that instead of just sitting around Maddalena intercepting British supplies (and the fort would be subject to intense aerial bombardment), we should attack the British flank directly. They haven't had long to dig in, so this would be quite a shock to their system and would allow us to keep the initiative. After all, Franc is right, we can't supply 3 mobile divisions from Ft. Maddalena, especially since the desert isn't exactly hard ground, it's quite sandy and can consume trucks very easily.

Also, I continue with my suggestion of keeping some mild forward pressure (NOT HEAD ON ASSAULT KAGE) on the British front line with the Italian divisions, even if it's just counter-maneuvering to their movements.

[Franconicus]

Chapter 47 – Operation ‘Penguin’
May 21st

Hoth calls all commanders to his HQ.
“Gentlemen, our divisions are currently standing at the line of Gazala. They are well supplied and besides Ariete and the 5. Light they have a reasonable combat strength. We have received heavy artillery and pioneers. Models division will arrive mid-June. On the opposite side the British forces stopped their advance some kilometers west of Tobruk. They started to fortify their position with a chain of strongholds. There is a lot of ship traffic in the harbor of Tobruk. There is the 9. Australian at Tobruk, the 7. Australian south of Tobruk, then the 4. Indian. South and east of the Indian there is the 7. Armoured Division. It looks like the British are waiting for reinforcements that may arrive within the next three weeks.
I received a message from the Führer itself. He tells me to explain how I plan to achieve the strategic goals in time. Furthermore, he urges me to be offensive and to take Tobruk as soon as possible.”

A strange smile appears on Rommel’s face.

“Therefore, I decided to start a new operation, called operation “Penguin”. The Italian 21. Corps with Trento and Bologna will do a faint attack, supported by heavy artillery. Behind them 5. Light will go into position. This group will be led by General Navarrini. I assume that the British will pull more forces to support their northern flank. Then our armored fist, the Italian 20. Motorized Corps with Ariete and Trieste will bypass the British positions together with the 15. Panzerdivision. This group will be led by General Rommel. He has to take Fort Maddalena, 150 km from his original position and to hold it. From there we can raid the British supply. The operation will start on May 23rd. Questions?”

Rommel: “Yes! Why do we stop a Fort Maddalena? If we manage to bypass the British lines and to repel the counterstrikes of the Britsh armoured forces, why do we not turn north and take Solum and Bardia? Then the whole English army would be trapped!”

Hoth: “We are not strong enough for such a huge operation. “Penguin” will prepare a bigger operation, that we will start as soon as the 3. arrived and the 5. Light is refilled.”

Cambara: “Ariete is far too weak for such an operation. The actual strength is two third under nominal. We should pull it out of the front and refill it!”
Hoth: “I know that it is hard, but we have only two tank divisions and I cannot leave one behind.”
Cambara: “The way across the desert is very risky. We will have vehicle break downs; and we will have trouble with supply.”
Hoth: “We have to take the risk!”
Cambara: “Why? We could bypass the British lines as suggested, then defeat the British tanks. Afterwards we should turn north and attack the left flank of the Indian Division, assault Fort Capuzzo and rip the entire British position. Then a frontal assault with the infantry divisions; that’s it. I bet we would be able to penetrate Tobruk directly. And we would not risk to get lost in the desert!”

Hoth hesitates for a moment. Should he
1) Stay with the original plan and head for Fort Maddalena?
2) Listen to Rommel and target for the Sollum and Bardia?
3) Listen to Cambara, turn north earlier and smash the British position from the flank?

[King Kurt]

Operation Penguin should head for the north!!

I think we should go for the italian plan. The key is defeating the British army, not taking territory. Rommel's is too ambitious and runs the risks of running into the British reinforcements coming up to the line. Hoth's plan is OK - but Hitler seems a bit Tobruk fixated, so let us keep him sweet as well. For all the sweeping armoured thrusts, the key characteristic of the most important Desert battle - the 2nd El Alemain - was that of an artillery/ infantry slogging match with the Axis infantry being ground down. Montgomery talked of a WW1 style battle.

[SwordsMaster]

3! Cambara is right. There is not point running across the desert with depleted divisions losing equipment and men. Destroy them where they are and THEN push into Sollum with the armour while the infantry suround and take Tobruk

[Kagemusha]

1) I suggest caution.We have to wait for more troops before we launch the main assault.If you think it will be hard to supply Maddalena.How hard it will be to supply our forces that will be completely behind the main British force with open rear like Rommel suggests.About Italian suggestion, we tryed to storm Tobruk that was defended by a single Australian division,how are we now supposed to storm 3 infantry and a British armoured division with same amount of troops. Lets just threaten their flank and cut of their supply untill our next panzer division arrives.

[DemonArchangel]

2.) I don't want to run all the way to Fort Maddalena.

[Franconicus]

2.) I don't want to run all the way to Fort Maddalena.
Bardia is even one step further!

[Stig]

Difficult one. Making a frontal assault while we have 2 almost destroyed division is stupid. So that's 3 out. Rommel is wrong, as he wrong always till now imo. So it's 1 for me

[JimBob]

3) Dead British can't defend or attack.

[DemonArchangel]

Bardia is even one step further!

AAACK!!! Alright then, Option 3. Let's rock and roll.

[AggonyDuck]

Option 3 is the closest to what I was going to suggest. We have an advantage in mobile divisions and if we can crush the 7th Armoured, then we will be able to outmaneuver the British at will. We will be able to pin the 7th Armoured with an attack from the south and then strike it in the flank from the east with an armoured division. If we manage to destroy the 7th Armoured, then the British have to start moving the Australian divisions to counter them, weakening the front for a frontal assault.

Basically plan 3 allows us to utilise our two advantages; numerical superiority and superior mobility. By doing going around the British position with our motorised units with a night march and doing a wide outflanking maneuver to pin and flank the 7th Armoured, we will put the Brits in a hard position. Overall the situation reminds me of the Battle of Gazala, except we are in a lot stronger position than Rommel was. If we can keep the battle mobile, we will win.

[Rodion Romanovich]

I'm afraid Rommel's plan 2 is overambitious again... Cambara seems right about the vehicle breakdowns in plan 1 etc., and what is worse is the fact that our forces at Ft. Maddalena could end up being isolated by British counter-attacking forces. Because we haven't taken Tobruk yet, we have important forces tied up there and can't get the strength we need to the east. I'd instead stick to smaller scalemanouver warfare - such as what Cambara suggested, or just sticking to defensive on our eastern front and step by step reduction of the force in Tobruk as our only offensive movement. We should try to keep the current line but build a mine barrier on our southern flank, keeping a mobile armored reserve close to our southern flank, and get artillery and planes to bombard the places where the British strength is most heavily concentrated. Use scout planes to find out in which places they have the worst combinations of lack of AA and high concentration of troops and attack those spots. For the threatened detachment at Solum, put a large tank reserve behind that position as well and in the cover of night as secretly as possible start building up a big and complex AT minefield in depth (several rows of minefields) there. That's the place where the British are most likely to attack next, if they attack. If they don't attack, we will have time to get more and more artillery and bombing missions to Tobruk, while keeping the pressure on the British armor as suggested by Cambara.

Since there is no option that is more defensive than what Cambara suggested, I'll have to go with no. 3.

[Kagemusha]

One simple question.If we are using number 3,which is pretty much the option DemonArchangel suggested before Franc,wrote the options in the chapter and majority was against it. How are you going to destroy the larger enemy with forces that previously couldnt destroy single entrenched division,while they should now supposedly do that to four divisions? I think we are about to get our arses kicked. Number 1 is the most defensive option.Number three is simple assault to the flank and after that to the front.

[AggonyDuck]

One simple question.If we are using number 3,which is pretty much the option DemonArchangel suggested before Franc,wrote the options in the chapter and majority was against it. How are you going to destroy the larger enemy with forces that previously couldnt destroy single entrenched division,while they should now supposedly do that to four divisions? I think we are about to get our arses kicked. Number 1 is the most defensive option.Number three is simple assault to the flank and after that to the front.

Ever though that attacking an entrenched enemy in a well fortified urban settlement isn't really comparable to launching a wide outflanking maneuver against the flanks and rear of a line? The current British deployment is quite vulnerable and allows us to use our one advantage: we have more motorised units. This essentially means that we can use maneuver to achive overwhelming superiority at the crucial areas of the battle, this was impossible in Tobruk, but is certainly possible in the desert.

If we concentrate the main effort against the British 7th Armoured and crush it decisively, then the British line is in big trouble. They are faced with the very real possibilities of either being cut off or attacked in the rear, of which neither is pleasant for the Brits. The two possibilities are an attack towards the south or an withdrawal, both which open up the British line for a frontal assault.

[Stig]

Option 3 is all about a frontal assault. Which will fail I tell you. And if we fail we have to retreat from Africa I can tell you that.

[DemonArchangel]

Stig: It's about maneuver. We have to attack anyway. There's nowhere else to retreat.

Kage: You want to stick to the original plan? We're not going to be able to drive that far through the desert without abandoning too much of our gear.

And hopefully the feint attack I suggested will tie down the Aussies long enough for us to destroy the 7th Armored.

[Stig]

Let Pavia dig in at Mersa Brega and construct a defensive line there. There sitting there being immobile anyway

[DemonArchangel]

I'm hoping that we can reintroduce motorized assets to Pavia later. Anyway, digging in won't help. WWI has come and gone. This is mobile war, whoever keeps moving wins the war.

[AggonyDuck]

Guys, the situation is very similar to the Battle of Gazala, so I suggest you read a bit about it and how Rommel approached the whole battle. He used a very similar approach to option 3, but he did it when outnumbered 2:1 and still manage to squeeze out a victory. Now we're doing something similar with actually a small advantage in numbers. I can't see how you can find such an attack to be disastrous for us, when it is apparent that panzers appearing behind the British defense line is a grave threat to the whole Eighth Army.

[Kagemusha]

You can say what you want.But you are just attacking a strong enemy with not enough troops and will get us defeated.You supported my plan when it was not written in the chapter,but now that it is you dont support it anymore.If its the majoritys choice to get ourselves defeated,then it is. And that is the way it goes.
Edit:Rommel was not able to take Tobruk first,becouse he acted just like we are acting.If he couldnt brake the enemy supplied from sea.He just let it be and that was his defeat in long run.

[Kagemusha]

And another thing with option two.Our front will be crushed and after the Brititsh will overrun our artillery and supporting parts,we are finished.But i guess Fallschirmjäger will be also needed in east front and Caen,before surrendering.

[Franconicus]

:coffeenews: Good God, 8 votes! This story is getting popular! 6 out of 8 for the Italian plan.

Don't be sad. Kage! I will use the name penguin anyway!:clown:

Chapter 48 – The Hook
Gazalla, May 21st – May 25th

The discussion goes on for hours, finally all generals agree with Cambara. When they leave the conference, Cambara asks Hoth: “Please tell me, why you name this operation penguin?”

Hoth: “Well, I thought our soldiers needed something to cool them while they march through the desert. Originally I wanted to name it ‘Dutch Penguin’, but it was too long. Cambara shakes his head while hoth is leaving: “Crazy Germans!”

The whole night the staff makes detailed deployment plans. Next morning the divisions begin to move to their starting positions. A sand storm delays the movements, but it also hides the units from the eyes of British planes. In the evening of May 22nd the Axis soldiers are exhausted, but in their starting positions.

5. Light builds mocks, to pretend that there are more tanks at the northern section of the front.

The British front emerges from the coast east of Tobruk to the oasis of Bir Hakeim in the desert. A continuous line of defense exists only near the coast, further south the British have strongholds.

On May 23rd the artillery of Navarrini’s group opens fire on the British positions. German and Italian planes drop their loads above the Australians. The bombardment lasts for four hours. Additionally German bombers raid the station and the magazines at Mersa Matruh. The 5. Light keeps on moving to create dust clouds and to pretend a large amount of German tanks. In the evening, Bologna makes an halfhearted attack against the Australian division.

As soon as night falls Ariete, Trieste and 15. PD start their nightly mission. Ariete and 15. PD bypass the southern flank. 15. PD turns north, marching behind the British lines. At the first day of light, Trieste opens fire on Bir Hakeim. Italian bombers and ground attack planes bomb that stronghold. Then the Italian infantry of Trieste attacks from the west, while Ariete attacks from the east. The defender, Polish infantry of the Carpathian Rifle Brigade, holds the fort.

In the meantime, the 15. PD keeps on marching northwards, led by Rommel personally. In the afternoon they are attacked by about 80 British cruiser tanks. The British tanks are fast and their guns are deadly. However, the German commanders are able to outflank the British and it shows that the British tanks cannot resist the German shells. The British tanks retreat, leaving 7 wrecks behind.

Rommel tells his tank commanders to follow the English as soon as possible. Only a reconnaisance detachment leaves the main body for a special operation.

Rommel keeps on pushing further all through the night. Around midnight he is stopped by British artillery and antitank guns. The German tanks try to bypass the ATGs while the infantry of the 115 Rifle Rgt makes a frontal assault. As soon as the British notice that the German tanks are trying to get into their rear, they turn around and flee eastwards as soon as possible.

On May 25th, Ariete and Trieste make another attempt to take Bir Hakeim. Although the assault is supported by Stukas and artillery, they cannot break the line.

In the meantime the British start a counterstrike against the 15. PD. This time the British forces consist of about 200 Cruiser Mk. II and Mathilda II tanks. The German tank regiment has 58 tanks. They try to slow down the British assault, while Rommel orders the rest of the division to form a defensive line. In front of that line is the 115. Rifle Rgt. supported by ATG and eight-eight guns. Behind that line is the artillery of the 33. Art Rgt. The German tanks retreat behind that line while the German guns open fire on the British tanks. The British force, which consists of the 4. and 7. Armoured Brigade, relies on their superior numbers and tries a frontal assault. However, the German fire power is to strong and the shells from the German flak and artillery penetrates the British tanks so eeasily that there are soon a lot of smoking British tanks spread on the battlefield. The British tanks retreat, leaving 38 tanks behind.

While the war on the ground makes a break, the war in the air and from the air goes on. German and Italian pilots fly many missions to support their commrades of Trieste and 15. PD, while their opponents do the same for their army. The sky is filled with planes and columns of smoke mark the toughness of these fights.

In the evening of May 25. Hoth sumarizes the situation:

The British are unloading troops at Tobruk. He also knows that the Italians send submarines to bring fuel to Benghazi and that other subs are trying to lay mines during night. The Brandenburger are preparing a special secret operation.

The Australian and Indian Divisions are still in their defensive positions. Rommels troops managed to drive around the British position, however Trieste and Ariete have not been able to take Bir Hakeim. Rommel himself has led the 15. behind the British lines. Although being attacked by superior British tank forces, he was able to continue his advance. Currently he is 20 km east of Fort Capuzzo. The British tank units retreated eastwards.

Hoth realizes, that Rommel is in a dangerous situation. On his left there is the 4. Indian Division, on his right there are the British tank formations and ahead is the fortress of Tobruk. As long as Bir Hakeim is occupied by the poles, it will be almost impossible to supply the 15. PD.

A1 Make the 15. return and take Bir Hakeim! Then they can advance northwards, again
A2 Make the 15. march north. Bir Hakeim will fall anyway.
A3 Order the 15. to turn west and to attack the Indians while Brescia does the same from the west.
A4 Give Rommel plenty of rope.

B1 Order the airforce to put the focus on Bir Hakeim
B2 Oder the airforce to cover the 15. and to attack the British tank forces.
B3 Order the airforce to bomb Tobruk, esp. the harbor
B4 Bomb all without priority

[Franconicus]

https://img157.imageshack.us/img157/5272/prsentation1yh0.jpg

[SwordsMaster]

A4, B1. This is an ideal situation for Rommel to shine. He is limited by theamount of enemy troops but if he can use his aggressive blitz gift to make the brits begin retreating, the garrison of Bir Hakeim will be surrounded and eliminated which we should aid with air raids and heavy bombing.

[Rodion Romanovich]

A1 - the British were clever enough to retreat with the majority of their armor since we threatened it well with our manouvers. Although we will fail to deal the devastating blow we wanted to their armor, we will manage to destroy important British units by taking Bir Hakeim. That puts us back almost at Status Quo in terms of land, but with great advantage in kill-loss ratio, since the Bir Hakeim garrison is weakened and isolated after the British armor fell back.

A combination of B1 and B2. If the British tank forces turn back west again, do more like B2, but if the tanks keep back, do more like B1.

[AggonyDuck]

For A there are two correct decisions really; either 3 or 4. The question is just which is better. I'd say it's best if we let Rommel have his freedom and do our best to support him. He excels in situations like these and should be able to do his best. So A4 it is, we should just do our utmost to support him.

As to where the airforce is sent, I believe we will need need to give our full support to Rommel. I don't think we will be able to crush the Bir Hakeim box fast enough to secure supplies that way. So B2 it is.

This is really starting to be almost exactly like the battle of Gazala. An allied brigade isolated in a box at Bir Hakeim and a Rommel behind enemy lines with supply difficulties.

Also, would it be possible to move the 5th Light Division to support Brescia, if indeed Rommel will turn west as I expect him to?

[Stig]

I don't want to give Rommel to much initiative. I would like A3, the Indians are good fighters. If we destroy them the English will surely know they have to retreat. Next to that, if we beat them we can fold ourselves around Tobruk and trap the reinforcements and the 7th Australian

For the airforce I would like them to both concentrate at the tanks and to make some attacks at Tobruk. Not really the harbour but atleast the city itself. If the English are bringing up loads of reinforcements, start bombing the harbour. we might lose it for ourselves but it might also be the best choice.

[DemonArchangel]

Ok, Rommel's current position is rather untenable. He's behind enemy lines, vastly outnumbered, and in a difficult supply crunch. He needs to retreat. By allowing him to attack, the British will inflict massive casualties on him.

That and Ariete is understrength, in the desert and has a rifle brigade blocking its line of retreat.

If the British are smart, they'll have the 7th Armored Division attack Ariete, thus cutting off the 15th PzD and freeing up the Carpathian Rifle Brigade. What Rommel needs to do is to perform a backhand stroke against the 7th Armored Division as it advances forward, hopefully hamstringing it and preventing it from attacking Ariete.

A1: Rommel has to turn back around in order to free up his own supply lines. After that, we can advance again.

B1/B2: Rommel needs something to cover his retreat (B2). Attacking Tobruk with our limited air forces would be fruitless, as it has heavy air defenses. Once Rommel reaches Bir Hakeim, then B1.

Also I have a proposal: The 5th LAD, Bologna and Brescia attack the 4th Indian Division (at night of course). I don't expect the 4th Indian Division to break, but this is primarily a preventative measure to prevent elements of the 4th Indian from attacking Rommel's withdrawal.

[AggonyDuck]

Anyone actually bothered to read about the battle of Gazala? I'd highly recommend that you do so, because our current situation is almost identical to what Rommel was in May 1942. ~;)

[DemonArchangel]

Aggony: What do you think about my backhand stroke?

[Stig]

What if we do this:
We retreat Ariete and the 15. Panzer. In doing this Ariete will attack the Rifle Brigade and 15. Panzer will attack the 4th Indian Division. Now hopefully the English will concentrate on our right flank. In doing this we should attack along the coast using Trento and the 5. Light. Hopefully the English 7th Armoured will be busy fighting somewhere else and we can push to Tobruk. Ofcourse the Infantry division opposite to the Rifle brigade and 4th Indian should attack as well.

[DemonArchangel]

Stig: NO! That'll leave us scattered all over the place, among other things.

[AggonyDuck]

Aggony: What do you think about my backhand stroke?

Well it would require that the British wouldn't concentrate their efforts in beating the 15.PD, which they pretty much have to. Leaving the 15th Panzer unchecked will leave it free to strike against the rear of the 4th Indian Division, which when combined with a frontal attack by Brescia would most likely force a British retreat in that sector and clear up the supply route for the Germans. That would make any attack against Ariete rather redundant, so I don't think we will see them attacking Ariete, especially when that isolated infantry box is working in their favour by tying down two divisions with a brigade.

What I feel is the best choice for us now is to turn our efforts against the 4th Indian Division. Have Brescia and maybe the 5th Light attack it frontally, while the 15. Panzer attacks it from the rear. I doubt the Indians will be able to defend against such an assault and it will most likely clear up the supply lines to the 15th Panzer. The question us just if the 15. Panzer can manage such an attack while being pressured by the 7th Armoured, hence I voted for option 4.

[Stig]

Stig: NO! That'll leave us scattered all over the place, among other things.
No it won't.
The tank divisions will retreat and in doing so attack (as one of the plans suggested).

[Franconicus]

We have 2 votes for A1, one for A3 and two for A4. I need another votes!

[Kagemusha]

A4 and B2. We have to restore our lines. At the current situation,we cant leave the Indian Division behind us. So lets give Rommel rope to use his tactical talent on this situation. B2 becouse if we leave the British armoured division to act freely,it could be our 15.pd that will be attacked from both sides.

[Franconicus]

Chapter 49 – Fox In the Desert
The ‘cauldron’, May 26th – 28th

Hoth is an experienced commander and he knows that in a complex tactical situation like this the decisions have to be made by the commander in combat. He arranges a fuel transport by seven Junker transporters, to give the 15.PD at least some mobility. He and Ramcke join the transport. It is almost midnight when the planes see the signal lights of the 15. and touch down. It is not a simple mission and three transporters turn into torches.

Rommel, Hoth and Ramcke have a short meeting. It is obvious that only quick decisions can prevent the 15. PD from destruction. Rommel asks Hoth for a maximum of air support. He also asks that the 104. Rifle Rgt. of the 5. Light supports the assault of Brescia. Then Hoth leaves again, to coordinate the activities on the western side.

Rommel starts immediately to give his orders. The reconnaissance detachment ‘Kunz’ leaves in northern direction for a special mission. The artillery rgt as well as the anti tank units give their remaining fuel to the tank units. Then they start to form a defense line against any British forces that may be coming from east. These units, mainly artillery, some ATGs and only little infantry are almost completely immobile, now. They try to fortify their positions. As the ground is too hard to dig in, they build stonewalls to protect the guns.

It is two o’clock in the morning when the tank forces start. They head east, where the Indian Division lies.

May 27th: At the first light of day, war breaks out again. Detachment ‘Kunz’ reaches the edge of the El Adem airfield and shells the British hangars. The fire of the British garrison forces this unit to disappear in the desert, again.

At the same time the armored parts of the 15. PD start to attack the Indian positions. Shortly afterwards, the Italian 20. Infantry Rgt. of ‘Brescia’ joins the attack. It is also supported by German divers.

Another combat focus is Bir Hakeim. Trieste and Ariete are trying to break through the positions of the Poles, again. The Italian air force supports this effort with an 80 bombers raid. Inside the strongpoint, there is a huge explosion. Nevertheless, the Poles keep on holding the fort.

At the stonewall, the gunners of the 15. PD have an easy morning. There is no sight of the British 7. Armored.

Around noon the RAF appears with increased strength. They bomb Ariete, the 15. – at the stonewall as well as the armored components – and they fly supply missions for Bir Hakeim. German and Italian fighters try to intercept them. No side gets the upper hand, many planes from both sides crash in the desert.

The armored part of the 15., led by Rommel himself, puts backwards units and artillery units down. It also manages to isolate some strongholds, but fails to dehisce the Indian front. The advance of Brescia is steady but slow. In the afternoon, the infantry regiment of the 5. Light joins the Italian forces.

When night falls, Rommel and Ramcke discuss the situation. Although the 7. Armored Division hasn’t participated; the German situation hasn’t improved at all. Bir Hakeim is still standing, the Indians are still holding the fort; there is no open path for supply. The 15. is running out of fuel, even water is getting short. Tomorrow, the Germans have to break through or the 15. PD will be lost. Additionally, there is little doubt that the 7. Armoured will enter combat tomorrow. Rommel asks Ramcke to get back to the stonewall position and take command over the forces there. It is crucial that the back of the 15. PD is secured.

Even at night, combat goes on. The RAF drops water tanks and ammo over Bir Hakeim. The German and Italian air forces bomb Bir Hakeim as well as strongholds held by the Indians. During night, soldiers of Brescia and the 5. Light continue to assault the Indian positions.

Also during night a special force of the 15. PD builds a secret fuel depot near Maddalena. Then they drive to the Italian fort, now occupied by British forces. They find that the garrison is strong, so they bypass the fort. In the morning they find a convoy camping in the desert, about 60 trucks. With the 2cm guns the Germans set two trucks on fire, the surprised British soldiers capitulate. They are soldiers of the Australian 6. Infantry Division. Now, this detachment has enough fuel and trucks to return home again.

May 28.- the day when the 15. will meet its fate. At the first light of day Rommel orders a final assault against the Indian position. He is willing to risks his last reserves on fuel and ammo to break through. At 7:30 two Indian strongholds are overrun. The German tank drivers meet comrades of the Italian infantry.

About the same time the battle of Bir Hakeim is over, too. The Poles sally at the first light of day. They break through Ariete and disappear in the desert.

At 7:35 Rommel receives a cry for help: the 7th Armored attacks the stonewall. Immediately, he gives the order to turn the tanks around and to hurry to rescue the threatened comrades. However, this is easier said than done. Before they can start this new mission, the tanks have to be refueled. The tank commanders are waiting impatiently for the fuel and ammo supply to arrive.

At the stonewall, British tanks approach the German positions. This time they are serious. 150 tanks as well a mounted infantry assault the German positions. They are supported by English ground attack planes. The Hurricanes attack the German cannons, esp. the 8.8 guns. These low level attacks cause a lot of damage and confusion. Fortunately, the German Luftwaffe appears and the Me 109 and Ju 87 enter combat.

On the ground the battle starts between British cruisers and infantry tanks against German artillery and antitank guns. Detachment ‘Kunz’ returns from its special mission at the right moment and attacks the right flank of the British. This gives the German gunners some time, but soon the few German tanks are gunned down. The British tanks pay a high tribute to the German gunners, but finally they are close enough to pay back. One gun after the other stops firing and the British tanks approach the position of the German artillery batteries. The German field gunners, almost without ammo, start to panic. Ramcke wonders how he could stop the British. The ATGs are overrun; there is almost no German infantry. The German divers inflict casualties, but the main tank forces push further. Ramcke calls for Rommel, but the tank regiment is too far away to help. Ramcke knows that there is nothing to retreat to. He does not even have fuel for the trucks. All he can do is surrender. He wonders when it is time to give up, when he will be no longer able to take the responsibility for the increasing casualties. Then he hears the sound of medium tanks on his right flank. From the sound of the engines he knows that they are not German. That is no surprise. There are no German tanks close to his position. This is the end.

Just when he wants to give the signal to surrender he notices that the British tanks retreat and regroup. Then he sees the tanks coming from the right, driving against the British like a battering ram. Ramcke sees the unit signs; these are tanks from Ariete, living up the division’s name.

The British tanks give up their formation and retreat. The Italians do not haunt them. The battle is over. Three hours later, Rommel and the rest of 15. PD arrives.

About 60 British tanks stay on the battlefield. However, 15. PD has suffered high casualties.

In the late afternoon Hoth arrives with a currier plane. The three generals make a review. 7. Armored Division is retreating eastwards, with about 70 tanks left; 4. Indian is beaten and retreating, too. 7. Australian is still blocking the costal road, but the first units are starting to retreat to Tobruk.

Ariete and 15.PD are combined now. They have in total about 30 German and 20 Italian tanks. Trieste is a bit behind with about 50% combat strength. Brescia is east of the 15.PD, with 50% strength, too. Bologna and Trento are still in their starting positions and have almost full strength.

Hoth has also news from the high command. Keitel is keeping his word. He sends new reinforcements: the first units of the IX. Air Corps arrived at Sicily and therefore the II. will be able to transfer an additionally squad to Libya. After the successful final of operation ‘Marita’ the Panzergruppe 1 is sending tanks and teams to refill the 5. Light. These tanks may not be brand new, but there are enough to give the division the strength of a full tank division.

There is also news from the high policy. Russia and Japan made a non-aggression pact. Shortly after this, Finland agreed to a pact of mutual assistance. Russia sends several divisions for garrison to Finland.

The three generals discuss the consequences of this, but soon they return to the closer problems. What to do now?

1) Make Ariete and 15. PD follow the 7. Armored Division and defeat it. As soon as there are no more British tank forces, the battle field will be ours!
2) It’s time to assault Tobruk. Let Trento and Bologna attack, order the 15. and Ariete to advance north and push through the ring of fortifications, before the British can reinforce the garrison. Trieste can secure the flank in case the 7. Armored will return.
3) Take the tank divisions and head for Solum and Bardia. Drive the British eastwards as far as possible!
4) Stop any advance. The troops are exhausted, the divisions run out of tanks. Wait for the reinforcements, and then it will be time to attack again!
http://www.wwiivehicles.com/italy/tanks-medium/m13-40/m13_40_03.jpg

[Rodion Romanovich]

A combination of 2 and 4. Make sure to resupply the units, strengthen the line to the east and advance moderately. The main goal of the eastern advance should be to establish a strong defensive line against the 7th armored, and complete the separation of the British Tobruk forces from the 7th Armored and the other British forces to the east, by reaching the coast east of 7th Australian division. They should only carry out limited pursuit missions after retreating enemy units. Once this has been completed, or earlier if it doesn't interfere with this main goal, the divisions around the Tobruk line should continue rolling up the line there by coordinated attacks from the west, east and south, pressuring on all the way to Tobruk and capturing and destroying as many opposing units as possible. How does the line look now by the way? If it is still possible (i.e. if it's still long enough), try to launch another wedge strike somewhere in the middle of the line, preferably between the Indians and Australians, and otherwise isolate enemy positions from each other as much as possible, then have the troops take their time to capture the forts one by one by assembling extreme local superiority in artillery and air support for one fort at the time, advancing slowly and methodically while keeping casualties down as much as possible.

[King Kurt]

Let's go for 1 - the aim of the game is defeat the English, not to take real estate. It is a gamble, but let's push on.

[DemonArchangel]

What Legio said. Option 4, followed by Option 2.

Kurt: You're usually a more cautious commander than this. You have to realize, we're out of the following:

*Tanks
*Anti-Tank Guns
*Fuel
*Water

....Thus, it is impossible to perform another armored advance.

We've also taken heavy casualties, especially in our mobile elements. Right now, we need to re-establish our supply. After we have more tanks and more troops, then we can advance to defeat the Brits.

Also Franc, show me the map.

[Franconicus]

Bir Hakeim is already yours!
VOILA, my demanding friend!
https://img61.imageshack.us/img61/2227/prsentation1ol8.jpg

[Stig]

I'm with KK, refill with the gas we have left and drive them from the desert. Once we've done that we can surround Tobruk again and take it.

[Kagemusha]

4. English have escaped and we are exhausted.With the current forces we have neither force to annihilate the retreating Brits or take Tobruk.

PS.Franc,Lol!...Finno Russian pact of mutual assistance. In reality fiirst hell would have frozen over before Finland would have let Soviet divisions in Finland.:laugh4:

[King Kurt]

Kurt: You're usually a more cautious commander than this.

True - but I believe our strategy is to destroy the enemy's army, not to rush for land. We are low on everything, but let us push on. Our reinforcements are nearer than there's and we have a chance to trap their 2 prime infantry divisons and possibly destroy their armour. Their armour must be weak now if the Italian armour drove them away. We have done the cautious thing by not rushing off eastwards, so let's try and finish the job.

[Stig]

Aye, if you retreat because you are attacked by Italian Tanks there really must be something wrong. Especially if you get attacked by the weakened Ariete division, that isn't even on full strenght

[Kagemusha]

Have you guys considered that might have only been an tactical error from the British commander of their armoured division? We luckily survived our last attack and now you want to drive deep after the enemy without tanks, supplies and with exhausted troops. The fact is that we dont have any force left that could be classified as panzer division anymore.

[Rodion Romanovich]

Or a fake retreat? I think us chasing their tanks would benefit them more than it would benefit us us. We've got 50 tanks of which only 20 are of higher quality, they have got 70 tanks, but if we are on the offensive they will build up positions with AT guns, mines and similar like we did in the previous battle, and they then get the advantage, plus the pocket at Tobruk is a bit too large for us at the moment and forces us to keep a rather large reserve around it.

I think we should instead restrict our eastern advance to trapping the Australians and Indians around Tobruk, and establishing a good defensive line against the 7th Armored to the east of Tobruk, rather than try to push for ground to the east. There should be some villages suitable to decent defense between Tobruk and Bardia, right? Those are what we should try to capture, and not waste undersupplied vehicles on capturing Bardia and Sollum. I believe an attempt to destroy 7th armored would be rather unsuccessful, whereas successfully trapping the allied infantry has higher chances of success. The Indian division could probably be damaged severely, and the Australians could be cut off and their pocket systematically reduced. These infantry divisions are of high quality and would be very useful to damage severely. By reducing the pocket we would pressure the British to commit their new reinforcements and reserves and attack again, to avoid losing the Indian and Australian divisions, alternatively they will try to evacuate Tobruk, which gives us a good opportunity to bomb parts of their fleet. We can't trade ground for men and vehicles.

[SwordsMaster]

Or a fake retreat? I think us chasing their tanks would benefit them more than it would benefit us us. We've got 50 tanks of which only 20 are of higher quality, they have got 70 tanks, but if we are on the offensive they will build up positions with AT guns, mines and similar like we did in the previous battle, and they then get the advantage, plus the pocket at Tobruk is a bit too large for us at the moment and forces us to keep a rather large reserve around it.

I think we should instead restrict our eastern advance to trapping the Australians and Indians around Tobruk, and establishing a good defensive line against the 7th Armored to the east of Tobruk, rather than try to push for ground to the east. There should be some villages suitable to decent defense between Tobruk and Bardia, right? Those are what we should try to capture, and not waste undersupplied vehicles on capturing Bardia and Sollum. I believe an attempt to destroy 7th armored would be rather unsuccessful, whereas successfully trapping the allied infantry has higher chances of success. The Indian division could probably be damaged severely, and the Australians could be cut off and their pocket systematically reduced. These infantry divisions are of high quality and would be very useful to damage severely. By reducing the pocket we would pressure the British to commit their new reinforcements and reserves and attack again, to avoid losing the Indian and Australian divisions, alternatively they will try to evacuate Tobruk, which gives us a good opportunity to bomb parts of their fleet. We can't trade ground for men and vehicles.

Agree. Focus the airforce on hitting the retreating british armour, and concentrate on surrounding Tobruk ASAP and then eliminating the divs trapped inside.

[Stig]

In the late afternoon Hoth arrives with a currier plane. The three generals make a review. 7. Armored Division is retreating eastwards, with about 70 tanks left; 4. Indian is beaten and retreating, too. 7. Australian is still blocking the costal road, but the first units are starting to retreat to Tobruk.

Ariete and 15.PD are combined now. They have in total about 30 German and 20 Italian tanks. Trieste is a bit behind with about 50% combat strength. Brescia is east of the 15.PD, with 50% strength, too. Bologna and Trento are still in their starting positions and have almost full strength.
The Brits have 70 tanks, we have 50, of which 30 superior German tanks.
Bologna and Trento are still at full strenght.


Where are those exhausted troops without tanks and supplies. We are at the advantage, and shouldn't give it away.

Maybe we should have a fifth option:
Let Rommel do as he wishes

[DemonArchangel]

One problem: We have no fuel as of right now. The tanks aren't going anywhere, even if you decided to pursue. Even if we did have fuel, I would advocate a moderate pursuit and an attack on the 4th Indian, so that we can then trap the British infantry forces inside Tobruk, while sending the 7th AD far away from our lines.

[AggonyDuck]

We need to keep on pushing, because halting our advance now would be giving up all the hard work of our attack.

Thus the question is: How and where to advance?

I do no think that we will be able to take Tobruk quite yet, instead what would be better is surrounding the three Allied divisions in Tobruk. With our increased airpower we can make the RN pay heavily for supplying the men.

I'm do not like the idea of attacking the 7th Armoured and capturing Sollum and Bardia either. It is a rather risky attack and there is a very real risk of being attacked in the flank by the Carpathian Rifle Brigade.

What I'd actually want to do personally, would be to attack the gap between the 4th Indian and the 7th Armoured Division. While the Ariete and 15. Panzer are driving north to the road, the Trieste follows them and secures their flanks and rears. During this dash, the airforce will do it's best to interdict and destroy the 7th Armoured Division armour. Once the coast has been reached, Trieste and Brescia should do a limited advance towards the El Adem airfield. This should go a long way in gaining air superiority around Tobruk.

But if that option isn't available, then I would select option number 1. It isn't exactly what I want, but it beats inactiveness and a dash for Tobruk. If we can manage to crush the 7th Armoured, then we have most likely won this battle. But it does come with considerable risks.