Rampage Out of Space

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Originally Posted by Garden Gnome

talk more about my upcoming demise?
And my obituary?
What do you plan on putting in that?
Please be kind.
I am inept but sweet.
The scumminess that you see dripping from me is an illusion.
A mirage.
My death might not bring you the happiness for which you dream.

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vote: Garden Gnome

I read Lewwyn's posts. I confirm we have a chat together. I also admit that I got quite paranoid about him after he stopped responding yesterday.
I have some work now, but I should be able to post a plenty in the second half of the day.

One person I haven't shared a read on yesterday is Laurentus. I think he had a very sketchy entrance not checking the flips first. Tbh, It felt almost twtbaw. I liked his later interactions, tho. I need to take a second look, but he joined the discussion with joy and wasn't afraid to voice his opinions. That's a good look. I'm still mildl paranoid about the derp, especially because he stopped catching up after being called out. That shift from reading the game to playing potentially helped him to avoid making proper reads there.

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Originally Posted by Vroendal

I've lost track of what's going on in the thread to be honest. Lau seems slightly derp-cleared assuming that as a wolf he would read the wolf chat before going into the thread. Dolby's EoD felt super townie to me. I'm scum-reading GG from yesterday, her voting Dolby is noteworthy. Both Dolby and Lau are scum-reading and voting El-A. I was still semi-town-reading him based on his initial entrance and brought him down after reading Dolby's thoughts. Honestly either GG or El-A would be fine with me at this point. Would prefer GG because I'm understanding a bit more as to why she's scummy, but going with my strong player town-leans on a wagon is probably the wisest option for me at this point because I have no idea what happened this phase. I'm choosing not to vote Winston because y'all know what my stance on him is already and it doesn't look like he's any kind of option right now.

Vote - El-A

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tbh, this feels like a wolf potentially saving another wolf. Would prefer GG and casting a vote on El is a striking contradiction.

One more point. Lewwyn's basically confirmed town for blocking me and outing himself instead of killing me at night or trying to manipulate my 1-shot power.

Unfortunately for him I used it n1 to peek Winston and tonight I got result that he's Umenses.

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Originally Posted by Garden Gnome

talk more about my upcoming demise?
And my obituary?
What do you plan on putting in that?
Please be kind.
I am inept but sweet.
The scumminess that you see dripping from me is an illusion.
A mirage.
My death might not bring you the happiness for which you dream.

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Lol, if you want this obituary to be nice, or better yet, stave it off, bring us a wolf, then, please and thank. Softing is going to do nothing for you at this point.

Let's round this up and kill Vroe and GG

Vote: Vroendal or Garden Gnome

Also, Csargo's my current lead for the 3p as he's having too much fun this game.

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Originally Posted by Laurentus

Lol, if you want this obituary to be nice, or better yet, stave it off, bring us a wolf, then, please and thank. Softing is going to do nothing for you at this point.

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Maybe she's brutal and this is a threat

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Originally Posted by pzelda

tbh, this feels like a wolf potentially saving another wolf. Would prefer GG and casting a vote on El is a striking contradiction.

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Meh, I deferred to Dolby's judgement myself yesterday, so I am surprised you aren't doing a similar callout to me, especially after how gung-ho I was about killing HK. But a solid point nonetheless.

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Originally Posted by pzelda

Maybe she's brutal and this is a threat

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If I go down after a good wolf hunt, it will be a death I can be proud of. Make me the Mozart of this game, ye beasties.

Ok, there are more questions than takes in Gnome's iso. First, her interactions with El are minimal. Meta-wise, I think town Garden Gnome would interact with El to get a free townread from him, but let's not reall use this meh reason as an evidence. Second, she townread HK in a scummy way. I don't mind her making a blank stance, but later on she questioned others Why HK over Dolby? and defended HK in a tmi-ish fashion. Third, Her progression on Dolby from asking about Nanook's scumminess to saying that the two ain't w/w to voting and pushing Dolby as a candidate felt weak at best and not based on her conviction.

Vroe trying to save Gnome with their votes makes the two an almost too obvious scum team.

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Originally Posted by pzelda

Ok, there are more questions than takes in Gnome's iso. First, her interactions with El are minimal. Meta-wise, I think town Garden Gnome would interact with El to get a free townread from him, but let's not reall use this meh reason as an evidence. Second, she townread HK in a scummy way. I don't mind her making a blank stance, but later on she questioned others Why HK over Dolby? and defended HK in a tmi-ish fashion. Third, Her progression on Dolby from asking about Nanook's scumminess to saying that the two ain't w/w to voting and pushing Dolby as a candidate felt weak at best and not based on her conviction.

Vroe trying to save Gnome with their votes makes the two an almost too obvious scum team.

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I continue to be surprised that you are not seeing team equity between me and Vro, either, because I switched to El to save Vro, initially.

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Originally Posted by Laurentus

Meh, I deferred to Dolby's judgement myself yesterday, so I am surprised you aren't doing a similar callout to me, especially after how gung-ho I was about killing HK. But a solid point nonetheless.

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I think your case was different. And I said that I was unhappy when you moved from forming reads and started playing real time. But your posts after that movement looked like you were really trying to figure out alignments of people you interacted with.

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Originally Posted by Laurentus

I continue to be surprised that you are not seeing team equity between me and Vro, either, because I switched to El to save Vro, initially.

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Ok, if you insist I'll go after you, if Gnome flips town.

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Originally Posted by pzelda

Ok, if you insist I'll go after you, if Gnome flips town.

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Would be nice if your reads are consistent. Both to avoid tunnels and to make your pushes less sus.

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Originally Posted by Timsup2nothin

Vro coming in swinging at whoever is handy is a stark contrast to the way El came in, as late arrivals go. Not gonna go spontaneous combustion about it, but noted.

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Tbh, the only thing I dislike about voting Vroe.

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Originally Posted by pzelda

Tbh, the only thing I dislike about voting Vroe.

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Yeah, my thing is I don't think Tim was anticipating he would go down so soon, and Vro is amazing lynchbait for people who don't know him, so this all taken together makes me very confident that Vro is just Town here. Tim's gunning for him felt like it was honestly trying to set up a lynch, and Tim also doesn't bus lightly, so yeah.

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Originally Posted by Laurentus

Would be nice if your reads are consistent. Both to avoid tunnels and to make your pushes less sus.

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I'm far too consistent this game for my liking this game. I almost feel like I might be stuck with wrong reads. But you can take a look at my tiers from yesterday. Gnome and Vroe were at the bottom. I admit I need to reread the second half of d2 to clean up my townreads (more or less everyone else at this point).

I also should check your reasons for saving Vroe.

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Originally Posted by Laurentus

Yeah, my thing is I don't think Tim was anticipating he would go down so soon, and Vro is amazing lynchbait for people who don't know him, so this all taken together makes me very confident that Vro is just Town here. Tim's gunning for him felt like it was honestly trying to set up a lynch, and Tim also doesn't bus lightly, so yeah.

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I don't think Vroe was an endangered specie at that point, but you're right about Tim not being a frequent busser. The comment's also kinda mild, so I keep wondering whether he aimed to put Vroe on a chopping board or just wanted to get some early distancing in. The majority of players barely realized that Vroe had posted at that point.

Oh, by the way, you're all probably aware of this, but that method to ISO where you go to the Gameroom and click on the post count, then the name of the person you wanna ISO, is not very reliable. I realised this when I did that brief ISO of GG at the end of the last phase. There were a few posts not represented there which I only ended up seeing after I read through the whole game.

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Originally Posted by Laurentus

Oh, by the way, you're all probably aware of this, but that method to ISO where you go to the Gameroom and click on the post count, then the name of the person you wanna ISO, is not very reliable. I realised this when I did that brief ISO of GG at the end of the last phase. There were a few posts not represented there which I only ended up seeing after I read through the whole game.

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Have you managed to bump into anything towny from her?

Oh, Vro, when you get back, I wanna hear what your take of me is before you do anything else.

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Originally Posted by pzelda

Have you managed to bump into anything towny from her?

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Not in the slightest.

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Originally Posted by Laurentus

Vote: El-ahrairah

Absent any context for the "shit between Nanook and him", and not having enough time to read the whole thread now, and also given how much pushback an HK lynch seems to be getting, presumably from a great deal of townies who have read the thread in far more detail than I did, and also given how fickle his vote jumps seem to be and my desire not to have Vro die as one of the few people who I can read fairly well here, and indeed, am presently town-reading for his tendency to WIFOM himself into oblivion and have a very sincere tone as town which I have never seen him replicate as Wolf, I guess this is my vote for today.

I wish to note that I get the reference from your name, though, my parents scarred me by showing me Watership Down when I was a child, and this may or may not have anything to do with my desire to symbolically get back at that movie, since it scarred me for life, lol.

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haha this vote. Yeah, It's terrible.

To be fair, Vroe has few terrible posts (his d1 list, d2 vote and probably more I forgot about), but he also has some very sincere posts, which look like he's interested in what's going on. Now, It's up to me to decipher, whether he's genuinely interested in the game as town or scum. I think rereading his posts again won't help me, but him making a list today might.

Unvote: Vroendal
Vote: Garden Gnome

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Originally Posted by Vroendal

The part I don't get at all is why you're being town-read, I feel like I've just been ignored because "vibes" say you're good to everyone, which can be understandable if they've had a long history playing with you, but from my readthrough of D1 and now I've yet to see a single decent argument as to why you're town.

You're probably not getting chopped today, it's probably me, but if I die they might move on to you and I'm fine with that.

If it's not you, I would immediately go after Ibn, then Nanook.

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Actually, I like this post from Vroendal.

I'm just popping in to let y'all know I will be indisposed for some hours as usual, meaning I will be unable to defend myself. I fully plan to participate, defend, and attack at a much higher level than before given that I've actually caught up through the entire thread.

I can quickly offer that in terms of my vote yesterday, though I was more heavily scum-reading GG, I recognized that (due to my own fault entirely) I hadn't read through the thread as I should have and I was looking at a wagon with my top town-read, a slightly derp-cleared player I respect, and another player I town-read vs a wagon with my top scum-read, a null read, and a slight town read. The wisest choice was obvious.

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Originally Posted by Dolby

GG is someone that I'm pushing, but give me a tl;dr of why that slot deserves to die right now

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Actually, I'm getting around to GG+Dolby (with Vroe, Panda and Nanook still having some w potential). Csargo's still my top pick for the sk for bad reasons.

I should specify that my earlier take on Winston/GG being mason was based on having a private chat with Lewwyn and a condition, which would have made my ability stronger if I targeted the same player as someone else.

I kind of regret targeting winston, who ended up being an obvious villa yesterday. I think that targeting Dolby would be way more helpful here.

Yeah, I think Gnome>Dolby>Csargo>Nanook>Panda should win us the game. Now, I really should close the tab and do something else.

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Originally Posted by hollowkatt

vote: Garden Gnome

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oh my god, you suck!!!!!
<vote: Hollowkatt>

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Originally Posted by Garden Gnome

oh my god, you suck!!!!!
<vote: Hollowkatt>

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How did my vote disappear?

vote: Hollowkatt
It's hard to OMGUS vote without the vote.

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Originally Posted by Vroendal

I'm just popping in to let y'all know I will be indisposed for some hours as usual, meaning I will be unable to defend myself. I fully plan to participate, defend, and attack at a much higher level than before given that I've actually caught up through the entire thread.

I can quickly offer that in terms of my vote yesterday, though I was more heavily scum-reading GG, I recognized that (due to my own fault entirely) I hadn't read through the thread as I should have and I was looking at a wagon with my top town-read, a slightly derp-cleared player I respect, and another player I town-read vs a wagon with my top scum-read, a null read, and a slight town read. The wisest choice was obvious.

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Nah, I will no longer accept this fence-sitting from you. Am I Town or not? You have all the info, both from my meta and from this game, to make that deliberation.

I think GG has gone full anti-spew, btw.

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Originally Posted by pzelda

Yeah, I think Gnome>Dolby>Csargo>Nanook>Panda should win us the game. Now, I really should close the tab and do something else.

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I would add Vro there instead of Csargo but if you are convinced that he is town then so be it..

Vote: Garden Gnome

Ok yeah I fucked up

Vote: Garden Gnome

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Originally Posted by Dolby

Ok yeah I fucked up

Vote: Garden Gnome

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Lol, is this an admission of guilt?

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Originally Posted by pzelda

Unfortunately for him I used it n1 to peek Winston and tonight I got result that he's Umenses.

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So what you're saying is that you're the Infiltrator?

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Originally Posted by Laurentus

Lol, is this an admission of guilt?

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No

Pzelda checking Winston seems to hold up based on his D2 comments (he wasn’t really present D1)

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Originally Posted by Dolby

No

Pzelda checking Winston seems to hold up based on his D2 comments (he wasn’t really present D1)

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I can believe pzelda used some kind of investigative power on me. I just don't believe that town had that investigative power.

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Originally Posted by Winston Hughes

I can believe pzelda used some kind of investigative power on me. I just don't believe that town had that investigative power.

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I think that a 1-shot delayed cop is reasonable

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Originally Posted by Dolby

I think that a 1-shot delayed cop is reasonable

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It's the implications for the SK that makes me think otherwise.

Also, what is with this neighbour bit?

Have I missed something, or is not at all clear exactly how and why pzelda and lew were connected?

Starting with a shared chat without being masons isn't unheard of, but it seems a little odd for it to happen for players with other powers (inc. a full cop shot) when there are so many vanillas in the game.

I'm surely off on a flight of fancy here, but...

I feel like it could actually be that both Lewwyn and pzelda are scum and Gnome is the sk.

Amusingly, the best move would still be to chop Gnome.

The rainbow vortex probs not a woof power?

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Originally Posted by Winston Hughes

I'm surely off on a flight of fancy here, but...

I feel like it could actually be that both Lewwyn and pzelda are scum and Gnome is the sk.

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Does Gnome kill Tim if SK?

It's real zany

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Originally Posted by Winston Hughes

I'm surely off on a flight of fancy here, but...

I feel like it could actually be that both Lewwyn and pzelda are scum and Gnome is the sk.

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I don't think that pzelda and Lewwyn are in that much danger of being killed by SK N2 yeah. Lewwyn more than Pzelda.

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Originally Posted by pzelda

I don't think Vroe was an endangered specie at that point, but you're right about Tim not being a frequent busser. The comment's also kinda mild, so I keep wondering whether he aimed to put Vroe on a chopping board or just wanted to get some early distancing in. The majority of players barely realized that Vroe had posted at that point.

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Tim doesn't bus, not D1 anyways. His D1 strategy is let each wolf do their own thing and sink or swim on their own merits. Later in the game he'll vote/push for credit if he needs to, but I've never seen him D1 push a partner hard or in any way that's meaningful.

pzelda, did Lewwyn know you had a power?

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Originally Posted by Vroendal

I'm just popping in to let y'all know I will be indisposed for some hours as usual, meaning I will be unable to defend myself. I fully plan to participate, defend, and attack at a much higher level than before given that I've actually caught up through the entire thread.

I can quickly offer that in terms of my vote yesterday, though I was more heavily scum-reading GG, I recognized that (due to my own fault entirely) I hadn't read through the thread as I should have and I was looking at a wagon with my top town-read, a slightly derp-cleared player I respect, and another player I town-read vs a wagon with my top scum-read, a null read, and a slight town read. The wisest choice was obvious.

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If you could give a run down of the living today that'd be awesome

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Originally Posted by Garden Gnome

oh my god, you suck!!!!!
<vote: Hollowkatt>

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Originally Posted by Garden Gnome

How did my vote disappear?

vote: Hollowkatt
It's hard to OMGUS vote without the vote.

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I just assumed the first post came with a vote :D

serious time though: Who's wolfy and why?

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Originally Posted by Winston Hughes

I'm surely off on a flight of fancy here, but...

I feel like it could actually be that both Lewwyn and pzelda are scum and Gnome is the sk.

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That's not unpossible

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Originally Posted by Csargo

The rainbow vortex probs not a woof power?

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In terms of flavour, I'd say it makes slightly more sense as a scum power than a town one (them being the weird bionic monstrosities here).

In terms of mechanics, my thought was that the scum can't kill the sk directly - they have to get it chopped - and that the vortex could be used to prevent the sk from killing one of them (as well as shutting down any town powers in the process).

But it is true that that kind of power would more usually be a townie thing.

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Originally Posted by Laurentus

Does Gnome kill Tim if SK?

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If I were the SK, I would kill anyone I want without concern for my victim's alignment.
So much fun.
but I'm just town here.

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Originally Posted by Laurentus

Does Gnome kill Tim if SK?

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No idea.

I've done no research around this at all, and am quite probably talking bollocks.

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Originally Posted by hollowkatt

I just assumed the first post came with a vote :D

serious time though: Who's wolfy and why?

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I'm starting to think Lewyyn. Seems to have a TMI factor.

vote: Lewwyn

vote: no lim

:hide:

Lewwyn and Zelda, what are the highlights and lowlights of neighbor chat, insofar as you're allowed to talk about it, if at all?

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Originally Posted by Dolby

Lewwyn and Zelda, what are the highlights and lowlights of neighbor chat, insofar as you're allowed to talk about it, if at all?

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also, was neighbor chat open at nights and did you guys use it?

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Originally Posted by Garden Gnome

I'm starting to think Lewyyn. Seems to have a TMI factor.

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I have a hint of this too, but it relates to you being the sk...

~;p

Just to wrap another length of tinfoil around my already bulging head, what if lew/zelda/tim had actually checked gnome as sk on n1...

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Originally Posted by Winston Hughes

Just to wrap another length of tinfoil around my already bulging head, what if lew/zelda/tim had actually checked gnome as sk on n1...

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https://media.giphy.com/media/J2DJxZ...OHWJ/giphy.gif

I'm thinking real hard, and have no idea how you're coming to these conclusions WH.

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Originally Posted by Garden Gnome

I'm starting to think Lewyyn. Seems to have a TMI factor.

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What gives you TMI vibes?

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Originally Posted by Csargo

I'm thinking real hard, and have no idea how you're coming to these conclusions WH.

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I hate being cleared. It does strange things to my mind.

Why isn't pzelda sitting on GG yesterday?

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Originally Posted by Csargo

Why isn't pzelda sitting on GG yesterday?

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You mean if I'm somehow right about all of this?

I guess because after Gnome flipped sk, it would put both of them in the tmi firing line. I had a feeling Gnome was getting chopped yesterday, and was a little surprised when the wagon didn't pick up steam. If they were reading the game the same way I was, it would make sense that the scum didn't push any harder in that direction.

As for why they'd then go ahead and do it today, I'd guess because they figure that otherwise Gnome is whacking Lew tonight, and so they really need him to go down here.

To be clear, though, while I think this theory is disturbingly plausible, I'm nowhere near convincing even myself that it's really the most likely scenario.

Which is why I'm still keen to hear what others think about it.

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Originally Posted by pzelda

Good morning fellow space citizens!

Page 1 - It looks like there's a wolf in csargo/rask. Dolby feels good. Borg guts town for fake derping.
Page 2 - I guess both wolves and towns posted on the page, but nothing decisive.
Page 3 - Lewwyn's choice of posts to respond to is noteworthy, but too light to be alignment indicative. Csargo being more active than usual is mildly unsettling.

Overall, not much to talk about yet. HK and Csargo could be waffles together, if Rask town, but that's a nasty association I got here. HK's approach to this game feels slightly diferent than the last time, but my alignment was different back then and It was easy to see towniness in his posts.
Rask feels really hyped for this game despite claiming light disappointment about his role. I haven't decided if it's a good look yet.
C4 posted enough for me to notice them, but that's all I can say about their posts with certainty.
Tim not flooding the gates with posts probably should be a villa lean, but it would be a meh meta lean.

Villa leans: Dolby, Borg
Scum potential: Rask, Csargo, HK

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Confidence says scumzelda tucks scumLewwyn and Tim in the indeterminate zone to avoid the dangers of both association and chop momentum.

Paranoia says zelda is too careful to place both scumbuddies in the same start-of-the-last-line position when formatting those paragraphs.

As it stands, I wouldn't chop either pzelda or Lewwyn today.

If Gnome is chopped and flips town, the theory would look less plausible.

If Gnome is chopped and flips SK, the theory would look more plausible.

If Gnome is chopped and flips scum, Lewwyn is definitely not scum and zelda probably isn't.

We need an alternative to Gnome, though.

Due diligence and all.

Lewwyn's posting style is so townie.

If he's scum, it's been a work of art.

The fact I'm still entertaining the idea of him being scum is a mark of the highest respect.

Ibn-Khaldun's iso looks better than I expected.

There's very little to work with, but what there is seems natural and lacking in any perceptible agenda other than finding scum.

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Originally Posted by Winston Hughes

Confidence says scumzelda tucks scumLewwyn and Tim in the indeterminate zone to avoid the dangers of both association and chop momentum.

Paranoia says zelda is too careful to place both scumbuddies in the same start-of-the-last-line position when formatting those paragraphs.

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The last time I was a wolf my only reads list contained all town and all my buddies were in the "everyone else can be POE" pile. It cost town the game b/c they assumed I ruled of 3 them.

Panda could be anything, but less likely scum than town or sk.

On iso, the impression is of someone feeling their way into the game.

With Tim as scumbuddy, I feel like panda would have been a bit more confident.

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Originally Posted by hollowkatt

The last time I was a wolf my only reads list contained all town and all my buddies were in the "everyone else can be POE" pile. It cost town the game b/c they assumed I ruled of 3 them.

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What is the rule of three, btw?

I heard of it before and assumed it was some kind of pseudo-scientific bollocks like wagonomics, but never bothered to learn what it actually means.

nanook's doing a new type of twtbw i've not seen before

posting nothing of significance whilst giving clear signals of total self-awareness

i can't call this necessarily townie, but i have to respect the purity inherent in the effort