If newspapers all over the world print these drawings, the whole boycott problem is solved. :juggle2:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sigurd Fafnesbane
That`s hilarious. :laugh4: Sort of...
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If newspapers all over the world print these drawings, the whole boycott problem is solved. :juggle2:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sigurd Fafnesbane
That`s hilarious. :laugh4: Sort of...
It loses some of its hilarity when there's an article right below telling Muslims to kill those who insult Mohammed.
Here's some cartoons from the Arab world; the vast majority of which are much cruder and more insulting than anything the Danes printed: http://www.tomgrossmedia.com/ArabCartoons.htm
Crazed Rabbit
It`s certainly not the first time that has happened. I do not take such threats much serious any longer.Quote:
Originally Posted by Crazed Rabbit
As if Mandelson didn't know beforehand that they would be re-published. There is nothing he can do about it, despite Fragony's suggestions that EU Commissioners have Darth Vader like powers to vaporise obstinate editors.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sjakihata
But what he has done is distance himself and the European Union from the policy of some papers (i.e. from the caricatures in question, not from the right to publish those caricatures). People who question Mandelson's attitude apparently have trouble understanding the concept of free speech. Free speech applies to governemts as well, and it includes their right to distance themselves from expressions they find inappropriate or unhelpful.
Oh you naughty. It is the destructive idea that whatever happens, it must be our fault. I have to compliment the idea that we are just so good that perfection is just out of reach and that we soon will all be making love war, and that we just have channel all that negative energy.Quote:
Originally Posted by AdrianII
Channelling negative energy - now there is a good description of 'diplomacy' if ever I saw one.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fragony
So I was right. He is appointed not elected. How is that democratic? You may be happy being represented by appointee, I am not.Quote:
Originally Posted by AdrianII
Mainly it is the ".tv" ending for Url website thingies, such as gm.tv and www.bbc.tv. This doubled its GDP. All boycotting muslims will stop pressing ".", "t" and "v" on their keyboards...Quote:
Originally Posted by AdrianII
Speaking of ridiculous behaviour, is anyone else surprised that nearly all protests come from governments and various religious organizations, not from the Arab street?Quote:
Originally Posted by Duke Malcolm
A couple of hundred Pakistani students protested and shouted ‘Death to Denmark!’ Big deal. There has been a street rally by women in Yemen, most of whom can’t read or write. It seems officials and warlords are only jumping on the bandwagon four months after the publication of the cartoons because some prominent Saudi cleric preached about them recently.
And what on earth is the story on these Danish Muslim clerics who toured the Arab world with a portfolio of ‘scandalous Danish depictions of the Phophet’, some of which were never published in Denmark or anywhere else?
I picked up the following from a Telegraph correspondent, but I do not read Danish so if at all possible, I would like confirmation from our Danish members.
The Danish tabloid Extra Bladet got hold of a 43-page report that Danish Muslim leaders and imams, on a tour of the Islamic world are handing out to their contacts to "explain" how offensive the cartoons are. The report contains 15 pictures instead of 12.The Muslim Horror Picture Show, eh? Now there is an outfit I would love to sue the skirts off if I were a Dane.
"The first of the three additional pictures, which are of dismal quality, shows Muhammad as a pedophile deamon, the second shows the prophet with a pigsnout and the third depicts a praying Muslim being raped by a dog. Apparently, the 12 original pictures were not deemed bad enough to convince other Muslims that Muslims in Denmark are the victims of a campaign of religious hatred. Akhmad Akkari, spokesman of the 21 Danish Muslim organisations which organised the tour, explained that the three drawings had been added to "give an insight in how hateful the atmosphere in Denmark is towards Muslims."
"Akkari claimed he does not know the origin of the three pictures. He said they had been sent anonymously to Danish Muslims. However, when Ekstra Bladet asked if it could talk to these Muslims, Akkari refused to reveal their identity."It is a side-issue, but here goes. Your Prime Minister is appointed by Her Majesty, isn’t he? Yet he represents you. Alright, alright, the PM is elected first. But all your government ministers are appointed, not elected, yet they represent you legally and diplomatically…Quote:
Originally Posted by InsaneApache
In the case of the European Commission, additional checks have been introduced to make sure that any given Commissioner represents the Union as a whole, not merely his country of origin or its government. Not bad at all as a system, really.
...hmmmmm... doesn't anyone know how to laugh anymore?
Adrian, the difference between the cabinet of a nation being appointed and the EU leadership being appointed is when you vote for a head of state, you have the ability to change the cabinet. Is there any vehicle of redress for Insane Apache to get rid of the head of the EU (ignorant American says who?)? Nope. Just like none of us can do a damn thing about Kofi Annan, the EU governement is non-representational and therefore, cannot be considered a democratic institution. I fail to see how you guys have gotten the ratification you have been able to muster without some say by the average Joe (or Jose) as to who is running their lives. Government by bureacracy is not Democratic (at least not in my book). People may moan about the US president & the electoral college, but at least there, voting does count. The current EU system is like the original system here in the US... each state assembly (which was mass elected) would pick 2 senators. Then the senate would pick the president. No ordinary citizen had diddly squat to say about the president.
The EU has no head and it is not yet a full union.Quote:
Originally Posted by Don Corleone
The (elected) European Parliament sent home the previous Commission. But then, the Commission President is a different animal altogether from the American President. He is appointed by our elected heads of government and approved by the European Parliament, and he carries out the broad policy outlines established by those heads of state, not his own preferred policies.
So Mendelson is working on a diplomatic approach in consultation with the European Governments, that is his job.
Are we getting a bit desperate Adrian? The party leader is elected by the party members. The Queen invites the leader of the party with the most MP's to form a government. She doesn't appoint him.Quote:
It is a side-issue, but here goes. Your Prime Minister is appointed by Her Majesty, isn’t he? Yet he represents you. Alright, alright, the PM is elected first. But all your government ministers are appointed, not elected, yet they represent you legally and diplomatically…
Oh so true.Quote:
Originally Posted by Don Corleone
Just to show that freedom of speech is double edged.
BNP
Who was it who said "I disagree with what they have to say but I shall fight to the death to allow them to say it"Quote:
A jury at Leeds Crown Court has cleared BNP leader Nick Griffin of two racial hatred charges and BNP activist Mark Collett of four others.
'bout sums it up.
Agreed. Makes a marked contrast to this:Quote:
Originally Posted by InsaneApache
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servl...International/
My God. Truly disgusting.Quote:
Gaza City, Gaza Strip — Armed militants angered by cartoon drawings of the Prophet Mohammed published in European media surrounded EU offices in Gaza on Thursday and threatened to kidnap foreigners as rage over the caricatures spread across the Islamic world.
Foreign journalists, diplomats and aid workers began leaving Gaza as gunmen there threatened to kidnap citizens of France, Norway, Denmark and Germany unless those governments apologized for the drawings.
That would be the great ideologue of the 'Trinity of Evil', Voltaire.Quote:
Originally Posted by InsaneApache
I'm almost tempted to think that France still functions like some kind of 'canary in a coal mine' for freedom of expression. France never fails to enrage those with a problem with the free flowing of ideas. No matter of what background, whenever or where ever militant intolerance rears it's ugly head, it's proponents feel an uncontrolable urge to invade, ridicule or torch France.
Fantastic.
http://www.my-smileys.de/smileys2/ass1.gif
Does that mean they'll be burning white flags soon?
(~;p)
uncalled for.
I'll give you that France has given the world a lot in terms of moving towards truly free speech. But as long as you have regimented secularism, and religious symbols of any type are outlawed, I don't think you can lay claim to being the bastion of free speech you once were.Quote:
Originally Posted by Louis VI the Fat
As for the intolerant masses wanting to invade, ridicule and torch France, that's just because... well, you're France. :oops: Just kidding, mon ami.
I feel that although the pictures were in poor taste, I feel that for those that don't like seeing things like that DON'T LOOK AT THEM! Follow this "turn the other cheek" part of whatever religion you preach!
religion can make me not get to go to the shops, take my shoes off, restrict what I do and where I do it, and all of this I am supposed to accept without a word of protest. And if I argue a theological point again this isn't socially acceptable, but I have to put up with whatever religious conventions are thrown in my direction.
A few years ago a Roman Catholic friend of the family was amazed that my brother bought a film on DVD - just couldn't understand it. I was told that it was rude to tell her that my brother "believed it was the right thing to do" as that was going to be an impolite comment.
I am sure that it is not true of all followers of Islam, but significant sections are acting rather like Christinanity did about 500 years ago... then the weapons were not as powerful though. :sweatdrop:
~:smoking:
https://img463.imageshack.us/img463/...burning1rr.jpg
American flag: € 25.
Gasoline: € 2.
Cigarette lighter: € 0.75.
Burning demonstrator: Priceless!
Uhm, that's stretching things a bit.Quote:
Originally Posted by Don Corleone
French law on secularity and conspicuous religious symbols inschools
Well if you look at how they have developed their infrastructure and economies they are in the dark ages. Without the oil they would be be in a very poor condition economically.
I believe that religion (ie Islam) is holding back the renaissance that the Arab world (and others) needs, to throw off the shackles of unenlightenment and oppression.
It is no coincidence that the industrial revolution was started in England. We had in place the free thinking and educational establishments that was needed to achieve this.
I stand corrected, Louis. Apparently, the ban on conspicuous religious symbols is just at schools receiving state funding. But that still doesn't invalidate my point. Children are required to attend school until age 16, and unless their parents can afford the tuition at an unsubsidized school, they may not wear any conspicuous religious symbols (such as a head scarf, a yamaka or a crucifix) for the duration of that time. That is a bit repressive.
On a side note, do you guys allow Sikhs to carry daggers to school? Does that fall under religious or cultural symbol?
That is what I am starting to think. I'm also starting to think up comparisons between burning people at the steak and burning cities with nukes (Iran).Quote:
Originally Posted by rory_20_uk
Well, enlightenment is only a minor factor for the industrial revolution. Much more important factors like geography, location, import/export, coal, infrastructure, political climate etc was the main reasons.Quote:
Originally Posted by InsaneApache
But it's all wrong, the revolution should have started in Russia, some aliens must have intervened. Oh wait, that's not the industrial revolution, but the permanent one.
And why do Sikhs carry daggers, have long hair and wear a bracelet? I think that this goes right back to times when Sikhs were actively warring with Muslims - have a weapon on hand to kill the enemy, and be different so you know who he is.
The BBC website mentions at least one reason why Islam gets so hot under the collar about symbols of Allah. And from the extremely tame language in the Koran (chapter 42, verse 11 of the Koran does say: "[Allah is] the originator of the heavens and the earth... [there is] nothing like a likeness of Him.") someone at some point blew things out of all proportion!
It's a new century people! Adapt!!! Apparently from the Koran it's easy to come with a society where women and men are equal and killing people over cartoons is even frowned on. Re-read the text and come up with something new as opposed to following Shi'ia Law, that after all is only interpretations by men and not god.
Maybe it's just me but some religions carry far too much dogma around with them, and find debate to be completely inimnical to themselves. I think that if something can't hold up to discussion it has to be deeply flawed.
~:smoking:
Seeing your lack of knowledge of your own country's political system, I understand you must be totally confused by that of the EU.Quote:
Originally Posted by InsaneApache
The British Prime Minister is appointed by the Queen, all other ministers are equally appointed by the Queen on the recommendation of the Prime Minister.
From the Official Website of the British Monarchy:
Until the end of the 17th century, British monarchs were executive monarchs - that is, they had the right to make and pass legislation. Since the beginning of the eighteenth century, the monarch has become a constitutional monarch, which means that he or she is bound by rules and conventions and remains politically impartial.
On almost all matters he or she acts on the advice of ministers. While acting constitutionally, the Sovereign retains an important political role as Head of State, formally appointing prime ministers, approving certain legislation and bestowing honours.
The Queen also has important roles to play in other organisations, including the Armed Forces and the Church of England.
Have to agree.Quote:
Originally Posted by Don Corleone
France revels in being hated and threatened by everyone, just like Britain.Quote:
As for the intolerant masses wanting to invade, ridicule and torch France, that's just because... well, you're France. Just kidding, mon ami.
We just have a handy sea in the way and historically a formidable navy.
Somebody gets it at last!:2thumbsup:Quote:
Originally Posted by BDC
EU's Trade Commissioner is a public servant of the EU?
How many public servants get elected?
How many ambassadors?
But they have to be elected first. Unlike the EU commissioners.Quote:
Originally Posted by AdrianII
HAHAHA very good semantics Adrian.
The point is, that is the elected leaders of EU, the Council that appoints the leader of the commssion - and they are elected. It is very representative, and I wouldnt call it democratic, it can be argued both for and against. Personally Im against the current system as well.
The problem is that no one in the commission holds any responsibility towards anyone, hence the often screw ups and closed accounting.
Cartoon prompts kidnap
Not nice.Quote:
THE rising tide of anger in the Palestinian territories over the publication of cartoons of prophet Mohammed took a sinister turn overnight with growing threats against European targets.
Gunmen in the West Bank briefly detained a German national amid the Muslim furore over the cartoons, some of which depicted the prophet as a terrorist, a militant group said.
Two masked gunmen seized the German from a hotel in the Palestinian town of Nablus "thinking he was French or Danish, and handed him over to police after realising their mistake," said a source from the Al-Aqsa Martyrs Brigades.
"The two men were acting to protest over the cartoons," he said.
So we have to give up free speech in our countries or be subject to terrorist attacks?Quote:
Palestinian gunmen besieged the EU headquarters in the Gaza Strip and scrawled "Closed Until Apology is Made to the Muslims" on the gate to the building, which had not opened for business for fear of violence.
"European provocations have placed the offices and European churches in our line of fire," the gunmen said.
"We give the Danish, French and Norwegian governments 48 hours to present their apologies."
The governments at the centre of the confrontation between the Muslim world and Europe have said the decision to publish the cartoons was the newspapers' responsibility.
But Palestinian Prime Minister Ahmed Qorei said the European governments should formally condemn the cartoons.
"What has been published was an attack on Islam and it has affected the feelings of all Muslims," he said
pfft no camel jockey will take my amendments. They seem to forget who there dealing with. People have a boiling point and you can only push them so far.
nm.
America is getting the hang of that notion too. It's just much more fun being hated by the oppressed peoples (or should I say governments) of the world.Quote:
Originally Posted by BDC
Well at least I can now see the irony.
To protest a cartoon that depects a religious leader as a terrorist. Some of the so called followers of the religious leader are going to show the rest of the world the falseness of these cartoons by the followers engaging in terrorist acts.
I wonder if they ever watched the Life of Brian and thought it was a documentary?
I don't feel comfortable. The pic showing Muhammed as a terrorist is plain silly and pointless. Obviously, the autors knew the Muslim population wouldn't like it and would protest.Quote:
Originally Posted by LeftEyeNine
Now, as silly as it was, I just don't care about the prohibition of Muhammed's pics. Some Muslims want apologies ? Fine, but I hope no one will apologise for practising freedom of speech, even in a stupid way.
Indeed. But the Queen has not been elected, has she? Nor have the government ministers. Or the diplomats in the Foreign and Commonwealth Office. Or the members of the Higher Education Inspection. Yet they all represent you in various ways. The same principle applies to the EU Commission. They are appointed by those who have been elected to do so in your name and mine, so they represent you and me on various levels.Quote:
Originally Posted by InsaneApache
And like you, I often wish they had different ideas and policies, though it has to be said that Mandelson is doing a reasonably good job. Of course it involves more diplomacy and less of the merciless one-on-one of Prime Minister's Question Time.
I wonder what you would have preferred him to say instead of what he actually said. "Pfwoar, laughed me arse off at those cartoons! What are the towelheads getting worked up over? Get a loife?"
Something along those lines? :mellow:
:laugh4:Quote:
Originally Posted by AdrianII
Why not? Don´t muslims honour honesty?:surrender:
Again - wearing headdresses. Very important in areas where sandstorms are present - even westeners put themon then, not required anywhere else in the world. So why are they still worn elsewhere? Most countries have national costumes which were what was worn many years ago and basically make you look like a prat. It seems in the Middle East it is the de rigeur to wear these all the time, even when there's not a spek of sand on the highly manicured street.
It really is a mindset that has a lot in common with North Koreans - completely fixated and completely immune to all reason.
~:smoking:
More goodies, sorry for the tactless link:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/religion_...kxBHNlYwN0bQ--
My favorite quote:
"I think this is not only about a bilateral issue between Indonesia and Denmark, this is a much more serious issue ... It involves the whole Islamic world vis-a-vis Denmark and vis-a-vis the trend of Islamophobia," [Indonesia's foreign ministry spokesman] Thamrin added.
Evidently free speach is called Islamophobia in the east.
Oh good they're ready to kill to defend the honour of someone who died over 1,000 years ago... does the Koran state that this is required, or is it again just dogma from previous interpretation?
~:smoking:
It is a form of entertainment for a couple hundred unemployed youth and some clerics at the low end of the theological foodchain.Quote:
Originally Posted by rory_20_uk
I heard an interview with him, where he said something along these lines; While we acknowledge the concept of freedom of expression, it shall not serve as a cover to violate others on their belief.Quote:
Originally Posted by Vladimir
I think that is the case on the edge, they think it shouldnt, we think it should.
The Danish paper is a secular paper from a European country with a small minority muslim population. Yet, the muslim world feels this, and all other newspapers, are obligated to follow the laws of the Quran. In other words, in the muslim mind, we are all ALREADY under Sharia, regardless of whether we're muslims or not. Interesting perspective, I wonder what else I do, or do not do, on a daily basis that an Imam in Amman would take offense to and force me to stop, given the chance.
That would be your normal BBQ, eating spareribs while drinking beer
Well it indeed shows the pen is mightier than the sword as some cartoons can cause an uproar like this, while cutting the heads off hostages in the name of Islam doesnt seem to do the same.
As it started with cartoons lets have another one:
https://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y2...ist_School.jpg
CBR
http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20060203...ropemediaislam
Very tasteless cartoons but at the same moment calling for riots and killing seem a little over the top over cartoons. With "art" of the Virgin Mary smeared in feces and other anti-religious and disrespectful displays such as the cartoons depicting Muhammad in a bad light, should free speech also show a little more curtesy. Not a dig on Islam, but when Christians and Jews are potrayed in this sort of disgusting way, you don't see so much violence as you do when Muslims are disrespected by secular media and society. Can someone explain to me why the phenomenom of violence in the Islamic Faith seems more prevalent in these sort of issues?
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=60620
Sorry a thread is already discussing this issue, could a mod combine my thread to it? Thanks
:creep:
Where would i be without you my Dear Friend!!!:laugh4:Quote:
Originally Posted by Proletariat
I objected to his assertion that the UK press should not print the cartoons. I repeat it has got nothing to do with him.Quote:
I wonder what you would have preferred him to say instead of what he actually said. "Pfwoar, laughed me arse off at those cartoons! What are the towelheads getting worked up over? Get a loife?"
Something along those lines?
Even Tony has put some clear blue water between Downing St. and his erstwhile ally.
hereQuote:
Downing Street tried to distance itself from the row by saying it was wrong for Tony Blair to tell the media what to do. Asked if he agreed with Peter Mandelson, the EU Trade Commissioner, who urged newspapers to think twice before publishing the cartoons, the Prime Minister’s spokesman said: “This is entirely a matter for the media organisations to decide what they ought to do within the law.”
Now Jack'boot' Straw has thrown his hat into the ring. God what a bleedin' shower. They want to try growing a backbone.
and hereQuote:
Foreign Secretary Jack Straw has condemned the decision by some European newspapers to reproduce cartoons of the Prophet Muhammad as "disrespectful".
I remember the deafening silence from these fellas when Iqbal Sacranie denounced homosexuals about a month back. One has to wonder how far these politicians will fawn to the Islamists?
You mean the European press. And it has to do with Mandelson, because he is controlling a trade row. As for Jack Straw, he and his government have the right to their own opinion just like everyone else.Quote:
Originally Posted by InsaneApache
On Sacranie's remarks you have a point. They were investigated by Police and found to be legal, but barely. However, that is not the real issue. Sacranie and some other Muslim clerics are advisers to Tony Blair, and Blair should distance himself from them as soon as possible. Bar one or two, they are an unpalatable lot and deserve no special consideration because of the people they claim to represent.
I couldn't agree more. Why Blair decided to jump into bed with that lot is a mystery to me. Most of the Muslims I know think, at best, they are self-righteous prigs and at worst traitors.Quote:
However, that is not the real issue. Sacranie and some other Muslim clerics are advisers to Tony Blair, and Blair should distance himself from them as soon as possible. Bar one or two, they are an unpalatable lot and deserve no special consideration because of the people they claim to represent.
The UK is, thank God, (:laugh4: )a secular state and should remain as such.
Quote:
Originally Posted by AdrianII
Apparently, a lot of people are manifesting now. Much more than a couple hundred at least.
Now, this is really getting funny. They are screwing their country a bit more by kicking all europeans out of there and will never get their damn silly apologies.
That's slightly OT, but this is something French are really proud of and that will hopefully never been negociated.Quote:
Originally Posted by Don Corleone
I'm not sure this is a good example, but it's like the Right to bear arms in the US. I think it's silly and pointless, but I understand why so many people care about that.
As I understand it, the cartoons were first printed as a "test" of free speech. All the other newspapers printed them just to show they could. That's ridiculous. Being free to make a political statement is one thing, seeing how much of a shitstorm you can start is another.
The violent response this is getting from the muslims is going out of hand. Boycotting and printing topless pictures of the virgin mary is all the farther it should go, though I don't approve of either.
This reminds me a lot of the Janet Jackson Nipple at the Superbowl thing. Nudity and swear words are edited out of most tv, that's not free speech. They don't allow it because it offends people...just like pictures of Mohammed offend people. I think it's a lot of fuss over some pictures just like I thought it was a lot of fuss over a nipple.
The paper has the right to print the images, but it isn't right. In fact it exceptionally nasty and thoughtless. Offending millions of people just because you can gets nothing but contempt from me. Freedom of speech doesn't mean you have to be offensive. As long as you can offend people you have freedom of speech.
Not as ridiculous as it sounds. Shouldn`t religions have to accept to such? Yes they should, it`s free speech, and everyone can offend everyone.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sasaki Kojiro
Besides, I don`t think the first printings were a test, but rather the later ones; like the Norwegian printer, who said that he tested free speech.
Well, we don`t have that sort of trouble in Europe.Quote:
This reminds me a lot of the Janet Jackson Nipple at the Superbowl thing. Nudity and swear words are edited out of most tv, that's not free speech. They don't allow it because it offends people...just like pictures of Mohammed offend people. I think it's a lot of fuss over some pictures just like I thought it was a lot of fuss over a nipple.
You should have seen what the state channel served me with the warning "strong scenes". ~:eek:
(it was uncensored sex. Did probably offend many, but news is news)
I agree, but it wouldn`t have been printed in other countries if it wasn`t for these massive, ridiculous reactions.Quote:
The paper has the right to print the images, but it isn't right. In fact it exceptionally nasty and thoughtless. Offending millions of people just because you can gets nothing but contempt from me. Freedom of speech doesn't mean you have to be offensive. As long as you can offend people you have freedom of speech.
Jyllands Posten tested it out; wont do it again.
All in all: it`s the reactions that are ridiculous, not the printings.
“Article 1
All human beings are born free and equal in dignity and rights. They are endowed with reason and conscience and should act towards one another in a spirit of brotherhood.
Article 2
Everyone is entitled to all the rights and freedoms set forth in this Declaration, without distinction of any kind, such as race, colour, sex, language, religion, political or other opinion, national or social origin, property, birth or other status. “
I think this article are against the Islamic principals and offend millions of them. How a women could equal to a man, for example. And no comments should be done about their faith, drawings or in writing. To question their faith and its applications isn’t allowed because it offences them.
So, in order to avoid terrorism and riots, these articles should be deleted from the Universal Declaration.:help:
Voltaire should be banned from printing, and Victor Hugo or other writers from GB, USA having the same approach.:help:
The debate in the French Assembly about the separation between Churches and State in 1905 should be deleted as well, because some leftist compare religions (all of them) with superstitions.
Au secours, help, upomoc !!!!:help:
Where was all this indignation, this hanger from the Muslim world when bombs exploded in Paris, Madrid, London, when the planes hit New York? Why the Imams, Ayatollahs and other Doctors of the faith didn't react and issued a fatwa against the poeple who commit and organised it?
They protest against cartoons, and not a word (or so little) against bombs? Gays hanged in Iran, women killed by stoning in Saudi Arabia, enslaved and let to die without medicaments or access to doctors in Afghanistan during the Taliban, women not allowed to drive (still Saudi Arabia) not a word…
But, caricatures, that is an offence!!!:furious3:
Speaking of free speech...
http://us.news3.yimg.com/us.i2.yimg....r399679231.jpg
http://us.news3.yimg.com/us.i2.yimg....ngs_llp117.jpg
http://us.news3.yimg.com/us.i2.yimg....ngs_llp121.jpg
http://us.news3.yimg.com/us.i2.yimg....ngs_llp118.jpg
http://us.news3.yimg.com/us.i2.yimg....3443127481.jpg
Lovely...
Maybe the cartoons hit too close to home.:no:
Impressive beards. :2thumbsup:
I, for one, admires Osamas beard(he sure looks like Santa). These ones aren`t even close to his. Wannabes...Quote:
Originally Posted by Dâriûsh
and not a 'red' one in sight. Interesting. :juggle2:Quote:
Originally Posted by Dâriûsh
Considering how the UN was (perhaps still is) considering illegalizing criticism of Islam, and how Muslims have tried to force and apology and silence criticism, I think it was important for the papers to show that they aren't afraid to print these. After all, if people have the nominal right to free speech, but are scared to speak out on certain issues, that isn't really free speech.Quote:
As I understand it, the cartoons were first printed as a "test" of free speech. All the other newspapers printed them just to show they could. That's ridiculous. Being free to make a political statement is one thing, seeing how much of a shitstorm you can start is another.
Terrorists saw off a man's head, slowly killing him as he screams, and videotape it, and not a peep of protest from the Muslim world*. Someone prints a drawing they don't like, and they threaten a continent with destruction.Quote:
Lovely...
Maybe the cartoons hit too close to home.
Crazed Rabbit
*Generalization of most incidents and ranking authorities of Islam, and Muslim people.
My problem with all that is why it took four months before the reaction?
The second one is, if, as I believe, Islamic/Fascist Terrorism is due to a minority, why so much Muslims react against these drawings they probably never saw?:dizzy2:
Third, if the goal was to stop that kind of caricatures, it missed the point. They are now every where.:laugh4:
And it will more and more difficult to pretend that Islam means peace. It is peace if you do what I want…:embarassed:
What are you talking about CR, about the UN making it illegal to criticize Islam? You can't just lay something like that out there not offer some support. Is there a UN resolution afoot or something?
A New Zealand newspaper has now printed the cartoons:
Paper prints Mohammed cartoons
Quote:
New Zealand Federation of Islamic Associations president Javed Khan said the decision by The Dominion Post to publish the cartoons could have "serious repercussions" for New Zealand's economy.
The federation holds the national contract to certify meat slaughtered to traditional Islamic requirements.
"We won't call for a boycott, and we don't want to see one, but news gets around the world pretty quickly. Muslims will make their own decisions and as you know, they've taken drastic action against Denmark," he told the Dominion Post
I was talking about Indonesia in response to the news agency story about protests at Danish establishments there.Quote:
Originally Posted by Meneldil
In Gaza and the Westbank there have been massive demonstrations with tens of thousands of people burning Danish flags or calling for vengeance against European countries. What an exercise in futility.
Still, this row clearly originates with the leadership of some nations and organisations, not with the 'Arab street' as they call it.
You´re mistaken, he has every right to do so. That's the whole point of it all.Quote:
Originally Posted by Insane Apache
Not important, essential!Quote:
Originally Posted by Crazed Rabbit
https://img.photobucket.com/albums/v478/Saturnus/m8.jpg
https://img.photobucket.com/albums/v478/Saturnus/M1.jpg
Note: I'm not posting these to insult moslims. In fact, I consider them rather distasteful myself, but every person has a right to be distasteful. If it weren't for the irresponsible, shameful and rascist reaction of many moslim countries (or their governments), I wouldn't want to be associated with these pictures. But they have made it a duty to show them.
To all moslim fanatics: beware! We don't want a conflict. We want peace and cooperation. With a little understanding from both sides this should be possible. If you want a conflict, that's your problem. You may be ready to die for your religion, but we are ready to die to defend our freedom. If you need to know, we will see who dies harder.
Amazingly, and sadly, it would appear the US government has chosen the way of appeasment: US State Department weighs in on cartoon, on side of muslims
I'm frankly shocked by this. At least this little weasel from the State Department, Mr. Kris Cooper, refused to call on American papers not to print the cartoons.
To my muslim friends, I hope you understand to many of us here in the West, this is not about insulting Mohammed or Islam. I know just how infuriating this sort of thing can be. Hell, in the US, an artist got an endowment from the NEA to dip a crucifix into a jar of his own urine, and it was labelled 'performance art'. But silencing the obnoxious by making threats or worse is not the answer.
To Condi, and the rest of the clods at the US state department.... shame on you. :no:
I read somewhere that "virgins" is a mistranslation and that the correct translation is closer to "grapes". I bet those bombers will be pissed off that after killing a few kids they only get a plate of seedless grapes instead of Virgins.
Or concerning the pictures, perhaps there is logic in the suicide bomber's methods: by killing kids they are ensuring that there are more virgins in heaven!!! :2thumbsup:
~:smoking:
Gah. Europeans are standing up better to radical Islam than the US. Shame on us.:no:
@DC:
The UN starts promoting "respect for all religions and their value systems". April 2005.
http://www.jihadwatch.org/dhimmiwatc...ves/006501.php
Important Quote:
Now:Quote:
Islam On Line (IOL) reported it this way: "The United Nations Commission on Human Rights adopted on Tuesday, April 12, a resolution calling for combating defamation campaigns against Islam and Muslims in the West."
http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles...e.asp?ID=20622
Refrences This:Quote:
The UN was happy to take the case. The UN High Commissioner for Human Rights, Louise Arbour, wrote to the OIC: “I understand your attitude to the images that appeared in the newspaper. I find alarming any behaviors that disregard the beliefs of others. This kind of thing is unacceptable.” She announced that investigations for racism and “Islamophobia” would commence forthwith.
http://www.nctimes.com/articles/2005..._0212_9_05.txt
So, in a nutshell, the UN says these depictions are unaceptable and is going to investigate them. What needs to be investigated? Is there not freedom of speech? An important question to ask the UN...
Crazed Rabbit
What a riot!:laugh4:
Next thing you know, the US and their partners in the Axis of Weasels will obstruct French-German UN-resolutions on the protection of the freedom of the west.
*pops open a bottle of Coward-Cola.*
Edit: all in good jest. http://matousmileys.free.fr/langue3.gif
Look ... even Fidel Castro joined the demonstration :inquisitive:Quote:
Originally Posted by Devastatin Dave
I wonder were these pics were taken - the weather doesn't look like Middle East to me. Is there an article going with the pics?
Ye Olde Britannia.Quote:
I wonder were these pics were taken - the weather doesn't look like Middle East to me. Is there an article going with the pics?
http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/europe....ap/index.htmlQuote:
No apology over Mohammad images, says Denmark
Quote:
Early Friday, Palestinian militants threw a bomb at a French cultural center in Gaza City, and many Palestinians began boycotting European goods, especially those from Denmark.
[QUOTE]Quote:
"Whoever defames our prophet should be executed," said Ismail Hassan, 37, a tailor who marched through the pouring rain along with hundreds of others in the West Bank city of Ramallah.
Quote:
"Bin Laden our beloved, Denmark must be blown up," protesters in Ramallah chanted.
And so on..Quote:
An imam at the Omari Mosque in Gaza City told 9,000 worshippers that those behind them should have their heads cut off.
I know there is already threads on this, but since this was a new Article, I felt the need to start another one. This is getting way out of hand. Over one stupid cartoon drawing in Europe, these guys are flipping out.
