El Barto's Clueless Mafia Game #1

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Originally Posted by Double A

OP doesn't say anything about it.

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that's why i asked ya dingus

Vote: Reidquat the kumquat the scumquat.

I can continue play, but be advised I'm quite sick and won't be as analytical.

@Pizza I just started coming down with something myself.

Vote: Jarema, let's get this started. Thoughts on Ishamel and TFT?

I personally would like to see how they interact today, if TFT is going to back up his accusation of Ishmael and how Ishmael reacts.

Ishmael can be lynched.

TFT still reads okay to me, to be reversed late game perhaps.

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Originally Posted by Visorslash

I personally would like to see how they interact today, if TFT is going to back up his accusation of Ishmael and how Ishmael reacts.

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Since you ask, I've actually reversed my position on TFT. His accusations against me in the previous day phase seemed sincere.

That leaves me with nothing, so I'll fall back to the default option of trying to get people to talk more. Jarema and edse haven't said much, but a vote for Jarema is more likely to do something given he's already got one.

vote: Jarema

Don't feel limited by Visor; thoughts on anybody are appreciated :beam:.

If Jarema is scum, Ishmael looks good.

If not, Ishmael and reidquat for the scum duo.

@El Barto

What happens if Bladescape doesn't post/vote today?

Hearing from edse would be good as well, need to hear from everybody, with a short game.

I'm inclining more and more towards ATPG being scum. I dislike such certainty so early.

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Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

If Jarema is scum, Ishmael looks good.

If not, Ishmael and reidquat for the scum duo.

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You can be partially right, just remove the poor reidquat from there, were me scum you would be dead. You alive, me good townie, a townquat! ...*possessed by Sitting Bull spirit*...

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Originally Posted by Ishmael

I'm inclining more and more towards ATPG being scum. I dislike such certainty so early.

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I dislike prevarication. This isn't early, we're at lynch or lose next round.

6 towns, two scums. -1 town lynch, -1 town murder.

4 towns, two scums. Lynch or lose.

"Early" pushes you over the top. We can lynch your partner scumquat next round.

Unvote, Vote: Ishmael

I've clearly rattled your cage. Time to die.

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Originally Posted by Riedquat

You can be partially right, just remove the poor reidquat from there, were me scum you would be dead.

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This is a bad argument. Zack was the must-murder last night, he was never getting lynched this game due to the lack of village PMs.

That being said, you can help me kill Ishmael and all will be forgiven.

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Originally Posted by Ishmael

I'm inclining more and more towards ATPG being scum. I dislike such certainty so early.

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Or visor and him... +10 for thread activity but they are directing the circus here... in the other hand atpg could be right about you, the thing is you and who else?

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Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

This is a bad argument. Zack was the must-murder last night, he was never getting lynched this game due to the lack of village PMs.

That being said, you can help me kill Ishmael and all will be forgiven.

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I prefer to lynch not kill Ishmael... and what are you going to forgive? :inquisitive:

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Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

I dislike prevarication. This isn't early, we're at lynch or lose next round.

6 towns, two scums. -1 town lynch, -1 town murder.

4 towns, two scums. Lynch or lose.

"Early" pushes you over the top. We can lynch your partner scumquat next round.

Unvote, Vote: Ishmael

I've clearly rattled your cage. Time to die.

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There is a difference between disliking certainty, and disliking taking a position. My objection was to your framing the debate in an attempt to guarantee that if Jarema were innocent, you would get a 'free' lynch. As you point out yourself, that would be game.

unvote; vote: Askthepizzaguy

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Originally Posted by Ishmael

There is a difference between disliking certainty, and disliking taking a position. My objection was to your framing the debate in an attempt to guarantee that if Jarema were innocent, you would get a 'free' lynch. As you point out yourself, that would be game.

unvote; vote: Askthepizzaguy

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This post smells funny... I somehow agree with it but something doesn't fit...
Atpg, as Ishmael kindly points out, if jarema is innocent, why Ishmael and me are guilty? And just as mental exercise, if is not me, who would be the next possible?

This is how I read the both of you.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

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Originally Posted by Ishmael

Somebody seems bitter. Given up hope for this year already? :beam:

vote: Double A

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Nominates a townie to die D1

+ wolf points.

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Originally Posted by Riedquat

Kumquat wants me to vote: jarema I disagree but he commands...:yes:

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Nominates Jarema D1, low-risk.

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Originally Posted by Riedquat

No, he is not! kumquat is a better one...

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Joking, low-content.

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Originally Posted by Riedquat

No and I wonder why do you think I am...

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Wants reasons to defend against.

+ wolf points.

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Originally Posted by Ishmael

You always nail me as mafia, and for the right reasons too. It's just fortunate the town doesn't listen to you most of the time when you do. You also often call me as mafia when I'm townie, but that's a different matter.

As for serious post analysis, I'd give Visorslash a tentative pass, and will be keeping a closer eye on TFT. I won't be changing my vote though, as I'd feel bad lynching one of the newcomers without more than a gut feeling on D1. No opinions yet on anybody else, really.

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Words directed at Visorslash feel wrong. Discussing the past is something I tend to do more as a wolf.

"Keep a closer eye on TFT" feels like a wolf lie.

Low number of opinions, low-risk.

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Originally Posted by Ishmael

All right, I'll bite.

Visorslash: In my experience he doesn't tend to post quite so much, so early, as scum.

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Disagree.

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TFT: Ruling Pizza townie off the bat. He doesn't tend to read easily. That seems like either overconfidence, or an attempt to get on the good side of one of the more talkative (and therefore potentially influential) players.

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Disagree, and I disagree with smudging TFT.

+wolf points.

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Are you saying that you're scum, or that I always vote for you even when you're townie?

Seriously though, whilst I don't tend to self-analyse much (perhaps I should), if I vote for you more often than others that's because I tend to find you suspicious more often than others, accurately or otherwise. It's not like my default course of action is just 'vote Visorslash.'

As for Pizza, see above; I don't feel justified in making any judgement yet.

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No one should be neutral on me at this point in the game.

+wolf points.

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Well, the meta analysis and post analysis were naturally separate. The meta analysis was of Visor's scumfinding ability, whilst the post analysis was about my opinions on how I might vote. There really wasn't much overlap.

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Filler.

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Originally Posted by Riedquat

Understandable, but it wasn't me who started it, who is in the players list? Me or kumquat? It is okay for me, people call me kumquat, scumquat, reidquat and riedquat... :P

Nah!! Really? Nobody noticed, ever! :P But don't change, we love you as you are!

But seriously, generally you always read me as scum, as town, as mafia and as third party, I don't remember a single time you had put me on the clear list... perhaps I'm always scummy!

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This strikes me as not only a butt-pulled statement, but also an attempt to undermine confidence in a read on Reid.

+wolf points.

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Here, you are the one who can read me as an open book, if you think I'm mafia, you are probably right or you are scum yourself.

:yes:

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I don't like this interaction with Visorslash.

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Originally Posted by Ishmael

Since you ask, I've actually reversed my position on TFT. His accusations against me in the previous day phase seemed sincere.

That leaves me with nothing, so I'll fall back to the default option of trying to get people to talk more. Jarema and edse haven't said much, but a vote for Jarema is more likely to do something given he's already got one.

vote: Jarema

Don't feel limited by Visor; thoughts on anybody are appreciated :beam:.

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Jarema has been nominated by several folks, therefore if he's a villager he's a low-risk lynch. He could also be a bussing target, less likely.

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Originally Posted by Ishmael

I'm inclining more and more towards ATPG being scum. I dislike such certainty so early.

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Wildly wolfy statement.

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Originally Posted by Riedquat

You can be partially right, just remove the poor reidquat from there, were me scum you would be dead. You alive, me good townie, a townquat! ...*possessed by Sitting Bull spirit*...

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I think I was half-right, actually.

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Originally Posted by Riedquat

Or visor and him... +10 for thread activity but they are directing the circus here... in the other hand atpg could be right about you, the thing is you and who else?

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Bull.

Visor and me are never the scum team here.

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Originally Posted by Riedquat

I prefer to lynch not kill Ishmael... and what are you going to forgive? :inquisitive:

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Also bull. Riedquat has not indicated he's willing to lynch Ishmael.

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Originally Posted by Ishmael

There is a difference between disliking certainty, and disliking taking a position. My objection was to your framing the debate in an attempt to guarantee that if Jarema were innocent, you would get a 'free' lynch. As you point out yourself, that would be game.

unvote; vote: Askthepizzaguy

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Caught wolf.

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Originally Posted by Riedquat

This post smells funny... I somehow agree with it but something doesn't fit...

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Prep for distancing.

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Atpg, as Ishmael kindly points out, if jarema is innocent, why Ishmael and me are guilty? And just as mental exercise, if is not me, who would be the next possible?

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You and Ishmael are guilty because you are both having a terrible game as wolf.

Simple as that. No offense, but you've done nothing townie so far.

I have Ishmael as 75% wolf and Reidquat as 65% wolf.

Not quite as certain as Fleeing Coward and Banjo caught wolf team, but enough that I'm willing to bet the game on these two on the lynch or lose round.

You have precisely one round to change my mind.

Jarema like 45% wolf.

It's possible but I have my doubts.

Visor, I'm pretty much the murder tonight, do you agree?

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Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

This is how I read the both of you.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Nominates a townie to die D1

+ wolf points.



Nominates Jarema D1, low-risk.



Joking, low-content.



Wants reasons to defend against.

+ wolf points.



Words directed at Visorslash feel wrong. Discussing the past is something I tend to do more as a wolf.

"Keep a closer eye on TFT" feels like a wolf lie.

Low number of opinions, low-risk.



Disagree.



Disagree, and I disagree with smudging TFT.

+wolf points.



No one should be neutral on me at this point in the game.

+wolf points.



Filler.



This strikes me as not only a butt-pulled statement, but also an attempt to undermine confidence in a read on Reid.

+wolf points.



I don't like this interaction with Visorslash.



Jarema has been nominated by several folks, therefore if he's a villager he's a low-risk lynch. He could also be a bussing target, less likely.



Wildly wolfy statement.



I think I was half-right, actually.



Bull.

Visor and me are never the scum team here.



Also bull. Riedquat has not indicated he's willing to lynch Ishmael.



Caught wolf.

Prep for distancing.



You and Ishmael are guilty because you are both having a terrible game as wolf.

Simple as that. No offense, but you've done nothing townie so far.

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I won't bother with the stuff in the spoiler. Some of it I've addressed or are disagreements in interpretation, and the rest is highly ambiguous. The last part caught my eye, though:

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You and Ishmael are guilty because you are both having a terrible game as wolf.

Simple as that. No offense, but you've done nothing townie so far.

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Sounds like somebody is giving themselves room to back away if you spearhead the lynch of a townie. And yet you call Riedquat out for distancing.

Lynch me tomorrow if I am wrong. As far as I'm concerned, if I ever get lynched this game it's game over anyway. Too many townies are AWOL. Today is lynch or lose for all practical purposes, yet you seem to believe we've got plenty of time.

Haha! I understand your reading of me, do not agree in every point but your point of view is understandable. In the post you mention I'm distancing from Ishmael I thought you were going to think exactly that when writing it, but my feelings about that post are exactly those.

And about acting townie, well... this is the way I roll... always, as town or mafia... I think? Correspond to others judge that.

I'm fine going after Ishmael but I agree he has some good points, I know you are completely wrong about me, so the what if you are completely wrong about him too, keeps popping out in my mind, there is a lot of people saying nothing and that worries me more than your accusation.

vote: Ishmael

sorry, I am sick. I am going back to my bed

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Originally Posted by Jarema

vote: Ishmael

sorry, I am sick. I am going back to my bed

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umm... as your mafia partner? :inquisitive:

Get well soon!

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Originally Posted by Riedquat

I'm fine going after Ishmael but I agree he has some good points, I know you are completely wrong about me, so the what if you are completely wrong about him too, keeps popping out in my mind, there is a lot of people saying nothing and that worries me more than your accusation.

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The italics reads as wolfy, surprise surprise.


You aren't going to lynch Ishmael because you know you hang after he dies and flips wolf.

Now then, there are several possibilities:

1) Ishmael is a wolf and you're his partner.
2) Ishmael is a wolf and I'm bussing him hard
3) Ishmael is a wolf and someone else is his partner.
4) Ishmael is not a wolf.

In universes 2 through 3 you still need to lynch Ishmael regardless of my accusation of you. Why my accusing you even factors in, is beyond me. Villager Reidquat would know it's meaningless, so why do you even bring it up? It's horribad logic.

In Universe 1, your lack of support for lynching Ishmael will cause you to hang tomorrow. You should probably lynch him. Maybe I change my mind about you.

(Spoiler alert: That ship has sailed....)

In Universe 4, your lack of support for lynching him reads as PIS to me, and I'd still lynch you tomorrow if I survive that long and people still read me as a villager.

No one should be defending Ishmael, he's a legit suspect acting wolfy.

The way you're uncomfortable with his lynch, and how you're stalling, indicates to me that between 1 and 2 of you are completely guilty.

Mmm, sorry, I thought I would have more time now that work has started but I was wrong.

When I read yesterday's posts I thought Ishmael and Jarema were the guilty ones, but today's voting doesn't really support that theory.

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Originally Posted by Ishmael

You always nail me as mafia, and for the right reasons too. It's just fortunate the town doesn't listen to you most of the time when you do. You also often call me as mafia when I'm townie, but that's a different matter.

As for serious post analysis, I'd give Visorslash a tentative pass, and will be keeping a closer eye on TFT. I won't be changing my vote though, as I'd feel bad lynching one of the newcomers without more than a gut feeling on D1. No opinions yet on anybody else, really.

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I reacted the same way as TFT when I read this post and Jarema's lazy vote with it's common explanation isn't very good in a game this small.

I'll go with Vote:Ishmael.

I need to be murdered tonight to prevent shenanigans, so if everyone could be on record as thinking Askthepizzaguy is an obvious villager, that would probably tilt things that way.

Regardless of how Ishmael flips, me surviving to lynch or lose is never good for village's ability to think clearly.

Well, I'm not going to get anything out of Jarema.

Unvote; Vote: Riedquat, I find his posts today to not nullify any suspicion I had on him.

Pizza, you or myself.

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Originally Posted by Riedquat

Haha! I understand your reading of me, do not agree in every point but your point of view is understandable. In the post you mention I'm distancing from Ishmael I thought you were going to think exactly that when writing it, but my feelings about that post are exactly those.

And about acting townie, well... this is the way I roll... always, as town or mafia... I think? Correspond to others judge that.

I'm fine going after Ishmael but I agree he has some good points, I know you are completely wrong about me, so the what if you are completely wrong about him too, keeps popping out in my mind, there is a lot of people saying nothing and that worries me more than your accusation.

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This post in particular - the understanding part of it specifically is something mafia like to do as it is not antagonistic and allows acknowledgement but also deflection.

It has been quite some time since I've played with Riedquat, but I think I'm right. Him, Ishmael are both good lynches I feel.