Pope 'refused meeting with Rice'

[Pannonian]

Given the way that rebel armies seem to have better then the latest tech it would be Cyborg Swiss Guard with built in Swiss Army Plasma Cannon with Swiss Army Knife as a bayonet... and a couple of Mecha.

I've always wondered how Petra, when it rebelled, managed to spawn triple gold chevron camel armies with gold weapons and armour.

Sidenote: I originally read the topic title as Pape 'refused meeting with Rice', and wondered why you had a thread about you.

[macsen rufus]

The goal is to point out that everyone hates the Bush administration because of Iraq.

Obviously. After all I couldn't possibly be interested in whether anyone feels any conflict over their spiritual and temporal leaders being at loggerheads, could I?

I am so grateful to Big Brother that my thoughtcrime was discovered before I became aware of it.

[Seamus Fermanagh]

Obviously. After all I couldn't possibly be interested in whether anyone feels any conflict over their spiritual and temporal leaders being at loggerheads, could I?

Of course you can -- and it's even a reasonable point for discussion. But on a forum devoted to games involving an annoying personfication of the Holy Father, you're bound to generate flippancies too.


There are moments of conflict for US Catholics. We see the Holy Father as our spiritual leader and respect his opinions on issues that stand at the nexus of spiritual and physical. Most U.S. Catholics do not expect the elected leadership of our secular government to adhere strictly to the tenets of Catholicism. Many of us vote for political leaders whose philosphy coheres with our own spiritual beliefs, though most do not expect any elected official to adhere to the tenets of Catholicism on all issues at all times. Caesar unto Caesar and all that.

So some sense of tension, yes. A crippling sense of conflict, no.

[macsen rufus]

And I suppose a lot must depend on where one draws the line of Caesar's ambit, too, and the whole Church-State separation question.

Actually, a related but verging slightly OT supplementary - between the extremes of Dawkins on one hand, and Navaros on the other what is the truth of the impact of religious movements on US politics? The extremes seeming to be Dawkins saying that you get nowhere in US politics if you do not "profess faith", specifically Christian, to such a degree it may as well be a theocracy, and Navaros who always portrays the Govt as a Godless bunch of rampaging secularists. They can't both be right in their depiction of the current administration, surely? Of course under Navaros' version, cool relations between the administration and the Holy See would be nothing remarkable. Still, the oft-quoted & denied "God told me to do it" justification just would not have played at all in a truly secularist society. I guess at root I'm as uneasy about theocracy in the west as in the (middle)east. I appreciate that the most vocal Christian community in the US are the evangelicals, who don't arise from the Catholic tradition, and I can't imagine the president telling, say Billy Graham to hop it, or vice versa.

So for some reason I get a gut feeling this little diplomatic dispute is significant, but can't put my finger on why. At the back of my mind there is the infamous "How many divisions does the Pope command?" comment. And of course the Catholic community is (appears to be..) way more diverse than the others I guess, with strong Italian, Irish and Latin components, and probably presents a less monolithic constituency in political terms.

But to be flippant: already one Crusade underway, can't launch another marker til that's finished

[drone]

But to be flippant: already one Crusade underway, can't launch another marker til that's finished

I think the current one is finished, and the king's influence has plummeted due to it's failure. Unrest and disloyalty are rampant throughout the empire.

[Kralizec]

I think the current one is finished, and the king's influence has plummeted due to it's failure. Unrest and disloyalty are rampant throughout the empire.

I expect the Confederate States will reemerge any moment now...

[FactionHeir]

I can imagine if the Pope excommunicated Bush/America, that there might be another Great Schism, with the US providing its own pope.