Heavy Fighting in South Ossetia

[CrossLOPER]

The Russians reap what they sow.

What? How is Georgia's terrible economic situation and ultra-nationalist government Russia's fault?

I can imagine it now:


(Scene opens on playground, large tough kid is talking to smaller kid)

Russia (Large kid): I'm gonna go pummel that Georgia, here's 10 bucks, tell the teacher I'm doing it for you.
Ossetia: You're the best!

Georgia SHELLED South Ossetia. They nearly wiped a town off the map.

There was a really, really messy civil war in that area. If you think that the break away republics had any wish to remain with Georgia, you're wrong.

Also, I'm not sure why people in this thread think that shelling a civilian population is a perfectly acceptable way of dealing with rebels.

[FactionHeir]

Also, I'm not sure why people in this thread think that shelling a civilian population is a perfectly acceptable way of dealing with rebels.

As long as they are a Western ally, anything they do is fine, no? Who cares if a few civilians die as long as they like us and are not communist or threatening us in any way

[Caius]

Bah. Let the war develop itself. Then we will know all the answers.

[Adrian II]

Bah. Let the war develop itself. Then we will know all the answers.

It appears that the Georgians got the message and are redeploying their troops in 'defensive positions' outisde of South Ossetia. This might be the beginning of a cease-fire - unless Abkhazia sees prolonged fighting, in which case it may take a whole week as I envisaged.

[rory_20_uk]

The Russians for some reason want these pockets of land. Their value might be more evident to others.

That the people want to join with Russia makes it extremely likely they will do so.

Europe needs the oil and gas. We'll do nothing to help in the slightest.

[Evil_Maniac From Mars]

Funny how that works.....

Yes, strange how Russia helps out its interests while Western interests help out Georgia. Face it, both sides are guilty of that.

Got to love the fact that Russia refused a Georgian proposed cease-fire, allowing the fighting to continue. If Russia were concerned about South Ossetia and it's citizens safety, wouldn't it want to stop the fighting?

For one thing, that was because Russia drove back Georgian ground forces. Secondly, according to Russian sources, Georgians are still firing, though I don't think Russians are advancing beyond the border. Whether the ceasefire is an accurate offer or not, or whether the Russians would take it, is an interesting topic.

Firstly, we're not sure if it's real. Georgian troops already said they'd pulled out of South Ossetia, at the same time they were massing more troops to put in. Secondly, Georgia has broken one ceasefire already. Thirdly, if it is real, Russia may want to teach Georgia a lesson in what happens when you mess with a country Russia is protecting, making Georgia less likely to attack again.

[Marshal Murat]

What? How is Georgia's terrible economic situation and ultra-nationalist government Russia's fault?

Had the Soviet Union reinvested in the region, when they had a chance, rather than funding terrorist organizations across Africa and Latin America, or had the Soviet Union adopted a better economic policy, many of the split-away republics would be in a better position to care for itself. Considering where the republics started off, few were really prepared to deal with the economic situation in the world at large. They simply sought independence from a ultra-nationalistic communist nation whose repressions against human rights is astounding, and are facing the results. They aren't the wealthiest nation, Georgia. They don't have the best services because they are essentially starting 10 years behind the rest of the world. It's not like people in former Soviet republics decided that eating grass and herding sheep was the best thing, ever. They've been trying to improve their economies, but it's not easy starting with a handicap.

The unfortunately economic situation only serves to breed ultra-nationalistic governments. Many nations, in the throes of economic downturn, often turn to nationalistic governments. Russia in 1916, Germany 1930s, Japan 1930s. All uniting the nation and changing the economy under the direction of nationalistic leaders.

Unfortunate economic times also causes people to isolate themselves culturally, socially, etc. This often leads to greater conflict between groups, clans, whatever. If Yugoslavia moved into a prospering nation following Titos death, then what impetus would any of the republics there-in have to split away and form their own nation?

Had Russia reinvested in the republics before they broke away, not abused them for cultural reasons, had a different economic policy, or abused ethnic groups with deportation and genocide, then yeah I think we would have a different situation.

Well, I heard that someone else proposed the ceasefire. I'm not sure who.

It might be those pesky westerners...

[Caius]

Well, I heard that someone else proposed the ceasefire. I'm not sure who.

[Devastatin Dave]

Also, I'm not sure why people in this thread think that shelling a civilian population is a perfectly acceptable way of dealing with rebels.

Are you kidding? Several here get in this thread get a boner if anyone ever mentions what NATO did to the Serbs. We bombed civilian Serbs in that conflict like a bad Dresden reenactment. Personally, I'm just waiting for the strongly worded statement from the UN. That'll show 'em!!!