The Midgard Saga II [Concluded]

[Andres]

It'll be a more fun version of wet.

But wine makes stains. How will I clean the blanket (which, apparently, is me) afterwards?

Why are we having this discussion? It's rather absurd...

[Warmaster Horus]

It's rather absurd...

And it's taken you this long to see that?

[seireikhaan]

But wine makes stains. How will I clean the blanket (which, apparently is me) afterwards?

Let the wife be concerned with the cleaning.

Why are we having this discussion? It's rather absurd...

Umm, it increases our postcount?

[Sigurd]

The lynch result is now posted.

The challenges so far:

1. GeneralHankerchief vs. Warmaster Horus
2. woad&fangs vs. Husar
3. makaikhaan vs. Kukrikhaan
4. Caius vs. Andres
5. Eliit Tuhkur vs. Privateerkev

[Husar]

I Challenge HUSAR!!!!!

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Challenges:

1. GeneralHankerchief vs Warmaster Horus
2. woad&fangs vs Husar

challenge: Husar

Because I don't think my previous post was in the correct format.

You seem very eager to fight me, I've taken ballerina lessons lately though so expect me to dance around you and look a lot better than you if it comes to a fight.

[KukriKhan]

Challenge: KukriKhan

We shall see who is the superior Mongol.

And who is some sort of extinct ugly bird. "khaan" indeed.

I welcome our enclosure by the höslur and vébond.

[FactionHeir]

Would someone bother to challenge me?

[Caius]

Would someone bother to challenge me?

I challenged Andres, sorry.

Unless you challenge someone, Caius, for example.

[Gaius Scribonius Curio]

Hate to have to point out this, but has anybody actually read the death description for CA?

... “Who are you?” the man didn’t answer. “I guess I asked wrongly. What do they call you?” the man smiled and answered: “They call me CountArach”. The law speaker looked closely into the man’s eyes. “You have been voted guilty by the rest of the people. Do you have anything to say?” The man stood still and uttered not another word...

..."Very well, I am sorry I have to do this, but it is your law and has been for as long as the first Thing. You need to die so that your blood can pay for the deed done here last night. Blood for blood. It has been your ways since Odin gave you this law”. The man smiled and nodded...

...."Never mind”, said the young law speaker. “Continue with the procedure, I guess you know what to do”. “Yes, I do” said the volunteer executioner. The volunteer walked slowly up to CountArach and stood before him. He leaned over and the crowd knew he was about the whisper the ritual words, but instead he said: “I know who you are old man, this time it is me who wins”. CountArach’s eyes widened and before he could react, the volunteer had pierced the mortal guise of CountArach with a sword and the life force quickly drained from him...

...The crowd cheered and the law speaker asked which Kingdom CountArach did belong to. The men of the kingdoms all looked at each other and shrugged. “You mean to say that no one here knew this guy?” Again the crowd shrugged. “That is odd. We should prepare the pyres and send these men to the worlds beyond”...


...CountArach found himself walking on a fine path towards a large building. The people he met bowed in reverence and looked to the ground. He barely noticed as he pondered the latest event. That executioner at the Thing, was he the one he suspected? If so, Midgard was in dire trouble.

From a tree next to the building he heard the ‘Kra’ from some birds. CountArach smiled. It was after all good to be home.

From my (admittedly little) knowledge of Norse Mythology, I'd have said that we collectively have just killed Odin, one of the most powerful Aesir!

This is based on the fact that he is walking towards a large hall (Valhalla?), which is to be expected and doesn't mean much in itself. However people are bowing down to him, and he thinks, 'Its is good to be home'. I'm fairly sure Odin resided in Valhalla.

Furthermore I remember reading (when I was in primary school, I had an interest in mythology at the time), that Odin was represented by crows or that they were his birds. Something to do with them finding his lost eye, if I remember correctly.

Take this with a pinch of salt as it has been years since I read any of this, but as I said I'm fairly sure of this....

Edit: Having read the passage in more detail I am now sure of my original guess. CA doesn't state his name, only what he is called.

Also when the speaker says; "it has been this way since Odin gave you this law" CA cracks what I take to be an ironic smile.

The executioner states that he knows who he is, and that he will win, I take this to mean that the Jotun couldn't pass up the oppurtunity to murder his main rival, also the wording that Sigurd uses to describe his death, (piercing his mortal guise) indicates immortality.

Finally he wasn't attached to any of the kingdomat the meeting indicating a special role.

Congratultions, men and women of the Kingdoms, we have just executed one of our most powerful allies in the struggle against the Jotun! Now did anybody see which way the young executioner ran, he is our Jotun!

[TinCow]

From my (admittedly little) knowledge of Norse Mythology, I'd have said that we collectively have just killed Odin, one of the most powerful Aesir!

Hmm, you're correct about the description. However, this was CA's reaction:

Wow, did you guys pick wrong? I was just pointing out the irony of my case...

If he was a major pro-town role, I would've expected something that sounded like he cared about his own death a bit more.

[Gaius Scribonius Curio]

See the above edit, the evidence is pretty convincing, I shall have a bit of a look at some Norse myths and see, but maybe CA didn't want to give away his role, even after death... Shall be back later with confirmation.

[woad&fangs]

well that sucks.

[pevergreen]

GSC beat me to it. 90% CA was Odin.

Ties in Migard 1 resulted in a No Lynch. Holmgang does increase your score by one.

Challange: KukriKhan

Vote: Challange: name may be counted as an actual challange, that mistake was made last time.

My holmgang score is under half of what I claimed last time, so KK should beat me soundly, I am challanging him as I dont like how he is voting.

[TinCow]

See the above edit, the evidence is pretty convincing, I shall have a bit of a look at some Norse myths and see, but maybe CA didn't want to give away his role, even after death... Shall be back later with confirmation.

I agree. It does look like we lynched Odin, though it would be better if CA could respond to this in some manner. What powers would Odin have had? Did we just lose a doctor, detective, vigilante, combo role?

[KukriKhan]

So Ragnarok approaches, eh?

Am I wrong in dimly remembering that Loki also used crows?

[FactionHeir]

The interesting thing is that N1 I got a message from Siguard about me hearing a Kra nearby which prompted me to ask whether night was over. Now it makes more sense with the explanation though. Does that mean I was investigated?

[naut]

So Ragnarok approaches, eh?

Am I wrong in dimly remembering that Loki also used crows?

Loki fought on the side of the Jǫtunn at Ragnarök.

CA must have been Odin.

I'm amazed that only 2 people didn't vote, high activity.

[Privateerkev]

I caution people from challenging for little or no reason. Decimating the ranks of the town in challenges will only help the Jotun.

But, if challenged, I will not back down.

I will see you on the field Mr Ferret...

[Seamus Fermanagh]

It seems likely that we have done for the mortal form of an immortal. The reverence of those being passed by CA suggest godhood and not jotunhood -- though both interpretations are possible.

The bird referrant is indistinct -- Sigurd adores a touch of ambiguity as I recall from I -- but the most consistent bird allusion is with Odin. In v 1.0, Odin was the "detective" for the good guys. We may be without a very important tool.

However, even with Odin's efforts in the last go-around, the Jotun still prevailed. Their Holmgang scores were very high, though not insurmountable. Assuming this theme continues in v 2.0, it would be poor odds for a human to face them unless and until holmgang skill has improved, however.

[KukriKhan]

We snuffed god? Geez.

FYI, the runic inscription in the Round 1 announcement



reads (more or less):

t h e g o d o d i n b e n e w o l e n t

g a w e h? ei? t h e

k n o w l e d g e o f

w r i t i n g a n d m a g i k

Does Odin's mortal disguise's death mean we lose or gain 'majik', I wonder.

[Caius]

Change the W for a V and it will make more sense, Kukri.

[naut]

We snuffed god? Geez.

FYI, the runic inscription in the Round 1 announcement



reads (more or less):

t h e g o d o d i n b e n e w o l e n t

g a w e h? ei? t h e

k n o w l e d g e o f

w r i t i n g a n d m a g i k

Does Odin's mortal disguise's death mean we lose or gain 'majik', I wonder.

"Gave Us The"

Is the second line, w is synonymous with v is Norse, since w makes a v sound.

Odin was the God of poetry, hence writing, and also magic and wisdom. Odin's pro-town role would make sense to be detective, since he is the wisest of the Æsir, but he would have been fierce in combat too. A grave loss.

[KukriKhan]

Yeah, I get that. I just did a straight, raw transposition. My question is: is this intended as a clue of some kind, or just a bit of norse ambience by our host?

[Privateerkev]

A note to those who play power-town roles in the future: Do not change your votes over and over for little or no reason...

Sorry guys, but in Day 1, with so little to go on, CA's rampant vote changing seemed like the most guilty thing around.

[Gaius Scribonius Curio]

Not much more to add, other than what reading I've done backs up what I thought originally. PK has a good point however, vote-changing for little reason is kind of semi-suspicious and on Day1 semi-suspicious is usually enough to get you lynched. That said I expected somebody to pick up my reference to GH's game, Kev was correct in his explanation of it, maybe I should have indicated that...

I'd also suggest that FH hearing a crow would indicate that CA investigated him, though since he was killed we have no way of knowing what the result was. In other words the fact that we can assume an investigation is of little value. Anyone else hearing crows in the night?

Finally the runes. If the translation indeed reads:

The God Odin, benevolent, gave us the knowledge of writing and magic (Roughly translated)

Then we should keep it in the back of our minds. Odin seems to be dead, so any later benefits we might gain by his being alive have gone. I think that it is dependent on who the 'us' is. The people of the Kingdoms, or the Jotun. Do 'we' of the Kingdoms, have the knowledge of magic, is the question that needs answering, or is that the Jotun.

Further research is required and I shall report back. However I doubt it is much of a clue, as it seems a statement of fact.

[glyphz]

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

I caution people from challenging for little or no reason. Decimating the ranks of the town in challenges will only help the Jotun.

I would think that the Norsemen of old preferred to settle disputes or crude arguments in battle rather than negotiations as they place great importance in their 'path of the warrior(?).' So challenges should be common.
(Then again, I know very little about the ups and downs of Holmgang, and how they may affect the rest of the game, as what Privateerkev cautioned)

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Congratultions, men and women of the Kingdoms, we have just executed one of our most powerful allies in the struggle against the Jotun! Now did anybody see which way the young executioner ran, he is our Jotun!

A note to those who play power-town roles in the future: Do not change your votes over and over for little or no reason...

Sorry guys, but in Day 1, with so little to go on, CA's rampant vote changing seemed like the most guilty thing around.

...
Agreed. Surviving N1 is based on not drawing the slightest of suspicion to oneself. Now, if CountArach is indeed Odin...
...
Well let's just say, none would have thought Odin, the head of the gods, is a an indecisive 'person' or at least a heavy N1 vote changer.
At least I didn't...

[Privateerkev]

I would think that the Norsemen of old preferred to settle disputes or crude arguments in battle rather than negotiations as they place great importance in their 'path of the warrior(?).' So challenges should be common.
(Then again, I know very little about the ups and downs of Holmgang, and how they may affect the rest of the game, as what Privateerkev cautioned)

I'm looking at it from a "mafia game" perspective. Holmgang kills people. Unless those people are Jotun, then every death hurts the town. Now, if it is true that winning in Holmgang raises your ability, then that does mitigate it a little. But we still need townies to be alive. And having them all slay themselves in Holmgang will hurt the town more than it will help by maybe raising someone's ability.

While it is true that a raised ability will make it easier to defeat a Jotun in battle, we will always have one good weapon to use on any Jotun. And that is the lynch. And the lynch doesn't need to be powered up by using it bunches of times first.

Now, that being said, I will not back down from a challenge. If ET is truly driven to meet his maker, I will then speed him on his journey.

But I do ask that we think strategically about Holmgang challenges. I am sure the Jotun would love for all of us to just slaughter each other while they sit, watch, and laugh. I'm not saying we should have no Holmgangs. It is our way and we should use it when we need to. But I will look at "joke Holmganging" like I look at "joke lynching." Which is unfavorably...

[LittleGrizzly]

Seeing as we usually have something like a 10:1 ratio of good guys to bad guys random holmganging just seems like a good way for the town to kill themselves off, out of those 5 fights theres at best 1 bad guy, he may not even lose so from this fighting we could just lose 5 good guys and with CA (if he is pro-town god) then this is not a positive start....

Do challenges have to be accepted or for the good of the town can they be rejected ?

[Privateerkev]

Sigurd will only pick one fight. So, at worst, we will only lose one townie. But, if the game goes long, those deaths add up. If it drags on and comes down to the wire, we might regret all of those 'joke-Holmgangs' just like some of us regret the meatball votes, abstains, lurking, inactivity, and other anti-town distractions in past games.

[Gaius Scribonius Curio]

I never played the previous version of Midgard, and as such I have little idea how good my 'holmgang stats are in comparision to everyone else. Something to consider however...

Sigurd surely will have thought of the fact that early in the game there will be joke holmgangs. There is every possibility that a Jotun will be the victim of one of these. If so it is likely that the Jotun will have fairly high stats in order to survive. In addition, I feel the Holm-gang is more to add flavour rather than be used as a viable alternative to lynching. Finally aren't the Jotun Ice-giants? I certainly wouldn't want to test my fighting skills with one of those...

I'd assume they'd rip little old me apart...

Edit: See Seamus above, already confirmed my fears...