Britain adopts Sharia law. Is this true?

[Goofball]

And what of the Jewish courts already in place?

I refer you to my earlier post in this thread, #84.

[Rhyfelwyr]

ah, ok. so these women who are so cowed under by the oppressive males that dominate their society will be walking into the magistrates office to file for divorce, get their child support, sue for battery and rape, etc?

And how will bringing the same prejudice into the law help?

[KarlXII]

And how will bringing the same prejudice into the law help?

Isn't prejudice always present in the law?

[Goofball]

Isn't prejudice always present in the law?

Sure, but can you show me a statute in British law that says "In matters of inheritance, female children are entitled to a share 50% smaller than that of their brothers?"

[KarlXII]

Sure, but can you show me a statute in British law that says "In matters of inheritance, female children are entitled to a share 50% smaller than that of their brothers?"

Can you also show me where this is present in Muslim law?

[Rhyfelwyr]

Isn't prejudice always present in the law?

Yes but this is systematically implementing it deliberately.

[Big_John]

And how will bringing the same prejudice into the law help?

who said it will?

i think all religion needs to be abolished from law. i hope one day humanity will evolve beyond the need for religion entirely. however, much of the outrage about this issue is simple bigotry. some of that bigotry is riding on the concern for muslim women train, but that doesn't diminish it.

yeah, women are repressed in certain muslim households and whatnot. we know. i don't see how this arbitration act is really going to exacerbate that situation, though. the problem is the society, not this act, which will provide religious arbitration to muslims in a nation that already provides such to other religious groups. if you are going to do it, do it right.

[Goofball]

Can you also show me where this is present in Muslim law?

Dude, read the article that is the subject of this thread:

Siddiqi said that in a recent inheritance dispute handled by the court in Nuneaton, the estate of a Midlands man was divided between three daughters and two sons.
The judges on the panel gave the sons twice as much as the daughters, in accordance with sharia. Had the family gone to a normal British court, the daughters would have got equal amounts.

[KarlXII]

Dude, read the article that is the subject of this thread:

OH NOES. THE JUDGES MADE AN UNFAIR RULING, DAMN ISLAM, DAMN IT TO HELL!

[Strike For The South]

OH NOES. THE JUDGES MADE AN UNFAIR RULING, DAMN ISLAM, DAMN IT TO HELL!

This has nothing to do with Islam. I find it weird that a western nation is even allowing religious courts to make decisions on their soil. Any religion.

[Crazed Rabbit]

so we will focus on one aspect of sharia law (inequity amongst male and female parties)? so what is the problem here, that the act that allows sharia arbitration or the pre-existing social inequity in certain fundamentalist muslim relationships?

what would repealing this act (specifically for sharia) actually accomplish?

That Sharia court decisions would not have the force of law behind them. This is making the situation worse.

CR

[KarlXII]

This has nothing to do with Islam. I find it weird that a western nation is even allowing religious courts to make decisions on their soil. Any religion.

I wholeheartedly agree.

[Strike For The South]

I wholeheartedly agree.

Then why are you defending them?

[KarlXII]

Then why are you defending them?

When did I ever announce my support, or defend them?

If you mean the "SHARIA COURTS R BAD BECUZ A JUDGE RULED SEXIST", I'm simply pointing out this was an unfair ruling, yes, but to say every ruling a Sharia court will make will be this is like saying putting a black man on death row means every black man convicted is going to the chair.

[Strike For The South]

When did I ever announce my support, or defend them?

If you mean the "SHARIA COURTS R BAD BECUZ A JUDGE RULED SEXIST", I'm simply pointing out this was an unfair ruling, yes, but to say every ruling a Sharia court will make will be this is like saying putting a black man on death row means every black man convicted is going to the chair.

Sharia law is unfair, you know the rules in Saudi Arabia right?

[Crazed Rabbit]

Strike - the lefties defend them because they're minorities.

Only a very few lefties will criticize minorities. They are by nature against the majority, and since that thought has formed in the west, it's always the white, Christian man who is wrong. Minorities are oppressed; they can't be wrong.

yeah, women are repressed in certain muslim households and whatnot. we know. i don't see how this arbitration act is really going to exacerbate that situation, though. the problem is the society, not this act, which will provide religious arbitration to muslims in a nation that already provides such to other religious groups. if you are going to do it, do it right.

This cements the results of that misogyny and oppression into law. The other religious courts (the Jewish ones) don't have this problem. If the hardliners forming vigilante groups in Jerusalem were around, it would be an issue, but they are not, so it isn't.

Secondly it seems a bit unfair that we for example allow jewish courts in the same manner so why not muslims ?

Just because there are other religious courts doesn't mean it should be okay for any religious courts to operate.

Why? Listen carefully, because this might be hard for some lefties:
Not all religions are equal. Some are morally worse than others. You cannot live forever in a wishy-washy world of moral relativism and treat unequals as though they are equal.

We are giving another tool to misogynistic oppressors to force their will on their victims. We are allowing their bigotry to take root in a greater area of society, and putting the weight of a western country's justice system behind it. How anyone can defend that is beyond me.

CR

[KarlXII]

Sharia law is unfair, you know the rules in Saudi Arabia right?

Yes I do.

I found something of interest. A Qadi, Sharia judge, cannot discriminate based off race, sex, religion, culture etc.

So this technically means the basis of the ruling of the inheritence was in violation of that. Interesting?

[Strike For The South]

Yes I do.

I found something of interest. A Qadi, Sharia judge, cannot discriminate based off race, sex, religion, culture etc.

So this technically means the basis of the ruling of the inheritence was in violation of that. Interesting?

....If you really think thats how these things work. Im no longer speaking to you

[Fragony]

OH NOES. THE JUDGES MADE AN UNFAIR RULING, DAMN ISLAM, DAMN IT TO HELL!

Interesting, classical case.

[KarlXII]

....If you really think thats how these things work. Im no longer speaking to you

I'm not saying that's how it works. I'm saying that's how it's supposed to work.

Argh!

My opinion: Abolish the courts, Islamic, Jewish, Hindu, it doesn't matter. Religious courts have no place in Western law.

[Strike For The South]

I'm not saying that's how it works. I'm saying that's how it's supposed to work.
.

Theories are great aren't they!

[ICantSpellDawg]

My opinion: Abolish the courts, Islamic, Jewish, Hindu, it doesn't matter. Religious courts have no place in Western law.

Exactly!!! Bravo SwedishFish. Welcome to the world of the mentally living! 1 legal standard - all equal before the law.

Religious courts can exist, but they can't have any governmental legal authority.

[AlexanderSextus]

Theories are great aren't they!

yeah, they are huh!! like that one, oh... what was it again, oh yeah COMMUNISM. Such a good theory.

[KarlXII]

Exactly!!! Bravo SwedishFish. Welcome to the world of the mentally living! 1 legal standard - all equal before the law.

I find it strange you would think I would support any religious court.

[KarlXII]

yeah, they are huh!! like that one, oh... what was it again, oh yeah COMMUNISM. Such a good theory.

Communism and Islam go hand in hand, right ?

Next time, in AlexanderSextus's world:

"Homosexuality and Islam, the hidden truth!"

[Fragony]

Communism and Islam go hand in hand, right ?

Yep, it's the import-proletariat that needs to liberated from the oppression that is living in a free society. Not being allowed to take 5 breaks for prayer, not getting a job because you insist on wearing raditional islamic ware and refuse to shake women's hand? Was it for this the clay grew tall?

O.P.P.R.E.S.S.I.O.N.

[Tribesman]

This is funny .

Had the family gone to a normal British court, the daughters would have got equal amounts.

Nope , if these daughters had gone to a normal British court and applied for an equal share they may have got an equal share , or if these children had made no submission to the courts on how to share the estate they would have got an equal share .
So since some people here want to take an example and go "its so unfair !!!!!" ...what are the details of this case ? what is the nature of the estate , what is the status of the children , has the mother predeceased her husband or has she waived her right to the entire estate ?
Inheritance laws eh ? children get equal shares don't they unless ...oh there is lots of unless isn't there , lots of different provisions and possible agreements .
Next thing is someone is going to suggest that a woman always gets 50% of the family holdings in a divorce case because that is the law so that is what happens .

That is what is funny about this , so many people going "look at this case" yet none has looked at it at all apart from some news reports on the verdict .

But anyway our honestly muslim loving non racist who doesn't have a problem with immigrants has thrown another doozy into the topic .

. Not being allowed to take 5 breaks for prayer

Wow Frag you really make them Muslims work long hours over there don't ya

[Fragony]

Ah there bees ze manifestation of ze leftist blind spot in ze flesh, epic faillure is yours once again.

By the way, did I already tell you I have muslim friends, look at my profile if you don't believe me, Hi Mouz qui pasa!

[InsaneApache]

Concerning the unequal treatment meted out in these so called 'courts'. This isn't just a Moslem thing. There is a very similar attitude in southern Europe. I've just got back from visiting my dad, who regulars will know, lives in Greece. There the attitude shown to the sons is vastly different from that shown to the daughters.

Also it might be as well to remember that the same attitudes were prevelent in the west until comparitavely recently. It's only about 80 years since women got the vote in the UK and the US. That, in conjuction with two world wars, has changed the perception of women a lot.

This came after a long struggle for universal suffrage, which in itself came about after universal education. That is the key. Education.

[Tribesman]

By the way, did I already tell you I have muslim friends

an absolute classic . A reworking of the old "I ain't a racist I have a black friend" , which is normally followed by .....a racist rant .
Well done frag you really are a laugh a minute .