The Great Game, another loss

**Fragony** · 10-11-2008, 08:34

Originally Posted by Kadagar_AV

QFT

However, if you would have gone after saudi arabia, at least the europeans wouldnt scratch their heads wondering "hmm... now why did they do that?"

Oh common the same guys that are crying foul now are the same ones crying foul when supposedly a genocide was being conducted in our own backyard. What pacifist europeans think should never be taken into consideration just because of the very fact that they can't think, they want to be a paralel universe despite not being one.

**Koga No Goshi** · 10-11-2008, 08:49

Originally Posted by Fragony

Oh common the same guys that are crying foul now are the same ones crying foul when supposedly a genocide was being conducted in our own backyard. What pacifist europeans think should never be taken into consideration just because of the very fact that they can't think, they want to be a paralel universe despite not being one.

Well hey you could spin that around, I find it annoying that so many European hawks disillusioned with their own governments use the internet to voice vehement support of anything reckless and aggressive the U.S. does. I don't think Europe's approval OR disapproval changes the fact that the way we're handling the war on terror is very bad, and bankrupting us for very little return.

**Fragony** · 10-11-2008, 09:06

Originally Posted by Koga No Goshi

Well hey you could spin that around, I find it annoying that so many European hawks disillusioned with their own governments use the internet to voice vehement support of anything reckless and aggressive the U.S. does. I don't think Europe's approval OR disapproval changes the fact that the way we're handling the war on terror is very bad, and bankrupting us for very little return.

It is not spinning around it is accepting that there is a difference between what you want and what it is. Shooting bad guys, I can't think of a better way of dealing with terrorists really. AdrianII is hardly a hawk, you wondered if I was the most rightwing person in the netherlands, well there is my leftist non-hubris and much apreciated nemesis.

**Koga No Goshi** · 10-11-2008, 09:16

Originally Posted by Fragony

It is not spinning around it is accepting that there is a difference between what you want and what it is. Shooting bad guys, I can't think of a better way of dealing with terrorists really. AdrianII is hardly a hawk, you wondered if I was the most rightwing person in the netherlands, well there is my leftist non-hubris and much apreciated nemesis.

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So, all America has to do, is keep up the billions we are bleeding out every month, until we "shoot every last bad guy."

That's fine talk, from someone whose great-grandkids aren't going to be paying the bill.

You really believe this is a sensible response to terrorism? That we have achieved optimal results for the investment put in?

**Fragony** · 10-11-2008, 09:24

Originally Posted by Koga No Goshi

..............................................

So, all America has to do, is keep up the billions we are bleeding out every month, until we "shoot every last bad guy."

That's fine talk, from someone whose great-grandkids aren't going to be paying the bill.

You really believe this is a sensible response to terrorism? That we have achieved optimal results for the investment put in?

Not just america, also england, australia, poland, norway, germany, france, holland, belgium, canada england, denmark, not all shooting but all helping neverthless.

Great investment, no dead beard is likely to become alive again, saves us 30 tennis tables and community centres here.

**Koga No Goshi** · 10-11-2008, 10:04

Originally Posted by Fragony

Not just america, also england, australia, poland, norway, germany, france, holland, belgium, canada england, denmark, not all shooting but all helping neverthless.

Great investment, no dead beard is likely to become alive again, saves us 30 tennis tables and community centres here.

I'm just glad you're nowhere near a meeting of the Joint Chiefs or a budget meeting. :)

**Incongruous** · 10-11-2008, 09:11

Originally Posted by Fragony

Oh common the same guys that are crying foul now are the same ones crying foul when supposedly a genocide was being conducted in our own backyard. What pacifist europeans think should never be taken into consideration just because of the very fact that they can't think, they want to be a paralel universe despite not being one.

I might do a Tribesman...

You mean that reality where Afghanistan was never planned properly and never conducted properly? Where the thing has been such a cock up that it is likely to re-create the conditions which leade to 9/11?

Yeah what a load of tossers they are!

**Fragony** · 10-11-2008, 09:20

Originally Posted by Bopa the Magyar

I might do a Tribesman...

You mean that reality where Afghanistan was never planned properly and never conducted properly? Where the thing has been such a cock up that it is likely to re-create the conditions which leade to 9/11?

Yeah what a load of tossers they are!

YEAH OMGWTFLOL

Make sure you look less rediculous when you do it, Tribesman has an excuse he is usually drunk and all the better for it, but what is your excuse, right now being this early in the morning?

Taliban bad = dead Taliban good,

capice?

**Brenus** · 10-12-2008, 00:53

“Oh common the same guys that are crying foul now are the same ones crying foul when supposedly a genocide was being conducted in our own backyard.”
Well, aren’t they the same crying about Russian Intervention against Georgia?
I agree. I do remember all the reports and news about the Talibans, public hanging, widow dying of starvation because no right to work, no doctors for women for the same reason and the fact tat a man can’t touch a woman, a country back to the stone age, no music, nothing just a plain theocratic dictatorship. The intellectuals making noises for supporting Massoud and its Northern Alliance… Hey guys it is done… The “right of intervention” at work…
I supported the Russian intervention against the apprentice genocider, I support the US intervention in Afghanistan. I wish we would have done that in Former Yugoslavia at the start, when the Croats started to hunt the Serbs in Vukovar…
Can we expect better for Afghanistan. Yes. It was better, not perfect, under the king. I have not a great admiration of kings in general, but it did work, even under the communist rule…

“You mean that reality where Afghanistan was never planned properly and never conducted properly? Where the thing has been such a cock up that it is likely to re-create the conditions which leade to 9/11?”
Probably not well planned, I think. Who would have planned to invade Afghanistan before? So, it leads to improvisation meaning alliances with the Northern Alliances, and few war lords, and the disaster of Bora Bora. And of course no planning for development and democratisation, civil society and Post War Psycho-Social Progrmme, demining etc...
To invade a country is not so much a problem, to keep is. In fact to make it safe is.
Yes, the US founded and trained the guys who killed them. Yes, the US Foreign Policy was so blind by the “Communist” menace they didn’t see the other one coming. They forget that the best enemy of communism s fascism and Nazism because they hunt on the same grounds
But no, the Taliban have no chance to win without the support of a big power… Like the one they had against USSR. And apparently Putine and co thing a little bit clearer than the Reagan Administration…

**Fragony** · 10-12-2008, 10:53

Originally Posted by Brenus

Well, aren’t they the same crying about Russian Intervention against Georgia?

Nope they have succesfully mentally blocked that, they are currently undecided nobody has told them what to think.

**Incongruous** · 10-12-2008, 12:08

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...r-Taliban.html

Mmmhmm, the smell of history about to repeat itself, Taliban no.2 here we come!

Brenus what are you talking about?
I'm sorry but are you in support of the "intervention"? Or are you pointing out that it has been a cockup?
Again stop going on about the women for God's sake they still do not have it better, in fact most of them have it worse off.

**Kralizec** · 10-12-2008, 20:49

Originally Posted by Bopa the Magyar

Again stop going on about the women for God's sake they still do not have it better, in fact most of them have it worse off.

Care to support that?

Afghanistan was practicly a collection of stone age tribes in 2001. The only reason that some people (and women in particular) are arguably worse off is because the Taliban targets people wich are perceived to be pro-Kabul and have started getting illusions about being free to walk umolested in public, etc. The Taliban's reign was the proverbial bad peace that's worse than war.

I've not given up mentally on Afghanistan myself by the way, but a lot will depend on what happens in Pakistan.