HAIKU MAFIA: The Cutting Word [Concluded]

**Askthepizzaguy** · 11-17-2010, 03:36

Good game guys. I blew it when I grabbed onto classical_hero and wouldn't let go. Had I instead chosen Joooray who I was sure was creeping up the scum meter for going after me (the case on me WAS ridiculous), we would have been fine.

**Joooray** · 11-17-2010, 11:22

Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

Good game guys. I blew it when I grabbed onto classical_hero and wouldn't let go. Had I instead chosen Joooray who I was sure was creeping up the scum meter for going after me (the case on me WAS ridiculous), we would have been fine.

I don't know, I liked it.

Yeah, it was me trying to look super innocent, I thought if I just joined the bandwagon and ignored the bad feeling about you and Sprig that was expressed by others, I might appear more scum, than by adding to the case against you, which had no chance of succeeding that day anyway. But I guess it was a bit much and might have gotten me lynched the next day, which was the only scenario in which we actually could have lost at that point. So, yeah, dodged a bullet there.

**Askthepizzaguy** · 11-17-2010, 11:30

Originally Posted by Joooray

I don't know, I liked it.

Yeah, it was me trying to look super innocent, I thought if I just joined the bandwagon and ignored the bad feeling about you and Sprig that was expressed by others, I might appear more scum, than by adding to the case against you, which had no chance of succeeding that day anyway. But I guess it was a bit much and might have gotten me lynched the next day, which was the only scenario in which we actually could have lost at that point. So, yeah, dodged a bullet there.

The reason it wasn't a good case was because my behavior was demonstrably not what you said it was, and I was able to rally townies to my side and avoid being lynched.

Had the wagon been on someone besides classical, it would have been a bad move for you to go after me like that. The real error was mine, but the case you put up against me wasn't strong and I was able to deflect it. Like I said, I blame myself for not capitalizing like I should have.

**Joooray** · 11-17-2010, 12:38

Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

The reason it wasn't a good case was because my behavior was demonstrably not what you said it was, and I was able to rally townies to my side and avoid being lynched.

Had the wagon been on someone besides classical, it would have been a bad move for you to go after me like that. The real error was mine, but the case you put up against me wasn't strong and I was able to deflect it. Like I said, I blame myself for not capitalizing like I should have.

Yeah, I've never been very good it making strong cases against others. But making a case out of little while knowing it is wrong is even harder.

**Askthepizzaguy** · 11-17-2010, 12:59

Originally Posted by Joooray

Yeah, I've never been very good it making strong cases against others. But making a case out of little while knowing it is wrong is even harder.

As you probably know, roughly 50% of the actual cases I toss at mafia suspects while town are entirely contrived. I take a little bit of actual suspicious evidence and I combine it with other things which look suspicious but don't really conclude one way or another. I combine that with the usual emotional trickery and that usually sells it.

Even as townie you have to embellish and sell your case, otherwise it won't be popular. So one could say I do exactly what I do as townie when I am mafia... which is try to convince people based on a little bit of truth and a little bit of opinion and a lot of selling. That's why it is hard to tell when I am mafia or not (woe be upon me).

It always has to make sense as an accusation, though; if for example the case was I'm defending Sprig, then it has to hold up in the most dire example, which was his near-death experience. I didn't bat an eye. That's one of the reasons your case smelled wrong to me.

It was wrong enough to make me immediately suspect you; that's the kind of thing you have to avoid. If it is a lie you tell, you want to try to make it consistent for the entire game, no matter what it is. If at one point during the game it rings inconsistent, and someone remembers why, then you generally can get called out on it.

But Sprig's gambit fooled me. I don't like to take that kind of risk when I am mafia, and that's why it never registered. I started trying to look at the game from a Sprig is innocent viewpoint, and that's a bad foundation to work from.

Sprig let me implode, and that's a good strategy when mafia against me; get past my senses and then let me toss myself off a cliff.

**Joooray** · 11-17-2010, 17:42

Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

It always has to make sense as an accusation, though; if for example the case was I'm defending Sprig, then it has to hold up in the most dire example, which was his near-death experience. I didn't bat an eye. That's one of the reasons your case smelled wrong to me.

Yeah, but I didn't save him there either, not even in private with my ability to add one vote. Isn't saving someone from the lynch the most obvious way of showing a connection. That's why your argument of not having saved Sprig at that point didn't stick with me.

Anyway, I have to put a some major work into my ability to play when I'm mafia. Here I apparently got lucky, but the Star Wars game over at the TWC was a disaster.

**classical_hero** · 11-18-2010, 12:57

So Renata and ATPG, if we work together, we can do much damage against those who are mafia.

**classical_hero** · 11-17-2010, 11:32

Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

Good game guys. I blew it when I grabbed onto classical_hero and wouldn't let go. Had I instead chosen Joooray who I was sure was creeping up the scum meter for going after me (the case on me WAS ridiculous), we would have been fine.

Well you did the dirty work for the mafia by getting the lynch onto me. I was correct in my suspicions of sprig and yet you did not listen to me. It was a shame we did not have enough people, since their might have been a chance for the town to get onto the mafia, but we did not have a chance. two killers for this small group is too many.

**Askthepizzaguy** · 11-17-2010, 11:36

Originally Posted by classical_hero

Well you did the dirty work for the mafia by getting the lynch onto me. I was correct in my suspicions of sprig and yet you did not listen to me. It was a shame we did not have enough people, since their might have been a chance for the town to get onto the mafia, but we did not have a chance. two killers for this small group is too many.

Townie MVP: Classical_hero

I admit, I screwed this one up.

**Renata** · 11-17-2010, 14:24

Originally Posted by classical_hero

Well you did the dirty work for the mafia by getting the lynch onto me. I was correct in my suspicions of sprig and yet you did not listen to me. It was a shame we did not have enough people, since their might have been a chance for the town to get onto the mafia, but we did not have a chance. two killers for this small group is too many.

I disagree; we (collectively) just got outplayed. It happens. Kudos for calling out Sprig.

**Renata** · 11-17-2010, 14:19

Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

Good game guys. I blew it when I grabbed onto classical_hero and wouldn't let go. Had I instead chosen Joooray who I was sure was creeping up the scum meter for going after me (the case on me WAS ridiculous), we would have been fine.

I wanted to vote Joooray by then, too, but my

role hampered me. If I was right, but couldn't push it through in time, my chances of being killed and thus ending the game would have gone way up. I can't believe that one extraneous "a" is the reason I was killed. Argh!

You're absolutely right, though. And even more so from my perspective. I really did get a bit of BS whiff from your posts (up until your obvious frustration over CH, which changed my mind). But that's a reason peculiar to me, and I knew my own alignment. CH's vote was also understandable. But Joooray's was not. Although he did very well with his reasoning otherwise (even about Sprig), that vote was pure opportunism.

Regardless, a very strong game from Sprig and Joooray.

**Askthepizzaguy** · 11-17-2010, 14:31

Originally Posted by Renata

I wanted to vote Joooray by then, too, but my

role hampered me. If I was right, but couldn't push it through in time, my chances of being killed and thus ending the game would have gone way up. I can't believe that one extraneous "a" is the reason I was killed. Argh!

You're absolutely right, though. And even more so from my perspective. I really did get a bit of BS whiff from your posts (up until your obvious frustration over CH, which changed my mind). But that's a reason peculiar to me, and I knew my own alignment. CH's vote was also understandable. But Joooray's was not. Although he did very well with his reasoning otherwise (even about Sprig), that vote was pure opportunism.

Regardless, a very strong game from Sprig and Joooray.

Good, then the obviousness of Joooray's guilt wasn't just my imagination; and I felt by the end it should have been clear I was being genuine to those who were paying close attention. I'm glad you made the right judgment there. You get points for noticing I wasn't scum in time.

I am having trouble telling classical as townie from classical as mafia. Game was too short and his posts were too few to get an accurate reading.