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  1. #1
    Xsaçapāvan é Skudra Member Atraphoenix's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ionians in Bactria?

    But Aristagoras was unequal to the occasion; and the struggle for independence, which had promised so fair, was soon put down. Despite a naval victory gained by the Greeks over the Phoenician fleet off Cyprus, that island was recovered by the Persians within a year. Despite a courage and a perseverance worthy of a better fate, the Carians were soon afterwards forced to succumb. The reduction of the Hellespontine Greeks and of the AEolians followed. The toils now closed around Ionia, and her cities began to be attacked one by one; whereupon the incapable Aristagoras, deserting the falling cause, betook himself to Europe, where a just Nemesis pursued him: he died by a Thracian sword. After this the climax soon arrived. Persia concentrated her strength upon Miletus, the cradle of the revolt, and the acknowledged chief of the cities; and though her sister states came gallantly to her aid, and a fleet was collected which made it for a while doubtful which way victory might incline, yet all was of no avail. Laziness and insubordination began and treachery completed the work which all the force of Persia might have failed to accomplish; the combined Ionian fleet was totally defeated in the battle of Lade; and soon after Miletus herself fell. The bulk of her inhabitants were transported into inner Asia and settled upon the Persian Gulf. The whole Ionian coast was ravaged, and the cities punished by the loss of their most beautiful maidens and youths. The islands off the coast were swept of their inhabitants. The cities on the Hellespont and Sea of Marmora were burnt. Miltiades barely escaped from the Chersonese with the loss of his son and his kingdom. The flames of rebellion were everywhere ruthlessly trampled out; and the power of the Great King was once more firmly established over the coasts and islands of the Propontis and the Egean Sea.


    THE SEVEN GREAT MONARCHIES
    OF THE
    ANCIENT EASTERN WORLD;
    OR,
    THE HISTORY, GEOGRAPHY, AND ANTIQUITIES OF CHALDAEA, ASSYRIA
    BABYLON, MEDIA, PERSIA, PARTHIA, AND SASSANIAN,
    OR NEW PERSIAN EMPIRE.
    BY
    GEORGE RAWLINSON, M.A.,
    My sources confirms it but it says Inner Asia.



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  2. #2
    Member Member WinsingtonIII's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ionians in Bactria?

    Quote Originally Posted by Atraphoenix View Post
    My sources confirms it but it says Inner Asia.
    That plus the reference to the Persian Gulf would seem to suggest Mesopotamia (or southern Iran) as opposed to Baktria.
    from Megas Methuselah, for some information on Greek colonies in Iberia.



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    Lost between books & coins Member DeathFinger's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ionians in Bactria?

    Quintus Curtius Rufus tells us about the Branchidai of Milet, who were exiled in Bactria for safety by Xerxes, because they supported the Persians. They are said to have been met by Alexander when he was here, and being killed by vengeance (Life of Alexander VII. V, 28-35). Of interest is the passage when Curtius says that they have kept the uses of their homeland, but spoke the double language and were half-blooded. We cannot be sure if the story of the Branchidai even has something right, but at least it shows that it certainly existed some communauties deep inside Persian empire.


    Quote Originally Posted by The Mad Arab
    This is also reflected in the Chinese name for the place, "Da-Yuan", (Great Ionia).
    This is not a consensus. Here from Tarn, The Greeks in Bactria and India, 1938 (not up-to-date but Tarn keeps to be a pillar in this kind of matter)

    Naturally I agree with those who have said that Ta-yuan does not mean 'the great land of the Yavanas'; it is enough that the Ch'ien-han-shu knows of a 'little Yuan', Siao-yuan, in the Tarim basin, which had nothing to do with Greeks3

    3=Wylie p. 28, de Groot p. 64 (Sao-wan). The latter (p. 12) says there is no traceable connection between Ta-wan and Sao-wan; all the less likely, therefore, is it that yuan (or wan) should be Yavana
    Sure we can wondering what was called Yavana by the Chinese and Hu peoples, but at least we cannot took this name like a proof of Greek presence here.

  4. #4

    Default Re: Ionians in Bactria?

    Thanks to everybody for answering. So, from what I have read here, there are some sources which confirm it but there is noe nough evidence. Though, it would make sense given the amount of greeks in the Bactrian Kingdom.

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    Member Member Hax's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ionians in Bactria?

    My sources confirms it but it says Inner Asia.
    Intriguing. "Inner Asia" from a modern perspective would probably correspond to the Tajikistan/Uzbekistan/Afghanistan area, but the mention of the Persian Gulf would remind me of either current-day Basra or perhaps Pars. Still, it would be kinda odd for the Persians to move a people to their homeland.

    This is not a consensus. Here from Tarn, The Greeks in Bactria and India, 1938 (not up-to-date but Tarn keeps to be a pillar in this kind of matter)
    Aah, interesting. Thank you.

    Apparently, I was wrong. My apologies.
    This space intentionally left blank.

  6. #6

    Default Re: Ionians in Bactria?

    Uh Eastern peoples referred to all greeks as Ionians since it ultimately kame from the Persian word for Ionian. So Ionians in Bactria might just be a linguistic mistranslation.

  7. #7
    Lost between books & coins Member DeathFinger's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ionians in Bactria?

    Yes, the word Yauna/Yawna means "Greek", probably because the first Greeks met by the Persian presented themselves as Ionians. Nevertheless, speaking of exil made by the Persians, there's more chance that they deported Ionians than Greeks of Europe, for obvious reasons ;)

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    Guest Member Populus Romanus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ionians in Bactria?

    Quote Originally Posted by DeathFinger View Post
    Quintus Curtius Rufus tells us about the Branchidai of Milet, who were exiled in Bactria for safety by Xerxes, because they supported the Persians. They are said to have been met by Alexander when he was here, and being killed by vengeance (Life of Alexander VII. V, 28-35). Of interest is the passage when Curtius says that they have kept the uses of their homeland, but spoke the double language and were half-blooded. We cannot be sure if the story of the Branchidai even has something right, but at least it shows that it certainly existed some communauties deep inside Persian empire.




    This is not a consensus. Here from Tarn, The Greeks in Bactria and India, 1938 (not up-to-date but Tarn keeps to be a pillar in this kind of matter)



    Sure we can wondering what was called Yavana by the Chinese and Hu peoples, but at least we cannot took this name like a proof of Greek presence here.
    Alexander killed those Greeks? How horrible!

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    Xsaçapāvan é Skudra Member Atraphoenix's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ionians in Bactria?

    AFAIR He gave no mercy Greek Mercenaries on Persian Armies.
    War is war...



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  10. #10

    Default Re: Ionians in Bactria?

    I never realized until this thread that I have been calling the Greeks by the name of the Ionians. Greeks I call huyn(a). As a side note, the Sarmatians and Saka we call the sarmatner and sakaraukner, respectively.
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  11. #11

    Default Re: Ionians in Bactria?

    I think Alexander killed all Greeks who 'betrayed' the Macedonians to the Persians. Whether this was really rational, I don't know, because he and his father were just fresh from subjugating Hellas proper. But I think he would have claimed hegemony over all Greeks. One who betrayed his 'Greek Empire' to their ancient enemies the Persians would have been a very evil man in Alexander's eyes.
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