Dragon Age 2: Gameplay and Discussion

[Monk]

23 hours? Steam clocks me in at 26 hours, and I've just now completed

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the Arishok's quest to track down the thief of the poison plans.

Of course, I'm OCD when it comes to side and secondary quests. Leave no stone unturned.

What can I say? I move fast

I did however miss a number of things simply because they aren't glarringly obvious. I missed out on recruiting Fenris on my first go because I only did the bare minimum of side-quests in the first act. So i suppose you could say 20 hours is around the very bare minimum to expect on any given play through when you're ignoring half the content

Or how about one fight early on during a secondary quest which pits you against

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a revenant, two rage demons, a desire demon, an arcane horror, and a crapload of shades and abominations? All in the same room. I wiped so many times, mostly because, at that point in the game, I only had access ONE healer. Stupid Merrill and her "unique" specialization. I'm stuck with Anders for most of the game, unfortunately. At least Morrigan had the ability to choose Creation spells in Origins.

Don't even get me started on that fight. I will freely admit i've bumped the difficulty down a notch here and there when i spent a full hour wiping on the same encounter just to get by. These high end fights are just not fun. Well, some are. But most like the ones you and Khaan describe are not.

The only "bug" I've encountered so far was bad clipping on armor models (including my companions' armor). Hands should not be able to clip through your thigh when talking, nor should your butt clip through your chest armor.

It's toward the final act, but I saw a number of quests bugging and encounters simply not loading properly. Might be one-time glitches (wrong place, wrong time) but it really set me off.

Do agree on Interparty banter though. It's one of the highlights of the game.

[rajpoot]

Got the game today. Been playing like crazy. Actually forcing myself to play like crazy because this is nothing like DAO. I just want to know what can happens at the end....otherwise the combat seems different (and unlikeable) and there are too few companion conversations (I literally jump with joy when I see the quest/marker to go and talk with a companion).
The really messed this game catering for those who weren't into Origins.

[Kekvit Irae]

After contemplating a bit, I know of another bug. A huge one, at that.
If you use Anders' Regroup spell or a restoration potion to revive dead team members in combat, sometimes they will act like they aren't even in combat because the game doesn't recognize them as being in combat. Sure, they'll attack, but they act lethargic. When controlling said character, autoattack is non-existent. For affected characters, they will be regenerating health and stamina/mana like crazy. This is definitely game-breaking as it makes characters like Varric with Bianca abilities or an Assassin Hawke completely unstoppable if controlled. I've had this happen several times (mostly because Anders is the only damn mage in the game with healing spells, thus forcing me to use him in every fight).

[TinCow]

Yes, I've encountered that same bug several times and it's very annoying. That and the bug where I can't click on a target (be it a door or an enemy) are very common and I'm amazed they let that slip through testing.

[TinCow]

I will give Bioware a big thumbs up on at least one plot point: Varric's companion question. Specifically when you first go to a particular house (further details omitted due to spoilers). That was very inventive, and I fell in love with it instantly. In fact, combined with the similar style of the 'tutorial' section at the beginning, I'm becoming rather fond of the 'narration' aspect of the story.

[Riedquat]

Well, about 33 hours logged on the current character, and just recently became "champion". Now I'm stuck on another crazy hard fight....

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Stumbled into a High Dragon fight back at the mine after. Holy dicks, that fight's just not fair. Thought I was doing decently well after fighting off the first 'ling rush and continuing to whittle down the high dragon's health. But that second 'ling rush headed by an adult dragon, all while the high dragon was nuking from... on high. Right, I might try it later.

Finished the game in four sittings, it took around 38 hours, skipped a lot of side quests and companions quests, I have a million questions and a terrible headache ;)

About crazy hard fights...

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The dragon high fight (whoever implemented this fight in game was for sure high)... I had to change party members twice to get it done, I hadn't a real problem with the dragon-lings waves or the adult dragon[s] (weren't they 2 or 3?) but with the big spitting fireballs at me for more than 15 minutes after I killed the second wave and refusing to land in the battlefield, while I spent the time running all along the field trying to evade them and waiting till I could use another restoration potion ; I'm not sure if I fell in a glitch or it's scripted this way but the only thing that worked to get the dragon out of that untouchable position was staying in one place and getting hit a couple of times by the fire spit.

Playing as rogue it wasn't a real hard fight, difficult for sure, annoying like no one else but not really hard for the fight per se. What was really a hard fight was dueling with the Arishok... experience I dont want to repeat anytime soon, spent a quarter of the time running from him, a quarter being impaled by his sword and the other quarter crying like a little girl while awaiting my health and stamina to rise a bit, I won the fight with 1 point of health left and thanks to the columns in the hall where the fight takes place, I don't know you but I really feel I truly deserved the champion tittle

[seireikhaan]

Well, clocked in around 45 hours, and its done. Plan is to give it at least one more playthrough, with a non-mage character. Overall thoughts and feelings:

The final boss(at least for me, I imagine different choices will alter the order or possibly who you even fight at all, idk, ) was quite fun and enjoyable. Much more well designed than most of the boss fights.

Bioware was on the ball for companions, of what we got to see of them. The interaction wasn't to the degree I wanted, but even Isabella was an enjoyable party member, which I seriously doubted when I started. The choices made in the later game mostly resulted in reactions that I figured would happen, which was a relief. No general nonsensical decisions by your party members, at least in my experience. I particularly enjoyed Varrick, who pretty much is the only reason the 'story-telling' format worked. Companion quests(well, those I did, I lost Isabella somewhat early) were all pretty fun. Once again, Varrick shone on his quests.

Combat, structurally, is fantastic, imo. Kiting generally works like it feels it should. The problem is too often, the fights weren't well balanced, so you were forced to kite the whole battle, which is distinctly un-fun. Mages were given the proper neutering they needed, but I'm not sure they found the balance quite right on rogues. Assassins in particular are immensely frustrating. One assassin at a time on the battlefield makes things interesting and challenging. Two just means you're likely to start the battle one party member down, which I don't consider particularly fair.

Random notes, bugs, irritants, etc...:

Level design. Seriously, Bioware? C'mon. This is the sequel to the massive, varied game I loved? Did they can the whole level design staff sans one person? I feel like I beat a 4 hour game a whole bunch of times. This was easily my biggest disclaimer on this game. Give some darn variety! I don't need or want to go through this same fragging underground or cavern or house for the 100th time. Enough to make me say this was a bad game? Honestly, almost. Not quite, but really close.

Only major bug I noticed was the clicking one TinCow noted. I don't consider it too game breaking(easy fix, pause button prevents shenanigans), but it did get annoying.

Pride Demon fights were quite interesting. The AOE crushing prison was quite nicely balanced, and an interesting touch. There was one fight which was, sadly, imbalanced once again by waves of rage demons, but oh well.

Champion's armor looks so close to being good, but ends up silly. What's with the protruding boilerplate sticking out of the chest piece?

Also, on the end:

For you all playing morally upright characters i'll warn you now to have one of your mages take up healing as a secondary.

For the final act:

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Your team picks sides in the Templar/Mage dispute, the only people left alive/left supporting me by this time were full friend, but I got the feeling they may have turned on me if they were Rival. I'm unsure, but you don't want to get caught on the other side of the isle from your tank/healer. There are some ROUGH fights ahead of you. Also.. Terrorism. Seriously.

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Very impressive terrorism, I might add.

Also, yeah, definitely try to get your party members some balance, and friends are a good thing. I ended up with a party consisting of myself(mage), Varrick, Merril, Anders, and Aveline. In other words, I was one friend short of not having a tank, and I'm pretty sure it was a close cutoff on her bailing too.

Also, Leliana? Really? Grah.... Curious what they make of it if you off her in Origins at Andraste's tomb.

To sum, there's lots of good, and lots of bad. Which is more bad than Origins, imo. Despite being hosed on how much you can converse with your party members, they still manage to shine. Despite poorly balanced fights occasionally rearing their ugly head, combat's generally a lot of fun. The story is good, and though the format isn't to my liking, it generally keeps itself in the background. If it wasn't for level design, I'd honestly say it was a pretty darn good game. But that element just knocks it down a fair number of pegs for me. Overall, I'd say about 7.5 or 8 out of 10. Bearing in mind, I consider Origins a 9.5. :/

[Scienter]

I agree with Yaseikhaan's opinion of the reused environments. In a lot of the dungeons I think, "I feel like I've been here before...wait, I have been here before!" The designers took a shortcut there. I'm not finished with the game yet, but I do wish there was more dialogue w/ the NPCs, and I really miss the "camp" from DA:O. Having to go to an NPC's home to talk with them is a bit of a pain.

I wish I could just

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move everyone to the Hawke estate when I got it

That said, I'm enjoying the game so far.

[Monk]

45 hours

38 hours

Jeeze what kept you guys?

To sum, there's lots of good, and lots of bad. Which is more bad than Origins, imo. Despite being hosed on how much you can converse with your party members, they still manage to shine. Despite poorly balanced fights occasionally rearing their ugly head, combat's generally a lot of fun. The story is good, and though the format isn't to my liking, it generally keeps itself in the background. If it wasn't for level design, I'd honestly say it was a pretty darn good game. But that element just knocks it down a fair number of pegs for me. Overall, I'd say about 7.5 or 8 out of 10. Bearing in mind, I consider Origins a 9.5. :/

That's pretty much how I feel with a few subtle changes here and there. Replace level design with incredibly annoying party interaction and yup, that's me. Party banter goes a long way to saving the experience but it can't quite make up for it in my opinion. Still thoroughly enjoy the game but I can't help but feel Bioware made some real stumbles here and there. Expected much better from this showing. Ah well. Even if it's not great, it's still good in my books.

I'm playing the game through a second time now as a pure Entropy mage, which is crowd control and debuffs (where before I was full elemental, AOE and control). The game is... surprisingly a lot easier. Taking Creation as a secondary tree so i am full on support for my team as well as some nasty status afflictions. It still doesn't help with some fights though. Mainly due to poor balance choices in the encounters. I'm of the opinion that the combat is a great improvement over the first, but just like the first, Bioware didn't bother to tune certain aspects of it to avoid random spikes in difficulty. A shame really, because it seems like combat was the main focus this time around.

The final boss(at least for me, I imagine different choices will alter the order or possibly who you even fight at all, idk, ) was quite fun and enjoyable. Much more well designed than most of the boss fights.

Final Boss fight spoilers:

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I supported the Magi and had to fight Orsino first, who turned to Blood Magic to save himself at the end. It was your standard tank+spank until phase 2 where he'd pick a party member and go after them, and then it was a game of keep away. Phase 3, his head jumps off his body and summons tons of additional mobs to fight while running wild on your party. COntroling phase 3 is very very hard. If you kill his head he rejoins together for another go and its just a game of keep away again. Fun, but LONG. Had to take 20 min to kill him.

Then I had to fight Meridith who was possessed by the artifact. A really easy fight mainly because I had built my team for mass AoE. When she summons additional just spam your aoe and kite around until Cone of Cold's up. Then blast 'em. She was the final boss for me, but I preferred the Orsino fight to be honest. It had a much bigger "Ah crap" feel to it.

The reason I suggested people have a back-up mage is.. well, I had to kill Anders for what he did. That was seriously a non-bro thing to do. Not cool at all, Anders.

[Kekvit Irae]

Well, I finally won the game. The lack of an epilogue added to my list of disappointments in the game.

[seireikhaan]

Jeeze what kept you guys?

Lots of side questing? I'm not sure how you beat the game so fast.

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If you didn't, I'd advise finding Hybris- he's a pretty fun fight if you notch the difficulty down to normal. Plus he gives you one of the sicker one-handed swords in the game. He wasn't part of any major quest, so its not hard to miss him.

I'm playing the game through a second time now as a pure Entropy mage, which is crowd control and debuffs (where before I was full elemental, AOE and control). The game is... surprisingly a lot easier. Taking Creation as a secondary tree so i am full on support for my team as well as some nasty status afflictions. It still doesn't help with some fights though. Mainly due to poor balance choices in the encounters. I'm of the opinion that the combat is a great improvement over the first, but just like the first, Bioware didn't bother to tune certain aspects of it to avoid random spikes in difficulty. A shame really, because it seems like combat was the main focus this time around.

Hmm. I pretty much skipped out on entropy. My only real experience with it(I think) was the occasional Arcane Horror ending my party with(I think) a death cloud. I'd gone full blood mage, a decent chunk of Force, and the full lightning/rock tree, with my only other dabbling being snagging upgraded heal. Blood magic gets pretty strong later game, if only for all the bonuses you can get for your health regeneration and health to mana ratio for blood casting. Final fight, I pretty much kept casting forever and with impunity as long as Aveline kept aggro. As long as I tempered my nuking, I could cast for just about forever.

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I supported the Magi and had to fight Orsino first, who turned to Blood Magic to save himself at the end. It was your standard tank+spank until phase 2 where he'd pick a party member and go after them, and then it was a game of keep away. Phase 3, his head jumps off his body and summons tons of additional mobs to fight while running wild on your party. COntroling phase 3 is very very hard. If you kill his head he rejoins together for another go and its just a game of keep away again. Fun, but LONG. Had to take 20 min to kill him.

Then I had to fight Meridith who was possessed by the artifact. A really easy fight mainly because I had built my team for mass AoE. When she summons additional just spam your aoe and kite around until Cone of Cold's up. Then blast 'em. She was the final boss for me, but I preferred the Orsino fight to be honest. It had a much bigger "Ah crap" feel to it.

The reason I suggested people have a back-up mage is.. well, I had to kill Anders for what he did. That was seriously a non-bro thing to do. Not cool at all, Anders.

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I had a pretty much identical route. The only difference was keeping Anders with me. Not sure if that was what ultimately scared Fenris off or not. I figured at that point, what's done is done. War's a gonna happen regardless of him being alive, so let's keep every healthy mage we can. Plus, I was just that impressed. I mean, did you see that explosion?

I didn't find the fights unreasonably difficult. Perhaps because I got that +5/6/7 to all stats rune into all of my companion's and mine's armor. That, and those statues in particular took ages to get moving, with the exception of the last two that dropped down and started firebreathing everything in sight. Orsino was an interesting fight, but probably one stage longer than necessary. Not super difficult assuming you've got a proper party arrangement, just long. Heck, the three rage demons waiting for you() outside of where you fight Orsino was a harder fight than either boss, if for no other reason than the usual mass-assassin spamming issues. Probably doing a non-mage playthrough just to explore the other possibilities.

[Kekvit Irae]

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I had a pretty much identical route. The only difference was keeping Anders with me. Not sure if that was what ultimately scared Fenris off or not.

Err... no. Sebastian certainly, but not Fenris.

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Fenris leaves no matter what if you side with the mages. If you mention to him about freeing slaves when confronted outside the Circle, and you have a good enough Friendship/Rivalry, he'll switch sides and join you again.

And regarding the First Enchanter...

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The whole thing felt like a rehash of the Golems of Amgarrak final boss, without the cool Fade shifting. Not as tough either.

[Greyblades]

Realy?

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I just asked him flat out of he could fight with me again. Seemed to work.

[rajpoot]

Right just finished the game. This is probably the quickest ever I've finished a full game....and certainly the longest I've sat on my PC in a go.
Anyway.....I don't know what to think. They've made a lot of changes and in my eyes its lost a lot of charm that the previous game had. I mean I loved talking to companions, and they had a ton of dialogue. So even in very long and tedious dungeons like the Deep Roads, I kept going because I knew I'll be rewarded with loads of interesting dialogue.
Now however the chats are far and few in between and I've been literally jumping with joy when I see a quest about going and talking to a companion. Specially considering that most other quests need one to negotiate through the same old dungeons/areas with a very uncooperative camera.
While the story is rather haphazard, it has its moments of awesome.

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I really liked the Act 2 quests about running back and forth between the Qunari and the Viscount trying to make peace. And the one with that Qunari mage.....Katojen or whatever his name was.....IMO the Qunari quests are amongst the best in this game.
Other moments worth mentioning are the climax to the Deep Roads quest where the sibling falls. The quest in which one finds Zevran (Isabela has some great dialogue with him) and the quest where Hawke's mother dies. I mean it might be a cheap shot trying to add drama by killing off the mother of an already lonely hero, but it works quite well nonetheless.

There are ofcourse bugs, with the import system. Found a few reference in the game about decisions I never took. And the combat system...well...I've come to realise I don't buy these games for the combat at all....I find it OK. Can live with it.
The ending was....unsatisfactory. Cliffhanger ending is one thing, and leaving a story half finished is another.
About Flemeth,

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When she pops out of that amulet, did it remind anyone else of Voldemort?

All in all I liked the last game better. Progress in design and stuff is important but trying to fix that which is not broken is not a good idea.

[Mailman653]

Reddit Poster Tracks Perfect Metacritic Dragon Age II Review Score to BioWare Employee

[Monk]

Reddit Poster Tracks Perfect Metacritic Dragon Age II Review Score to BioWare Employee

As if Metacritic's user reviews are a hotbed of intellectual discussion and unbiased opinion without his contribution. Have you strode through the muck of those public sections before? My god. As a whole i'd advocate not approaching toward metacritic with a ten ft. pole. There's far too much generalized, unfocused fanboy hate combined with PR that it makes it impossible to get a read on the product.

As important as game reviewers love to make themselves out to be these days I really don't see much substitute for simply trying it yourself and making up your own mind.

[Scienter]

As if Metacritic's user reviews are a hotbed of intellectual discussion and unbiased opinion without his contribution. Have you strode through the muck of those public sections before? My god.

I made the mistake of looking at the comments on Metacritic. I think my brain may have melted a little. I'm enjoying DA2 despite its flaws. I think in the future I'll just ignore Metacritic since it seems like a place where people go to rage instead of posting something useful.

[rajpoot]

I don't how many of you've seen this, but a certain dwarf says something really unexpected if clicked on enough times. Quite creepy.

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[Techno Viking]

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tl;dr: Bioware caught posting metacritic user reviews..

[Kekvit Irae]

I don't how many of you've seen this, but a certain dwarf says something really unexpected if clicked on enough times. Quite creepy.

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Not enchantment!

And regarding amusing things, there's one guy I totally, completely agree with about the game:

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http://cloud.steampowered.com/ugc/57...C36AE44AACA3F/

(ignore the quickbar, that was before I discovered the joy of Assassinate)

[Greyblades]

Uh is that some sort of jab at old asciii games?

[Monk]

Uh is that some sort of jab at old asciii games?

That NPC is there to break the fourth wall. He also talks about how sometimes he feels as if he's trapped in a grand story, and nothing he does means anything.

[Kekvit Irae]

Uh is that some sort of jab at old asciii games?

He's a joke on an old running debate over complexity in games over time. Mass Effect 2 is more "streamlined" than Mass Effect. Dragon Age 2 is more "streamlined" than Dragon Age: Origins. Etc, etc.
If anything, he's a jab at the fans.

[rajpoot]

Playing again as a mage. I have a question about Act 1. No spoilers, but still putting it in tags just incase.

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I can't seem to go to the Gallows...? Is it a glitch or is it actually scripted this way? How am I supposed to get the quests there if I can't go?

[Kekvit Irae]

Playing again as a mage. I have a question about Act 1. No spoilers, but still putting it in tags just incase.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

I can't seem to go to the Gallows...? Is it a glitch or is it actually scripted this way? How am I supposed to get the quests there if I can't go?

The Gallows opens up if you pick up a side/secondary/main quest that goes there. Just walk around and pick up quests, and eventually it'll open up.

[rajpoot]

The Gallows opens up if you pick up a side/secondary/main quest that goes there. Just walk around and pick up quests, and eventually it'll open up.

Right it's open now, but I still can't get the Herbalist quest.

[Kekvit Irae]

Right it's open now, but I still can't get the Herbalist quest.

I believe it happens after a few main quests are taken care of. Progress with the plot in act 1 and check back with him.

[frogbeastegg]

I like the game on the whole so far, although it's quite mixed and will have to pull something special if it is to end up viewed as great instead of good.

They shouldn't have called it Dragon Age 2. If they had called it Dragon Age: Kirkwall (or whatever) it wouldn't have created false expectations. As a side story in the same world it would be a nice game. As a semi-direct continuation it doesn't feel like it fits; gameplay is too different, plot is mainly unrelated, and aside from a few links there's nothing strong to tie it back to DA:O.

My other main thought on the game is that it's Bioware's KOTORII, i.e. a game with lots of great ideas which didn't get the time and budget it needed in order to realise them. Imagine if Kirkwall was designed to be more like Amn, or even one of the cities in the Assassin's Creed games. Large, interesting to explore, filled with people and little places, and alive. Instead it's closer to Mass Effect's Citadel. Imagine if you had enough people in your party to get some choice as to who to take instead of "I need X so I have to use Y." Imagine if outside the city consisted of more than a few tiny maps. Imagine if the conversation options were fleshed out sufficiently that instead of wondering why Varric has no beard you could ask him, since it's a great glaring question the first time you meet him!

Combat is ... uh ... tolerable. I'm a rogue. I hit the attack button a lot, people die. My party rambles around doing stuff I can't track but which probably mostly ties in to the tactics I set. Then a second wave appears surrounding us so that any attempt at positioning is useless. I hit the attack button a lot more and my party does whatever it is they do. I win. Yay?

Skill development seems mainly designed to force me to waste points in skills I don't want so that I can't afford many of the ones I do want, or alternately spend half the game with my points unused.

I like the story framing. The idea that the game is being related after the event is novel, and it's a change from the tired Bioware formula.

The times people are giving out are a little shocking to me. I'm near the end of chapter 1, have done all of the sidequests but not many of the main quests, and I'm at around 17 hours. I haven't been dawdling either. I'm around level 9, which is somewhat worrying considering the level cap is meant to be 20.

This is the first Bioware RPG I can remember where I really don't like every single sidekick you can recruit. Well, except maybe Varric. He's sort of genericly tolerable; yet another loveable rogue. Oh - there's Dog. I like Dog. Probably because he can't talk. We've got (minor spoilers)

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Sister "Wa wa, repressed mages and life on the run!" or brother "Boo, evil mages!" depending on your own class.

Emo Elf who escaped from Final Fantasy and who constantly unloads about his tragic life right from conversation 1. I swear Squall from FFVIII was peppier than this guy.

Whinging repressed mage who unloads tragic life story on you from conversation 1. There's nothing left of the funny old Anders. Who knew losing his pet cat could do this to a guy? I used to like Anders. I sort of liked Justice as well. Two characters ruined for the price of one, gah! If it weren't for the healing spells I'd leave him behind too.

Blood mage elf who alternates between incredibly-stupid-but-intended-to-be-cute-but-really-is-just-stupid and some kind of demonic pokemon trainer while giving the impression that she's far too dumb to understand what she is doing.

Aveline the walking cold towel, there to remind you of GRIM and DUTY and BOREDOM every time you breathe. Her husband probably lied about the darkspawn taint in order to get away from her nagging. And I'm playing as a good character too; I hate to think of how much she nags evil characters.

Boob pirate the wonder girl ... er, except that description makes her sound more interesting than she is. Still, at least she doesn't whine. Much. Yet. Not sure how many times I can listen to variations on the same joke before I move her off the indifferent list and file her under hate with the rest.

Repressed church boy who constantly unloads about evil mages, also revenge and "Boo! My poor family!" The only thing he has said which is not angst related is "Thank you" but that was for killing the mercs who slaughtered his family so it doesn't count.

Is there anywhere in Kirkwall which sells prozac? I could mix it in with their health potions and they would never know ...

Maybe they improve further into the game. If so I doubt it will matter since it will take some impressive work to redeem them. Even the party banter, usually a highlight for me, makes me roll my eyes. There's the odd funny conversation, or the odd insightful one, but mostly it is character X indulging their pet unload topic on everyone else, with other characters unloading back. There have been a few funny or character exploration conversations and they're as good as ever; the game desperately needs more.

[rajpoot]

The spoiler-ed character description made me laugh more than most jokes in the game. The reason I find it hard to care about the companions is because they hardly seem have lived any life before they met Hawke. In the previous game, everyone seemed to be keen on talking about their past experiences in great detail. I miss that here.

[Greyblades]

I feel realy out of the loop here; I dont think in my last playthrough I realy noticed all the angsting and when I did I didnt mind much, maybe its because I didnt play all that many JRPG's and arent sick and tired of them, but I dont realy feel the revulsion you guy are getting .

Ok I've got my own gripe: why the heck does this game feel so rail-roaded for failure?
For example:

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During one of the main quests you have to escort a rogue qunari mage out of the city to some beach on behalf of a chantry sister, he's also mute, I can't refuse, its a main quest. Ok the sister isnt exactly miss nice and is getting on my nerves; screw her I'm going to blow the whole thing to the arishok... Ok he doest care, just says "I'm worthy".

With no other option I agree and take the walking magic-brick-out-house to the beach, sounds like the start of a picnic. After beating up the usual thugs on the way (kinda missing the option to intimidate by pointing out that I beat a fricking dragon in an earlier quest, mage didnt help much by the way) I get to the beach and there's a bunch of qunari who ask for him back, I say get lost he's mine and a fight ensues. After I've finished up and take a rod from the qunari, the mage starts talking, but says he has to die. I tell him no but the mage still sets himself on fire and dies , apparantly none of my mages can summon a pail of water.

Annoyed I reload to an earlier save and hand him over to the qunari hoping for a better outcome, nope, the qunari executes the mage and then attacks me in fear that I was possessed by a daemon the mage might have summoned. In retrospect maybe having anders/daemon of vengeance along might not have helped my case.

In the end, no matter what I do the qunari group attacks me, the mage burns to death, the arishok ignores me and I can't even kill the sister that started all this just threaten her. Even that just gets a dismissive reaction out of her.

And that's one of the least disasterous quests.