favorite medieval film?

[gollum]

Indeed the (russian i think) actor that plays Biliwoolf (from the Anglo Saxon epic Beowulf) is very good in his part.

[HopAlongBunny]

Holy Grail.

The filth and stench of medieval living almost oozes from the screen.
The Black Knight scene is legend :)

[gollum]

heh - finally. Indeed holy Grail is a classic by all accounts. The satire, the animations, the acting and the superb direction (which is shown in scenes that are "serious" in between the gags). An all time classic and favorite, accessible and boys only (few femmales i know really like it), which is another plus ;)

[caravel]

Braveheart is my favorite (serious) medieval-era movie as well; in fact, it's actually in my personal "Top Ten" list overall. Gross historical inaccuracies aside, I have to admit I find it a highly entertaining film.

Please don't take this the wrong way, but that film is one of the biggest steaming piles of poo ever to released upon the world. The film is a unpleasant medium for the director's unsavoury political and social views and xenophobia. It ooozes anglophobia, homophobia, scots nationalistic ideals and is in essence a propaganda piece. It steals the character of William Wallace and perverts it to suit Gibson's propaganda aims. (the long haired hippies in woad and kilts are also laughable, it's about as historical as LOTR). On the surface it seems harmless, but sadly people often believe that such films are historically accurate or come to incorrect conclusion as to what is accurate and what isn't.

Yohei

[gollum]

I actually always had a question about BH; in the first battle depicted, after he makes his rousing speech and the troops start cheering, he says something in celtic/gaellic (i guess), something to the effect of "Gaora Gabra" (with apologies for my ignorence). Does anyone know what it means and how its spelled?

[gollum]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WLrrBs8JBQo

Just to refresh your memories..., please enlighten me.

[gollum]

Also forgot to mention that unsurprisingly no one mentioned Luc Beson's Jean D'Arc - The Messasnger. It was a terrible film really and in all probability as many gossiping and not so gossiping sources say a pet project of his then girlfriend and supermodel protagonist Mila Yovovitch. At the time, Mila was in her early twenties and the depiction of the Saint is pretty much along the lines of a protestingly atheistic worldview that abounds among 20something year olds. Besson had little choice it seems than accept the idea, and the two of them were riding on the success and the confidence it brings, of teh 5th element in which Mila was substantially better at acting since she had virtually no dialogue :)

In any case, Jean D'Arc, despite many stellar actors and an expensive and very historically accurate production was a commercial and critical flop as it deserved, since the subtext through which the astounding by all accounts personality of the Saint was approached discarded religion and was there to "prove something" - ie that you have to practice what you preach and that morality cannot be achieved by returning violence to the violent, typical 20something year old points.

Unsurprisingly the best actors of the film were the ones portraying the English. Even good actors like Dustin Hoffman and Faye Danaway are burried by the script and the depiction of the characters they interpret. However the worst performance imo goes without a shadow of a doubt to Mrs Yovovitch :) Trully despicable portrayal of one of the most intruiging and bold persons to have ever lived.

I like however the assault sequence of teh Tourelles - it was beautifully shot and climaxed.

Unfortunately for Luc, the movie flopping seems to have separated him from Mila ;)

[Ser Clegane]

Of the more recent movies I would second KoH* and Jeanne D'Arc (setting historical accuracy aside I actually also like Braveheart).

One of the older movies I am quite fond of is El Cid - although I am generally not very fond of Charlton Heston as an actor.

*EDIT: referring to the Director's Cut - the cinematic version was too obviously cut, it did not really flow.

[Vantek]

Apart from comedy (Monty Python) and fantasy (LotR, Excalibur), I guess Braveheart is the only one I can think of. This is not to say that I adore the film, but simply I can't think of a better one. Kingdom of Heaven was to me just a mindless action movie with a medieval theme. Jean d'Arc I found to be simply boring "aRtsY" lunacy. And actionless drama isn't my thing when it comes to medieval setting, because it's pretty much impossible to credibly reenact medieval setting and even if someone actually managed to pull it off, I just wouldn't be able to relate to such clueless people. So what are we left with... Gladiator, Troy and 300 weren't medieval, they were ancient... Can't think of anything :/

EDIT: I just remembered feudal japan (Akira Kurosawa's stuff), but I wouldn't consider them to qualify for the question either.

[gollum]

I think that Charlton Easton and Sophia Loren embodied such perfect (male and female, respectively) stereotypes in El Cid, that it actually works for the movie (paradoxically), despite or perhaps because their performances flirt with being caricatures. Sophia clearly won the race though - even though Charlton was such tough competition. The production is very ambitious (especially given the time it was shot) and i would say monumental.

However none of them was as much caricature as Orlando Bloom and Eva Green in KoH. Classically stereotypical Hollywood lines for the first "fateful" meeting of him and her ("give me a cigarette" etc) were directly translated to the medieval age ("give me some water"). The performances were, in adition, wooden and unreal and they followed the equally unreal transformation of Balian from a country side blacksmith to an expert swordsman, strategist, lover and pseudophilosophising moralist in no time. Bloom's dyslexia also took its toll in his delivering of his lines. He was far better in support roles as in Lord of the Rings imo.

[Durango]

However none of them was as much caricature as Orlando Bloom and Eva Green in KoH. Classically stereotypical Hollywood lines for the first "fateful" meeting of him and her ("give me a cigarette" etc) were directly translated to the medieval age ("give me some water"). The performances were, in adition, wooden and unreal and they followed the equally unreal transformation of Balian from a country side blacksmith to an expert swordsman, strategist, lover and pseudophilosophising moralist in no time. Bloom's dyslexia also took its toll in his delivering of his lines. He was far better in support roles as in Lord of the Rings imo.

Yep, that about says it all.

The film was inbalanced. Especially the defender siege AI, since they could take so many siege towers out with these "contraptions" that
they had in Jerusalem. Not to say anything about the completely absurd Virtues that Balian must have had! "Extreme Swordsman",
"Prettyboy" etc....

But the morale and fatigue penalties in the desert they got right at least.

On another note, the classic film The Seventh Seal is pretty decent.

[gollum]

Indeed Durango,

your compatriot Ingmar Bergman has given us this theater-like classic, in which a weary knight returns to his plagued homeland from the crusades, disgrantled and disillusioned, and battles Death incarnate in an allegorical chess match as he struggles to find meaning in a world where Death, spiritual and physical, seems to have absolute rule.

A very worthy and necassary addition to the list, although containing no action (in case anyone was expecting it).

[virus_found]

This http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0102081 and this http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0089322 come to mind. I don't count The Holy Grail here, because it's different. Monty Python is Monty Python.

[edyzmedieval]

However none of them was as much caricature as Orlando Bloom and Eva Green in KoH. Classically stereotypical Hollywood lines for the first "fateful" meeting of him and her ("give me a cigarette" etc) were directly translated to the medieval age ("give me some water"). The performances were, in adition, wooden and unreal and they followed the equally unreal transformation of Balian from a country side blacksmith to an expert swordsman, strategist, lover and pseudophilosophising moralist in no time. Bloom's dyslexia also took its toll in his delivering of his lines. He was far better in support roles as in Lord of the Rings imo.

I didn't pay that much attention to Balian. Eva Green is way too beautiful/hot for me to even think about Orlando Bloom's acting...

[gollum]

Thanks for bringing up these films virous found. They certainly seem interesting and the fact that they seem native productions make them all the more so.

Well edyz, if you have the hots for Eva, i rest my case ;)

[edyzmedieval]

Well edyz, if you have the hots for Eva, i rest my case ;)

Yeah, right, like you wouldn't when I show you this... http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_zJZbKdIHjj...n_elle_007.jpg

[gollum]

This could be the beginning of the "Favorite medieval film Lady" thread, which, assuming all are as inspired as you, may well outdo the babe thread - and considering how much drone seems to hang in there this is a very realistic development ;)

We got the right kind of mod-e for that sort of thing, here in the main hall.

[PershsNhpios]

My favourites are surprisingly unacknowledged here...

El Cid was mentioned once, and I found this to be a remarkably poetic film. It was slightly too American for my liking, as are such films as Fall of the Roman Empire and Ben-Hur, which I paradoxically find difficult to watch because, since I have such a high fascination and respect for the era, any perceived disrespect or ignorance found in the film will cause it to be very blemished in my view.

Nonetheless, I found the portrayal of Cid's era to be marvellously real and immersive, but the spiritual accent wasn't there, since it was replaced with a more American Christian zeal. If El Cid could have been played with the same wardrobe, scenery (I have fallen in love with Espagna in that movie) and actorship, but with the feeling, spirit and old Iberian style of religious zeal shown in Guns for San Sebastian, then I would watch it o'er and o'er..
(A side note for brother Gollum, I watched Guns for San Sebastian having adopted Anthony Quinn as my favourite actor after seeing Zorba the Greek. That film mirrors my own spirit. Χόπα!)

One which I saw only once, and only in part, but which has gripped my interest is Ivanhoe, which is also a mediaevally religious tale. The combat, as in the Duel of El Cid, is highly immersive and quite shocking the first time it is seen. I wish I could have seen more of this, but I can say that the wardrobe, actorship and story were I believe on par with that of El Cid. This is an old movie, but in colour.

Two movies now with another of my favourite actors, Connery (My most favourite movie ever was made so by the combination of two favourite actors, 'The Man Who Would Be King'), who starred in a mystery called The Name of the Rose, which is based on the book, Il Noma della Rosa. The movie is dark, set in I believe Alpine Italy where Connery is sent with a young protégée to investigate a vicious murder which occured in an isolated Monastery. The film involves the inquisition, envelops the audience in the austere, scholarly life of the monks and is the only movie in which I have seen classical Greek involved in the script.
There is even a scene in which Connery attempts to read aloud some of the (I believe) Aristotelean manuscript.
It is a very intriguing murder mystery, and a unique movie.

Now I also enjoyed Connery's role as Robin Hood, but I cannot remember the title of that movie - he is a much more world-weary Hood than is usually portrayed.

If I may digress to a 'more civilised era', if you are interested in the above choices, allow me to introduce you to a film, the only one I know of, which represents the Thirty Years War.
It stars my only other favourite actor apart from Quinn and Connery, the only other British actor, Michael Caine, and is called The Last Valley, in which a small alpine village seems to remain the last valley settlement untouched in Central Europe by plague and war. This is brought into jeopardy when a plagued wanderer (Omar Sharif) and a mercenary captain and his party (Caine) stumble at once upon the village and attempt to find shelter in the isolating winter and co-exist with each other, whilst the town tries to maintain independence, and the Captain to subdue it.

---

My favourite mediaeval lady would be that French bint from Braveheart, but let's not tarnish the Hall with whores and carnal sins.

[gollum]

Thank you for your list and analyses, Glenn.

The "Name of the Rose" comes from the book of the same name by Italian philosopher, semiotics Professor and author Umberto Eco. The film is a European production entirely and the actors chosen for it are also predominantly europeans as well as the director; in fact the director had to sell his own private building in Munich to finance the film :) - it has a very good air of authenticity. It features the first role of Christian Slater in the big screen.

The plot revolves around a series of murders of Monks that work in teh Scriptorium of a famous Benedictine Italian monastery and use the famous library of it, which is of limited access to strangers and outsiders. At the same time there is a meeting between the various monastic orders and Papal delegates that debate the ecclesiastical problem of the time ie how the calling of Christ for poverty is to be understood by the Church as an institution.
It is indeed a fine film, although a little bit revisionist as is its author - ie it places a very modern mentality man who happens to be a Sherlock Holmes of sorts as well in a medieval setting, and the era is viewed from his perspective that coincides with that of the viewer. However, this is fully plausible, and throughout the middle ages there wwere such people. Overall it is indeed a very enjoyable and authentically produced medieval film and highly reccomended (although it has no battle action in case anyone was expecting any).

I agree with your assessment of El Cid. It certainly has strong points, and the production as i posted back in the day is really top notch. The battle scenes are also amazing and pretty realistic too in how they portray tactics of teh era.

I'll check out Last Valley, i also enjoy Michael Caine's acting - he's really a very good actor.

[gollum]

The lady you like in Braveheart is Sophie Marceau, and i have to commend your taste on this one; much more my cup of tea than Eva Green ;)

http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgur...ed=0CCkQ9QEwAA

And just to do real justice to Sophie, take your pick ;) :

http://www.google.co.uk/images?hl=en...w=1190&bih=719

[drone]

This could be the beginning of the "Favorite medieval film Lady" thread, which, assuming all are as inspired as you, may well outdo the babe thread - and considering how much drone seems to hang in there this is a very realistic development ;)

We got the right kind of mod-e for that sort of thing, here in the main hall.

To the best of my knowledge, the "babes in the Babe Thread only " restriction is for the off-topic forums only. Long hair stacked up 10 feet high and corsets, yeah, I have no problem with that.

I would also recommend The Name of The Rose, good movie and good book.

Now I also enjoyed Connery's role as Robin Hood, but I cannot remember the title of that movie - he is a much more world-weary Hood than is usually portrayed.

Robin and Marian?

[PershsNhpios]

Robin and Marian would be the one.

And yes brother Gollum that is the mediaeval crumpet I was referring to.

She looks quite French in all of those pictures, but in some of them she is exceedingly French.

From the train of this discussion, I fear our Hall is less chaste than would be expected of a brotherhood.

[caravel]

One pretty decent one I saw recently: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0837106/

[Plato]

It's not been mentioned, probably because it sends them into a lather, but the Eva Green fan-club should stick to Bertolucci's The Dreamers.

Commenting on a few that have already been mentioned:
The Polish film Krzyżacy (English title: Knights of the Teutonic Order) is certainly different, but it requires a fair bit of background knowledge to make sense of: at least read the Wikipedia entry on the Battle of Grunwald/Tannenberg so that you understand the lead up to the battle and the significance of the two swords.

Gollum's synopsis of Brancaleone:

In it a conscious full blown black satire of the middle ages is presented, including religion, chivalry, romance, nobility, the knight's quest and other such themes.

reminds me of the Decameron, written in the 1350s (and, I suppose, The Canterbury Tales also). However, Pasolini's attempts to film them haven't been too successful - quite comic for not necessarily the right reasons and pretty fruity.


As for my favourite? I haven't got one, or at least not seen one that would hit the spot. Monty Python and the Holy Grail is marvellous, obviously, but I was disappointed many years after first seeing it when I discovered that interdental brushes do exist.

One of the best I've seen that's not been mentioned is Marketa Lazarova. It evokes central Europe with a population less than one twentieth of now: wide, empty spaces; clan more important than some distant king; ramshackle buildings; and a hand-to-mouth existance for all.

The same director made another film set in the middle ages: Valley of the Bees, but it's not anywhere near as good.

[huth]

Kingdom of Heaven - but only the Director's Cut version - I think it is the best movie about crusaders ever made. Excellent directing, cinematography, scenography, costumes, fighting scenes, ah... everything but Balianorlando! What is he doing in that movie, and his totally artificial character, arrrgh, that priest in the beginning should push him into the fire!

Name of the Rose - the book is great(excellent as for medieval philosophy and teology, intellectual though in general) and movie adaptation was made very well, especially scenography and casting are really good.

Joan of Arc by Luc Besson - I know, it's totally unhistorical, pure funny entertainment, but directed well and I enjoyed this movie.
I also partially saw some older movie about Virgin of Orleans which probably was very historically accurate, but because of night and weariness, unfortunatelly I dropped off.

Is '1492: Conquest of Paradise' still a medieval movie? If so, it's definitely the best one, the story was so well displayed, and even if you know how all of this happened, the movie pulls you into seat.


It's a big surprise for me that some of you know "Krzyżacy" :) That was a pinnacle of socialist movie production and I'd say it's the biggest superproduction, blockbuster made in Poland to date, and it is not good...
Movie was probably awesome when it was released, now it's not very enjoyable, but maybe I write that, because I don't like Sienkiewicz' literature :P

You really like Braveheart? I couldn't stand hollywood style in that movie, good-evil concept, Mel Gibson and arms/armour - it's just terrible. New 'Robin Hood" is slightly better, but why, why Scott could make such a bad movie after 1492, KoH and others, I don't understand...

[caravel]

You really like Braveheart? I couldn't stand hollywood style in that movie, good-evil concept, Mel Gibson and arms/armour - it's just terrible.

The less said about it the better - though I actually commend CA for the "Mel Gibsons at Arms" that you can recruit in Scotland in MTW - someone must have had a particularly nasty sense of humour to put those in there...

//edit: Actually it would be interesting to mod your "Mel Gibsons at Arms" to have a negative impact on the jewish religious percentage in a province... more historically accurate...

[Plato]

Braveheart fans can stick Henry the Fifth in their pipes and smoke it. If you don't like the chatting up of a French princess in that film, blame Shakespeare!

Also, no mention in this thread of Les Visiteurs. Come on, it even got a horrendous Hollywood remake.

[Geezer57]

One which I saw only once, and only in part, but which has gripped my interest is Ivanhoe,

Thanks for mentioning Ivanhoe - if I had one favorite, this would be the one. For a 1952 film, the final trial-by-combat is extremely intense - amazingly well choreographed for the period. And the stellar cast (Robert Taylor, Elizabeth Taylor, Joan Fontaine, etc.) doesn't hurt the least little bit.

[gollum]

Yes Plato, Les Visiteurs is lots of fun - partly because its French, partly because of Jean Reno and partly because of the contrast of medieval and modern age mentality. My favorite is the bathroom scene

[Axalon]

While I totally fail to see how this is a MTW related topic, I’ll happily participate here since Drone is seemingly ok with this…


For me,

“Name of the Rose” is the way to go… I just love that soundtrack and overall it is an excellent film straight up. I think Connery (a much underrated actor) does ones of his best performances ever in that film. …Wonderful story and scenery - very dramatic and interesting. I have not read the book, but I suspect it to be good as U.Eco is one very smart and educated man…

“Ladyhawke” could (it should) have been good, but the soundtrack really killed that movie. Rutger Hauer is doing an excellent part there (the man can act, he just do it in the wrong films usually).

“Black Death” is pretty good, for those of you who have missed it. Good story with a twist and overall I like it.


As for medieval fantasy/mythic stuff…

“Excalibur” rocks all over essentially. That is a great film and also one of my all time faves. The soundtrack is just fantastic. And, that “love”-scene in full plate-armour is just priceless! I want more of that! Hell, I want to do that!

Tolkien/Lotr stuff doesn’t count as it deserves a category of its own… Good stuff anyhow. Although the soundtrack is not as good as I would have liked. To me it is essentially poor instrumentation that is the biggest cause for it (too much brass, too little strings). And perhaps too, ah well I don’t like the choir-boy-thingy-fetish that Howard (the composer) is in too…


Going for Dungeons and Dragons then….

Conan the Barbarian the movie remains to me the best one ever made in this seriously beaten up and mistreated genre (movie-wise) and I think it is actually a very good movie in general. James Earl Jones and Mako does some wonderful work in there. The photo and visual composition is real good, and the soundtrack – yet again – is to me a masterpiece. Yup, a masterpiece…


Bubb-blubby-lub done…

- Cheers