Askthepizzaguy Mafia II: The Revengening [Concluded]

[Beskar]

I think you should give the triforce to bow-wow-wow.

[Renata]

Okay, Beskar:

Triforce to Backwards Logic

[Askthepizzaguy]

ANNOUNCEMENT:

ArpeggiateTHIS2 Replaces Classical_hero2 who replaced El Barto

Winston Hughes Replaces GamezRule

Yaseikhaan Replaces Mythmonster2

[Greyblades]

I was going to wait until my card was updated so I could check my credit amount but I think I can work it out myself.

Bet 30 credits on reneta

[johnhughthom]

Replacing replacements...

[seireikhaan]

I'd really like to be able to vig again. Not very nice to take my super awesome weapon of doom.

Utility Flashlight to myself
Silenced Handgun to myself
Triforce to Backwards Logic
Rabbity Rabbit to Robbiecon
Omega Sample to Chaotix

As far as the vote, I'm willing to bite on Kage.

Vote: 40 credits on Renata

[seireikhaan]

Ok, just to make sure formatting and all that, since I flubbed the first attempt.

Bet: 40 credits on Renata

[Renata]

I'm not mafia.

If I die from this, please look to the people who have been using Kage's suspicion as a means of stirring the pot but not entirely committing. The chaotics know perfectly well I'm not one of them and that's going to influence how much they're willing to risk on a bad bet. Greyblades committing his 30 only *after* Diamondeye put in 60 ahead of him (despite me harassing him all night) is more suspicious than Diamondeye is.

[Beefy187]

Utility Flashlight to Beefy
Silenced Handgun to Beefy
Triforce to Beefy
Rabbity Rabbit to Beefy
Omega Sample to Beefy


I'm always against voting for Renata on principle.
She is never guilty.

[a completely inoffensive name]

ACIN:
You do realize that at the time I accused them mythmonster and visorslash had posts in the same number range as at last a couple people on your list, right? That at the time I accused *him*, Greyblades had even fewer?

More to the point: where are Psychonaut and Greyblades in that list of every freaking lurker in the game, ACIN?

well renata, i am not as expert as you at mafia so i dont know how to verify the numbers of people's posts for 30+ pages. i seem to remember reading posts from greyblades but i will take the time to control-f his name and comb through past pages.

i have not been recording post counts, i just go off of what i remember reading over the past 4 days. lol compared to earthling everyone seems like a lurker so you may be right.

but all joking aside, your statement still is "meh" to me. lets say you are right, what evidence makes THESE lurkers worthy of all of our attention and why should we let those i listed slide?

[a completely inoffensive name]

Utility Flashlight to Beefy
Silenced Handgun to Beefy
Triforce to Beefy
Rabbity Rabbit to Beefy
Omega Sample to Beefy


I'm always against voting for Renata on principle.
She is never guilty.

doesn't seem like you take the advice of your cow sig.

[shlin28]

Okay.... I am probably adding more reasons to the List of Reasons Why I Should Be Murdered, but I'm gonna say this anyway.

I have also been in contact with Renata for a while, just giving her some heads up of what I'm gonna do and giving some rather poor advice to her. I'm not say that she is definitely Evil, but she does gives an impression of actively trying to root out the Chaotics. Yes her thread behaviour can be a bit suspicious, but the advice she has been giving me in private has largely been useful and probably helped the town a bit. I did have my suspicions of course, but all of them could easily be coincidences - I could post them later if any of you want to see them, but they were really terrible arguments .

Also, don't forget the fact that I (and a few probable innocents known to her) are still alive, even though she as the organiser could have easily found out our abilities and stopped/killed us. I accept that there could be a leak in this group, but I don't expect it to be Renata, since her actions vindicates her innocence.

So... er, don't lynch Renata?

As for suspects, I have no idea as usual, Myth (Khaan), Earthling and Greyblades are my guesses, but I think I am willing to give Khaan and Earthling a chance first. Bet: 5 Credits on Greyblades

As for item votes, for now I will Vote: MOBILE HOLOGRAM EMITTER to shlin28 as an extra 10% could help me to do what I do best. Protection would be nice as well, but other people may need it more.

PS: I know I do not sound convincing at all, but er... give peace a chance and try to vote for some real suspects?

[Renata]

well renata, i am not as expert as you at mafia so i dont know how to verify the numbers of people's posts for 30+ pages. i seem to remember reading posts from greyblades but i will take the time to control-f his name and comb through past pages.

i have not been recording post counts, i just go off of what i remember reading over the past 4 days. lol compared to earthling everyone seems like a lurker so you may be right.

but all joking aside, your statement still is "meh" to me. lets say you are right, what evidence makes THESE lurkers worthy of all of our attention and why should we let those i listed slide?

I actually have more posts than Earthling now; I think that's kind of pathetic of me.

I'm not saying we should let those you listed slide. But you skip the biggest suspect I have on the lurker list and ignore the fact that at least two of my recent suspects *are/were* lurkers, it tends to stand out. As does you calling out the batch of them, en masse, as if there were nothign to distinguish among them and they are all equally worthy of attention, no skin off your back which one or why as long as it's no one you care about, right?

Red_spy, 4 posts, latest on April 27, which is somethign like two weeks ago. Nothing of note, a few item votes to self, a few small bets. Since then, poof. Also (though most here wouldn't know this), he disappeared from a NOTW game on CFC at approximately the same time, only turning up a day or so ago to protest his mistaken lynching. His failure to be replaced just now is of some concern; however after civplayah's example not one I'm eager to follow up on, certainly not with a lynch. My estimation: vig bait at best.

Psychonaut: 15 posts, about two per day, right in the scummo sweet spot at this point of the game. However, nothing in the last four days.
1 -- 4 credits on ACIN (no danger to you, this is day two while I'm being bandwagoned), votes some items to himself
2 -- changes item votes to try trade with diamondeye
3&4 -- fluff
5 -- (day three while ACIN is temporarily on the hook) lectures everyone in a joking manner about having not realized ACIN was scummy earlier,when he did. Puts 5 on ACIN. Tries to make item trade with believer.
6,7, 8 -- fluffityflufffluff
9 -- has no idea what's going on, puts 5 on MRD
10 -- fluff
11 -- implies he's had cash stolen from him, is going to put all credits into bets therefore,bets 39 on earthling. offers item trade, omega virus sample to him for another item to anyone
12 -- votes two items to visorslash (who isnot going to get them)
13 -- tells earthling he's ignorant b/c he's only reading 1 post in 10,that he'll probably be lynched even if he claims something hugely protown, so if you want his vote to move make it snappy
14 -- votes holocron to diamondeye
15 -- apologizes to earthling if he is innocent, would be too busy and not remember to check the thread ifhe didn't get a votein early

Psychonaut's clearly just playing here (or wants people to believe he's just playing). Nothing here is serious. He's showing up almost every day to place a vote of no consequence or disclaimed sincerity and vote an item or two to people (minus DE yesterday, I think, and Believer earlier -- both investigation items) who are not going to get them. The only vote to date he's had much effect on is Earthling's lynch, and he apologized for that one in advance. He also seems to have slipped into the "I have no idea what's going on, look how confused I am, town" zone ever since the ACIN thing, and has never brought up ACIN again since then.

Assessment: in the scum zone, needs attention.

See the difference? Now you. Which of those 8 or 10 lurkers you mentioned are worthy of pursuing NOW, and which ones can be left until later?

[a completely inoffensive name]

I actually have more posts than Earthling now; I think that's kind of pathetic of me.

I'm not saying we should let those you listed slide. But you skip the biggest suspect I have on the lurker list and ignore the fact that at least two of my recent suspects *are/were* lurkers, it tends to stand out. As does you calling out the batch of them, en masse, as if there were nothign to distinguish among them and they are all equally worthy of attention, no skin off your back which one or why as long as it's no one you care about, right?

Red_spy, 4 posts, latest on April 27, which is somethign like two weeks ago. Nothing of note, a few item votes to self, a few small bets. Since then, poof. Also (though most here wouldn't know this), he disappeared from a NOTW game on CFC at approximately the same time, only turning up a day or so ago to protest his mistaken lynching. His failure to be replaced just now is of some concern; however after civplayah's example not one I'm eager to follow up on, certainly not with a lynch. My estimation: vig bait at best.

Psychonaut: 15 posts, about two per day, right in the scummo sweet spot at this point of the game. However, nothing in the last four days.
1 -- 4 credits on ACIN (no danger to you, this is day two while I'm being bandwagoned), votes some items to himself
2 -- changes item votes to try trade with diamondeye
3&4 -- fluff
5 -- (day three while ACIN is temporarily on the hook) lectures everyone in a joking manner about having not realized ACIN was scummy earlier,when he did. Puts 5 on ACIN. Tries to make item trade with believer.
6,7, 8 -- fluffityflufffluff
9 -- has no idea what's going on, puts 5 on MRD
10 -- fluff
11 -- implies he's had cash stolen from him, is going to put all credits into bets therefore,bets 39 on earthling. offers item trade, omega virus sample to him for another item to anyone
12 -- votes two items to visorslash (who isnot going to get them)
13 -- tells earthling he's ignorant b/c he's only reading 1 post in 10,that he'll probably be lynched even if he claims something hugely protown, so if you want his vote to move make it snappy
14 -- votes holocron to diamondeye
15 -- apologizes to earthling if he is innocent, would be too busy and not remember to check the thread ifhe didn't get a votein early

Psychonaut's clearly just playing here (or wants people to believe he's just playing). Nothing here is serious. He's showing up almost every day to place a vote of no consequence or disclaimed sincerity and vote an item or two to people (minus DE yesterday, I think, and Believer earlier -- both investigation items) who are not going to get them. The only vote to date he's had much effect on is Earthling's lynch, and he apologized for that one in advance. He also seems to have slipped into the "I have no idea what's going on, look how confused I am, town" zone ever since the ACIN thing, and has never brought up ACIN again since then.

Assessment: in the scum zone, needs attention.

See the difference? Now you. Which of those 8 or 10 lurkers you mentioned are worthy of pursuing NOW, and which ones can be left until later?

i have no intention of "calling out" people, merely that there are people that imo have not been looked at all.

red_spy i would agree is another civplayah situation, i added his name to give my point more oomph by padding the list of names.

well as of right now i do not have the same kind of knowledge about the posts of lurkers as you do of psycho. so i will concede on that i dont have an alternative. which means in all likliness i might just vote for psycho.

HOWEVER, i will be doing the same post by post analysis of Crazed Rabbit, Subotan and warman to attempt to find such scumminess among those i have listed. and if this next lynch turns out to be a dud, i will have alternatives ready to suggest.

[Romanic]

Renata has been the most active player in this thread, and she's been organizing the Town effort behind the scene, those are facts. It's very atypical of a Scum, we rarely see this. Personally I got a strong Town feeling for her, from all she's done in this game, publicly and privately.

You don't lynch a Town leader unless you have a strong case against her. Where's the case?

All I'm seeing is Kage accusing Renata for acting similarly to the last Star Wars game, a game where she was converted afaik, and I doubt that her activity level didn't change after he faction changed, but I didn't follow the game after I dropped out though. Anyway that's clearly not enough to lynch Renata. All you're going to accomplish, if you're Town, is to get other Town players to suspect you, and either attempt lynch or vig you, unless she flips Chaotic, but again, I really doubt that.

[...]
As someone on the outside looking in, I am of the opinion that Renata is probably scum, but has placed herself in the center of a group of townies- I'd say the players she's been coordinating are likely innocents, while she has been manipulating them. You guys have little reason to trust me right now... so if there is someone who is a likely town player from Renata's group, I'll switch my vote there. Just please make sure it doesn't go to Renata herself.

Bet: 1 on Renata
[...]

Why do you think she's Chaotic and has been manipulating others?

If because we haven't seen positive results yet, it's not a good reason. You know that these things happen, it's typical to this game. Everyone is wrong most of the time because of the setup, having a low % of guilty players makes it hard to find who they are.

[...]
I'll be brief now, but I'll try to elaborate on things later. I've been consciously "noncommital" in the thread to avoid the attention of mafia and vigilante alike... I started with a 10% Faction scanning item, which got stolen but I was voted a new one the same day, so I've been continually firing 10% scans into the dark, also trying to find out my hidden ability.

You said you want to see me to get in the game? I might not have a lot of credits (couple of failed creditstealing attempts), but I'll Bet 60: Renata. You can call me Charlie if she's Evil.

You just flushed your conscious non-commital plan down the toilet here.

If you keep 60 credits on Renata and she flips Town, you will become a big suspect and are likely to be targeted by other Town players who were working with her. If you are relying on Kage's case to place this vote, I suggest you think twice. Kage was killed on Night 1, and didn't have much chance to have private talks. All Kage is likely to have is a gut feeling, but he's unaware of what happened behind the scenes. There's no reasonable case here.

I was going to wait until my card was updated so I could check my credit amount but I think I can work it out myself.

Bet 30 credits on reneta

Not surprised by this. Greyblades is a strong suspect.

Ok, just to make sure formatting and all that, since I flubbed the first attempt.

Bet: 40 credits on Renata

WHAT ARE YOU DOING KHAAN????? ....

30 minutes into the game, and you're placing a bet on the leading Town player???

I bet you didn't read the thread much, or have you been following it before? If you didn't, please do

You should reconsider that bet, Greyblades is by far a much better choice.


Bet: 60 credits on Greyblades

I don't have much time to make a case, am working tonight, but I'll try to get more posts in before the day ends.

[Kagemusha]

FOS Romanic. Your defense of Renata is bit unneeded anyway as you seem to be very tied to her destiny. You are on my list as well. To be clear im not talking about the Renata through out the star wars game, but Sith Renata of that game.
I think you should hang as well definetely if Renata is Chaotic.
We are mafiosi here and obviously any mafiosi with half of brain should understand not to leave the town effort in hands of the player who´s alignment you dont know. There is no point in leving loose ends, when you can be certain of things.

[Crazed Rabbit]

I think it's disturbing that someone can lurk a bunch and not get more attention in terms of being lynched (or coming close anyway).

Here's what I know;

Nothing about night activities or behind the scenes stuff.

MRD should be resurrected.

We should probably listen more to ACIN.

CR

[Beskar]

I'm not mafia.

And in a game where we are all the mafia...

Nice confession.

[Beskar]

Also, Romanic is my suspect number 4, that post he did was pure nonsense, and he is actively defending anti-mafia scum.

[Diamondeye]

Renata has been the most active player in this thread, and she's been organizing the Town effort behind the scene, those are facts. It's very atypical of a Scum, we rarely see this. Personally I got a strong Town feeling for her, from all she's done in this game, publicly and privately.

Some of us might not know those "facts"; Yes, she's been active (then again, aren't scum relatively active as well, normally?), and I haven't been in on the "behind the scenes" stuff.

All I'm seeing is Kage accusing Renata for acting similarly to the last Star Wars game, a game where she was converted afaik, and I doubt that her activity level didn't change after he faction changed, but I didn't follow the game after I dropped out though. Anyway that's clearly not enough to lynch Renata. All you're going to accomplish, if you're Town, is to get other Town players to suspect you, and either attempt lynch or vig you, unless she flips Chaotic, but again, I really doubt that.

The first half of this is empty oratory, then you decide to lay down general rules as to what is enough to lynch people? It's my credits, I'll be the judge of where and when I put them.
Sure, if Renata hangs, and is town, I know someone might be angry with me (Romanic for one), but that's the risk I'll run when I suspect someone. Like I do now.

You just flushed your conscious non-commital plan down the toilet here.

Well yes because I was asked to. Making a move eventually has to be a consideration, why not now with a sack of credits and a good suspect.

If you keep 60 credits on Renata and she flips Town, you will become a big suspect and are likely to be targeted by other Town players who were working with her. If you are relying on Kage's case to place this vote, I suggest you think twice. Kage was killed on Night 1, and didn't have much chance to have private talks. All Kage is likely to have is a gut feeling, but he's unaware of what happened behind the scenes. There's no reasonable case here.

I think I've answered this once already. Kage's suspicions are a feather in the cap but not the essentials. And (believe it or not) I know that voting 60 on a townie is a big no-go. So you should probably understand my bet as a sign of confidence in the case.

I bet you didn't read the thread much, or have you been following it before? If you didn't, please do

Rhetorics.

You should reconsider that bet, Greyblades is by far a much better choice.

And dictating what others have to do.

Bet: 60 credits on Greyblades

At least your money is where your mouth is. Are you keeping it there?

And in a game where we are all the mafia...

Nice confession.

Also, Romanic is my suspect number 4, that post he did was pure nonsense, and he is actively defending anti-mafia scum.

I think I'm going to listen to Beskar more. FOS Romanic.

[Romanic]

For the purposes of a team victory, neutral is considered part of your team, regardless of your team. So they can go both ways. Shifty buggers.

Don't listen to Beskar, you have no idea what his goal are. As per the rules, neutrals can win with either side, let him rot in his coffin.

Thanks for all the FOS people. I feel your love.

[Greyblades]

Jolt's neutral and dead, I say we don't do what he wants either.

[Kagemusha]

Well i am evil. Resurrect me and i will get the chaotics. Listen to my advice and i will help you get the chaotics. Maybe only few remember the days when i have actually been playing a pro town role and i can be quite useful in it. This time im mafia, but still i can help save the town, so listen to me and resurrect me if im right. If im wrong, go ahead and dismiss my advice.

[thefluffyone93]

Well i am evil. Resurrect me and i will get the chaotics. Listen to my advice and i will help you get the chaotics. Maybe only few remember the days when i have actually been playing a pro town role and i can be quite useful in it. This time im mafia, but still i can help save the town, so listen to me and resurrect me if im right. If im wrong, go ahead and dismiss my advice.

[Chaotix]

Unvote: TRIFORCE

Vote: TRIFORCE to Backwards Logic
Vote: SILENCED HANDGUN to Yaseikhaan
Vote: OMEGA VIRUS SAMPLE to myself

[Beskar]

Don't listen to Beskar, you have no idea what his goal are. As per the rules, neutrals can win with either side, let him rot in his coffin.

Thanks for all the FOS people. I feel your love.

Actually, you know I am not an anti-mafia and since I was killed.. well.. I am really going to work with my killers.

Plus I will rez Kagemusha.

[Renata]

hologram emitter to Shlin28

[a completely inoffensive name]

Yeah, I am not real comfortable in just handing a few people all the items.

Bus drivers are the best defense against the mafia and right now, I think they need to be spread out before Renata and shlin just tell everyone they are legit allow us to give the items to whomever we want.

VOTE ITEM: Mobile hologram emitter to myself

All items should be contested over and I haven't seen anybody else go for it besides shlin.

[dcmort93]

For the time being I'll bet 30 credits on Greyblades due to his rather scummy behavior thus far, but this will change if a better candidate appears

Also If I'm inactive for a few days I'm in the process of setting up a new PC

[Greyblades]

My, my. Thats two lurkers crawling out of the woodwork to defend reneta, both with a fair amount of credits to throw around if I were to judge. If reneta does turn out to be scum we wont have a problem figuring out her partners.
Raise: 20 credits on reneta