Askthepizzaguy Mafia II: The Revengening [Concluded]

[Earthling]

Visorslash you'll gain nothing useful out of looking at the cards if you don't have some other hidden information or ability that is helping you, to save you wasted time if you're honestly trying to do something townie. Everything interesting has already been pointed out (some rough correlation of suit and numbers to most factions with cover roles causing some exceptions) or won't matter if we can't get other living people to reveal their cards anyway.

[Visor]

Gotta do something. Besides me and Chaotix, who else do we have as leads?

ACIN, Greyblades? To me, they are both town. The person who tipped Chaotix off is someone I would like to have a talk with.

[Romanic]

Visorslash, personally I think you are exaggerating what can happen if the Lovers succeed in finding each other. If they're antiTown, it can't be their only goal, otherwise it's too easy.

As in Zelda, it wouldn't be far fetched to think these two could be plotting against the Town, but they won't be winning with 25 players remaining, or at least if won't affect our victory conditions again. If it does, I'll be seriously questioning the setup.

Feel free to pursue your ideas, and if someone feels like joining you, fine, but personally I won't be looking at the lovers. We're busy enough dealing with the Chaotics, and wondering if they're sick enough to attack me three nights in a row.

[Visor]

Hmm. Okay. I'd rather be safe than sorry though.

Well, anyone have a case on someone besides me or Greyblades?

[Romanic]

On Greyblades, acin and Visorslash being Chaotics, I'll refer you to one of my posts

Here's the Day 6 voting history:

1408 dcmort 20 on Earthling
1409 dcmort fold
1419 Chaotix 1 on Renata -> (Renata 1)
1420 BL 10 on DE -> (DE 10, Renata 1)
1425 DE 60 on Renata -> (Renata 61, DE 10)
1429 Renata 10 on Greyblades -> (Renata 61, DE 10, Grey 10)
1435 GE 5 on khaan
1444 Greyblades 30 on Renata -> (Renata 91, DE 10)
1447 Yaseikhaan 40 on Renata -> (Renata 131, DE 10)
1452 shlin 5 on Greyblades -> (Renata 131, Grey 15, DE 10)
1455 Romanic 60 on Greyblades -> (Renata 131, Grey 75, DE 10)
1469 dcmort 30 on Greyblades -> (Renata 131, Grey 105, DE 10)
1470 Greyblades raises 20 on Renata -> (Renata 151, Grey 105, DE 10)
1537 DIY 25 on Greyblades -> (Renata 151, Grey 130, DE 10)
1540 Psychonaut 22 on Greyblades -> (Greyblades 152, Renata 151, DE 10)
1542 Greyblades raises 1 on Renata -> (Greyblades 152, Renata 152, DE 10)
1546 Psychonaut raises 10 on Greyblades -> (Greyblades 162, Renata 152, DE 10)
1557 Bow-wow-wow 20 on Renata -> (Renata 182, Greyblades 162, DE 10)
1597 Renata fold, & 10 on DE -> (Renata 182, Greyblades 152, DE 20)
1602 Psychonaut fold -> (Renata 182, Greyblades 120, DE 20)
1603 Romanic fold -> (Renata 182, Greyblades 60, DE 20)
1611 Greyblades fold, & 51 on DE -> (Renata 131, DE 71, Greyblades 60)
1612 Visorslash 40 on DE -> (Renata 131, DE 111, Greyblades 60)
1615 shlin fold, & 10 on DE -> (Renata 131, DE 121, Greyblades 55)
1620 Earthling 3 on DE -> (Renata 131, DE 124, Greyblades 55)
1623 acin 60 on DE -> (DE 184, Renata 131, Greyblades 55)
1626 Fluffy 15 on Renata -> (DE 184, Renata 146, Greyblades 55)
1628 Fluffy fold -> (DE 184, Renata 131, Greyblades 55)
1635 DIY fold, & 10 on DE -> (DE 194, Renata 131, Greyblades 30)
1638 Visorslash raise 10 on DE -> (DE 204, Renata 131, Greyblades 30)
1639 BL raise 50 on DE -> (DE 254, Renata 131, Greyblades 30)
1640 khaan fold, & 10 on DE -> (DE 264, Renata 91, Greyblades 30)
1642 Bow-wow-wow remove 20 from Renata -> (DE 264, Renata 71, Greyblades 30)
1644 Skooma 10 on DE -> (DE 274, Renata 71, Greyblades 30)
1646 Earthling fold -> (DE 271, Renata 71, Greyblades 30)
1651 Visorslash remove 35 from DE -> (DE 236, Renata 71, Greyblades 30)
1653 Fluffy 27 on Renata -> (DE 236, Renata 98, Greyblades 30)

acin looks very non-Chaotic after turning the tide in Renata's favor (#1623)
Greyblades also looks good in my opinion. I don't see him moving 51 credits on Diamondeye if they are partners (#1611). Too gutsy imo.
Visorslash also looks somewhat good for his 40 credits on DE (#1612). Probably not bussing either (but possible, he could have sensed the tide was turning).

Of course Renata looks awesomely non-Chaotic from all this.

Any bet on DE, done after #1623, could be a chaotic teammate bussing him for Town creds, specially those smaller bets (DIY, khaan, Skooma).

There also was a lot of non-voters, and I'm expecting a Chaotic or two in that list, since it would have been difficult for them to place a safe vote, siding with Renata or DE being two dangerous options. Non voters (not including those who unvoted) : Arpeg, Beefy, Believer, Crazed Rabbit, landlubber, Link, Red_Spy, robbiecon, Subotan, Warman, Winston.

You can draw your own conclusions from this voting record, pretty sure it's correct.

Sure it's possible that one of them early bussed DE, anticipating what would happen, but I think you're everyone solidly arguing in this thread today is Evil. And it's typical of townies to fight at each others, when the mafia is watching discreetly.

I think you should stop wasting your time, arguing with each others. Sure Earthling is right that these players are not confirmed, but there's enough evidence, from the DE lynch particularly, to give them some rope. We can revisit their scum-iness later.

[Earthling]

I know exactly who I have cases on and want to see dead and it's been discussed, others have some of their own opinions, just don't see a benefit of sharing with you in public here Visorslash, because even if you're not chaotics the chaotics could read what we're up to too and gain advantages they don't need to have in planning their own night actions. Your list of candidates and priorities isn't even close to my own though, except that you also mention Greyblades. Yes, I'm still of the opinion. between you and Greyblades one of you has to go so if you personally know you're in the clear you should be looking at Greyblades and vice versa. There's little chance you were both minor townie roleblockers and an even lower chance on top of that that you both got into a tiff with Renata because of your minor roleblocking claims, at least one of the two of you was so defensive and antagonist because you are not evil-aligned.

The other priority I've said a zillion times is to get faction scans or reveals from every player and know every faction's factional goals. But people like Bow-wow-wow continue to simply ignore the thread and not show up, let alone anyone else too cowardly to share info for general coordination against the chaotics. So for the time being, true, we're not getting great use out of thread discussion and really just waiting on night results again.

However about this lover business, if anything if it is Chaotix + someone else's problem it might even be more beneficial for them to step forward on their own, because if they could convince me (and probably others) they're not chaotic I probably wouldn't care, Roman's assessment of victories sounds right to me too, and it would be great to remove people from the list of "possible chaotics need to die eventually" if we could narrow down the list for free.

[Greyblades]

I had expressed doubts that MRD was Mafia and so it turned out he was a simple townie. So I had been the main person to advocate lynching Earthling and he turned out to be a joker role. Contrary to some, DE's revealing of scan results in the end was a very clear indication that he was Mafia, and I said it so, and it happened that he was. After it was revealed Renata was Mace Windu, I was one of the few people who put forward the possibility that even though DE had tried to incriminate Renata, that did not clear Renata off as a mafioso as she could be of a rival Mafia faction composed of Good people.
So far I have been pretty accurate in seeing what is going on.
Your behaviour is something in the thread. Your vote change from Earthling to mythmonster, when you did (After mythmonster advised voting for himself to avoid Earthling being lynched), and you turned your massive vote on Earthling to a 10 credit vote, not explaining anything but simply putting a smiley; that was it. Trying to maintain Earthling as a lynch bait (As he hadn't been lynched yet), and using a very unusual post to turn your vote on mythmonster, that sealed it right there for me. Every other post you make is oozing with scuminess. I had told Earthling I wasn't sure if he was Mafia, though something was definitely off with him. It turned out he was purposedly trying to kill himself and troll us into lynching/killing him. Comparatively, I say that your behaviour is a lot more like Mafia than him. A lot more. Thus why you need to be lynched pronto. And I'm pretty certain that you'll turn out mafioso.

A picture is worth a thousand words and I'm sure that it was clear I was pissed at him trying to kill me. You realy dont have anything do you?

There's little chance you were both minor townie roleblockers and an even lower chance on top of that that you both got into a tiff with Renata because of your minor roleblocking claims, at least one of the two of you was so defensive and antagonist because you are not evil-aligned.

A tiff over roleblocking? I got into a "tiff" over her admitting to trying to kill me!

[Visor]

admitting to trying to kill me!

Did the same thing to me. And a bunch of others have said they tried to kill me as well.

[Diamondeye]

Visorslash, personally I think you are exaggerating what can happen if the Lovers succeed in finding each other. If they're antiTown, it can't be their only goal, otherwise it's too easy.

As in Zelda, it wouldn't be far fetched to think these two could be plotting against the Town, but they won't be winning with 25 players remaining, or at least if won't affect our victory conditions again. If it does, I'll be seriously questioning the setup.

I'm thinking the least that can happen if the Lovers succeed (and I believe you, Visor!) is what happened with Renata; 2 points less for everyone else. We don't want that ("We" = evil + Chaotic).
Also, I think I know who at least one of the lovers are, so a revive would be really great.

[Visor]

I'm thinking the least that can happen if the Lovers succeed (and I believe you, Visor!) is what happened with Renata; 2 points less for everyone else. We don't want that ("We" = evil + Chaotic).

That's my thinking.

Also, I think I know who at least one of the lovers are, so a revive would be really great.

I know who both are, so no need to panic. :D

[Diamondeye]

I know who both are, so no need to panic. :D

Well in that case get me revived so you can tell me in private. Then I can have the other guys handle the murdering of the turtledoves.

[Visor]

Sent a PM to everyone, so no need to worry! All your scum friends know. Their love will never last now!

[Kagemusha]

Hmmmmmm.....Distraction.

[Bow-wow-wow]

The other priority I've said a zillion times is to get faction scans or reveals from every player and know every faction's factional goals. But people like Bow-wow-wow continue to simply ignore the thread and not show up, let alone anyone else too cowardly to share info for general coordination against the chaotics. So for the time being, true, we're not getting great use out of thread discussion and really just waiting on night results again.

I'm showing up in thread, I'm just not revealing the factions.

[Bow-wow-wow]

Sent a PM to everyone, so no need to worry! All your scum friends know. Their love will never last now!

I never got one. :/

[Earthling]

First, this lover business, seems like a worthless distraction at this point, but if it gets random lurkers to knock each other out I don't care. Whoever these "lovers" are I'll let you know that I will have no hard feelings if you kill Visorslash in turn or something like that, there's no evidence that's been provided (to me) this is worth caring about and again, clearing out neutrals or lurkers just narrows the suspect list of chaotics down.

I will bring up one other point of discussion that could be of use to the general thread here, and that's for people to look over item votes with the knowledge of known scum like Diamondeye, perhaps Renata a little bit because of the possibility of blocks of people opposing/favoring her also giving clues to scum. Most people ignored this when I brought it up before, except for possible scum defending their own actions, but it's still a good lead. So let's try again.

Visorslash seems insistent that his item votes were accidental and meaningless. However I wonder what he would made of Psychonaut's votes, Psychonaut voted Diamondeye items and Diamondeye to him numerous times across several days starting way back on Day 2. Considering he's a lurker-scum otherwise, anyone seriously looking for a case on somebody and having something they can do to help the town, knock yourselves out. Psychonaut would owe us all an explanation for his votes and what he's been up to for a long time anyway.

[a completely inoffensive name]

Lol, say Earthling...would you like to make a wager?

If Visorslash and Greyblades and Psychonaut are all innocent you can't post anything longer then 160 characters next mafia game.
If one of those three is chaotic then you get to pick what my punishment is.

*Oh please, please none of you be chaotics*

[Earthling]

They are certainly not all evil-aligned but there's no point to having a wager with nothing to offer in return, I don't care about whatever you do in games on here. Would be much more fun if you went and hassled somebody like Jolt with some bet over whether I'm actually evil-aligned or something like he refuses to believe.

[a completely inoffensive name]

They are certainly not all evil-aligned but there's no point to having a wager with nothing to offer in return, I don't care about whatever you do in games on here. Would be much more fun if you went and hassled somebody like Jolt with some bet over whether I'm actually evil-aligned or something like he refuses to believe.

Ah you are no fun.

[thefluffyone93]

My God...
All this squabbling reminds me of....
THE REAL HOUSEWIVES OF NEW JERSEY.

FEAR.....

[Chaotix]

Maybe the Knight who is always victorious is just a cover role for the Mad Hatter?

I'd like to know who the person who tipped off Chaotix is. :P

Nobody tipped me off.

All I had to do was read the thread and find out that Visorslash was sending out PMs and trying to organize vigilante hits. You weren't exactly subtle about that.

Anyway, I need to find another player as part of my personal victory condition. It's not going to affect anyone else negatively. Believe me or not, I don't care.

[a completely inoffensive name]

Nobody tipped me off.

All I had to do was read the thread and find out that Visorslash was sending out PMs and trying to organize vigilante hits. You weren't exactly subtle about that.

Anyway, I need to find another player as part of my personal victory condition. It's not going to affect anyone else negatively. Believe me or not, I don't care.

[thefluffyone93]

...........We can dance if we want to
We can leave your friends behind
'Cause your friends don't dance and if they don't dance
Well they're no friends of mine
I say, we can go where we want to
A place where they will never find
And we can act like we come from out of this world
Leave the real one far behind
And we can dance

[naut]

Visorslash seems insistent that his item votes were accidental and meaningless. However I wonder what he would made of Psychonaut's votes, Psychonaut voted Diamondeye items and Diamondeye to him numerous times across several days starting way back on Day 2. Considering he's a lurker-scum otherwise, anyone seriously looking for a case on somebody and having something they can do to help the town, knock yourselves out. Psychonaut would owe us all an explanation for his votes and what he's been up to for a long time anyway.

Cool story bro. Let me summarize: Barking. Wrong Tree.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Still missing a bunch of orders; was kinda hoping for more activity this late in the game. Please send in orders if you haven't already.

[Romanic]

Still missing a bunch of orders; was kinda hoping for more activity this late in the game. Please send in orders if you haven't already.

Nights already are 48 hours!!

[Visor]

You snooze you lose. :P

[Romanic]

ATPG, can you tell us who didn't send orders?

Please???

[Visor]

I can tell you now tha Red Spy was on last night, viweing the thread. No doubt he sent orders in.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Sorry, I'm just a little frustrated. I've already done as much as I can to keep the game running, and it's involved a lot of duct tape and band-aids, prods, replacements, and extensions. At this point I may have little choice but to just let the chips fall where they may and hope some of you are still having fun.