Church leaders do not believe in a literal understanding of the Bible

**rory_20_uk** · 03-14-2012, 18:16

Originally Posted by Lemur

I've always thought one of the great strengths of Christianity is that we do not, in the majority, regard the Bible as the literal word of God. As an earlier poster said, it's not a book; it's a library, cobbled together over millennia. It's full of poetry, wisdom, mutually contradictory instructions, stories, weirdness, sublime passages, the works.

A childhood friend of mine became a monk. He had an interesting take on the ritual and mind-bending contradictions of the Bible: "All of that **** is poetry. God doesn't care about it, just that we do good works and live good lives." Which coincides nicely with Rabbi Hillel's take on scripture: "That which is despicable to you, do not do to your fellow, this is the whole Torah, and the rest is commentary, go and learn it."

That is close to Quakerism. Most high churches aren't going to say all their heirachy, money and power is tacked on and not required. Women are still not ordained, priests don't marry due to dogma.

**rvg** · 03-14-2012, 18:26

Originally Posted by rory_20_uk

Women are still not ordained, priests don't marry due to dogma.

Not ordaining women and maintaining celibacy have good reasons behind them. I see no problem with that.

**rory_20_uk** · 03-14-2012, 18:28

Originally Posted by rvg

Not ordaining women and maintaining celibacy have good reasons behind them. I see no problem with that.

Care to elaborate?

**rvg** · 03-14-2012, 18:35

Originally Posted by rory_20_uk

Care to elaborate?

Sure. Women do not get ordained for the simple reason that all of Apostles were men. Jesus deliberately only chose men for those roles.

As for maintaining celibacy, I'm a husband and a father, there's no way I can fully dedicate my life to God. 1st Book of the Corinthians puts it best:
"I want you to be free from anxieties. The unmarried man is anxious about the things of the Lord, how to please the Lord. But the married man is anxious about worldly things, how to please his wife, and his interests are divided. And the unmarried or betrothed woman is anxious about the things of the Lord, how to be holy in body and spirit. But the married woman is anxious about worldly things, how to please her husband. I say this for your own benefit, gnot to lay any restraint upon you, but to promote good order and to secure your undivided devotion to the Lord."

**Idaho** · 03-15-2012, 16:29

Originally Posted by rvg

Sure. Women do not get ordained for the simple reason that all of Apostles were men. Jesus deliberately only chose men for those roles.

What about Mary Magdelen? She even had her own gospel until some 4th century Assyrians got rid of it.

**rory_20_uk** · 03-15-2012, 16:40

Originally Posted by Idaho

What about Mary Magdelen? She even had her own gospel until some 4th century Assyrians got rid of it.

It becomes a self-fulfilling argument - they are all men because everything that we choose to view as "authentic" showed they were men. It is merely coincidence that any evidence that points to women having a broader role in the church isn't properly Christian.

**rvg** · 03-15-2012, 16:50

Originally Posted by Idaho

What about Mary Magdelen? She even had her own gospel until some 4th century Assyrians got rid of it.

She was not an apostle.

**Idaho** · 03-15-2012, 20:07

Originally Posted by rvg

She was not an apostle.

She was. She isn't now.

**Philippus Flavius Homovallumus** · 03-15-2012, 22:30

Originally Posted by Idaho

What about Mary Magdelen? She even had her own gospel until some 4th century Assyrians got rid of it.

Have you read said Gospel? All extant evidence point to Mary of Bethany a.k.a. Mary Magdelene as most likely Jesus "wife", not an Apostle, in the sense of one of his inner "managerial" circle of followers, that does not mean she is not an "Apostle" in the literal sense and indeed the Roman Church describes her as "Apostle to the Apostles" because she brought them the news of the resurrection.

**Idaho** · 03-16-2012, 11:33

Originally Posted by Philipvs Vallindervs Calicvla

Have you read said Gospel? All extant evidence point to Mary of Bethany a.k.a. Mary Magdelene as most likely Jesus "wife", not an Apostle, in the sense of one of his inner "managerial" circle of followers, that does not mean she is not an "Apostle" in the literal sense and indeed the Roman Church describes her as "Apostle to the Apostles" because she brought them the news of the resurrection.

So does that mean that women can be popes but not priests?

Or is it just another story to pick and choose at like the rest of the Bible?