How could a loving god send people to Hell?

[Sigurd]

The bible is a group of books. Some of these taken from Judasim some from favourite authors as selected by the Nicea editors.

We should lose the Nicea connection with the compilation of the Bible permanently. I am sorry to say that those who still make this connection are snoozing in class.
And it is not as bleak as we make it. The translations over all is pretty much quality work - but the history behind the meddling with and the purposeful editing, removing, adding, reinstating etc.. makes it simply untrustworthy as a canon of THE TRUTH.
Maybe some believe as GC states that the divine will get through despite all this, but I have to counter with the fact that there are over 35 000 self proclaimed Christian denominations out there ALL claiming to have the truth as explained by the canon of scripture. ALL claiming that their interpretation is the ONLY correct one. A logic which collapse on itself on the first disagreement of a doctrine... i.e Baptism - necessary or not. The Holy Ghost confirmed for one group that it is necessary for salvation and it also confirmed for the other group that it is not necessary. It doesn't take a very intelligent man to point out the paradox there.

[total relism]

Really? Which first hand observers were they? And which bits did they write?

I think i will make translation of bible next thread instead of slavery or why is there death and suffering as this seems to be the biggest claim against bible on this thread.

Oh come on, you know that the Bible is the word of God, no matter what they did in Nicea. Foolish boy.

I think i will make translation of bible next thread instead of slavery or why is there death and suffering as this seems to be the biggest claim against bible on this thread. I will say people on this forum need to watch a debate and actually learn for themselves and stop watching the da vinci code code. I am truly amazed how well the media has done its job in indoctrination.

I like this subject, right here, but when taking about religious text you have to qualify everything with a little bit of faith, because worldly proof is likely not forthcoming.

If the Bible is figurative, and the product of man, but also divinely inspired, then it falls on the individual Christian or group of Christians to recognize that they are studying the divine word through the corrupt and self-serving lens of man. If your faith is as strong as your mind, you will learn the correct lessons.

"wordly proof" I think you mean evidence for based on observation. This will be great topic when I do it so stay around [future thread].

The bible is a group of books. Some of these taken from Judasim some from favourite authors as selected by the Nicea editors.

In modern terms it is much like the early Japanese manga that came out west. They were dubbed 'translated', key elements were changed, and disparate stories melded to make a story arc even if the orginal stories weren't related.

The same thing can be seen with Star Wars. You have the films which are considered core with devout fans debating if I, II and III are still core, is Clone Wars considered canon or not. Whilst particular books written by approved authors is considered part of the extended universe. On top of that is all the fan fiction and fan clubs. Some of which such as the 501st got folded into the core films.

Add in Disney's takeover, fifty years and lot of new authors. Then do a best of anthology and you will have something that approaches the eclectic assemblage that we refer to as the bible.

The bible is a story "inspired by someone", "written about by others" and edited by yet others who weren't even there.

It's a best of collection done by cover bands.

I will be saving these quotes about the claims people are making, lets see if these same people claim the same on my translation of the bible thread when facts are presented.

I believe in concrete evidence. What's your reason for not believing in evidence?

This assumes i dont believe in "evidence" i would say the reason I cant be atheist and the reason I am christian is because of the evidence [future thread]. Also in that thread if you stay around I will show it is you [assuming your atheist] who must reject alot of concrete evidence.

We should lose the Nicea connection with the compilation of the Bible permanently. I am sorry to say that those who still make this connection are snoozing in class.
And it is not as bleak as we make it. The translations over all is pretty much quality work - but the history behind the meddling with and the purposeful editing, removing, adding, reinstating etc.. makes it simply untrustworthy as a canon of THE TRUTH.
Maybe some believe as GC states that the divine will get through despite all this, but I have to counter with the fact that there are over 35 000 self proclaimed Christian denominations out there ALL claiming to have the truth as explained by the canon of scripture. ALL claiming that their interpretation is the ONLY correct one. A logic which collapse on itself on the first disagreement of a doctrine... i.e Baptism - necessary or not. The Holy Ghost confirmed for one group that it is necessary for salvation and it also confirmed for the other group that it is not necessary. It doesn't take a very intelligent man to point out the paradox there.

I think i will make translation of bible next thread instead of slavery or why is there death and suffering as this seems to be the biggest claim against bible on this thread. I will say people on this forum need to watch a debate and actually learn for themselves and stop watching the da vinci code code. I am truly amazed how well the media has done its job in indoctrination.

[spankythehippo]

This assumes i dont believe in "evidence" i would say the reason I cant be atheist and the reason I am christian is because of the evidence [future thread]. Also in that thread if you stay around I will show it is you [assuming your atheist] who must reject alot of concrete evidence.

So a guy gets crucified and dies. Then a few days later he comes back to life? Sorry, that is not a believable story. To be considered evidence or truth, it must be able to be repeated. If I drop an apple, it will fall to the ground. I can drop millions of apples, and they will all drop to the ground. Hence, the theory of gravity still holds true.

Has anyone else come back from the dead? Has anyone else fed 5000 people with 2 fish (or whatever the story says)? Has anyone else been able to change water into wine?

If one were to call these feats of Jesus "experiments", these "experiments" cannot be recreated, so they are not reliable, hence they are rejected. Reliability lies in the ability to perform the same experiment multiple times to achieve the same results. There is only so much a fairy tale can educated others on.

Now, if one says that some stories in the Bible are exaggerations, what does that say about the rest of the Bible? If you read a textbook and find a huge number of mistakes, it is not a valid textbook. Same thing with the Bible. It loses it's credibility.

[total relism]

Sorry tr but this stuff is getting a bit boring now. Having someone fill the back room with Scripture lessons is lowering the tone.

Can you just put it all in one thread?

I am thinking of doing the other 13 over two threads, I think you guys are right that would be better.

So a guy gets crucified and dies. Then a few days later he comes back to life? Sorry, that is not a believable story. To be considered evidence or truth, it must be able to be repeated. If I drop an apple, it will fall to the ground. I can drop millions of apples, and they will all drop to the ground. Hence, the theory of gravity still holds true.

Has anyone else come back from the dead? Has anyone else fed 5000 people with 2 fish (or whatever the story says)? Has anyone else been able to change water into wine?

If one were to call these feats of Jesus "experiments", these "experiments" cannot be recreated, so they are not reliable, hence they are rejected. Reliability lies in the ability to perform the same experiment multiple times to achieve the same results. There is only so much a fairy tale can educated others on.

Now, if one says that some stories in the Bible are exaggerations, what does that say about the rest of the Bible? If you read a textbook and find a huge number of mistakes, it is not a valid textbook. Same thing with the Bible. It loses it's credibility.

Evidence for the Resurrection is future thread, many atheist have become christian on this alone. There is aplenty wrong with your logic and i will be glad to show you on that future thread.

[spankythehippo]

Evidence for the Resurrection is future thread, many atheist have become christian on this alone. There is aplenty wrong with your logic and i will be glad to show you on that future thread.

My logic is used in science. The computer you are typing on is a product of science. This site is hosted on the internet, also a product of science. I assume you live in a building, a product of engineering, which is, inherently, science. I believe your signature says "Test all things; hold fast what is good". Isn't that what I've been saying? Test theories, if they work, utilise them. If they don't, scrap them.

It pays to be concise in your argument. So tell me what's wrong in a clear format without the use of long and meaningless Biblical quotes that hardly reflect your argument or your point. Also, just a tip, use better sentence structure, punctuation and grammar. I don't even bother reading those massive walls of unorganised text.

[InsaneApache]

many atheist have become christian

What about christians that become athiest?

[total relism]

My logic is used in science. The computer you are typing on is a product of science. This site is hosted on the internet, also a product of science. I assume you live in a building, a product of engineering, which is, inherently, science. I believe your signature says "Test all things; hold fast what is good". Isn't that what I've been saying? Test theories, if they work, utilise them. If they don't, scrap them.

It pays to be concise in your argument. So tell me what's wrong in a clear format without the use of long and meaningless Biblical quotes that hardly reflect your argument or your point. Also, just a tip, use better sentence structure, punctuation and grammar. I don't even bother reading those massive walls of unorganised text.

As far as science I agree 100%, if your faith contradicts science your faith is wrong. This is future thread the one i do most. But you have mistaken what I was saying on the post. The rest we shall wait for other thread on the topic.

What about christians that become athiest?

Not saying they haven't, I just said many atheist have become christian because of the evidence for the resurrection of jesus, can you point to any christian who became atheist because of the historical inaccuracy of the resurrection?. Actually if you can, please save for that thread.