Hearthstone Mafia [Concluded]

[Logic]

So, I can't shake help but shake the feeling that GH and Kage are teamed, but here is the biggest evidence AGAINST the theory that I can find:
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Day One, Final Tally

3 El Barto (Montmorency, Kagemusha, GeneralHankerchief)

2 Montmorency (Dp101/Snerk, Manasi)
2 Dp101 (Logic, Csargo)

1 Manasi (El Barto)

Not Voting: Sooh
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There is no good reason I can think of for both scum to be on a D1 wagon mislynch and kill the only other person on the same wagon the following night. I'll have to ISO GH next.

[Csargo]

Ok, thanks.

So overall it would be safe to say that you don't really have a particularly strong scumread on Kage but he's still a bit worse-looking than everyone else?

Yeah, I don't have a Manasi level scumread on him, but he's done enough in my mind that he's worthy of being at the bottom of my list imo.

[GeneralHankerchief]

Yeah, I don't have a Manasi level scumread on him, but he's done enough in my mind that he's worthy of being at the bottom of my list imo.

Speaking of Manasi, can you elaborate your take on her? Your read of her in your earlier main post was the shortest by far, just wondered if there was anything more.

[Csargo]

Speaking of Manasi, can you elaborate your take on her? Your read of her in your earlier main post was the shortest by far, just wondered if there was anything more.

Not really. I find it pretty hard to read Manasi most of the time. I felt the disillusionment with the state of the game seemed genuine, I share the same sentiment to a degree, but that seemed townie to me at least. Other than that I've just gotten good vibes from her posts, the content has been good I've thought as well. It's probably more of a gut read than anything else honestly.

What do you think of her so far?

[GeneralHankerchief]

Not really. I find it pretty hard to read Manasi most of the time. I felt the disillusionment with the state of the game seemed genuine, I share the same sentiment to a degree, but that seemed townie to me at least. Other than that I've just gotten good vibes from her posts, the content has been good I've thought as well. It's probably more of a gut read than anything else honestly.

What do you think of her so far?

I'm coming around more and more to Kage being town, so a lot of folks are dropping for me as a consequence and Manasi is one of the biggest droppers. Yeah she looked good but the more I think about it, the disillusionment thing is reasonably easy to fake and something that's not necessarily indicative of her alignment. She could just have been excited to play a game on the Org in this particular environment and have been ready to pull the wool over people like Monty's and my eyes.

[GeneralHankerchief]

@Dp101, I know you've got RL stuff, but if you could give your input on things sooner rather than later, I'd greatly appreciate it.

[Logic]

There is a reasonable chance I won't be online enough for more than glances during the weekend.

[GeneralHankerchief]

There is a reasonable chance I won't be online enough for more than glances during the weekend.

When do you see yourself logging out for the rest of the phase?

[Logic]

When do you see yourself logging out for the rest of the phase?

The wife's spring break starts NOW. And she wants to do stuff. So I might be able to log in tomorrow morning, early my time. But that is probably all you will get from me this phase. If I do log in, I plan to do GH's ISO.

[GeneralHankerchief]

The wife's spring break starts NOW. And she wants to do stuff. So I might be able to log in tomorrow morning, early my time. But that is probably all you will get from me this phase. If I do log in, I plan to do GH's ISO.

Don't bother.

I hardclaim Tracker.

I tracked Csargo and he visited Monty last night.

Vote: Csargo

[GeneralHankerchief]

Q: Is this serious/real?
100% yes. The only way it isn't is if my track was tampered with in some way, and considering this game started out with 9 players I consider that highly unlikely.

Q: Why claim now?
I was originally going to hold off until D3 considering Sooh is the most likely N2 kill, but if we got this lynch wrong it would have put us in LYLO and I want no part of that. Considering Csargo as well as the people I believe are most likely to be his partners are pushing Kage, and Kage is currently the leading candidate, I decided to claim now. This way we still got some information out of the round but everyone will (hopefully) see this in time to move their votes accordingly.

Q: Why did you track Csargo?
Because he was the most clear player. If you're mafia, you're going to assign your most clear player to do the kill.

Q: I don't believe you.
Sorry. Lynch me if you must, but you'll see my flip.

[Csargo]

Don't bother.

I hardclaim Tracker.

I tracked Csargo and he visited Monty last night.

Vote: Csargo

[Csargo]

Don't bother.

I hardclaim Tracker.

I tracked Csargo and he visited Monty last night.

Vote: Csargo

https://i.imgur.com/oTBgIbU.mp4

[Csargo]

Don't bother.

I hardclaim Tracker.

I tracked Csargo and he visited Monty last night.

Vote: Csargo

[Csargo]

That was difficult.

[GeneralHankerchief]

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[Csargo]

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[Kagemusha]

Good job GH! So my hunch about Csarco was right while i was wrong about Barto. I still havent lost it.Vote:Csargo

If Csargo flips scum we definetely have sometihng to work with.

[Dp101]

Catching up, this post worries me, a lot.

Here's Dp's full amount of posts since subbing in:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

(re: Manasi thinking Kage's early wall was suspicious and weird)


(re: my early takes on Csargo and Sooh being town and Kage possibly being mafia)

N1




re: Csargo saying there hasn't been much discourse going on


responding to Kage about his townreads on Csargo and Manasi


responding to Manasi directly asking him for his take on Kage


responding to Manasi about the game being low-activity


responding to Kage asking Manasi why she's so aggressive




responding to Manasi about how she left Dp out of her reads.

I don't think this is town Dp. I just don't. I get that he's rusty. I get that he's been super busy IRL. I also don't care. The thing I look for with Dp is that super pure tone. That's not a feature that really needs extended immersion in the game to make itself known, like Logic's effort for example. It just naturally rises to the surface. And it hasn't here.

I find this level of aggression from you extremely... unsettling. You are expecting me to be completely pure in tone, and also somehow think that I can get that even while not being fully in thread? Like, imo, the main thing that good tone stems from is being extremely in-sync with how the thread is feeling, and that's near-impossible to have while not being around that much. I agree that my participation here has been spotty at best, and I did not anticipate being quite this rusty when I returned to the game. Honestly the "let's throw DP under the bus 100% with complete certainty and expect him to do things that he can't/doesn't (such as have good tone while not being around)" feels extremely reminiscent of my last org game with you as scum.

[Dp101]

Don't bother.

I hardclaim Tracker.

I tracked Csargo and he visited Monty last night.

Vote: Csargo

Welp, lolme. Ignore everything I just said in my last post. Vote: Csargo

If you lied about this, I'm coming for your head tomorrow.

[Dp101]

Not really. I find it pretty hard to read Manasi most of the time. I felt the disillusionment with the state of the game seemed genuine, I share the same sentiment to a degree, but that seemed townie to me at least. Other than that I've just gotten good vibes from her posts, the content has been good I've thought as well. It's probably more of a gut read than anything else honestly.

What do you think of her so far?

I feel like this is... probably something that's said more towards a wolf than a villager? Like, it feels like Csargo was internally going "ok, time to talk about a consensus town, this shouldn't be too hard", and then thought he could get away with saying a fair amount of vague good-sounding things that are similar to what others have said, relying on the fact that people are mostly already agreeing as a way to get out of having to fake too much work. If Manasi was scum with csargo here, I'd expect either a. continuing the "I can't really read manasi" thing throughout the post rather than trying to construct a townread that might link them together, or b. having more specific reasons to give the townread rather than just going with the flow. To expand on the latter option, if I thought I was fairly secure and had an opportunity to talk about a scumbuddy who was doing well, I'd emphasise what has been getting them townread as hard as I can, in order to try and support them more and hopefully promote us as a towncore. Instead, there's this weird non-specific read.

[Dp101]

@Dp101, I know you've got RL stuff, but if you could give your input on things sooner rather than later, I'd greatly appreciate it.

Yeah, sorry, trying to lay stuff out now.

[Dp101]

I'd put you higher than Dp101 purely because I can get a better read on you going forward than I can Dp101.

I feel fairly good about Logic currently, because his most recent stuff is pretty inline with what I remember from other games. I had him way lower initially, but his current engagement/posts have been excellent imo.

Manasi feels good at this point.

I think I'm usually pretty good at reading you, but that's probably wrong. You going along with the Barto vote so easily sort of put me off a bit. Nothing you've done since has raised my read of you all that much.

Dp101 is sort of meh hard to gauge with so little coming out from him.

Kage's summary post was odd to me, but that seems to be par for the course for D1 lists. Thought the Barto push was weird, I clearly wasn't a fan.



I think Logic's quote sums up my thoughts on Kage pretty well.

Moar attempted spew-reading attempts, since I never do this and need to get better at it, and the play is imo clearer if GH is lying so I see more value in trying to catch the scum after Csargo:

The logic read feels somewhat like providing support to a scumbuddy who has improved dramatically and trying to push that point into people's heads. If logic was town here, I feel like scum!csargo would be focussing on lacklustre prior actions rather than trying to paint a picture of improvement.

Vague Manasi read is *noted*, but not sure exactly what it means.

Tries to discredit kage via logic, in a way that strikes me as honestly weird regardless of alignment. Leaving aside the part where it's honestly fairly wrong, I'm not sure what incentive there is as either alignment to make this push based off of logic's. This would make town!logic somewhat more likely, but it's also possible that this is a wolf-team coordinating somewhat clumsily to push a mislynch (although why they wouldn't go on me is a mystery to me).

[Dp101]

Someone talk to me pls I know it's not the best hour but idk what I'm doing.

[Kagemusha]

Someone talk to me pls I know it's not the best hour but idk what I'm doing.

Vote Csargo. GH has claimed to be some sort of tracker/ detective and painted Csargo scum. Its the absolutely best we have so far. If Csargo does not flip scum. We will lynch GH next.

[Sooh]

Don't bother.

I hardclaim Tracker.

I tracked Csargo and he visited Monty last night.

Vote: Csargo

Why did you track Csargo?

If he was the most clear player, wouldn't he be the most likely player to be visited?
To track someone seems to be more profitable by going after your scum reads, no?

[Sooh]

Thank you for the ISO Logic. Like i said earlier if you are scum. You are playing extremely well. Your process seems very good, but conclusion is wrong. You build a case against me based on connection with GH, which you seem to be doubting very much in your Iso. So you seem to be arriving into wrong conclusion with genuine thought process, unlike Manasi who seems to be trying to use momentum in order to push who she wants to be lynched. I want to hear from the only confirmed townie aka Sooh before pushing what i have in mind.

The more I read this the less I like it.

When I read that it sounds like "I don't want to make any pushes on my own, but I'll look for whoever the clear person pushes and I'll say that I agree with one of those, especially if one isn't on my team"

[Kagemusha]

The more I read this the less I like it.

When I read that it sounds like "I don't want to make any pushes on my own, but I'll look for whoever the clear person pushes and I'll say that I agree with one of those, especially if one isn't on my team"

Sooh. If Csargo is scum. I was the first person to see that. I made the push towards Barto, but i was wrong. How can you accuse me of not wanting to make my own cases when that is the exact thing i have been doing the whole game. And that is the exact same thing i do every time i play these games. It is quite frustrating being called weird, intense and ..., but that i can understand, but not wanting to make my own cases. That is just blatantly wrong. Why i wanted to wait for you was because i did not want to turn this game more into direction it was going, aka people being lazy and not going through their own process.

[Kagemusha]

I am staunch believer of the KISS principle. If you have the most simple answer to a dilemma use it. Only if the solution is not working, find more complicated one. At this point lynching Csargo should be a no brainer. The mathematics are on the town side. No matter if GH was pulling a straight forward stupid stunt as a scum now and fake claiming a role. The town would still get a scum and afterwards the numbers would be at towns side.

[Sooh]

I still want to hear from GH regarding his selection of tracking Csargo. I also want to hear from Csargo who appear to have been stunned by this.