Sorceror 17er Game Thread

[katze]

oh i guess ive been in F3 as mafia but that F3 only lasted a few hours and i didnt even get to vote in it because a villager accidentally selfhammered after being voted by the other villager

[Sleep]

i instinctively typed "acknowledged" before remembering that this means nothing for my alignment

shame

anyway if you boomed me whatever and its on me for not listening to the screams of the dead players calling for your head

i think as mafia i very easily could have pivoted onto hk last eod and that saves cape which puts me in a game winning situation given he was hard townreading me

on me for being a lamer and not following through but i let myself be cowed


regardless my instincts yesterday was that the interactions hk was getting cleared off were weak and that he had spent significant portions of the game spinning his wheels rather than meaningfully attempting to find the last mafia. that was my impression on my iso skim of him. ive seen better reasons to townread you

[Sleep]

oh i guess ive been in F3 as mafia but that F3 only lasted a few hours and i didnt even get to vote in it because a villager accidentally selfhammered after being voted by the other villager

i was like wut for a minute before i remembered it was alexa in the champs f3 and not you

[katze]

@Sleep @hollowkatt

what do you feel has been the best part of your game?

what do you regret the most this game?

[Sleep]

i dont know if this would be meaningfull convincing at all but this isnt really how id approach f3 as mafia

[katze]

anyway if you boomed me whatever and its on me for not listening to the screams of the dead players calling for your head

i think as mafia i very easily could have pivoted onto hk last eod and that saves cape which puts me in a game winning situation given he was hard townreading me

on me for being a lamer and not following through but i let myself be cowed


regardless my instincts yesterday was that the interactions hk was getting cleared off were weak and that he had spent significant portions of the game spinning his wheels rather than meaningfully attempting to find the last mafia. that was my impression on my iso skim of him. ive seen better reasons to townread you

thing is like

my vote on cape was super super last second and dobby/HK were probably never going to swap

so like, if you're maf then you probably didn't do anything because you didn't think it'd pan out? thats how i see it

[katze]

i dont know if this would be meaningfull convincing at all but this isnt really how id approach f3 as mafia

how do you think you'd approach this F3 as mafia

cause this post on its own does nothing :p

[Sleep]

@Sleep @hollowkatt

what do you feel has been the best part of your game?

what do you regret the most this game?

i guess the bset part has just been...just maintaining my effort and WIM? sometimes i struggle in games to maintain enthusiasm but i feel i have been consistent this game despite being hugely distracted in the middle of it


i mean, mostly my reads have not been very good. i think all 3 previous chops were lazy on my part and i should have played better. i caught essentially 0 mafia this game. i always join these invitational type player games thinking im going to do etter this time and work hard and ill be smart and have good reads and prove myself. and then i get shithoused and reminded i'm basically an ordinary player who is probably =rand. so thats frustrating ebecause i dont think it was a very good game on my part. even when i did come around to correctly townreading someone i was too cowed by the other players to be vocal about it. its just a reminder of hwhere im at, but im trying not to engage in excessive self-flagellation over that anymore. (i have thoughts on the limits of read rate but dont really wanna get into that here)

i dunno

i guess i wish i hadnt backed down on cape? my other wrong reads it was too hard for me to find an alternative but with cape i had the correct read and let dobby fight me out of it

[hollowkatt]

@Sleep @hollowkatt

what do you feel has been the best part of your game?

what do you regret the most this game?

I think my best part was D1 when I had the reads on Ender and Monstr. Since then I have epically fallen off a cliff and my reads have plummeted.

I feel like the engagement I had with dobby was probably my most villagery work in terms of actually finding common ground, understanding why I was being suspected, and showing dobby how he could have been wrong.

I also enjoyed susing on Raskol even if most of that was shitposting.

As far as regrets, not doing more "homework" and trying to fly by the seat of my pants the last couple of days. I really thought Cape was going to be a hit and end the game. I haven't done much due diligence with regards to Sleep.

I think the most important day is D1, then D2. By D3 we were looking for the metaphorical needle in the haystack because we were down to 1 wolf left and far too many villagers.

I find things are easier / become more obvs as the game naturally dwindles down and with three wolves dying in the first three days that has given the last wolf a lot of wiggle room in terms of "just be more town than 1 other person". They don't even have to be particularly deep because again the only day we really have associations from is D1 and part of D2 but Dolby blew up early and Ender lolcatted till he blew up.

[Sleep]

how do you think you'd approach this F3 as mafia

cause this post on its own does nothing :p

mmmf okay

so like the approach ive had, if im not in a confirmed cross going into the day, is that i basically fencesit as hard as possile and dither my time away. the clock is ur ally as mafia. people are naturally hesitant to make a decision and under time pressure they are mioe likely to make a mistake. throwing down the gauntlet in a 1v1 means i lose a vote from someone who could have given me the win. this is especialy true when ypuve been claiming to be townreading hk for a while - eod vote yesterday notwithstanding given it was the only counterwagon available

in general in f3 the bet way to win, if you have to give up hammer, is to give it up to the person most likely to vote wrong. (i made a mistake in a turbo giving it to benneh over IH because i had locked myself into pushing IH). in this situation with you coming out set against me i probably take my chances and just vote you and let hk hammer

[hollowkatt]

how do you think you'd approach this F3 as mafia

cause this post on its own does nothing :p

The two times I've been in F(x) I bullied someone into voting town. Syn voting Dizzy in bluey on TS and Cornflower voting Inconquerable when I was wolfing with Mistyx in champs.

I tried the same tactic in a game on SC2mafia in a deck mafia game guillo hosted over there. Got 1 person to vote town but couldn't get a second, then the two people who weren't voting town voted me (it was F4 and sleep wasn't allowed) and the guy I'd gotten to vote wrong swapped.

Anyways, I typically play wolf like I play Dark Souls, Big Bonk style, not so much finesse.

[katze]

nod nod

again, to both of you:

how confident are you that i am town?

how confident are you that the other person is a wolf?

[Sleep]

have either of you ever been in a spot like this? i have but i play a lot of mafia

[hollowkatt]

mmmf okay

so like the approach ive had, if im not in a confirmed cross going into the day, is that i basically fencesit as hard as possile and dither my time away. the clock is ur ally as mafia. people are naturally hesitant to make a decision and under time pressure they are mioe likely to make a mistake. throwing down the gauntlet in a 1v1 means i lose a vote from someone who could have given me the win. this is especialy true when ypuve been claiming to be townreading hk for a while - eod vote yesterday notwithstanding given it was the only counterwagon available

in general in f3 the bet way to win, if you have to give up hammer, is to give it up to the person most likely to vote wrong. (i made a mistake in a turbo giving it to benneh over IH because i had locked myself into pushing IH). in this situation with you coming out set against me i probably take my chances and just vote you and let hk hammer

That makes sense in a game where Hammer and Locked Votes are a thing. Given though that it's not I think it would be in your best interest as wolf to continue to hammer HK wolfing, try to get me in compromised positions, and work to maintain that till the deadline. I think that works for a couple reasons and the biggest one being solving fatigue. I remember a MU game where town lost to Dya, Zone, Ephemeral when Dya and Zone were the last two wolves alive b/c Dya buried myself, visor, and... fatmo? in wall after wall for a gameday and a half to force that fatigue in.

The problem with that strategy is that you also run into wolfing fatigue where you've got to make sure that you continue to make sense and appear more town than the person you're trying to get chopped.

Another reason that works is the longer you dogpile the same person the more likely they are to start experiencing tilt which can be taken advantage of again to further indicate they're wolfing. It's a fine line to walk though because you want your "victim" to be on the back foot but you don't want to actually induce real tilt b/c that most often is townie when it happens.
You want unsettled and nervous, not "rager"

[hollowkatt]

nod nod

again, to both of you:

how confident are you that i am town?

how confident are you that the other person is a wolf?

none confidence with left tinfoil

[katze]

have either of you ever been in a spot like this? i have but i play a lot of mafia

by "spot like this" do you mean F3

cause yeah but if you want me to link the game you're gonna have to sieve through a really hard to navigate archive site and it's like, my 5th game literally ever. would say it's not super representative of my play even though i did lolcat and openwolf in that F3 (yes i was town) (yes i got the hammer) (dont ask questions)

[Sleep]

nod nod

again, to both of you:

how confident are you that i am town?

how confident are you that the other person is a wolf?

about 80-20, i'd say? enough that i would've been willing to bet the game on it a while ago

the way hk has playing doesnt really make sense to me as town although im going to research to see if im just flat-out missing something here in terms of playstyle

i mostly found the idea that you were unpaired with ender/ladd persuasive while i thought hollowkatts interactions with ender looked more like scum theater to me - call each other wolfy then back off for a bit

[hollowkatt]

have either of you ever been in a spot like this? i have but i play a lot of mafia

exactly once tbh.

I was town on my home site, long fought game, down to three people left, I wanted the hammer, day deadline was like 96 hours or something like that, and we danced for literally days before I got it wrong.

[Sleep]

by "spot like this" do you mean F3

cause yeah but if you want me to link the game you're gonna have to sieve through a really hard to navigate archive site and it's like, my 5th game literally ever. would say it's not super representative of my play even though i did lolcat and openwolf in that F3 (yes i was town) (yes i got the hammer) (dont ask questions)

if you dont think its representative of where youre at as a player anymore then i dont need to see it because it wont be useful, altho id look at any lylo situation

[hollowkatt]

anyways, I'm going to be spending time re-reading D1 again. Tag me if there's anything specific you want to talk about.

[katze]

if you dont think its representative of where youre at as a player anymore then i dont need to see it because it wont be useful, altho id look at any lylo situation

https://fol-archive.netlify.app/t/vf...!page=257.html

the abovementioned towngame if you realllly care (its a pretty funny read tbh)

https://www.mafiauniverse.com/forums...ar-of-the-Rift

mafia f3

https://www.mafiauniverse.com/forums...38#post5339138

mafia f5

https://www.mafiauniverse.com/forums...ons-Team-Mafia

town f6 if you wanna stretch the definition a bit

https://www.mafiauniverse.com/forums...Poisoner-21-er

town, wasnt in any lylo/mylos but was consensus PoE in LyLo-1, i guess it's probably similar to this game

[Sleep]

That makes sense in a game where Hammer and Locked Votes are a thing. Given though that it's not I think it would be in your best interest as wolf to continue to hammer HK wolfing, try to get me in compromised positions, and work to maintain that till the deadline. I think that works for a couple reasons and the biggest one being solving fatigue. I remember a MU game where town lost to Dya, Zone, Ephemeral when Dya and Zone were the last two wolves alive b/c Dya buried myself, visor, and... fatmo? in wall after wall for a gameday and a half to force that fatigue in.

The problem with that strategy is that you also run into wolfing fatigue where you've got to make sure that you continue to make sense and appear more town than the person you're trying to get chopped.

Another reason that works is the longer you dogpile the same person the more likely they are to start experiencing tilt which can be taken advantage of again to further indicate they're wolfing. It's a fine line to walk though because you want your "victim" to be on the back foot but you don't want to actually induce real tilt b/c that most often is townie when it happens.
You want unsettled and nervous, not "rager"

technically true that when i am in a cross going in and burying the other person is effective. but im not really doing that here, i havent even bothered to truly case you

[Sleep]

and in mentioning "solving fatigue" i feel like that is an exact description of your play the last few days, hollowkatt

where i have basically been manic in restlessly combing over the thread for new information

i guess what im having a hard time seeing is someone being this lax in this spot as town

[katze]

i cant tell if im glad votes arent locked so i dont have to stress about making The Decision or if im sad that i have to still consider worlds where i get voted instead

i also kinda ran out of questions although i thought giras answer to the best thing/biggest regret was good

[Sleep]

i cant tell if im glad votes arent locked so i dont have to stress about making The Decision or if im sad that i have to still consider worlds where i get voted instead

you dont have to consider it its happening

vote: katze

[Sleep]

sike

vote: hollowkatt

[katze]

you dont have to consider it its happening

vote: katze

walterwhitefallingover.gif

[katze]

im trying to process like

cause one of you is mafia and one is town, ldo

and you both came into today with pretty opposite views on dobby

so obviously like - i thought dobby was gonna die. im town. therefore the person who also thought obby would die is town! wowee

(yes i know its not that simple)

(but i still think HKs view of that is weird and im trying to decipher if it's an absurd villager thought or not)

[Sleep]

i will do research largely to entertain the curiosity of my idle mind


i can try to put to words my feelings about hk like i should have done yesterday


or i can regale you with my boomer tales of how i went 5/5 in f3/f4 as mafia back in 2012

[Sleep]

im trying to process like

cause one of you is mafia and one is town, ldo

and you both came into today with pretty opposite views on dobby

so obviously like - i thought dobby was gonna die. im town. therefore the person who also thought obby would die is town! wowee

(yes i know its not that simple)

(but i still think HKs view of that is weird and im trying to decipher if it's an absurd villager thought or not)

i also thought dobby was clearly town and hk giving that view just sounds kinda fake honestly