Tarot Mafia

[Dolby]

The only reason ladd went over in the first place is because he went to bed, coupled with the people most likely to shield him (me jan sunbae) also *all* either being in bed or afk. If I'm a wolf in his shoes and I think I can swing it over, I *go* for it. Then try to post my way out of it the next day (which dya just taking him out being a good move because of that lol, i used to say that in some situations like that you just shouldn't give me a chance to talk because I can be *very* convincing so you if it doesn't hurt your wincon, just kill me before I get the chance)

Feeling somewhat ill today which fuckin sucks.

maple help do you have any sense of what the approximate vc is

[grr]

so like. umm. did maple actually kill arctic with pgo. because. idk if that has ever been cleared up in any capacity but 3 town deaths one night still kinda wild isnt it. neutral was gone alr. i lowkey thought some town might have popped bopolis for the stuff dya pointed out last at EoD (thot maybe dya themselves, i found it also a bit pingy).

the only reason i'd be kinda surprised is cuz, maple announced pgo openly in thread so. uhhh. didnt expect he would shoot there?

also like. where did that "wisdoms PR claim doesnt check out" thing disappear to. lmao. yesterday everyone was like oh yeah thats not a thing probs and today is like ???

yeah ig bottom line is idfk what yall are doing ngl.

[Maple]

maple help do you have any sense of what the approximate vc is

I think its like 3 or so votes on wisdom and i and then random votes elsewhere?

i wasnt exactly keeping count lol

[Dolby]

so like. umm. did maple actually kill arctic with pgo. because. idk if that has ever been cleared up in any capacity but 3 town deaths one night still kinda wild isnt it. neutral was gone alr. i lowkey thought some town might have popped bopolis for the stuff dya pointed out last at EoD (thot maybe dya themselves, i found it also a bit pingy).

the only reason i'd be kinda surprised is cuz, maple announced pgo openly in thread so. uhhh. didnt expect he would shoot there?

also like. where did that "wisdoms PR claim doesnt check out" thing disappear to. lmao. yesterday everyone was like oh yeah thats not a thing probs and today is like ???

yeah ig bottom line is idfk what yall are doing ngl.

I think I came up with the maple killed arctic with pgo theory but don't believe it anymore

think that wisdom is a wolf for posting unrelated to their claim

[grr]

Wisdom 3 Dolby, insomnia, grr
Dolby 2 Maple, Enderwiggin
maple 2 wisdom, gemma
knightofneeee 1 dyachei

i think this is VC currently.

[Dolby]

ok cool

Jan visited Dya last night so he wasn't roleblocked, Maple isn't a townlock or anything but I think they aren't a good yeet today.

[grr]

ok cool

Jan visited Dya last night so he wasn't roleblocked, Maple isn't a townlock or anything but I think they aren't a good yeet today.

how'd you know?

[Dolby]

how'd you know?

tracked him

I know this is an insane use of a track but I thought it would be a good proxy if Maple was alive today. Am a JOAT, used a doc on Stett N1 and roleblock on Maple N2

[Maple]

@Dolby so dyachei and sunbae both have wisdom/ben as not w/w

i guess based on day play

but there's the possible w/w potential with like the whole picking up the wagon and moving it to ladd

I'm of two minds here. 1) Killing ladd can be seen as worth it in and of itself (i wish language evolved to just make inandofitself be one word, that'd go so hard). It's pretty big to get him to go over esp if you're voting with our only mech confirm (dya, who voted there first). 2) Would ben see the risk of swapping to ladd (against the plan + generally very wolfy to do) to be worth it independently? Or would further upside be required?

Upside 1) Jan is still locked into jailing me. I think it is very reasonable for him to think I am dying either way and that Jan wouldnt deviate from the plan, however even if jan *does* perhaps he thinks surviving to the next day he can just get me to go over after killing jan?
Upside 2) Save w!wisdom, or save v!wisdom for a future ml. Straight forward.

Downside 1) If dya still has a shot left and lied about the claim, there is immense risk here (obviously). Does he believe that they are *truly* out of shots? I would assume yes based on taking the risky line, that or just didn't think about it in general.
Downside 2) Jan really didn't want ladd to die. Ladd dying increases the odds of jan deviating from the plan. Further, if jan *lied* about jailing me (which he was genuinely considering doing, or so he tells me(i was also considering not sending him the card and just saying fuck it cause I didnt want the card-haver to die(which would have been rewarded cause *presumably* if someone else got a medic save they save jan there so lol) and we both *did* regret it come the night phase)

~~~

ANYWAY

with all of this in mind.

And the posts made by sunbae and dya.

What's the vibe?

[grr]

I think I came up with the maple killed arctic with pgo theory but don't believe it anymore

think that wisdom is a wolf for posting unrelated to their claim

tracked him

I know this is an insane use of a track but I thought it would be a good proxy if Maple was alive today. Am a JOAT, used a doc on Stett N1 and roleblock on Maple N2

so i assume you are just saying you are a wolf I assume?

[Maple]

fucking christ man

i don't even know

[grr]

so i assume you are just saying you are a wolf I assume?

@dyachei

[grr]

I mean sure

Vote: Maple

Vote: Dolby

lol

[grr]

oki bye

[Maple]

If you're a wolf, you're just using the publicly available claims and such to make a claim that is strictly speaking all correct.

But every action you took is ~reasonable.

Why track Jan over someone else?

[Dolby]

wrt to my d2 day play btw, I had a strong sense that Maple/Ladd/Wisdom was the wolf team. Arctic into PGO theory was an attempt to see if I could identify wolf TMI (I actually thought that benneh looked good off of interactions with regard to me on that ugh)

Tbh I think that Benneh just killed ladd regardless of Wisdom's alignment and it isn't an action that really indicates anything towards Wisdom tbh. Ladd has potenital to make himself a non elim today, but Wisdom didn't seem like they could

I think that Sunbae has been really towny off of day play today

[Dolby]

If you're a wolf, you're just using the publicly available claims and such to make a claim that is strictly speaking all correct.

But every action you took is ~reasonable.

Why track Jan over someone else?

Can't track the factional and began operating under the theory that wolves had an ENV. If wolves had an arsonist, I don't think I would have been able to identify them through last nights action tbh (especially since if they do have an arsonist they likely ignited stett n2)

[Maple]

Okay claims

I'm basically a JOAT who receives random NAs, turns into inventor

Ender is *something* (enhancer), doesn't know what they do and we don't have a full claim for it yet i guess

Jan was a JKer (RB+pro) **recieves a 1x vigi when inverted**

Dya is a 2x vigi, disrupted by night actions

Wisdom is 2x FF

Dolby is JOAT (medic/rb/track/?)

~~~

So the inverter. I think they have to claim. I have like 2 setup reads and I can't really out them until the inverter claims, just because ya know infosec or whatever.

am I missing anything?

[Dolby]

to be clear, I thought it was more valuable to establish if Jan had or had not been roleblocked then finding a random action. I've been dripping TMI that Jan had been roleblocked all of today. I also considered tracking Wisdom to see if they moved last night but I don't think they explicitly stated their n2 anymore
@grr you can't really see me/maple as teammed right?

[Visor]

Players Votes

Dolby 3 (Maple, EnderWiggin, grr)
Wisdom 2 (Dolby, insomnia)
Maple 2 (Wisdom, Gemma)
Theknightsofneeee 1 (dyachei)




beleive this is correct

[Maple]

vote: unvote

need to sort this out, we can't maj

[Sunbae]

What exactly is a pko or pgo or whatever ability was being floated? Is it an action?

[Dolby]

What exactly is a pko or pgo or whatever ability was being floated? Is it an action?

Maple has a one shot paranoid gun owner (which shoots everyone who visits her when activated). This was from when they gave themselves a card n1 before they were inverted

[Maple]

What exactly is a pko or pgo or whatever ability was being floated? Is it an action?

I have the 10 of swords. At night, I can activate it. I haven't given the specifics, but it gives me the ability to kill someone who visits me if I jump through a couple specific hoops. I haven't claimed what those hoops are yet so they cannot be played around.

[Sunbae]

Ok, my question is because Dolby has said he roleblocked manti on n2 but on day 3 made the argument that manti was the one that killed Arctic on that night and I am trying to see if this is an inconsistency or if thats fine

[Dolby]

Ok, my question is because Dolby has said he roleblocked manti on n2 but on day 3 made the argument that manti was the one that killed Arctic on that night and I am trying to see if this is an inconsistency or if thats fine

look

If I was a wolf and making a fake claim I would have claimed to block Wisdom because of that (heck, I even brought that theory and that it came from me on this page 2 minutes before making the claim)

Maple was my strong wolfread but wolves would have TMI that they straight up killed arctic. I was pushing that theory to see if there was any resistance to it that was not natural.

[Sunbae]

Gemma,

My concern with the idea that Benneh was just distancing with Wisdom is that Benneh was actively trying to kill Wisdom multiple times when it became viable in addition to defending himself from Wisdom once Wisdom started suspecting there and in addition to the way he was trying to make mechanical arguments on why Wisdom should die. It just did not seem partner-y in the slightest to me (and I feel like Dya also has come to this conclusion and they also have lots of Benneh experience).

I can maybe see Maple being a bus once the claim happened but he also actively tried to argue maple was wolf kp and should die over the likes of others which, i think we're all in agreement that maple IS a big wolf PR if wolf right? So idk, him trying to push maple over at points also doesn't seem right. As for pushing ladd over at the end I think thats easy: what wolf wouldnt want to kill ladd if they had the chance!

[Sunbae]

Ok so if I understand all of the claim situations:

On day 2 Maple said they have a self confirming role that will happen overnight. The thread, which had found Maple wolfy enough to force a claim, agrees to kill Rask over Maple in an effort to let Maple's claim self resolve.

Dolby, a JOAT, roleblocks Maple

On day 3, we open with 3 deaths. The argument provided is that Maple's PGO - an item that kills anyone who targets them last night - was activated and killed Arctic, who is likely villa even vig given the "death is KP" post Arctic made.

Dolby then puts forth the argument that Maple's PGO is what killed Arctic.

On day 3, the thread once against allows Maple to live because Jan can jailkeep, talk to maple, and then execute.

On night 3, Dolby tracks Jan to Dya.

On day 4, Manti claims that Jan jailkept Maple (a day action), received a protective card, and that card was used on Dya. Due to receiving a protective card, Jan allows Maple to live. Jan is killed in the night.





Here is my conclusion:

Having Dolby claim a track of Jan to Dya makes me believe Manti. Benneh's spew makes me want to villa read Manti.

What I do not believe is that Dolby as a villager can argue that Maple's PGO is an item that - in Dolby's own words - "Kills everyone who targets Maple in the night" and killed Arctic ON THE SAME NIGHT DOLBY VISITED MAPLE. And then use that argument as a means to push Maple. If Dolby believes this, Dolby would be dead because again, Dolby visited Maple that same night.

What I think instead is that Dolby is just a wolf roleblocker, blocked Maple to prevent the "self resolving" thing (which the specifics weren't known yet at that point), and then blocked Jan last night to prevent a Maple kill because keeping Maple alive to muddy the waters is pro-wolf on those two nights.

In addition to all of this, I have found my reads to be pointing to a Dolby wolf world as well as found interaction with Benneh to be partnery.

All things considered I will be Vote: Dolby and hope it is a hit

[Maple]

Dolby, did you at any point soft that you were going to be visiting me in the night?

[Dolby]

Dolby, did you at any point soft that you were going to be visiting me in the night?

don't think me or Cobalt softed at any point