Gemma's Favorite Music Mafia

[waza]

Vote:lissa

[Visor]

Vote:lissa

Why lissa

[waza]

Why lissa

idk lol

u/ladd were my designated tinfoils if taffy seemed town

u seemed towny enough last couple of pages and errrr im not worried about ladd cos i know people are just gonna hound his ass all game regardless of alignment

maple seems fine enough ig

ender is townreading me all game and i like it, doesnt neccessarily make him town though

so it really just boils down to if i think theres 2 wolves in that pool......and im like errrr maybe? but im not really convinced it has to be the case either, and plus i think most of those names should get got before me lmao, unless someone gets hell tunneled but thats on them not me if that happens

so yaaa this is a big lead up to a very disappointing finish where i just say im shrugging and trying to aim for the wolf i lose to now rather than later before its too late, not convinced it has to be lissa but im just testing the waters. mostly just boiled down to me looking back at eod votes, trying to think what wolves would be doing and what their wincons would be. lissas vote on rask seemed pretty random so yah i voted there and will see what happens or how i feel in the morning or after ive read the game some more

[waza]

idk lol

u/ladd were my designated tinfoils if taffy seemed town

u seemed towny enough last couple of pages and errrr im not worried about ladd cos i know people are just gonna hound his ass all game regardless of alignment

maple seems fine enough ig

ender is townreading me all game and i like it, doesnt neccessarily make him town though

so it really just boils down to if i think theres 2 wolves in that pool......and im like errrr maybe? but im not really convinced it has to be the case either, and plus i think most of those names should get got before me lmao, unless someone gets hell tunneled but thats on them not me if that happens

so yaaa this is a big lead up to a very disappointing finish where i just say im shrugging and trying to aim for the wolf i lose to now rather than later before its too late, not convinced it has to be lissa but im just testing the waters. mostly just boiled down to me looking back at eod votes, trying to think what wolves would be doing and what their wincons would be. lissas vote on rask seemed pretty random so yah i voted there and will see what happens or how i feel in the morning or after ive read the game some more

ig one of the things with ladd is that for me to believe hes a wolf i have to accept thats hes played against his own wincon during this game lmao

hes a smart gui, probs one of the smartest i met on fm so i somewhat expect him to be aware of how certain things would play out if hes a wolf

and if hes a wolf that means hes townsided unnecessarily to his own detriment at times (im going off vague memory so ill need to fact check)

like if ben is town which i think he is, then lads shielded me ben sunbae from getting heat when we were vulnerable. ok sure i somewhat forced him into townreading me so that doesnt count as much, and if ben is town hes the type of town that i imagine anyone with tmi would have a really hard time trying to justify a sr on

but with sunbae, there was a moment where sunbae was getting alota heat, and ladd spoke out against it and has been vocal against pushing the taffy wagon. the thing is though, if ladds a wolf hes well aware that hes on a timer, and that people have vocally expressed if taffy is town they'll push him. so its in ladds benefit to delay the taffy flip as long as he can,rrather then reinforce it. so for example when haru gets pushed, ladd is much better off just doing literally anything other than what he did lmao.

tbf one of the last times i tried to apply a wolf strategy read on someone it failed (twice) but i dont remember many other times its backfired. im not outright clearing ladd and will obv keep an open eye, its just i cant really figure out what his game plan would be as wolf, i can make a similar case for maple albeit i find it less convincing so i probs wont unless i feel stronger about it

[nebjiamn]

ig one of the things with ladd is that for me to believe hes a wolf i have to accept thats hes played against his own wincon during this game lmao

hes a smart gui, probs one of the smartest i met on fm so i somewhat expect him to be aware of how certain things would play out if hes a wolf

and if hes a wolf that means hes townsided unnecessarily to his own detriment at times (im going off vague memory so ill need to fact check)

like if ben is town which i think he is, then lads shielded me ben sunbae from getting heat when we were vulnerable. ok sure i somewhat forced him into townreading me so that doesnt count as much, and if ben is town hes the type of town that i imagine anyone with tmi would have a really hard time trying to justify a sr on

but with sunbae, there was a moment where sunbae was getting alota heat, and ladd spoke out against it and has been vocal against pushing the taffy wagon. the thing is though, if ladds a wolf hes well aware that hes on a timer, and that people have vocally expressed if taffy is town they'll push him. so its in ladds benefit to delay the taffy flip as long as he can,rrather then reinforce it. so for example when haru gets pushed, ladd is much better off just doing literally anything other than what he did lmao.

tbf one of the last times i tried to apply a wolf strategy read on someone it failed (twice) but i dont remember many other times its backfired. im not outright clearing ladd and will obv keep an open eye, its just i cant really figure out what his game plan would be as wolf, i can make a similar case for maple albeit i find it less convincing so i probs wont unless i feel stronger about it

waza, i thikn i'm starting to see a pattern with you and I think you value people calling townreads a way of townsiding. i won't say you value it too highly, its more just me realizing what you value

but IMHO, those kinds of takes are silly for a wolf because ladd has to have townreads on people?

lets go through who you mentioned:

1) he townread me. he gets 0 credit for this, he would even tell you, he has never pushed me incorrectly or failed to clear me correctly. i have fooled him a few times, but the only times he's ever really been sus of me were when I was wolfing. i legitimately entered this game knowing near 100% certainty ladd would townread me regardless of his own alignment. in fact, i know he knows this meta so well, I was actually pre-emptively wondering if this would be the game he cashes in on the meta to try to sus me a bit (if he's wolf) and that's the only reason i wouldnt say is was absolutely 100% certain instead of near 100%

also i was never vulnerable day 1 lol.

tl;dr ladd sorta has to TR me until the one day he cashes in on the meta and we'll have to see if i'm keen on that or not, i was never in danger, he shouldn't really get towncred for 'townsiding' by tring me

re: sunbae -- i think you have a valid point, sunbae def was vulnerable

re: you (waza) -- i don't really know how vulnerable you were? you had lots of defenders besides ladd, similar to the way i did. neither you or i was ever a serious wagon during the day.

if i add these 3 reads up i don't think he was 'townsiding to his own detriment' in the worlds he is a wolf? he was pushing taffy all game while this happened?

i just sorta disagree with your assessment that because ladd is on a 'timer' that he wouldn't then push for taffy to die because then it puts the spotlight on him. that is literally his MO quite often BECAUSE he's on a timer.

i don't really think you can say he's played against his wincon if he's wolf. i think killing taffy d1 and getting 2 PR claims out of day 1 would have been excellent for w!ladd but we got lucky a wolf died d1 instead.

i still feel like a lot of his reads were non-collaborative in ways that feel mor elike his wolf self than not. i'm not deadset on him being wolf--i do think if he's town he's played a pretty good game for identifying lots of towns correctly, but i don't think its absurd to have him in the middle of the POE given the current game state and where his wolf reads landed

[nebjiamn]

i wont lie i'm inclined to sheep my early inclination on maple + annika, especially as annika digs in deeper in the tunnel

"isn't playing +EV" isn't an inspiring towncase for someone who just came off 2(?) exhausting wolf rands and isn't being townie anyway

vote: maple

im curious to see how reads on ender/visor/ladd develop tho

[Visor]

Annika where you at

[waza]

waza, i thikn i'm starting to see a pattern with you and I think you value people calling townreads a way of townsiding. i won't say you value it too highly, its more just me realizing what you value

but IMHO, those kinds of takes are silly for a wolf because ladd has to have townreads on people?

lets go through who you mentioned:

1) he townread me. he gets 0 credit for this, he would even tell you, he has never pushed me incorrectly or failed to clear me correctly. i have fooled him a few times, but the only times he's ever really been sus of me were when I was wolfing. i legitimately entered this game knowing near 100% certainty ladd would townread me regardless of his own alignment. in fact, i know he knows this meta so well, I was actually pre-emptively wondering if this would be the game he cashes in on the meta to try to sus me a bit (if he's wolf) and that's the only reason i wouldnt say is was absolutely 100% certain instead of near 100%

also i was never vulnerable day 1 lol.

tl;dr ladd sorta has to TR me until the one day he cashes in on the meta and we'll have to see if i'm keen on that or not, i was never in danger, he shouldn't really get towncred for 'townsiding' by tring me

re: sunbae -- i think you have a valid point, sunbae def was vulnerable

re: you (waza) -- i don't really know how vulnerable you were? you had lots of defenders besides ladd, similar to the way i did. neither you or i was ever a serious wagon during the day.

if i add these 3 reads up i don't think he was 'townsiding to his own detriment' in the worlds he is a wolf? he was pushing taffy all game while this happened?

i just sorta disagree with your assessment that because ladd is on a 'timer' that he wouldn't then push for taffy to die because then it puts the spotlight on him. that is literally his MO quite often BECAUSE he's on a timer.

i don't really think you can say he's played against his wincon if he's wolf. i think killing taffy d1 and getting 2 PR claims out of day 1 would have been excellent for w!ladd but we got lucky a wolf died d1 instead.

i still feel like a lot of his reads were non-collaborative in ways that feel mor elike his wolf self than not. i'm not deadset on him being wolf--i do think if he's town he's played a pretty good game for identifying lots of towns correctly, but i don't think its absurd to have him in the middle of the POE given the current game state and where his wolf reads landed

yeah i get that, thats why in the fourth paragraph i said his trs on me and u are nai and he woulda done it regardless of alignment

it was mostly his sunbae tr, ladd tends to go for the path of least resistance as wolf and yeah he doesnt really townside because it doesnt really prolong his stay much. thinking back to a mash for example where he accidentally bussed and then got pushed d2 for being alive anyways, it sucks but yeah people are just gonna hound him if hes alive for too long, or not as correct as they want him to be etc. etc. so yeah i dont really see him stick himself out on a limb to defend villas that are poe'd when he can just let the push on sunbae happen. again i need to fact check if this played out how i remembered but yeah

its funny cos the first part of ur post reminded me of what i was speaking to about arctic here

I use what’s given to me lol

Funnily enough someone made this exact post you did not long ago except replace how people are reading me with meta instead, and then another game replace that but with w/w and pairing interactions. D1s are scarce for info so I work with what I got, most people didn’t post much so what I’m left to use is how people are handling me and vibe reads mixed with meta

The longer the game goes the more diverse my reads get usually

but yeah ben i can see why u think that lol, ig townreads matter to me in the specific context of ladd and this game but yeah lol this post was pretty useless all in all and i hope nobody read this hoping for some insight on someones alignment lol or mine for that matter. i forgot to reply to this earlier but it reminded me of arctics post lol so i went back to it

just so this isnt a completely useless post errr

vote:maple

havent read arctics walls ill read it when i come back, just voting maple cos i forgot about him and wouldnt mind some disscussion there again

[waza]

i suppose if im thinking about something i tend to hyperfocus on it or bring it up alot

idk lol i always wondered/was confused why people would try to find patterns in my solving but then the claimed pattern would be something different every time someone noticed a pattern lol. but its starting to make sense to me now i think