Classroom Application of EB (going live in a couple of months)

[mikil100]

If only the media saw this side of video games. This is amazing. Great. I hope it works out for you, sounds so promising.

[lenin96]

This a great idea, you might want to cover up the gaesaetae though.

[Antinous]

You might also want to censor the naked fanatics and other naked units.

[antisocialmunky]

Or have them sign wavers :-p

You could also tell them if you have some extra time you could do a multiplayer tournement at the end of it just for fun.

[Antinous]

You could try to do a multiplayer with some one online and have both of you role play in a historical battle like at Pydna and record the video, that way your students could study each sides strategy.

[||Lz3||]

I wish I was your student

[Teleklos Archelaou]

Good grief - of course I'll have the "modesty" patch enabled when I install it.

[Olaf The Great]

What school do you teach at and where is it?

[Teleklos Archelaou]

It's in the U.S., is a private college preparatory school, I'm happy to be there and it's happy to have me - that's about all I'll say.

[jabarto]

At first, I was wondering how your superiors would view video games in the classroom, but I think Kull has a point about this being good publicity. I can see this idea panning out very, very well, for all involved.

[Tiberius Claudius Marcellus]

As an aspiring teacher myself, I would find excellent value in the script commands. You can show your students how the societies changed through time by 'forcing' different eras/reforms through the command line. If done on the overhead projector you could quickly teach the entire class the differences in technologies, tactics, culture, politics, and migrations etc.

Good luck to you with this.

[HunGeneral]

I don't want to get off-topic but what does setting

"general" view

mean? I don't remember having heard of it before. Could someone please explain it?

[Maion Maroneios]

I don't want to get off-topic but what does setting mean? I don't remember having heard of it before. Could someone please explain it?

That's basically a setting that enables you to see battles through your general's viewpoint. Which basically means you are restricted to just seing what your general does, which in turn again (IMO) is quite dumb and not worth doing. Why?

1) You miss most of the action
2) You lose most of your men simply because they just sit and get slaughtered (while in reality you don't just sit when you're threatened)
3) Your men do not even respond to things like a possible outflanking maneuver (by the enemy) or oncoming charge, unless you see it coming
4) You basically have to remain stationary with your general somewhere behind where you can observe the battlefield and make sure you don't miss the most crucial things

But that's just me

Maion

[HunGeneral]

Thanks Maion for clearing me up

Can this be turned on and off during battles? - I can understand its useles but it sounds interresting to try when the enemy is far away or look that way while your troops are climbing the enemy walls. (where you have nothing better to do than watch)

By the way: In some of the screenshots in the competition I could see that the units had no factional banners (except those a banner-carrier had in hand) - how did they do that? Are thoose pictures edited or can this also be set? (sorry for such silly questions but I don't have much experience changing the setting - besides I found no such setting among he options...)

[I Am Herenow]

If I'm not mistaken, General Cam is "turned on" just by hitting Delete and following your General unit; hence, you can stop doing so whenever you wish.

Banners can be adjusted using the EB Configuration or EB Preferences shortcut IIRC.

[Rilder]

Whatever you do, don't talk to them like they don't know how to use a computer, every single teacher in my old school thought that everybody was a bunch of savages who didn't know what a computer was.

[Beefy187]

Our school had Simcity on the computers. I wish we had EB too..

Good luck!!

[Ludens]

If I'm not mistaken, General Cam is "turned on" just by hitting Delete and following your General unit; hence, you can stop doing so whenever you wish.

There is actually a setting in the options menu that sticks the camera close to the general. I tried to play with it, but it's very difficult. You have to position your general so that he has a good overview, or else you won't be able to control your flanks. You could off course turn over control of the army to the A.I., but because you cannot order the A.I. it will always mess up your battleplan, so I never do.

Edit: it's sounds like a very interesting idea, TA, although I am curious how much they will pick up. Let us know how it turns out. Sorry for spamming your topic.

[Digby Tatham Warter]

With the limited time you will have, will the lack of money in EB early on be a problem? partic as autoresolving battles will cause massive casualties.

At least your students can look at the possibility of sacking certain temples etc(which used to happen when some ruler was particulary hard up).

[Rilder]

There is actually a setting in the options menu that sticks the camera close to the general. I tried to play with it, but it's very difficult. You have to position your general so that he has a good overview, or else you won't be able to control your flanks. You could off course turn over control of the army to the A.I., but because you cannot order the A.I. it will always mess up your battleplan, so I never do.

I can't remember but doesn't giving AI control still allow you to give commands?

Still wouldn't use it but still.

[Cyclops]

I can't remember but doesn't giving AI control still allow you to give commands?

Still wouldn't use it but still.

Yep, its like telling your boys to flee, they break but can be "un-broken" again.

I play with general cam on these days for flavour. You really have to think about position and sometimes the general sits on a hilltop for the whole battle directing traffic and can't get into the flanking charges, which I find delicous. If I want to get my hands bloody I run the risk of losing control of the battle which is a sweet little choice to be faced with.

With my current Sweboz campaign (230 BC and I'm about to descend on Roman Mediolanum) my generals sit front and square on the battle line so I can usually see the whole shebang. It was different as Lussotannan, they're a bit softer targets.

I haven't put units out of LOS on AI control yet, maybe I'll give it a whirl tonight. "Dammit, I told you to hold the flank, not countercharge!"

[artaxerxes]

Am I the only one thinking EB could revolutionize history lessons? I mean, that EB could be one of the first steps in the direction of making simulators of historical events that allow students to see the world exactly as it was at the time of the events? I mean, like a flight simulator, just for history students (I really shouldn't be making that remark, as I know immensely little of flight simulators, so don't know what I'm talking about, but whatever)

[Tiberius Claudius Marcellus]

Am I the only one thinking EB could revolutionize history lessons? I mean, that EB could be one of the first steps in the direction of making simulators of historical events that allow students to see the world exactly as it was at the time of the events? I mean, like a flight simulator, just for history students (I really shouldn't be making that remark, as I know immensely little of flight simulators, so don't know what I'm talking about, but whatever)

I don't think you're the only one at all who thinks like this (see all the comments above!). Simulators like this are already used on TV shows on this history channel. I may be mistaken; but I believe Vanilla RTW was used extensively for Roman-era battles.

Using EB or EB-like programs is just as accurate as using a flight simulator because they both lack complete realism. While you may be able to maneuver a plane technically correctly, and the gravity/physics engine may be damn near perfect, you'll still never have that feeling in the pit of your stomach when your plane starts to stall or the nerves that would be frazzled in real life attempting to put down a 747 loaded with fuel and 300 human lives in a huge thunderstorm with an engine gone. The same thing goes for the human element in the battles of EB or planning campaigns / doing diplomacy etc.

[C.LVCIANVS]

... Hoping that won't be an escamotage for playing EB at work, TK.
" 'Morning classroom... Today's test: 1v1 tournament, max 50k, rules: no art, max 2 ele, max 6 cav, max 4 missile, max 4 ho arc. The winner will pass the exam, the losers... Will pass under my yoke!

I remember when I was in high school... I & II gymnasium at classic licaeum, and my history teacher asked ME, a 14 years old boy, which mark I preferred to give myself in her subject... She didn't know if what I wrote in homeworks or class test was right or wrong...Quite confusing for me...

Years later I've understood how works the italian school system, so I stopped wasting my time and looked for a job. The grim reality...

Now, my 13 years old brother, 1,50m tall, still watching cartoons on Disney Channel (sometimes "Cheetah girls" too ) treats his teacher ironically about political europe's geography... What's the capital city of Hungary?

[Antinous]

Sorry buddy can't help you there. Try google.

[A Very Super Market]

You could replace the losing music cue with lots of people screaming...

So how does the Italian school system work? Or do you just mean it sucks?

[Titus Marcellus Scato]

I really like the idea of running a 'Time Commanders' session in the classroom, with EB as the engine. Put a team of boys against a team of girls, and watch the girls win, because they will cooperate while the boys argue!

Shouldn't be the main focus of the project, but a fun couple of hours to show the problems faced by generals on the battlefield.

Concentrate on historical battles, not 'game-generated' ones from the campaign.

Playing a campaign for a short while may be OK - perhaps a good idea could be to play a campaign long enough to get your faction out of debt (using the factions that struggle financially at first.)

[Olaf Blackeyes]

I really like the idea of running a 'Time Commanders' session in the classroom, with EB as the engine. Put a team of boys against a team of girls, and watch the girls win, because they will cooperate while the boys argue!

I WANNA see the results of this.

[Antinous]

The boys will eventually start having their troops kill each other.... OMG it will be the amazon war women all over again!!!!

[mikil100]

I don't think you're the only one at all who thinks like this (see all the comments above!). Simulators like this are already used on TV shows on this history channel. I may be mistaken; but I believe Vanilla RTW was used extensively for Roman-era battles.

Using EB or EB-like programs is just as accurate as using a flight simulator because they both lack complete realism. While you may be able to maneuver a plane technically correctly, and the gravity/physics engine may be damn near perfect, you'll still never have that feeling in the pit of your stomach when your plane starts to stall or the nerves that would be frazzled in real life attempting to put down a 747 loaded with fuel and 300 human lives in a huge thunderstorm with an engine gone. The same thing goes for the human element in the battles of EB or planning campaigns / doing diplomacy etc.

Yeah, this history channel used RTW for simulating battles. I think it was modded, 'cause if I remember correctly the number of troops on the battlefield was amazingly large. I liked the show, but after re-watching it was more eye-candy than historical accuracy..

I think all TW games and their mods really put a arcade feel to ancient battles, definitely doesn't get the thought through that 5,000 men won't come back to their wives and children after a hard fought battle. EB is still by far the most immersive, though.