America - The Freest Country?

[Brenus]

“ask the average Frenchmen to point out a random European country he/she/french will have no idea”: Depends on the age of the “average” French. Old generations had to learn maps by heart (and named all the capital cities and rivers and main productions and …. of countries…)

“Met some francaises who didn't even know germans speak german, one was a doctor the other was an architect.”
I knew it. When I was kid we had compulsory language at school, and choice for the first language was English or German. I knew the level went down right after I left….

“I could give an example, of an Orgah who seems to think this, but I'm sure you already know who it is” I want names!!!!

[Meneldil]

Not sure you placed the brackets right. Educated americans usually think too highly of Europe for whatever reason no idea. Let's take France for example, ask the average Frenchmen to point out a random European country he/she/french will have no idea. Met some francaises who didn't even know germans speak german, one was a doctor the other was an architect.

I've hanged out with the worst kind of scums at times (in high school) and they all knew germans speak german
I know the average french undergrad is not really smart, but not knowing Germany? Either you met the dumbest french girls ever, or you're simply making it up. People still have to learn by earth the name of every european country and of its capital, as well as the major rivers and mountains if they want to get into a university (and the vast majority of people go to the university). Heck, there's a whole 2 months-long geography lesson about Germany, its culture and its economy in high school.

“I could give an example, of an Orgah who seems to think this, but I'm sure you already know who it is” I want names!!!!

I plead guilty. After having studied for more than 8 months in Canada, I think the Canadian education system would make the french one look marvellous. People in 4th or 5th year of Poli Sci, Geography or History would get beaten to pulp while trying to pass any kind of french first year exam. And I'm not even talking about the completely useless courses, such as 'Philosophy of Love', 'Celtic Culture', 'Feminist Marxism' and other assorted mumbo-jumbo.
Things might be different in the US though.

Quite obviously, I did my best to show all the crude Canadians and Americans I've met that I'm superior (and freer) on every level, and to act as the biggest arrogant *** ever.

Conclusion: Frenchmen visiting America are freer to act as than anyone else.

[Evil_Maniac From Mars]

I plead guilty. After having studied for more than 8 months in Canada, I think the Canadian education system would make the french one look marvellous. People in 4th or 5th year of Poli Sci, Geography or History would get beaten to pulp while trying to pass any kind of french first year exam.

The American university system is much better than the Canadian. You will never see a Canadian university ranked nearly as highly as Harvard or Yale, and for a good reason. On the other hand, Canadian pre-university education appears to be quite good compared to what I have heard about America's.

[Fragony]

@Menendil

Why would I make it up? And they were both pretty much there and I pretty much believe them, they didn't sound like the stupidest women in France.

edit: and I didn't say they never heard of Germany, I said they didn't know Germans speak German.

[Rhyfelwyr]

I think we are a bit harsh on Americans at times. Just some random stuff off the top of my head, but I remember there was a Guardian article recently that said 4/10 Brits don't believe in evolution. Also, I remember a video where a reporter was asking some questions to French people walking about the streets, and quite a few of them thought the sun revolved around the earth.

And don't even think about asking them to point out a country on a world map.

[Husar]

I believe you're right, actually, I know you're right (I have several members in my family that follow this exact line of thought). It's an elitist view, that Europeans, and their culture are far more enlightened than the otherwise brutish, and dim Americans.

I like to behave like this for fun. And if I told you every time it would not be as much fun anymore.
I think different countries in the western world are...different.
The USA (America is a really large continent with many countries for Europe's sake!) is behind in healthcare, Germany is behind in corporate identity, the UK is behind in destroying cameras, France is behind in language etc.
All countries have their ups and downs but are generally much better than North Korea.

Oh yeah, of course saying this makes me some rainbow-coulored liberal lalaleftie who is completely naive and doesn't see what kind of fascist regimes are enslaving him.

[Hax]

All countries have their ups and downs but are generally much better than North Korea.

Lies and slander, how dare you insult our great Leader Kim Il-Jung and his immortal father, Kim Il-Sung?! That will be prison for you!

Manse! Manse! Manse!*


*cry similar to the Japanse "banzai", meaning "ten thousand years".

[Jolt]

Not sure you placed the brackets right. Educated americans usually think too highly of Europe for whatever reason no idea. Let's take France for example, ask the average Frenchmen to point out a random European country he/she/french will have no idea. Met some francaises who didn't even know germans speak german, one was a doctor the other was an architect.

Well to be fair I heard a story of an Irish girl who couldn't point on the map where France was. x_x

[Beskar]

I remember watching a video where Americans pointed to Australia as being Iraq.

[Evil_Maniac From Mars]

I remember watching a video where Americans pointed to Australia as being Iraq.

You can find those, or similar, for almost every country. Remember also that they only show the stupidest people in the final video clips. Unfortunately, that can lead to misconceptions about some countries when people presume that the people in them are simply ignorant.

[Jolt]

You can find those, or similar, for almost every country. Remember also that they only show the stupidest people in the final video clips. Unfortunately, that can lead to misconceptions about some countries when people presume that the people in them are simply ignorant.

There's nobody stupid enough in other countries to say a triangle has 1 side. xD

[Louis VI the Fat]

There's nobody stupid enough in other countries to say a triangle has 1 side. xD

Not to mention, only Americans are so self-obsessed they can't see both sides of a triangle.


@Frags:
- I must insist on the use of the cédille in 'Françaises'.

- You are correct that the French share at least one peculiarity with the Americans. One that is to no small degree responsible for their mutual image abroad as 'arrogantly self-obsessed'. Namely, that both do not travel abroad much, and may hence be somewhat lacking in understanding and appreciating foreign cultures.

Seventy percent of Frenchmen did not travel to a foreing country last year. While this is not a shocking percentage for, and possibly to, Americans or Australians, it is in stark contrast to most other West European countries, especially North Europe.
The French go skiing in the French Alps. Sunbathing on the Southcoast. To visit a foreign and distant land, they go to Brittany. (Bretagne, the French region, not the Great Island) To see Germany, Strasbourg suffices.

The French holiday abroad no more than a Spaniard goes sunbathing in Greece. What for anyway? Some people are born lucky. Others have to get on a plane for it. A lifetime doesn't suffice to discover all the wonders of France, so why waste it on visiting foreign countries whose inhabitants work all year long just to be able to flee their countries and spend two weeks in France?

Birmingham, Ruhrgebiet, Rotterdam? What am I supposed to do there anyway?


- Did you ask the shockingly ignorant Françaises whether allemand was spoken in Allemagne? Or whether German was spoken in Germany?
I just don't see the first happening with a doctor and an architect. Possibly the latter.
Or maybe they were already at the stage were they answered 'no' to all your questions.

'Care for a drink?'
Non!
Will you please sleep with me?
Non!
Do you know that the Germans speak German?
Non!

[Fragony]

Birmingham, Ruhrgebiet, Rotterdam? What am I supposed to do there anyway?

In the case of Rotterdam I suggest marking targets and hope the Germans still have it in them. Instructions will follow.

[Husar]

@Frags:
- I must insist on the use of the cédille in 'Françaises'.

Trying to prove my point, aren't you?

[miotas]

I remember watching a video where Americans pointed to Australia as being Iraq.

It was the chaser boys https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DJ3RrqBqk14, and it wasn't iraq, but apparently iran, north korea and france are all on terra australis. Australia also has it's fair share of idiots https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FcBDBi5qzjc

[...]The French holiday abroad no more than a Spaniard goes sunbathing in Greece. What for anyway? Some people are born lucky. Others have to get on a plane for it. A lifetime doesn't suffice to discover all the wonders of France[...]

I admit to having similar thoughts regarding holidays and australia.

And on the whole freedom thing, I think it's very much a matter of personal interpretation, and australia fits my personal interpretation quite well. Since moving out of home I'm hard pressed thinking of more than 1 or 2 things that I've wanted to do and not been able to, and they have been related to financial, rather than legal, restrictions

[Brenus]

"I just don't see the first happening with a doctor" Doctor in what? Paraspychology?

Our friend was a little gullible, or he should choose better. Well. Depending of what he was seeking for, of course. I mean, a rewarding intellectual exchange of course...

[Furunculus]

Americans tend to conflate the terms anarchy and chaos. That too goes pretty far back in our "national myth" since we view the early Confederation days as having been too problematic.

Freedom in the USA is mostly freedom "from" as it was put ealier.

Our freedoms are mostly encoded as limitations ON government rather than specific assertions of rights. You aren't really granted the freedom TO do very much, so much as the government is prevented from infringing on your ability to do what you want.

Interestingly, the right TO keep and bear arms is a "to" statement.

this would appear to be a characteristic of common law countries, the principle being that you define the few things that cannot be done, rather than recognise and regulate the many that can.

Don't confuse freedom with independence either. A 17th century frenchman had less freedom but more independence than a 21st century London City financier.

It's a balancing act. A fun fact, the European country with most legislation text is actually Spain. It is also the european country where less legislation is enforced as a percentage of the total. As usual, quality and quantity do not go hand in hand.

I would have a lot more respect for a government which enforced a very small amount of legislation rigidly and without exception than Spain.

Personal freedoms-wise, well, we're getting less and less. In that sense Somalia probably is the freeest place on the planet.

agreed, and again this may be a symptom of a civil law system where an attempt to define all the freedom to's results in a flood of laws which are then treated with contempt by the subject populace.

[Beskar]

Seventy percent of Frenchmen did not travel to a foreing country last year. While this is not a shocking percentage for, and possibly to, Americans or Australians, it is in stark contrast to most other West European countries, especially North Europe.
The French go skiing in the French Alps. Sunbathing on the Southcoast. To visit a foreign and distant land, they go to Brittany. (Bretagne, the French region, not the Great Island) To see Germany, Strasbourg suffices.

On the otherhand, I love going to different countries, it is not al about sunbathing or ski-ing.

[Strike For The South]

Not to mention, only Americans are so self-obsessed they can't see both sides of a triangle.


@Frags:
- I must insist on the use of the cédille in 'Françaises'.

- You are correct that the French share at least one peculiarity with the Americans. One that is to no small degree responsible for their mutual image abroad as 'arrogantly self-obsessed'. Namely, that both do not travel abroad much, and may hence be somewhat lacking in understanding and appreciating foreign cultures.

Seventy percent of Frenchmen did not travel to a foreing country last year. While this is not a shocking percentage for, and possibly to, Americans or Australians, it is in stark contrast to most other West European countries, especially North Europe.
The French go skiing in the French Alps. Sunbathing on the Southcoast. To visit a foreign and distant land, they go to Brittany. (Bretagne, the French region, not the Great Island) To see Germany, Strasbourg suffices.

The French holiday abroad no more than a Spaniard goes sunbathing in Greece. What for anyway? Some people are born lucky. Others have to get on a plane for it. A lifetime doesn't suffice to discover all the wonders of France, so why waste it on visiting foreign countries whose inhabitants work all year long just to be able to flee their countries and spend two weeks in France?

Birmingham, Ruhrgebiet, Rotterdam? What am I supposed to do there anyway?


- Did you ask the shockingly ignorant Françaises whether allemand was spoken in Allemagne? Or whether German was spoken in Germany?
I just don't see the first happening with a doctor and an architect. Possibly the latter.
Or maybe they were already at the stage were they answered 'no' to all your questions.

'Care for a drink?'
Non!
Will you please sleep with me?
Non!
Do you know that the Germans speak German?
Non!

See this is how Americans feel. We have everything and we're much politer. The only thing Europe has on us is old stuff. You know who also has more old stuff then me? My Nana and as you can tell by the health care threads me and her are having a tiff.

[Husar]

We have everything and we're much politer.

You see, the problem with that is even if it's true, it might just mean you lie more often(which is pretty weird considering you're also more religious).

[Strike For The South]

You see, the problem with that is even if it's true, it might just mean you lie more often(which is pretty weird considering you're also more religious).

No, it just means we habor less hate then you. Evidence: Who started both WWs? Germany. Who ended both WWs? AMERICA.

Ironclad

[Gregoshi]

No, it just means we habor less hate then you. Evidence: Who started both WWs? Germany. Who ended both WWs? AMERICA.

Ironclad

INCOMING!!!!

[Evil_Maniac From Mars]

No, it just means we habor less hate then you. Evidence: Who started both WWs? Germany. Who ended both WWs? AMERICA.

Ironclad

I'll give you a three out of four, and a bonus for four out of five on the conclusion.

[HoreTore]

No, it just means we habor less hate then you. Evidence: Who started both WWs? Germany. Who ended both WWs? AMERICA.

Ironclad

Uhm.......

Back to school for you, SFTS

[Fragony]

The only thing Europe has on us is old stuff.

America isn't that old, America is owned by the Dutch, didn't you know? Kinda losing it to the Chinese but we can bankrupt you with the snap of a finger

[Jolt]

[Luso-Dutch colonial rivalry]The only thing the Dutch owned was Sri Lanka, Taiwan and Indonesia. >__>[/Luso-Dutch colonial rivalry]

The former-most was also owned by Portugal and Britain.

[miotas]

They could have had australia, but it wasn't good enough for them. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KpBY...ature=related# Unless that was all a charade...

[Brenus]

“No, it just means we habor less hate then you. Evidence: Who started both WWs? Germany. Who ended both WWs? AMERICA. “

This doesn’t speak well for your system of education.
Read: Sarajevo, Gavrilo Princip, about WW1.
About the end, well, read all the campaign, and where exactly and when, the US forces were engaged...

About WW2 the Germans did started it. But just for fun have a look of where the Red Army was in June 1944, and examine the D-Day in Normandy with the Russian massive offensive at the same period. You will find it interesting.

[HoreTore]

About WW2 the Germans did started it. But just for fun have a look of where the Red Army was in June 1944, and examine the D-Day in Normandy with the Russian massive offensive at the same period. You will find it interesting.

IMO, the spy who told Stalin that the Japanese was planning to attack the US instead of Siberia won us WW2...

[Strike For The South]

“No, it just means we habor less hate then you. Evidence: Who started both WWs? Germany. Who ended both WWs? AMERICA. “

This doesn’t speak well for your system of education.
Read: Sarajevo, Gavrilo Princip, about WW1.
About the end, well, read all the campaign, and where exactly and when, the US forces were engaged...

About WW2 the Germans did started it. But just for fun have a look of where the Red Army was in June 1944, and examine the D-Day in Normandy with the Russian massive offensive at the same period. You will find it interesting.

Princip? Sounds like a pansy Frenchman. Figures, they always need us to clean up there messes.

The 20th century was about two things. America defending the rest of the wrold from Germany and America defending the rest of the wrold from the USSR.

Boom.