A movie on Cúchulainn

[Genava]

Here:
http://breakthrufilms.co.uk/uk/films/hound/

The movie is in development, it will combine several methods of 3D modeling already used in 300 and in LotR. The actors will be real, only the universe will be virtual.

Productors: Tamsin Lyons & Hugh Welchman
Realisator: Paul Bolger
With the support of the Irish Council of the cinema (Bord Scannán na hÉireann).

Personally I am very skeptical, the summary shows a history reinterpreted and I think that will be very different from the myth. I hope that they will not use weapons of the Bronze Age or worse.

Two pictures:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

On facebook: http://www.facebook.com/album.php?ai...d=139511119775

[bobbin]

Is that Colin Farrell playing Cuchulainn? I bloody hope not! but i suppose at least his irish accent will finally fit in now (Alexander)

[oudysseos]

Look like a gratuitous piece of merde, alright, although, to be honest, none of these green-screen movies like 300 or Sky Captain were any good. It turns out that special effects aren't enough to make a good film.

There was a brilliant graphic novel done a couple of years ago, An Tain.


However, it's in Irish, which may limit its appeal somewhat.

[Genava]

Is that Colin Farrell playing Cuchulainn?

I don't know.

It turns out that special effects aren't enough to make a good film.

Yes, I agree. Beowulf for example was a really bad movie.

There was a brilliant graphic novel done a couple of years ago, An Tain.

Thanks Odysseos. Personally I know this comic, very different from the myth but interesting.
http://www.oghme.com/cuchulainn/post...=en&navlang=en

[Tux]

Yes, I agree. Beowulf for example was a really bad movie.

The animation of the actual movies(Beowulf & Grendel or Beowulf )?!

I found the animation and the last quite ok...

[ziegenpeter]

I don't know.
Thanks Odysseos. Personally I know this comic, very different from the myth but interesting.
http://www.oghme.com/cuchulainn/post...=en&navlang=en

Well you seem to be the expert of Celtic graphic novels ;)

So what's the difference between the myth and the comic?


Beowulf&Grendel was quite good - Leonidas as Beowulf ;) - the animated one was OK and the Christopher Lambert thing was utter püllschitt.

[oudysseos]

"The Myth" is not quite as monolithic as all that- there are a couple of different recensions of the Tain, and lots of little individual parts that are traditionally grouped with it. Kinsella's translation, although a true masterpiece, went a long way towards enshrining the notion that there is one and only one Tain, which is not quite the case.

Also, let's not forget that the Tain is not history, nor is it really the end result of a long oral tradition, so don't look it for accurate information about Late Iron Age Ireland. Barry Raftery is the man for that (Pagan Celtic Ireland).

Which is why, I suppose, people feel free to do their own versions of the Tain in film and comic. There's lots in Kinsella's version that wouldn't translate well to the screen- although, the version that Genava linked to looks like a truly epic piece of crap. It's a shame, as I think that there is a really good Cuchullain movie that could be made.

[Genava]

Well you seem to be the expert of Celtic graphic novels ;)

Yes I like the comics and the novels

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

The animated movie of Beowulf was bad for me. I don't like Angelina Jolie and the history was ridiculous.
The history of Beowulf&Grendel was better, the costumes too but why there was no action? They run everywhere for nothing in this film But I like this version.

[Tux]

The animated movie of Beowulf was bad for me. I don't like Angelina Jolie and the history was ridiculous.
The history of Beowulf&Grendel was better, the costumes too but why there was no action? They run everywhere for nothing in this film But I like this version.

Yeah, I agree there. But the first Beowulf movie with Christopher Lambert was really crap.

This one one doesn't show any potential either, but we'll see...

[oudysseos]

You know, I've always been struck by the possible connexions between Beowulf and King Arthur. Bee-Wolf = Bear, Artur/Arturos = Bear Man (in Brittonic), the action of the poem Beowulf is thought to take part in the 5th century (it was written much later, of course), as does the "original" action of the King Arthur legend. There are other connnexions between Scandinavian and English folk tales: the God Beow (another possible source for Beowulf's name) is linked to John Barleycorn. Another possibility is that Beowulf comes from Þórólfr,' Thor's Wolf'- and the 'th' part of Arthur has always been hard to explain in Latin or Brittonic. What if it's Art- Thor, 'Thors Bear', or something like that. We already have Cuchullain, 'The Hound of Colum', so why not the Bear of Thor? So what I'm suggesting is that the folk tales and legends of Britain's Bear have their origins in similar tales brought over by Saxons and their neighbours, and that the whole 'Romano-British General fighting off the Germanic invaders' thing is nonsense.

[Cyclops]

There was a nice looking but rather "interpretive" comic called Slaine with some fine work in it. he was some kind of Gesaetae with a big axe and a mean dwarf side-kick.

I have a very old and colourful 70's (?IIRC) book about Nuada and Balor etc. It was closer to the source material on the storyline than Slaine, and the visuals were striking, if a little florid.

So there are a few irish-flavoured graphic novels out there.

Is there a project for Tuatha de Danaan TW? The Balor unique unit could have the Bartix Megaklasmae ray.

[Genava]

I have a very old and colourful 70's (?IIRC) book about Nuada and Balor etc. It was closer to the source material on the storyline than Slaine, and the visuals were striking, if a little florid.

By Jim Fitzpatrick? I have two books of him.


Oghme comics made this version of Lugh and of Balor:
http://www.oghme.com/celticheroes/pu...tured-h_fr.jpg
http://www.oghme.com/celticheroes/pu...r_1024x768.jpg
It looks like the Japanese super-heroes XD

Lugh the Saiyan vs Balor!

[ziegenpeter]

the version that Genava linked to looks like a truly epic piece of crap. It's a shame, as I think that there is a really good Cuchullain movie that could be made.

What makes you say that? Did I miss anything? I only get the page with an eye (which could be an eye from one of those AVATAR guys...) and some sketchy synopsis. Not a lot to base a prediction in, he?

[geala]

Thank you for the info, Genava. Cuchulainn is one of my most favorite "heroes". It is very probable that the movie will be a desaster but I will buy it nevertheless on all accounts just because of the setting. Are there any informations on the release date? ( I mean the movie, not EB II...)

@ oudysseos: what makes "An Tain" so brilliant? The adaption of the story? The dialoges? Unfortunately I cannot read Irish. The costumes of the people shown at least are not what I imagine when I think of Cuchulainn and Co. or Irish warriors in general.

[oudysseos]

Hmmm. Hard to say. For us interested in our putative native tongue, an Irish language comic book is pretty cool. It's not really meant to be historically accurate, because the Tain does not take place in history. Also, I know some of the guys who produced it, so I'm not impartial.

[geala]

I understand your sympathy very well. It's a pity that I cannot read Irish or Gaelic myself.

It's just this, if I were able to make a movie or comic about a saga like that of Arthur, the Nibelungen, Beowulf or some from Island, I would use the chance to show some historical imprints. The Tain or other stories in which Cuchulainn appears might not be historical (at least I don't think the old warriors were f.e. able to chop off hills with their swords), but stem from a culture and point to a certain time (maybe disputed). Proper clothes, weapons and armor would be important for me. Some cloth is also described in the Tain itself (or my weak memory betrays me), as far as I remember more tunics and kilts and bare feet, not loincloths and boots.

BTW, how is Cuchulainn pronounced? I do it normally like Cou-chou-linn (like in "you", "check" and "Lindisfarne", Ku-tschu-lin in German), all syllables short and I accentuate the first syllable (although the accent on the second syllable would make a more impressive name in my ears). What is the correct method? How do you pronounce Tain Bo Cuailnge? Tan Bo Coulnay or Tun Bo Coulee or ...?

[bobbin]

BTW, how is Cuchulainn pronounced? I do it normally like Cou-chou-linn (like in "you", "check" and "Lindisfarne", Ku-tschu-lin in German), all syllables short and I accentuate the first syllable (although the accent on the second syllable would make a more impressive name in my ears).

More like "koo khullin" with the "kh" sounding like the "ch" in the scottish "loch" but starting with a almost silent "k" sound (infact you could get away with just saying "koo hullin"). "khullin" should be said quickly with the stress on the first syllable.

[athanaric]

More like "koo khullin" with the "kh" sounding like the "ch" in the scottish "loch" but starting with a almost silent "k" sound (infact you could get away with just saying "koo hullin"). "khullin" should be said quickly with the stress on the first syllable.

Like [ku 'xuli:n]?

[geala]

More like "koo khullin" with the "kh" sounding like the "ch" in the scottish "loch" but starting with a almost silent "k" sound (infact you could get away with just saying "koo hullin"). "khullin" should be said quickly with the stress on the first syllable.

Thanks. But I'm still a bit dazzled. Is "oo" differently spoken to "u"? Is it the English pronunciation what you mean? I don't think so, because "u" in English is mostly pronounced like the "a" in "are". Is "oo" more a long "o" or more like "ou" in "you" or "oo" in "cool" (which sounds like ou in you, both more or less a long "u" in German)? In German we pronounce the "u" like "ou" in "you" and the "ch" like in "loch", the "i" like an English "ee". So I would pronounce Cuchulainn now like Ku-(c)hu-linn (German pronunciation) or Cou-(c)hou-lin (English pronunciation).

It would be much more easy if the English speaking people would speak as they write.

[bobbin]

Like [ku 'xuli:n]?

Actually [ku:'ːxʊlɪnʲ] but i'm not very fluent in IPA and I think most people wouldn't be. The wikipedia page has a recording of the pronounciation if anyone wants to hear it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/C%C3%BA_Chulainn

Thanks. But I'm still a bit dazzled. Is "oo" differently spoken to "u"? Is it the English pronunciation what you mean? I don't think so, because "u" in English is mostly pronounced like the "a" in "are". Is "oo" more a long "o" or more like "ou" in "you" or "oo" in "cool" (which sounds like ou in you, both more or less a long "u" in German)? In German we pronounce the "u" like "ou" in "you" and the "ch" like in "loch", the "i" like an English "ee". So I would pronounce Cuchulainn now like Ku-(c)hu-linn (German pronunciation) or Cou-(c)hou-lin (English pronunciation).

It would be much more easy if the English speaking people would speak as they write.

Ah sorry yes it can be a bit confusing, the first "u" is long (as in the german "für") the second is short. I wrote it as "oo" to differentiate from the short "u" later. The "i" is also short like in the english "bin" or "sin".
Remember the name isn't from english hence the pronounciation is different.

[Ibrahim]

Actually [ku:'ːxʊlɪnʲ] but i'm not very fluent in IPA and I think most people wouldn't be. The wikipedia page has a recording of the pronounciation if anyone wants to hear it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/C%C3%BA_Chulainn


Ah sorry yes it can be a bit confusing, the first "u" is long (as in the german "für") the second is short. I wrote it as "oo" to differentiate from the short "u" later. The "i" is also short like in the english "bin" or "sin".
Remember the name isn't from english hence the pronounciation is different.

kʏ:'xylɪnʲ, based on your description. the umlaut u in german (or the goose's "oo" ) is represented roughly by IPA /y/, not /u/. and the IPA for the i in Sin (assuming RP or GA pronunciation), is a slightly different character-If I didn't know better, I'd have said it as roughly kʏ:kɜlɪən

[athanaric]

It's [kʏ:'ːxʊlɪnʲ], according to the sound sample on wikipedia. They are contradicting their own text...

the umlaut u in german (or the goose's "oo" ) is represented roughly by IPA /y/, not /u/.

Ahem. That would be the "goose" in RP, in very Received Pronunciation, that is.
In German, there are variations of the ü, mainly short [ʏ] and long [y]. Also, German vowels are not quite as nasal as English ones (which makes it easy to spot a German accent).

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Speaking of sounds, why did you guys have to invent the ain, ghain, and qaf sounds?
They are a royal PITA to learn.

[KARTLOS]

By Jim Fitzpatrick? I have two books of him.


Oghme comics made this version of Lugh and of Balor:
http://www.oghme.com/celticheroes/pu...tured-h_fr.jpg
http://www.oghme.com/celticheroes/pu...r_1024x768.jpg
It looks like the Japanese super-heroes XD

Lugh the Saiyan vs Balor!

i have these (the jim fitzpatrick books), got them when I was a child they are great!

[Ibrahim]

It's [kʏ:'ːxʊlɪnʲ], according to the sound sample on wikipedia. They are contradicting their own text...




Ahem. That would be the "goose" in RP, in very Received Pronunciation, that is.
In German, there are variations of the ü, mainly short [ʏ] and long [y]. Also, German vowels are not quite as nasal as English ones (which makes it easy to spot a German accent).

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Speaking of sounds, why did you guys have to invent the ain, ghain, and qaf sounds?
They are a royal PITA to learn.

I wasn't referring to RP with the goose part: in Ohio and Indiana, goose really is pronunced the same way the umlaut u is in german (specifically the long one). its part of the reason I can tell that fuer=/= fur in german (its almost as nasalised as in german). I speak english the same way my mom does, and she's from western Ohio, so it kinda goes from there...

actually, we have all the hard vowels german has (minus the short umlaut u): the long umlaut o is found in "stone", the short one in "toe", the long umlaut u is in "goose" and "moon", etc. what can I say, its great to learn english from there (minus the "warsh" and the "we was", both of which I don't do)

as to why we arabs invented those sounds: we didn't. they were already there in proto-semetic. we actually have fewer consonants in Arabic than Protosemetic. just be thankful classical arabic gim and dad are said differently today than the 7th century

*edit: added stuff.

[Cadwalader]

It's [kʏ:'ːxʊlɪnʲ]

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Speaking of sounds, why did you guys have to invent the ain, ghain, and qaf sounds?
They are a royal PITA to learn.

Sorry, but this coming from a Dane? Take a look at this Danish sentence:

Rakkeren vred Anders Grås hest om på ryggen og begyndte at åbne den.

Now written in IPA:

[ˈʁɑɡ̊ɐɐn ˈʋʁæð̪ˀ ɑnɐs ˈɡ̊ʁɔːˀs ˈhɛsd̥ ˈʌm pʰɔ ˈʁœɡ̊ŋ̩ ʌ b̥ˈɡ̊ønˀd̥ʌ ʌ ˈɔːb̥nə d̥n̩]

See what I mean?

[athanaric]

Sorry, but this coming from a Dane?

I'm German (sometimes I'd rather be Danish though). Kimbrolandam encompasses part of modern Germany...

Take a look at this Danish sentence: [...] See what I mean?

Nice I'll try to pronounce it...