Victoria 2 (and indeed Victoria if there's still anyone left playing it here)

[Furunculus]

it does look like they have improved things from the carious AAR reports that have come out.

[Alexander the Pretty Good]

That AAR you posted was a good read, Rurunculus. :D

[Furunculus]

indeed, took over an hour and i didn't move from my seat once.

[Meneldil]

it does look like they have improved things from the carious AAR reports that have come out.

Yeah, it does, except for that whole part about Prussia forming Germany after getting her butt kicked. That was kind of weird, but still not as "wtf-ish" as Italy declaring war on Germany in 1937 or some similarly ridiculous HoI3 event.

[frogbeastegg]

I plan to wait a minimum of 2 weeks after release and see how people feel about the game. The AARs for CK and EUIII looked good too; I brought both at release and found major problems with both. I'm also aware of the problems the other games had at release.

I am lightly optimistic though. Paradox have admitted multiple times that HOI3's release state was a mistake which could not be allowed to happen again. I'd say that they are very aware that another buggy and/or feature-poor release will do them a lot of harm.

Disappointed about the lack of a printed manual in the retail boxed version though. It's a cheapskate move and I notice the game doesn't cost any less because of it.

[Martok]

Looks like there will be a demo coming out tomorrow. You're restricted to playing the USA, and it lasts for 15 years. No MP or save/load, but it will include the tutorial.



Not sure how I feel about this one. I know the original Vicky received a lot of praise, but I know it's also been -- criticized? observed to be? -- complex to the point of being intimidating for some players. As someone who's still learning the ropes of (and occasionally overwhelmed by) EU3 -- a game which, by almost all accounts, is far more user-friendly than most previous PI titles -- I admit to feeling less than totally optimistic about my ability to get a handle on an even more....involved game.

On the other hand, it's a fascinating time in history, especially as it explores various social, cultural, & economic ideas that hadn't received much attention til then. And supposedly the sequel will make things more accessible this time around, so I can perhaps hope I may have a(n at least somewhat-realistic) chance of being able to grasp it.


I suppose I'll just have to try out the demo and see what it's like. (I wish a country other than the U.S. was playable, though....)

[Monk]

Looks like there will be a demo coming out tomorrow. You're restricted to playing the USA, and it lasts for 15 years. No MP or save/load, but it will include the tutorial.



Not sure how I feel about this one. I know the original Vicky received a lot of praise, but I know it's also been -- criticized? observed to be? -- complex to the point of being intimidating for some players. As someone who's still learning the ropes of (and occasionally overwhelmed by) EU3 -- a game which, by almost all accounts, is far more user-friendly than most previous PI titles -- I admit to feeling less than totally optimistic about my ability to get a handle on an even more....involved game.

On the other hand, it's a fascinating time in history, especially as it explores various social, cultural, & economic ideas that hadn't received much attention til then. And supposedly the sequel will make things more accessible this time around, so I can perhaps hope I may have a(n at least somewhat-realistic) chance of being able to grasp it.


I suppose I'll just have to try out the demo and see what it's like. (I wish a country other than the U.S. was playable, though....)

Victoria is about three times as complex as EUIII is and four times as unforgiving. Where as in EUIII, if you make a mistake and lose a war you can probably make a turn around (due not only to how long the game is but the simplified economical system), in Vicky if you lose a war you could very well wreck your economy for the entire game, sending you into a spiral that you can't get out of in time to do much else on the political stage. If at all possible I suggest studying the manual like a holy text and... what's that?

Disappointed about the lack of a printed manual in the retail boxed version though. It's a cheapskate move and I notice the game doesn't cost any less because of it.

Oh

I'd suggest giving the demo a go, but saying it's "complex" doesn't cover the half of it.

[Marshal Murat]

I got Vicky as part of a "Paradox Package". I only really played Vicky and HoI. Vicky was tough just because of the number of factors that one had to juggle, but from the looks of it (i.e. AAR) the system has been eased to allow a more streamlined game. I had planned on buying it some time, but after reading the AAR, I'm definitely looking forward to it (where did my day go? Oh, that's right, invading Mexico...)

[seireikhaan]

Original Vicky is an excellent game. Very rewarding once you've gotten your head wrapped around it. A better, more polished, more fun game than EU III. I'm going to wait and see on this, though. I am concerned that they're keeping with this more open-ended, less linear game structure from EU III/HoI III. Vicky is very structured, and benefits greatly from it. If it loses the structure, I have doubts that the sequel will be worthy of the name.

[Jolt]

On the other hand, it's a fascinating time in history, especially as it explores various social, cultural, & economic ideas that hadn't received much attention til then. And supposedly the sequel will make things more accessible this time around, so I can perhaps hope I may have a(n at least somewhat-realistic) chance of being able to grasp it.


I suppose I'll just have to try out the demo and see what it's like. (I wish a country other than the U.S. was playable, though....)

Believe me, nothing I've done in EU3, no matter how big the empire has made me feel as much pleasure to watch as this:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

or especially this:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Building an economy and industry and army and navy into the greatest power in the world, then seeing how your country's POPs behave is is extremely fun.

To give you an example, in my Austrian game, since 1900's has hit, Fascist parties have appeared, and as it happens, wierdly enough (As Fascist parties usually come to power in frustrated countries who have core territories owned by other powers), my POPs steadily gave the Fascist party their support, and the party DNSAP (Austrian Nazi Party) had a course pretty much like the Nazi party. In the first elections it participated, it got like 5% of the votes, making it a minor party (The two major parties were, the Socialists - who won the elections - and the Conservatives), then in the second election they bumped the Conservatives off the second placed party, becoming a major party (The two most voted parties gain the "Major Party" Attribute, which gives the party extra votes in the next elections) with like 19% of the votes. In the third election, that year there was a Socialist split between the Old Socialists, which had won the previous elections and whose economical policy was "State Capitalism" and the New Socialists whose economical policy was "Interventionism". As it happens, the left-wing voters fractionned off, splitting their votes between both Socialist parties (Like 13-14% for each, with a slight advantage for the New Socialists), while the DNSAP had like 23% of the voting intentions. But in a Constitutional Monarchy, I am allowed to Ban Parties during election campaigns (Which last 9 months in the game), and since a Fascist party coming to power would trigger a regime change from a Constitutional Monarchy into a Presidential Dictatorship, RPing the Austro-Hungarian Kaiser, I banned the DNSAP a few weeks before the election actually took place. As a result, the New Socialists won the elections and the Old Socialists disbanded. It was pretty awesome.

[al Roumi]

On the strength of your recommendations and the excellent AAR, I am going to try the demo. If it's all good (and not tooth pullingly buggy), I might buy the game soonish. I guess it depends on whether I want to have a social life. Otherwise, this looks like a game after my heart.

EU3 is good fun (despite its idiosyncrasies) but the sight of those pop screens from from Vicky2 makes EU3's slider based control of most things in "domestic" policy look crudely infantile. I will probably regret this frequently over the next month but: bring on the detail!

[Alexander the Pretty Good]

Download commenced, 30 minutes to go!