View Full Version : Kung Fu Mafia [Concluded]
Crazed Rabbit
05-19-2007, 17:55
For some reason something tells me that Crazed Rabbit may have been innocent - sorry. I will respect your original influencing post and vote against Ichigo next round.
I will reveal my role after this round if everybody starts a bandwagon against me.
How about you respect my new wishes and vote to lynch yourself, mafia scum?
Heck, even if you believed my analysis Ichigo wouldn't be the one to go after.
Oh, and it seems you've already made up a role in case your mafia scuminess is found out. Big whoop.
I regret that final vote - I now beleive that he is for the town. Siguard could also be a target too - he placed the frame on him.
How convenient. Sadly, your sins will only be cleansed by the pure ocean water drowning you.
Who should we have lynced then CR?
Kindly be refered to my sig.
Crazed Rabbit
Omanes Alexandrapolites
05-19-2007, 20:39
Yeah well, I have a dislike to Ichigo's distracting posting style, possibly concealing himself.
I am, not mafia, you should have my trust on that. Crazed Rabbit you got mail!
Yeah well, I have a dislike to Ichigo's distracting posting style, possibly concealing himself.
I am, not mafia, you should have my trust on that. Crazed Rabbit you got mail!
:wall: :wall: :wall: :wall: :wall: :wall: :wall: :wall: :wall: :wall: :wall: :wall:
Omanes, you put the final vote on someone and then you want to follow their ideas?
Say goodbye to your future night kills, because I am going to challenge you every day from now until your death.
Crazed Rabbit
05-19-2007, 22:23
Yeah well, I have a dislike to Ichigo's distracting posting style, possibly concealing himself.
I am, not mafia, you should have my trust on that. Crazed Rabbit you got mail!
Sorry, the dead can't receive PMs or the like regarding the game. That means I cannot in good faith take into account anything you said in your PM.
I stand by my demand to have you lynched.
Can you hear the crashing of the water upon the rocks? It is the ocean calling for you.
CR
What if Omanes survive throughout the game? Wouldn't you be pissed, CR? ~;p
pevergreen
05-20-2007, 00:46
Hm....There's something wrong with my fight scene. The fact that he has the style advantage would be it.
Should i ask it in PM or in thread Sasaki?
Mantis>Dragon>Crane isn't it?
Dragon (Mui) style beats White Crane (Fujian) style
If you didn't explicitly state a style you used your default.
What's strange is CR's second name: Zhi.
Everyone else lynched or killed had a second name of Mui, Fujian or Shui, presumably based on their starting style. Is CR somehow different from the rest of us?
:wall:
You're right.
He must be special - either pro or anti town...
Crazed Rabbit
05-20-2007, 02:02
Gee, regretting leading a bandwagon against me? :furious3:
Being dead, I can't tell you what was in my PM from Sasaki.
I can only urge you to lynch Omanes.
CR
EDIT: I swear I am pro-town, just FYI.
If you were pro-town, the chances that you didn't PM another pro-town person about your identity/role during the game are miniscule.
Get them to vouch for you.
Oh, and I don't see any obvious clues here (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zhi) - does anyone else?
Hm, only thing that makes sense is that he beats all other styles.
That, or LOSES against all other styles :beam:
I think he was some type of detective.
seireikhaan
05-20-2007, 04:49
So....Warluster still wasn't wog'd. Now why would that be? WH and CA were, why not him? FoS: Warluster. What is he still doing in this game? A lot of you guys said to wait till next day to vote him. Well, next day's coming round the corner...
Also, does anyone want me to continue analysing writeups? If I'm gonna keep doing this, I'd feel a little better to have some protection.
Omanes Alexandrapolites
05-20-2007, 07:52
I think he was some type of detective.Quite - I'm the shop watcher - I monitor the shop for half of the night - it enables me to see what people are buying and can, with a little bit, or in my case quite alot, of thinking, enable me to work out who is mafia. Immobilizing me won't help any towniee at all, mostly because I can't kill and can't buy anything - I'm too disciplined to be allowed to own items - it's against my religion.
Anybody who wants to immobilize me now, really should consider which side they are on and what they are trying to do. If they are trying to end the kills, ending me will conclude in no success.
Quite - I'm the shop watcher - I monitor the shop for half of the night - it enables me to see what people are buying and can, with a little bit, or in my case quite alot, of thinking, enable me to work out who is mafia. Immobilizing me won't help any towniee at all, mostly because I can't kill and can't buy anything - I'm too disciplined to be allowed to own items - it's against my religion.
Anybody who wants to immobilize me now, really should consider which side they are on and what they are trying to do. If they are trying to end the kills, ending me will conclude in no success.
Wait I was talking about CR. So you knew he was a shop watcher? or what? I don't quite understand this.
Omanes Alexandrapolites
05-20-2007, 09:49
Wait I was talking about CR. So you knew he was a shop watcher? or what? I don't quite understand this.I'm the shop watcher.
It looks as if I've got you to do what I wanted you to do, I won't vote you next round.
Convenient that he can't counter claim, isn't it?
Someone who's brought something from the shop in private PM omanes asking what it is, and post up if he's right or not
Omanes Alexandrapolites
05-20-2007, 09:53
sapi, you know, almost totally, that I'm certainly not mafia. I was protecting Pannonion one night, with you, and the kills were exactly the same as always.
There's two kills per night, and three mafia.
That proves nothing, unfortunately.
If you're innocent, you won't object to the testing of your role.
Omanes Alexandrapolites
05-20-2007, 10:27
May I ask how you plan to do this testing of my role? I would be more than happy to agree, but I see no way of this being possible - I only watch the shop for half the night - the other half I'm sleeping.
Anyhow sapi, I managed to find out what you bought all the way back on Night II. You purchased a Small Vial which, supposedly, contains antidote although it could also contain weak or strong poisons.
Omanes, I, for one, don't believe you. This seems disturbingly reminiscent of that time Sasaki The Wolf got hold of Gertgregoor's trust and used his role to exclude him. I think you're either a mafioso desperately trying to save yourself or a mafioso with the help of the real shopwatcher trying to save yourself.
An innocent person does not lynch someone and then want to follow their ideas, after no additional evidence has been brought to the table. Ever.
FOS: OMANES
I think his idea is that someone buys something from the shop and you identify it.
Omanes Alexandrapolites
05-20-2007, 10:34
I think his idea is that someone buys something from the shop and you identify it.I get information on the packages that individuals come out with in terms of size - I can never find out who buys what:
A small vial could be either an Antidote, Weak Poison, or a Deadly Poison.
A small package could contain either some Mystic Herbs, a Prayer Book, a Blow Gun or a Slingshot.
A large package could contain either an Armoured Vest or a Crossbow.
This can help in the working out of who is the mafia, yet I've, sadly, not managed to do any pin-pointing yet. Lynching me will get you guys nowhere, as I have said. It will just make life easy for the mafia by both allowing them to get into the shop without me seeing them and by reducing the number of real monks.
Anyhow, Orb, you seem very eager to pick up on this without showing any signs of doubt. Why might this be - if you look closely there is little or not conclusive evidence other than a simple change of opinion.
Warluster
05-20-2007, 10:35
Why is everyone hellbent on lynching omanes.
And don't jump on me because I sound like I am defending Omanes, I am not, but why are you going for one person. COuld someone give me a overview on reasons you think he's the mafia?
First he followed CR's 'list of suspects'. Then, as soon as he could finish off CR, not Ichigo, his initial target, he changed his vote to kill CR with no real reason given. A couple of posts later, with nothing else of note having been said, he then decided that CR was clearly innocent after his death (and before the kill revealed his odd name), actually, and that we should start lynching the people he listed again.
And where have you been all game?
Warluster
05-20-2007, 10:44
Hm, so he knocked off CR, but then said was innocent. Okay, thats suspcious!
Why is everyone hellbent on lynching omanes.
And don't jump on me because I sound like I am defending Omanes, I am not, but why are you going for one person. COuld someone give me a overview on reasons you think he's the mafia?
I won't diginify that with an answer. It would be different if you would have been posting this whole time, but you haven't I think you should be the next to be lynched. If someone can prove Omanes is telling the truth then I'll forgive his prior actions.
I don't think anyone can 'prove' he's telling the truth. I'm fearing a CDTC type coverup, as Moros/gert gave Sasaki his role PM and information to save Sasaki's neck in that game. I believe that Omanes freakish lynch and then repentance are so untownyish that he cannot possibly be innocent.
Omanes Alexandrapolites
05-20-2007, 10:54
I can prove it myself - look here (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?p=1531739#post1531739). When I refer to "my informant" I refer to myself - it was a tactic which I used to conceal myself from the mafia.
sapi then confessed to this remark - look here (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?p=1531846#post1531846).
Does this confirm my innocence to you guys?
No, it doesn't, as that is public knowledge.
Someone who brought something from the shop needs to PM omanes detailing the night and asking what they brought.
If he gets it right, we believe him. If he gets it wrong, we lynch him.
I can prove it myself - look here (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?p=1531739#post1531739). When I refer to "my informant" I refer to myself - it was a tactic which I used to conceal myself from the mafia.
sapi then confessed to this remark - look here (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?p=1531846#post1531846).
Does this confirm my innocence to you guys?
Do you really think the mafia won't notice that? Also, what if it was an informant, who is now dead, and so can't contradict you?
I drew a parallel to the case in CDTC when a guilty Sasaki was defended and covered for by an innocent detective.
Solid proof is not entirely possible unless we have multiple people buying and even then you could simply have an informant who trusts you, rather than actually being the shopwatcher. yourself.
Omanes Alexandrapolites
05-20-2007, 11:44
If he gets it right, we believe him. If he gets it wrong, we lynch him.I watch the shop for only half the night - I don't observe it all the time, so I don't know about all visitors throughout the night.
BTW, pevergreen, you didn't visit the shop in my observence time - that night I only saw sapi. He's also the only person who I've seen so far. On Night III I was busy protecting Pannonion so that night I didn't see anybody as I was engaged. Night IV - this night, if I'm correct, I'm still waiting for my PM.
I don't trust Orb, he has just jumped in, asking no questions, and has simply gone along with what you guys have said. Focus on him and you may have an intruder by the hair. Another point in this regard - ByzantineKnight - his starting attitude as we have seen, was dodgy and quite dangerous. Now he's just vanished, why?
Just jumped in asking no questions? You protected someone on one night. That would not make you innocent, nor is there be any guarantee that you actually did so, rather than just saying you had. Yes I have gone along with what others have said, because what others have said is almost definitely, in my mind, correct.
I simply don't believe you're innocent, because of your entirely suspect voting. An innocent does not just lynch someone (changing their vote just as soon as they have the opportunity to finish someone) then change his mind about their guilt before any extra evidence is added. My other suspect is warluster, for being alive with less posts than others who were Wogged.
So now you're saying you're the shopwatcher, but you don't know every visitor? This sounds like a 'I don't have a role, so I'll pretend that it only has a 50% chance of success, so I can pretend not to have seen someone if it's tested.' See Sigurd's fake reveal in Sasaki's first multi-role mafia. Saying that success is uncertain is a very simple, albeit usually effective bluff.
Omanes Alexandrapolites
05-20-2007, 12:00
It is correct that I only have 50% chance of spotting somebody - as does Pannonion monitoring his area - I think he can confirm that if his role is a clone of mine in only one area - the region his watches.
I may be stupid, but I'm not that stupid. I would never false claimed a role and never have done yet in any mafia game. Check my claim in the Midgard Saga (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?p=1426228#post1426228) and then the final write up (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?p=1438619#post1438619) for more details on that. I know this won't convince you, but it's always worth a try.
BTW, Orb, sapi was there, sapi helped me protect, sapi can confirm that if he wants to. greaterkhan can do the same too if he wishes. I'm also now completely convinced that you are mafia. Any non-imposter monk would be convinced by that evidence, yet you carry on against me, you keep on trying to point suspicion at me. People, look at Orb, it's clear, at least to me, that he's no friend of the temple.
I can confirm that you were part of a protection group; I cannot confirm whether you are innocent or not, as a mafia would simply join in in name and go off and target someone else.
BTW, Orb, sapi was there, sapi helped me protect, sapi can confirm that if he wants to. greaterkhan can do the same too if he wishes.
If one of you does not send your pm, or sends with incorrect names, there will be no protection. You will not be informed if there is no protection.
So they A) Can't confirm you and B) if there were at the time more than two mafia, as pannonian has claimed, you aren't proved innocent anyway.
I may be stupid, but I'm not that stupid. I would never false claimed a role and never have done yet in any mafia game. Check my claim in the Midgard Saga and then the final write up for more details on that. I know this won't convince you, but it's always worth a try.
Have you ever been Mafia before? Sigurd never claimed a false role until he was mafia at risk of being strung up. His false claim with its '50% chance' led to him being victorious, and the town losing. Claiming a true role once does not make you innocent for all future games.
Oh, and you have never even tried to explain your change in guilt allocation (Ichigo-CR-Ichigo again) and change of vote for the sake of expedience (Ichigo not certain to die, so you take out CR). These are the main charges standing against you. Why haven't you even bothered to rebutt them? and just claimed a fake-looking role to 'prove' you innocence.
Oh, and I poke holes in your claims and provide good parallels, so
Any non-imposter monk would be convinced by that evidence, yet you carry on against me, you keep on trying to point suspicion at me. People, look at Orb, it's clear, at least to me, that he's no friend of the temple.
because I clearly don't agree with you, for stated reasons, which you do not even bother to reply to (generally you just post more information), I must obviously be guilty. MAFIA TACTIC on your part.
I require three things to convince me you're innocent:
1. Pannonian to confirm that a 50% chance is how his role could function. So far, only Seamus has (to my knowledge, I missed out a couple of games, though) used a specific chance for any role's function.
2. At least one new accurate statement about what someone bought.
3. You to provide a damn good reason for your change of mind after the CR lynching. You have provided no real reason for finishing him, or for then believing him again.
As much as I hate to agree with Orb, who I don't trust, :yes:
Don't worry, Sapi, I don't trust me either and I have to agree with myself all the time :)
Omanes Alexandrapolites
05-20-2007, 12:58
Have you ever been Mafia before?Never have I played the role of a member of the mafia scum! If I was to be a mafioso though, I would probably be hiding in the shadows, lurking and just posting every now and then, trying to avoid being noticed. I'm most certainly not acting like that in this game.
I'm still not convinced of your innocence Orb. If I have my way, you'll be throw of a cliff tomorrow into the rocky and fierce sea below, yet I'm more likely to suffer this fate than you are the way you are playing this. Wait until tomorrow, and I will post up who bought what size package the half of the night I was shop watching - the PM often comes late though. If they can confirm that, then you have no choice but to trust me to a certain extent.
So you've never been mafia before? So what's the relevance of your comment about never having forged a role? Usually only the mafia forge roles (CDTC being an exception, due to the sheer complexity of it). You have been relatively out of the way, done very few notably conspicuous things, and made one completely illogical (for a townie) manoeuvre. As soon as people picked up on that and called you into question, you claimed a role. As soon as I pressed you on that and sapi asked for you to be tested, you gave a '50% chance', used in no previous mafia game except CDTC (to my knowledge), as an excuse not to get everyone's details. One of your mafia buddies buys an item, you confirm his item. He says 'wow, it's a miracle, he must be the shopwatcher'. You don't claim to have seen anyone else because of the 50% chance.
And you still can't/won't answer about your odd voting?
We (the town, not including Omanes Alexandrapolites the Mafioso) don't feel the need to spare you for a round and lynch an innocent when you act in a manner which is clearly guilty, and give the mafia another 1/2 kills.
Omanes Alexandrapolites
05-20-2007, 13:48
sapi, has no affilations with me other than through the protection of Pannonion. He is most certainly not my "mafia buddy" and that previous post was not a distraction plot. If you look through the posts you will find that I have voted for sapi multiple times and right now he seems to be on your side to a certain extent. Since when did the mafia work like that - they always work with some form of coordination, even if often it is hidden?
My odd voting was due to something that Pannonion, who I am loyal too, as is sapi, said here (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?p=1546398#post1546398). The list was made by Crazed Rabbit so I withdrew my vote and followed Pannonion's advice - killing CR. After that I decided to read through the thread and, oddly I could find nothing large suggesting that CR was mafia - there was much more there to suggest he was town. Henceforth I apologised for my vote and continued with CR's list.
I don't claim that sapi was. I suggest that the real shopwatcher made the enormous mistake of trusting you, telling you about Sapi so you could relay it to the town and getting murdered by you subsequently. I'm guessing he's now dead, so you're claiming his role. I'm claiming that that's probably what you'll do next round.
So you went in blindly on Pannonian's advice, stated no reason, put the final vote on and then looked for evidence?
Smells of expedient Mafioso bandwagon-joining to me.
I don't believe you yet.
Omanes Alexandrapolites
05-20-2007, 19:07
I now sincerely regret calling myself an informant to fool the evil mafia consisting of Orb (most definitely) and (possibly) sapi. I should have known that the mafiosos would use it against me - possibly the most innocent fellow of this temple - in the future.
The real shop-watcher is not dead - he's here posting right at you and you know it you stinking mafioso. The more you post, the more I suspect you for the evil deeds occurring in this temple. I know I wont die in this, Orb knows he can get an very easy lynch on me so he won't bother trying to assassinate me and my threat to his mafia supremacy.
BTW, no personal offence is intended, I just think your definitely scummy and the unsuspecting town needs to know about it. Oh yes, why do you think the shop-watcher, a delicate, precise and sensitive role, would trust me automatically right at the start of the game? Also, what makes you think that the shop-watcher is dead. I suggest that as many guys as possible go shopping tonight so, hopefully, I will spot you, and be able to prove my innocence, and, with any look, Orb's guilt.
TevashSzat
05-20-2007, 19:37
Omanes, don't even try to make Orb look guilty. Don't know if he is innocent himself but he is alot more than you are. We don't care what role you have, but just killing CR when Sasaki clearly stated that it was 4 to lynch
'I now sincerely regret calling myself an informant to fool the evil mafia consisting of Orb (most definitely) and (possibly) sapi. I should have known that the mafiosos would use it against me - possibly the most innocent fellow of this temple - in the future.'
I'm not using the fact that you claimed to have an informant against you. I'm using the fact that you are doing things indicative of your guilt against you.
Guilty points:
Original action: voted for Ichigo, promoted CR's list. When CR was on his last vote to lynch (highlighted by Sigurd using red letters next to the tally, so a mistake can't really be claimed), he immediately switched vote and killed him.
Then he went back to promoting CR's list and accusing Ichigo.
At the time he gave no reason. Then, when I pressed him about it, he *still* delayed in answering me, presumably to find an excuse. His explanation was along the lines of: 'Pannonian made a post accusing CR. But I went over the thread later and decided he was innocent.'
An innocent doesn't lynch someone before going over the thread and then say that the lynchee was innocent, hoping to get people blaming another hot lynch candidate. Nor does he go over the thread after he's just lynched someone. Every single one of your actions screams 'lynch me please, I'm mafia'.
An innocent goes over the thread, makes a judgement and then casts the vote.
His shopwatcher reveal:
1. As soon as he is considered to be possibly guilty, he threatens to reveal if people start a bandwagon O_o but does not actually reveal. Presumably he's busy fabricating a role, because he does not actually have one to hand, and going over whatever PM he got from the now-dead shopwatcher.
2. Then when the pressure builds he 'reveals'
3. When he is pressed further. He 'reveals' that he has a 50% chance of success. The precise same ploy Sigurd used to win the first multi-role mafia, and granting him the option of selectively ignoring purchases that he doesn't know about.
His other actions:
1. He says that Sapi and GK can verify that he was protecting someone therefore 'proving' his innocence. This would not prove that he's innocent, because there were four mafia according to Pann to start with. They could also not verify that he actually turned up to the protection, as is stated explicitly in the rules. Conclusion: he's clutching at straws to try to bluff the town or hope they don't notice and save his neck.
2. He immediately accuses me and (to a lesser extent) sapi of being mafia, just because I accuse him of being a mafioso and won't accept his non-existent proof of innocence. After I give a list of conditions under which I would consider him innocent, he does not even seek to meet those conditions.
'I now sincerely regret calling myself an informant to fool the evil mafia consisting of Orb (most definitely) and (possibly) sapi. I should have known that the mafiosos would use it against me in the future.'
The mafia would simply kill you anyway if they a) didn't think you were protected much of the time and b) didn't know that you were one of their own.
The plural of mafioso is mafiosi. I draw a parallel to CDTC, in which Moros, an innocent rogue detective, gave Sasaki the Wolf his role PM and results, allowing the latter to fool many, many people.
In this game, the dead can reveal nothing discussed outside the thread. Hence, you were able to take a round of his results and kill him the night after he revealed himself to you with no personal risk.
'I know I wont die in this, Orb knows he can get an very easy lynch on me so he won't bother trying to assassinate me and my threat to his mafia supremacy.'
I'm sure you know you won't die. Because you are mafia. Alternatively you could just be the most mafiaesque townie ever to enter one of these games. I'm personally hoping we can get the lynch on you, just to prove my doubts about town collective intelligence wrong :laugh4:
Omanes Alexandrapolites
05-20-2007, 21:16
Drat, you guys picked the wrong night to visit the store. Nobody entered, damnation must be upon me today - I can't prove my innocence.
Sometimes I wish the mafia could come along and vouch for me - save me from this cursing at your hands.
Do you really think, if I was mafia, I would be stupid enough to make that mistake! I may have pretty poor quality intelligence, but that sheer idiocy, it's even beyond me! The mafia, no matter who they are, would never do that, and you know it. I still believe that you are mafia - blaming Warluster just because he's a little inactive, then blaming me because I make a small mistake in my voting.
I sometimes wish I had vigilante abilities, or at least had kill ability, at least then I could silence your terrible lies and claims contesting my validity.
'Do you really think, if I was mafia, I would be stupid enough to make that mistake! I may have pretty poor quality intelligence, but that sheer idiocy, it's even beyond me!'
Do I really think, if you were a townie, you would be stupid enough to make that mistake?
Same way that a mafia Luca wouldn't accidentally post in the thread something that he'd meant to PM to his don, incriminating the don and the made, wiping out the entire family in a couple of days?
I think it was a slight mafia slip on your part. They happen.
'The mafia, no matter who they are, would never do that, and you know it. I still believe that you are mafia - blaming Warluster just because he's a little inactive, then blaming me because I make a small mistake in my voting.'
I doubt a townie would do it either.
He's not been just a 'little inactive'. He's had less posts (of which very few are meaningful) than quite a few who were wogged and was not wogged. It's pretty much etiquette to attack lurkers who survive the wogs where more active men are smitten.
OK, so what else do I have to go on?
Your reactions to the accusations were
odd (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1548993&postcount=1049).
You cited things which were clearly wrong according to the rules (protection verification, protection preventing you from having been mafia), and you also suggested that you would never falsely reveal. Supporting it with the fact that you'd truthfully revealed earlier. Which is fairly ridiculous.
Who else should I accuse when I have this ten foot high, blood red, metaphorical writing on the wall saying
OMANES IS NOT ACTING LIKE A TOWNIE. LYNCH HIM
Sasaki Kojiro
05-20-2007, 22:41
Kuo Mui sat at a small table, enjoying his evening tea. He had always loved tea, it seemed to calm his nerves and right now he was feeling particularly jumpy with all of the recent deaths.
"Good evening, Kuo Mui." Kuo Mui turned his head to find a fellow monk, dressed in fine black robes and a hood to hide his face. "May I enjoy some tea with you this evening?" "Of course, I have plenty to share," responded Kuo Mui. The monk sat down at the table, and the two discussed the recent murders as time slowly passed by.
"Yes, its a terrible pity what has been going on lately." The monk stated. "Oh dear, it seems we've run out of tea. Please, allow me to fetch us some more" "Thank you, it is much appreciated," Kuo Mui answered. "I can't believe we went through it so fast. I suppose it was quite excellent tonight."
Upon leaving, the monk retrieved a bow and quiver from the next room. The monk silently returned to the room Kuo Mui was in, facing Kuo Mui's back. The monk pulled an arrow from the quiver and nocked in in the bow. Kuo Mui heard the slight sound behind him and turned. "Are you returned with the tea alre-" Kuo Mui's sentence was silenced as an arrow flew from the bow, driving itself through Kuo Mui's heart. The monk strung another arrow to the bow, and shot it through Kuo Mui's head, to make sure the job was finished.
"Thank you for the tea, it was indeed most excellent tonight," the monk said as he left the room.
****************************
Zhi Mui left from the dojo. He'd been training hard to make sure he was still the best. His knuckles still hurt from hitting pevergreen a few hours earlier. A monk greeted him on his way home, 'Hello.' 'You?' 'Take a little care, this salve really helps the knuckles after a fight.' 'Thanks.'
'np'. Zhi Mui turned around and the monk raised a sword. Zhi Mui turned quickly but not quickly enough. The monk hacked into his left shoulder. Zhi Mui leapt backwards and readied his fists for combat. 'Too slow. The blade and the salve were both poisoned.' Zhi Mui smiled and his right arm shot to the vial in his belt. The armed monk moved like lightning and drove the sword through Zhi Mui neck. The monk prised the vial from Zhi Mui cold, dead hands.
'Dumb as a rock.'
****************************
Killed (9):
Dutch_guy
ChuggtheSquirrel
Andres
discovery1
Redleg
GH
Roadkill
Caius
Sapi
Lynched (4):
Tran
BlackAxe
doc_bean
Crazed Rabbit
Expelled from Temple(8):
Ignoramus
Killfrenzy
Ultrawar
Xehh
Kagemusha
Beefy187
CountArach
WarmasterHorus
Left the temple(1):
HughTower
Living (15):
Ichigo
pevergreen
Faust|
Xdeathfire
Kommodus
Greaterkhaan
ByzantineKnight
Omanes
Stig
Warluster
Sigurd
Orb
TwilightBlade
Pannonian
The_Stranger
With 15 alive, it's 5 to lynch.
Orb is awfully active for someone who should be hosting a game
Vote: Orb
I don't need long posts. I just see you making lenghty posts here while you're in the progress of starting your own game
Warluster
05-20-2007, 22:52
I'm not gojgnto vote for Omanes, as though he was sortta suspicous, he isn't a suspect for me, and Orb seems hellbent on getting him.
But I ain't voting for orb either, and the reasons you provide Stig aren't exactly excellent. Maybe orb's just a fast typer? Maybe he has a lot of time to host a game and try to prove Omanes is guilty?
But Omanes has provided countless evidence to prove he is innocent.
For now I vote no one.
Vote:Warluster
Orb:1
Warluster:1
But I ain't voting for orb either, and the reasons you provide Stig aren't exactly excellent. Maybe orb's just a fast typer? Maybe he has a lot of time to host a game and try to prove Omanes is guilty?
No he said he was busy.
And those last posts don't look like the work of someone who is busy, he's getting awfully involved into this game.
Also:
Challenge: Orb
So he won't have a night action
'I'm not gojgnto vote for Omanes, as though he was sortta suspicous, he isn't a suspect for me, and Orb seems hellbent on getting him.'
I'm hellbent on getting him because he's guilty as hell.
'But I ain't voting for orb either, and the reasons you provide Stig aren't exactly excellent. Maybe orb's just a fast typer? Maybe he has a lot of time to host a game and try to prove Omanes is guilty?'
All of the above is correct. I'm a fast typer. I have plenty of time now (COA is nearly ready. I'm mostly touching up the role PMs and fleshing out a few of the items with descriptions).
'But Omanes has provided countless evidence to prove he is innocent.'
He's provided countless posts, but only one piece of potentially valid evidence (Sasaki's antidote). I have methodically and systematically taken apart every other statement he's made.
He has also made up obviously incorrect evidence ('being in protection group clears him' line), and done things which are the trademarks of mafia forgery (50% chance) and generally acted suspiciously.
---
Stig, at least, has a valid point. Unlike the Omanes-styled 'he accused me so I'll accuse him' point. If Pannonian confirms that the roles could have a 50% chance of success, I might reconsider my vote and attacks.
Vote: Omanes for reasons previously explained
Challenge: Omanes
---
I probably did say I was busy, but when? My free time has enlarged miraculously over the last couple of days (no more school). It's also my generic excuse for being slow to start something.
Crazed Rabbit
05-20-2007, 23:36
Guys, Omanes is showing classic mafia behavior.
Let's review - first he agrees with me and my analysis, then, when I am about to get killed, he knowingly puts the final vote on me and kills me - providing no good reason whatsoever. That's textbook bandwagon.
Then, almost immediately afterwards, seeing the suspicion of him rise due to his scummy actions, he recants his death vote. He was blowing in the wind, opinion-wise, which means his beliefs are only what are expedient for his survival.
As I predicted, he tries to make a role claim - of something that can't be verified by anyone, and of a role that's already been mentioned.
Next, he tries to throw suspicion on his accusers for daring to question him.
People, what we have here is a mafia who's practically revealed himself to us. All we need to do is finish him off.
Crazed Rabbit
PS I'd buy body armor - seems like both mafiosos have weapons.
Pannonian
05-21-2007, 00:15
The case for Omanes:
I have said before that I would not reveal all the details of my role, for there were certain details that only another pro-town role would have, that I wished to check out their claims with. When Omanes approached me early in the game, claiming to be a shopwatcher, I immediately tried to check his info (that no-one visited the shop on N1) with the town. After Blackaxe said that he did visit the shop to buy something, I asked Omanes for an explanation. He explained that he only watched the shop for half the night.
I am the training grounds watcher. I watch for half the night, meaning I only have half the information. I cannot be sure if anyone I see is or is not a mafioso - I only see people who train, and what they train in. However, anyone I see training is confirmed to have not been involved in scum activity that night. In addition to this, I have to maintain higher standards than other monks, and thus cannot buy or own anything. As you can see, this fits Omanes' description in every way, except he watches the shop, while I watch the training grounds.
The case against Crazed Rabbit:
There was a private forum set up, whose members were HughTower, CR, GeneralHankerchief, Redleg, and Kommodus, where they discussed whom to protect. One night, their protective target was me, but since I had been promised protection by someone else, I asked them not to waste their efforts, and to look elsewhere instead. They eventually decided on CR. That night, both GH and Redleg died. That left me looking at their group, watching for training activity over the next few nights, and trying to arrange for duels to see if they would join the town's activity. I'd seen HughTower training before, and Kommodus agreed to fight a duel despite having low fighting ability. But there was absolutely nothing forthcoming from or about CR. I asked HughTower what it was that made them decide to protect CR, but there was no reply, and he's since left the game. CR has a reputation for honesty, but on logic and evidence alone, he screamed guilty.
Pannonian
05-21-2007, 00:24
Over 5 nights, I've not seen Orb train on any night. Considering he claims to have spent his nights training (the details of which he's kept nebulous because the dog ate it, along with his homework), there is a fairly low probability of escaping my view. His explanations have been unconvincing at best.
The same applies for Sigurd, whom I'd like to account for his night-time activities. If you've been involved in group actions, please state what they were and let the other members of the group confirm this.
Vote: Orb
No, I claimed to have done nothing at all and maybe trained for one night. I was relatively busy at the time, so I'd forgotten a lot. I had originally believed (mistakenly) that you needed another person to train with you to get any improvement, and only noticed otherwise when Sapi claimed to train alone. I have offered to train anyone who was interested previously, but noone has so far contacted me about that.
That offer still stands.
I've trawled through my PMs, after I realised that I had to use the search function to find them (they were in an old Civ IV mod folder for some reason. I love being organised :laugh4:). I pmed Ig asking him to train on night one. He read my pm, or at least it says that, but didn't reply. I asked him again on 12thCG pm, and he said OK. I sent my message in to Sasaki. I'm not sure if I actually trained, though.
seeing as your role corresponds with Omanes', I'm going to withdraw my challenge.
Unchallenge
The Crazed Rabbit thing is interesting, but I don't think the mafia would have odd last names (all others dead were named after styles) allowing townies to identify them after lynches. Fighting a duel once isn't much of a problem if there are three-four mafia for Kommodus (who has been strangely inactive/retentive about Holmes), or it could just be a fluke.
Warluster comes from huge inactivity, and being spared from a WOG when more active people were expelled, into making two completely neutral/useless posts, which is a reason I don't trust him.
pevergreen
05-21-2007, 01:08
I am leaving myself open, as it seems i would have one of the highest scores.
seireikhaan
05-21-2007, 02:48
Vote: Warluster. Well, a couple of you said last round to wait and see if Warluster was wog'd. He wasn't wog'd and now just lately he's started posting, though nothing of consequence. This screams "I'm posting to save my role" to me.
Why wasn't he wog'd when he had fewer posts then some of the people who were wog'd? And now he starts posting? I think he's mafia. What have you been doing this whole time, Warluster? And now that you seem to finally be paying attention, do you have anything of consequence to say?
-inappropriate for dead player-
Sasaki
seireikhaan
05-21-2007, 03:07
Also, I'm kinda curious as to where BK went to. He's mysteriously disappeared for the last couple of rounds. Anyone there, BK?
Also, I forgot the tally for my last post:
Orb: 2(Pannonian,Stig)
Warluster: 2(Greaterkhaan,Ichigo)
Omanes: 1(Orb)
Also, I'm kinda curious as to where BK went to. He's mysteriously disappeared for the last couple of rounds. Anyone there, BK?
Also, I forgot the tally for my last post:
Orb: 2(Pannonian,Stig)
Warluster: 2(Greaterkhaan,Ichigo)
Omanes: 1(Orb)
Last Activity: 05-13-2007 22:41
Damn, interesting.
A couple things struck me:
From Omanes:
"Drat, you guys picked the wrong night to visit the store. Nobody entered, damnation must be upon me today - I can't prove my innocence."
What is this supposed to mean? ~:confused:
and from Redleg:
"Makes for a nice little story, however its not exactly true, I don't discuss the game in any other forum, only in the thread and via PM from the .org.."
I'm thinking, wouldn't Pann remember that Redleg was in the group especially if he died the next night?
I'm feeling stupid right now, and don't trust myself enough to vote, so I'll await explanations before I make a move.
Actually,
Challenge: Pannonian
Now, this result may be interesting..
Gah, ok..
Knew I shouldn't have made a move.
Unchallenge
Pann fought Ichigo, who's skill is fairly well established.
*I swear I'm not under chemical influence*
Pannonian
05-21-2007, 06:10
I remember wrongly - Redleg was mentioned as a protection candidate, but he wasn't actually linked to the forum. Actually, re-reading it, I'm not sure who actually got the protection from the group for the night - CR asked Redleg whether or not he had protection, but Kommodus also requested protection for Sapi's antidote that he was carrying.
Crazed Rabbit
05-21-2007, 06:12
The case against Crazed Rabbit:
There was a private forum set up, whose members were HughTower, CR, GeneralHankerchief, Redleg, and Kommodus, where they discussed whom to protect. One night, their protective target was me, but since I had been promised protection by someone else, I asked them not to waste their efforts, and to look elsewhere instead. They eventually decided on CR. That night, both GH and Redleg died.
You've got your information wrong. If you know the site, perhaps you ought to go back and have a look at what I told Redleg before that night. I know Kommodus is still alive and knowledgeable.
Or would the real facts not suit your agenda?
Personally, I can't believe that Omanes only has one vote.
I asked HughTower what it was that made them decide to protect CR
Ah (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1494042&postcount=5)-hem (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1477483&postcount=43).
Crazed Rabbit
Pannonian
05-21-2007, 06:14
Warluster should be lynched one day, but I'd rather have Orb or Sigurd lynched tonight, with one of the experts (Stig or pevergreen) duelling with Warluster to deny him his night action.
Oh, that's easy, tho I haven't trained for 2 nights now, since I forgot:
Unchallenge, challenge: Warluster
Omanes Alexandrapolites
05-21-2007, 07:13
Thankyou Orb, and many thanks to Pannonion. Since sapi is dead, I think that may be a mafia framing attempt against me. Since Orb has concluded his out and out warfare so quickly, without trying to get Pannonian too, I feel that he may not be mafia.
What is this supposed to mean?Nobody visited the store in the period of time that I was watching it last night, that means that I cannot prove my innocence for today without aid from external parties - namely Pannonian.
Warluster
05-21-2007, 07:55
Why, put it this, all who wonder why I wasn't wog'ed, I was quite suprised I hadn't been as well. And stopped coming to this game as I thought I had been kicked out because of inactivity.
That my reaon, and if you don't believe, too bad as I know its true.
There was a private forum set up, whose members were HughTower, CR, GeneralHankerchief, Redleg, and Kommodus, where they discussed whom to protect.
Can you give us a link to that forum and provide us with a username and password so that we can check it for ourselves?
Pannonian
05-21-2007, 08:34
Edited out while I check game ethics with Sasaki.
pevergreen
05-21-2007, 09:17
Thankyou Orb, and many thanks to Pannonion. Since sapi is dead, I think that may be a mafia framing attempt against me. Since Orb has concluded his out and out warfare so quickly, without trying to get Pannonian too, I feel that he may not be mafia.
Nobody visited the store in the period of time that I was watching it last night, that means that I cannot prove my innocence for today without aid from external parties - namely Pannonian.
Well Omanes, you havent responded to my question. I gave you the night, but...
Thankyou Orb, and many thanks to Pannonion. Since sapi is dead, I think that may be a mafia framing attempt against me. Since Orb has concluded his out and out warfare so quickly, without trying to get Pannonian too, I feel that he may not be mafia.That makes less than no sense.
Care to explain?
I'd suggest that Orb is lynched, and pever challenges Warluster.
Orb has been pursuing Omanes a lot, and while I once found merit in his arguements, I'm inclined to trust Pannonian's defense of him. As such, I'm coming to believe that the mafia are Orb, Warluster, and either GK or pever.
Why?
Orb - general argumentative nature, but wrong. Been suspecting him for several rounds now. Possible kill on me to establish an alibi ("but the guy supporting me died"). Apparently failed to train.
Warluster - inactivity and yet no WoG
GK - his attempts to organise protection groups have seemed too overtly pro town; and at the same time none of them have worked. His groups have either been infiltrated or, as I suspect, he's a mafia working to stop townies from training.
pever - I've posted this up before; he's just been jumping around a bit too much with the votes and challanges and he acted strangely in an early PM exhange
~sapi
My argument was entirely logical until Pannonian, whom I trust, confirmed that the roles could indeed work like that. Omanes had acted in a manner that was entirely mafiaesque, even producing a role reminiscent of Sigurd's forged role in an earlier game. He'd also made several completely illogical or false arguments.
However, Pannonian has now explained that the role could be genuine, and so, I am prepared to give Omanes the night for us to check his role.
I did fail to train, because I'd thought initially (until I asked who you trained with) that you needed to train with someone to get any improvement. I have offered to train anyone who wanted to be trained, but noone has contacted me. That offer is still open.
Pannonian's comment is interesting, but I stand by the fact that CR had an odd name, suggesting a townie role.
'Possible kill on me to establish an alibi ("but the guy supporting me died").'
Possible kill on you to implicate me ("Orb didn't want anyone else with good Kung Fu or "Orb was trying to make an alibi") (either for those reasons, or for Kung Fu envy/fear).
Personally, I'd guess that the kill on you happened because you claimed to have been in a few protection groups somewhere and also made your antidote's existence known.
EDIT: And Unvote. I currently suspect warluster and Kommodus (his inactivity and retension about Holmes, as well as the new evidence Pannonian has brought to the board. One night lost to a duel is a small price to pay for a good alibi), but I'm going to wait a bit before casting a vote.
EDIT EDIT: Here's the tally
Orb: 2(Pannonian,Stig)
Warluster: 2(Greaterkhaan,Ichigo)
Personally, I'd guess that the kill on you happened because you claimed to have been in a few protection groups somewhere and also made your antidote's existence known.@Sasaki - was I killed by a weapon, or poison, or both?
The description doesn't make it very clear...
This has been an interesting development...
[Pannonian]You claim you have not seen me or Orb at the training ground any night?
This sounds suspicious as I have trained every night since we started.
If Omanes is mafia then Pannonian is one too.
This watching business seems pointless in this game as a mafioso who does not carry out a night action will naturally train [three Mafiosi scenario].
The shop watching is also pointless as both mafia and townies can buy stuff.
It seems however evident that Omanes have been watching the shop as he correctly identified sapi buying something. sapi is now a confirmed innocent.
Would the mafia have these watching abilities too? as in 'When not performing a kill you can watch the shop'
that would explain the 50%... it is not half the night, it is; every other night.
If Pannonian and Omanes is mafia then Warluster is one too. I have hosted when he was mafia and he will blurt out when supposed to stay silent. Stig or Alexander was under threat and he came to the 'rescue' ... but got lynched in the process. See any similarities here?
vote: Omanes
Interesting comment, Sigurd. I'm not yet fully assured of Omanes' innocence, and Pann's earlier confused comments to incriminate CR do not seem logical, but I trust him for now.
Nonetheless, if you think in this scenario that Warluster is mafia, we should lynch him first, then see if Pannonian and Omanes can both fulfil their claimed roles still, naming who's training and who bought something. This would, at least, either prove your theory right or wrong (could include a challenge, to reduce it to one of Pannonian/Omanes, which would mean that the original 4 mafia claimed by Pann would definitely be down to 2, so that they would definitely be innocent if they got something right.)
Vote: Warluster Inactivity. No wog. Insubstantial posts. Sigurd's suspicion. Experimental purposes
Orb: 2 (Pannonian,Stig)
Warluster: 3 (Greaterkhaan, Ichigo, Orb)
Omanes 1 (Sigurd)
EDIT: Challenge: Pannonian for experimental purposes. If Omanes can successfully get a shopbuyer right in this situation, Sigurd's theory is wrong and both he and Pannonian are proved innocent.
EDIT EDIT: Sorry, just realised I messed up the vote tally :shame:
Alternatively someone could challenge Omanes and see if there are still two kills.
In that case, lynch warluster (most likely mafia) and challenge and incapacitate both Pannonian and Omanes.
If the kills stop...
I will challenge: Omanes...
I still can't see the benefit of having someone watch the shop.
tally:
Warluster: 3 (Greaterkhaan, Ichigo, Orb)
Orb: 2 (Pannonian,Stig)
Omanes: 1 (Sigurd)
Stig vs. Warluster
Orb vs. Pannonian
Sigurd vs. Omanes
Pannonian
05-21-2007, 14:07
From the above, I rather suspect both Orb and Sigurd are mafia, and that there will be one kill tonight to frame either Omanes or me as scum, and discredit the other. The flurry of activity is proably because I named both, despite their attacking each other earlier in the thread (2 days ago?), as suspects.
Here's some information which those still alive may or may not wish to confirm. If you believe my claim above those of Orb and Sigurd, please take your votes off Warluster (a duel can take care of him), and lynch one of Orb or Sigurd tonight.
Ichigo trained in Crane on N1.
Pevergreen trained in Crane on N2, training twilightblade on N1.
Faust trained in Dragon on N3, 4, 5.
Stig trained in Crane on N2.
Kommodus trained in Dragon on N3.
Please don't ask for details on who trained in what on such and such a night, proving by my lack of answer that I am lying, as Sigurd is trying to do. I only watch for half the night, so I only have half the information, and only that relating to the training grounds. Still, the grounds is a more popular place than the shop, so I'm not surprised Omanes has so little information - half of nothing is nothing.
If other players (Orb excepted) can confirm they've been in group activities with Sigurd, I'll start taking my eyes off him. However, at this point, I strongly suspect him and Orb to be mafia.
Sasaki Kojiro
05-21-2007, 14:12
@Sasaki - was I killed by a weapon, or poison, or both?
The description doesn't make it very clear...
weapon
Pannonian
05-21-2007, 14:31
About the outside forum I referred to earlier. Here's the reply from Sasaki.
I've referred to an outside forum, which Andres has asked me to post a link to. Is this legit,
No. It would essentially be quoting pm's, since you can have a private conversation with someone and then paste the link for all to see.
Sasaki
You may quote this pm
If other players (Orb excepted) can confirm they've been in group activities with Sigurd, I'll start taking my eyes off him. However, at this point, I strongly suspect him and Orb to be mafia.
Why do you keep pressing this issue?
I have already stated that I trained every night. Alone.
From the above, I rather suspect both Orb and Sigurd are mafia, and that there will be one kill tonight to frame either Omanes or me as scum, and discredit the other. The flurry of activity is proably because I named both, despite their attacking each other earlier in the thread (2 days ago?), as suspects.
Here's some information which those still alive may or may not wish to confirm. If you believe my claim above those of Orb and Sigurd, please take your votes off Warluster (a duel can take care of him), and lynch one of Orb or Sigurd tonight.
Ichigo trained in Crane on N1.
Pevergreen trained in Crane on N2, training twilightblade on N1.
Faust trained in Dragon on N3, 4, 5.
Stig trained in Crane on N2.
Kommodus trained in Dragon on N3.
Please don't ask for details on who trained in what on such and such a night, proving by my lack of answer that I am lying, as Sigurd is trying to do. I only watch for half the night, so I only have half the information, and only that relating to the training grounds. Still, the grounds is a more popular place than the shop, so I'm not surprised Omanes has so little information - half of nothing is nothing.
If other players (Orb excepted) can confirm they've been in group activities with Sigurd, I'll start taking my eyes off him. However, at this point, I strongly suspect him and Orb to be mafia.
As I've stated, I've done nothing so far in any night phase (except possibly trained with Ig on night 1). I had until quite recently (sapi's reply to my inquiry as to who he trained with) thought that training required another person, and though I have advertised my willingness to train someone before that in the thread, noone has taken me up on this.
It does somewhat damage your credibility that you are entirely unwilling to accept this test. The fact that Warluster has survived a WOG where more active people have been expelled is severe damning evidence: people have suggested that he's famous for inactivity, so I've held off a vote for a turn or two, but he's still here. He then makes an insubstantial an neutral post. Sigurd, who has seen him as mafia before, has also condemned him.
What I find very interesting is how you were earlier pushing for an organised duel sysem and suggesting that we should make use of this tool, but are now entirely against it when it is directed at YOU.
Ichigo trained in Crane on N1.
Pevergreen trained in Crane on N2, training twilightblade on N1.
Faust trained in Dragon on N3, 4, 5.
Stig trained in Crane on N2.
Kommodus trained in Dragon on N3.
Alright we can work with this...
Is this all your results?
you got 2 results on night 1 (Ichigo and Pever(Twilight))
you got 2 results on night 2 (Pever and Stig)
you got 2 results on night 3 (Faust and Kommodus)
you got 1 result on night 4 (Faust)
you got 1 result on night 5 (Faust)
Crane
Dragon
Mantis
Oh, and unvote Omanes, vote: Warluster
tally:
Warluster: 4 (Greaterkhaan, Ichigo, Orb, Sigurd) - One more vote to lynch
Orb: 2 (Pannonian,Stig)
Stig vs. Warluster
Orb vs. Pannonian
Sigurd vs. Omanes
mmmmm, I don't trust Orb and Sigurd really. So seeing I want to stop them from a night action it's hard to challenge any one of them. Furthermore challenging Warluster doesn't seem to have a use either:
Unchallenge, Challenge: Orb
Pann seems to be a townie (as he knows all sorts of stuff, and yet you wish to experiment, this far into the game?)
The only thing that Pann has against him is the fact that he hasn't been killed yet.
Pannonian
05-21-2007, 15:42
As I've stated, I've done nothing so far in any night phase (except possibly trained with Ig on night 1). I had until quite recently (sapi's reply to my inquiry as to who he trained with) thought that training required another person, and though I have advertised my willingness to train someone before that in the thread, noone has taken me up on this.
It does somewhat damage your credibility that you are entirely unwilling to accept this test. The fact that Warluster has survived a WOG where more active people have been expelled is severe damning evidence: people have suggested that he's famous for inactivity, so I've held off a vote for a turn or two, but he's still here. He then makes an insubstantial an neutral post. Sigurd, who has seen him as mafia before, has also condemned him.
What I find very interesting is how you were earlier pushing for an organised duel sysem and suggesting that we should make use of this tool, but are now entirely against it when it is directed at YOU.
I have no problems with the duel system, even when it's directed at me. Beating me or Omanes up won't affect our work - we can still watch our respective areas from our hospital beds. The only thing I want is to see you and Sigurd lynched, because I think you are both mafia, currently working together to discredit me and Omanes.
So I want one of the experts to duel with Warluster, to deny him his night action. Another can beat Omanes up until he's black and blue, it doesn't matter much, as our watching ability is passive - we don't need to actively investigate to get results. My current kung fu ability is 7, style white crane. Last time Ichigo and I fought out a draw using Crane style. Since Ichigo also knows Dragon style, I invite him to beat me up using that - Dragon beats Crane beats Mantis beats Dragon.
Following the above, the duels would be:
Stig v Warluster - Stig wins, knocking out Warluster for the night.
Pevergreen v Omanes - Pevergreen wins, knocking out Omanes for the night.
Ichigo using Dragon v Pannonian - Ichigo wins, knocking out Pannonian for the nght.
Orb and Sigurd can challenge me and Omanes if they want, as their knocking us out won't affect the collection of results from watching the shop and training grounds. The only thing I'm wary of is if they challenge someone else, particularly Stig or Pevergreen, to deny us the required duel losers (Warluster, Omanes, Pannonian).
Pannonian
05-21-2007, 16:07
Stig, if you want Orb knocked out, The Stranger would be a better match with his Mantis style. Your Crane loses against Orb's Dragon, and Orb has already won more duels than you have, putting you at a further disadvantage. I would really like Warluster to be knocked out, or at least to have his style revealed.
Warluster will get lynched mostlikely
And believe me, my Crane won't lose
Beating me or Omanes up won't affect our work - we can still watch our respective areas from our hospital beds.
Orb and Sigurd can challenge me and Omanes if they want, as their knocking us out won't affect the collection of results from watching the shop and training grounds. The only thing I'm wary of is if they challenge someone else, particularly Stig or Pevergreen, to deny us the required duel losers (Warluster, Omanes, Pannonian).
Hehe... nice try there Pann, It is not your watching abilities we want blocked.
And believe me, my Crane won't lose
Am I reading this right?
You will go against Orb using crane; you do realise that you need a score of 27-28 to beat Orb ?
If I need a 28 score to beat Orb he needs to have 25, which is impossible, as he claimed that he hasn't trained at nights.
I can challenge you ofcourse. What do you have against Pann?
Stig, the only way you could possibly win using crane is by having done night kills :)
25 is quite possible for my 3 duels and constant day training (the gold I got from BA has financed this). 9 (base) + 6 (3 duels) + 10 (5 day trainings, including today) + 1/0 (1/0 night trainings) = 25/6
You can't have more than 10 (base) + 0 (0 duels) + 8 (4 day trainings) + 5 (5 night trainings) = 23, so if you win, you are guilty.
Hm, I'm very suspicious of Pannonian and Omanes. It seems to me that players with detective-type roles should be able to easily provide airtight defenses of themselves... especially once they have "revealed" their roles. I'm not seeing this from these two. Typically, since roles are pro-town, isn't the most difficult decision when and how to reveal a role?
Orb, did I ever say I'd be using Crane?
But tell me, how do you get those day trainings, afterall:
As you night action you may choose to practice Kung Fu. This will add 1 point to your score. If you know someone with at least twice your score and they agree to train you, you can add 2 points (they get one point). You may purchase lessons from the Kung Fu teacher for 10 gold. This take place during the day so they do not interfere with your night action. You get two points or you can get 1 point + learn a style.
PM Sasaki during the day and say 'I'm going to train with the master for the +2 to my Dragon style'. As of yet, I have not received a free training for promising to challenge Ichigo with it.
Pannonian
05-21-2007, 17:31
Hm, I'm very suspicious of Pannonian and Omanes. It seems to me that players with detective-type roles should be able to easily provide airtight defenses of themselves... especially once they have "revealed" their roles. I'm not seeing this from these two. Typically, since roles are pro-town, isn't the most difficult decision when and how to reveal a role?
I revealed I had a role after ByzantineKnight challenged me on the 4 mafia comment, but I kept some information back because I didn't know how many other roles there were, and I wanted to keep those bits secret to check out future claims. Omanes' claim of shopwatcher was checked out by me in this manner (see the early game, R1 IIRC, when I asked if anyone visited the shop). Omanes, for whatever reason, came clean with all those details after last night's lynch of Rabbit. Seeing him under pressure despite his innocence, I backed him up with a full reveal of my role, including rolename, extent and limits.
AFAIK there isn't a vanilla detective role in this game with a magical investigate ability, only area-watchers who need time to build up a picture, and who then need to interpret that picture to the best of their ability.
Based on that, and from what I've seen here, I have my suspicions of Orb, hence my vote for him. Considering Sigurd's claim to have trained every night, I have even greater suspicions of him (there's 0.5^5=3% chance of escaping my view on all 5 nights), but I don't really mind if we wait until next round before we lynch him. Neither Orb nor Sigurd can be blocked from night actions, as they are fearsome fighters, but Warluster AFAIK can, as he's not shown any ability to fight (nor post, for that matter) so far. Hence my preference is to lynch Orb and Sigurd ASAP, while blocking Warluster by having the experts duel with him.
Omanes Alexandrapolites
05-21-2007, 17:33
I still can't see the benefit of having someone watch the shop.My role allows clearance of individuals. For example, if tonight, somebody buys a large package, crossbow/armour, and there is only one kill, then perhaps that person is innocent.
I don't trust you Sigurd, and I feel that Orb is not on the same side that I am fighting for, the town, either, although I am now beginning to think that he may be more pro-town that I thought. Just to prove my innocence, I allow you to challenge me, and actually welcome it, but then there is the question over whether the mafia will stop their kills for one night, just to frame us. Unless the rules state that they have to kill, there is nothing stopping them doing that. Also, as my role PM hints, if somebody is protected, then there will only be the kill that is not protected shown.
BTW, even weaklings can challenge me, and win, so don't bother trying to find veterans to beat me into dog food with!
PM Sasaki during the day and say 'I'm going to train with the master for the +2 to my Dragon style'. As of yet, I have not received a free training for promising to challenge Ichigo with it.
And you can simply get it for free, as Sasaki never mentioned it in the role pm?
And everyone can do it?
Where did Sasaki mention this?
So, Pannonian, you have no evidence whatsoever to suggest that warluster is innocent after his expedient appearance and posting/inactivity, and yet would prefer Sigurd or I to be killed just because you haven't seen us night train and we have passable Kung Fu scores?
And you can simply get it for free, as Sasaki never mentioned it in the role pm?
And everyone can do it?
Where did Sasaki mention this?
IN THE PRECISE BIT OF THE RULES YOU QUOTED EARLIER.
I never said it was free. it cost 10 gold per day. Blackaxe left me his prayer book and gold, so I have been able to afford it every day.
'You may purchase lessons from the Kung Fu teacher for 10 gold. This take place during the day so they do not interfere with your night action. You get two points or you can get 1 point + learn a style.'
Oops. I misread that, thinking you could only do skill + 1p.
Unchallenge, challenge: Warluster
I'll block hisnight action, now lynch someone who's suspicious.
Orb for example as he shouldn't have time, he claimed so himself. And he has a game to host.
Omanes Alexandrapolites
05-21-2007, 17:54
Oh yes, almost forgot, Vote: Orb
I would normally vote for Sigurd, but, unless something big happens between the end of the voting and the start, he will never be the target of this town.
My reasoning for this action is mostly due to the fact that I follow Pannonion's judgement. His experience and wisdom in the art of playing mafia games is elite so his actions, as long as he is fully trusted, should be followed to enable town victory.
Oh yes, almost forgot, Vote: Orb
I would normally vote for Sigurd, but, unless something big happens between the end of the voting and the start, he will never be the target of this town.
My reasoning for this action is mostly due to the fact that I follow Pannonion's judgement. His experience and wisdom in the art of playing mafia games is elite so his actions, as long as he is fully trusted, should be followed to enable town victory.
Pannonian's judgement led to you lynching an almost certainly innocent man.
@Stig, where did I say I shouldn't have time? I said it was a valid point, which is not the same thing.
I'm quite happy to die for the town, but Warluster has done nothing indicative of innocence. If people can give me a good reason not to vote for him, I'm OK with that. For now it's just a Kung Fu skill envy attack from Pannonian on me and minimal real reasoning. I've said I haven't trained at night, and explained that, so why are you accusing me?
Can someone else challenge Pannonian? Currently if I'm lynched Pannonian will certainly not be stopped.
So I want one of the experts to duel with Warluster, to deny him his night action. Another can beat Omanes up until he's black and blue, it doesn't matter much, as our watching ability is passive - we don't need to actively investigate to get results. My current kung fu ability is 7, style white crane. Last time Ichigo and I fought out a draw using Crane style. Since Ichigo also knows Dragon style, I invite him to beat me up using that - Dragon beats Crane beats Mantis beats Dragon.
Hmm, no, why don't we just lynch your buddy Warluster.
Vote: Warluster
Warluster: 5 (Greaterkhaan, Ichigo, Orb, Sigurd, Faust)
Orb: 2 (Pannonian,Stig)
A little executive action and now we'll see what happens... but not on your terms. I'm sorry, but if you guys have pro-town roles, you are doing the sloppiest job imaginable.
We'll see if they're guilty now.
Sigurd should flatten me in a duel, given that I haven't trained at night, so if people want to try that tomorrow, I'm entirely happy with it.
FoS Faust
if it still counts:
Unchallenge, challenge: Orb, just want to see your real score
Oh, there were fifteen of us and only eight votes. A few more people joining in wouldn't do badly for us.
The Stranger
05-21-2007, 20:21
Am i still in this game? i was gone for 5 days and im still in it... thats nasty... i couldnt have trained...
Sasaki
Could you please PM me a few things. My current kungfu score, AND ADD MY POINTS FOR WINNING THE CHALLENGE NOW!, and my the amount of money i have...
TOWN
How much is it to vote? Is there someone i need to challenge? My score is 17 but could get a boost if Sasaki adds the points I deserve. Does anyone know who i should vote for...?
Pann
I read the pages, PM me if you wish to clarify why i had to read them...
Vote: No Lynch (for now)
Answer from a townie, who sorely wishes he had 80 gold.
The vote is over. Yes, you seem to be here still.
Kommodus
05-21-2007, 20:56
*cautiously raises hand from the back of the room*
I have a few questions that I'd like answered. The first is for Orb: you say you've only trained once, and (IIRC) that you've been idle on other nights. (If I have that wrong, please correct me and explain what you have been doing on the other nights.) Can you explain your motivation for this? I'm not quite sure why you would do nothing for so many nights in a row, when at a minimum a townie can at least train a bit.
My second question is for both Pannonian and sapi. Pannonian, early in the game you claimed there were four mafiosi. At this point sapi has claimed, once or twice, that there were three. How do the two of you explain this discrepancy? Also, P, now that you've revealed your role there should be no harm in telling us this: how did you know there were four mafiosi? That knowledge doesn't seem inherent in your role as a "training grounds watcher."
Actually, I suppose that's all the questions I have right now - the rest are mere observations.
I was very frustrated to see Omanes cast the lynch vote on CR in such a reckless fashion. That struck me as a highly suspicious maneuver, as any mafia team would be eager to avoid the power of The Truth (tm), and getting the Rabbit lynched is the only real way to do it. CR should've been given more time to log in, swear his innocence, and help us avoid lynching another innocent player.
Omanes claimed to be following Pannonian's advice, but that's not what P advised. His vote was intended to pressure CR into revealing his true identity.
Furthermore, Omanes' defenses after having cast the ill-advised vote were, frankly, miserable. He decided to re-read the thread after making a game-changing decision? Riiiight... either that or he knew CR was going to log in later and swear his innocence; therefore, he pre-emptively decided to change his mind.
It's certainly possible that Omanes really is pro-town, and is simply playing badly (no offence intended). I actually believe that he is the real shop-watcher, since Pannonian's role and Omanes' role rule parallel. However...
It's not impossible for a member of the mafia to have an additional ability. In Graffiti Mafia, Xiahou was a mafioso, but also had role-blocking capabilities. The ability to watch the shop or the training grounds can serve the town, but either ability could serve the mafia as well...
Finally, I'd like to verify that I was being protected the night GH and Redleg were killed (night 3). Sapi had just given me the antidote, and I was worried the mafia would attack me and take it away (since it was public knowledge). It doesn't matter now, since sapi has been murdered and the mafia have it anyway. :shame:
My motivation was really quite simple. I thought (and I was wrong) until a couple of days ago that you could only train with another person. I have offered to train anyone who wants to, but got no response on that, so assumed that no townie trusted me enough to train with me. Last night I spent a lot of effort answering Omanes and writing roles for COA and in the midst of that forgot to PM Sasaki.
(which will start tomorrow evening, as I could start it now, but have an exam tomorrow so wouldn't be able to answer the load of follow on questions that would inevitably follow the complicated role PMs for a while.)
Pannonian
05-21-2007, 21:21
My second question is for both Pannonian and sapi. Pannonian, early in the game you claimed there were four mafiosi. At this point sapi has claimed, once or twice, that there were three. How do the two of you explain this discrepancy?
There was an textual analysis earlier which concluded that there were 3 mafiosi.
Also, P, now that you've revealed your role there should be no harm in telling us this: how did you know there were four mafiosi? That knowledge doesn't seem inherent in your role as a "training grounds watcher."
It's in my role PM, which I can't quote.
I was very frustrated to see Omanes cast the lynch vote on CR in such a reckless fashion. That struck me as a highly suspicious maneuver, as any mafia team would be eager to avoid the power of The Truth (tm), and getting the Rabbit lynched is the only real way to do it. CR should've been given more time to log in, swear his innocence, and help us avoid lynching another innocent player.
Omanes claimed to be following Pannonian's advice, but that's not what P advised. His vote was intended to pressure CR into revealing his true identity.
Furthermore, Omanes' defenses after having cast the ill-advised vote were, frankly, miserable. He decided to re-read the thread after making a game-changing decision? Riiiight... either that or he knew CR was going to log in later and swear his innocence; therefore, he pre-emptively decided to change his mind.
It's certainly possible that Omanes really is pro-town, and is simply playing badly (no offence intended). I actually believe that he is the real shop-watcher, since Pannonian's role and Omanes' role rule parallel. However...
It's not impossible for a member of the mafia to have an additional ability. In Graffiti Mafia, Xiahou was a mafioso, but also had role-blocking capabilities. The ability to watch the shop or the training grounds can serve the town, but either ability could serve the mafia as well...
Omanes was putting up an awful defence, about as bad as mine earlier in the game, so I weighed in with a full reveal of my role. Omanes is pro-town.
Sasaki Kojiro
05-21-2007, 21:34
Huang Fujian has been thrown over the cliff to his death
Warluster: 5 (Greaterkhaan, Ichigo, Orb, Sigurd, Faust)
Orb: 2 (Pannonian,Stig)
Stig vs. Warluster
Orb vs. Pannonian
Sigurd vs. Omanes
*********
Orb vs pannonian
Orbs dragon style gives him an advantage against pann's white crane, but it is hardly needed. This fight is over in close to record time.
********
Sigurd vs Omanes
Both are using dragon style. This fight ends in record time.
********
Killed (9):
Dutch_guy
ChuggtheSquirrel
Andres
discovery1
Redleg
GH
Roadkill
Caius
Sapi
Lynched (5):
Tran
BlackAxe
doc_bean
Crazed Rabbit
Warluster
Expelled from Temple(8):
Ignoramus
Killfrenzy
Ultrawar
Xehh
Kagemusha
Beefy187
CountArach
WarmasterHorus
Left the temple(1):
HughTower
Living (14):
Ichigo
pevergreen
Faust|
Xdeathfire
Kommodus
Greaterkhaan
ByzantineKnight
Omanes
Stig
Warluster
Sigurd
Orb
TwilightBlade
Pannonian
The_Stranger
Night will be 24 hours.
Twilightblade
05-22-2007, 07:55
Wow I missed 2 lynches!!
You should have lynched Orb, considering his highly suspicious actions of late.
Fos: Faust - there was no need for that.
Both you and Omanes deserve to be lynched, regardless of innocence, for taking away our opportunity for discussion...
My second question is for both Pannonian and sapi. Pannonian, early in the game you claimed there were four mafiosi. At this point sapi has claimed, once or twice, that there were three. How do the two of you explain this discrepancy? I was basing my claims off what GK determined from his textual analysis of the kills.
There was a private forum set up, whose members were HughTower, CR, GeneralHankerchief, Redleg, and Kommodus, where they discussed whom to protect. One night, their protective target was me, but since I had been promised protection by someone else, I asked them not to waste their efforts, and to look elsewhere instead. They eventually decided on CR. That night, both GH and Redleg died. That left me looking at their group, watching for training activity over the next few nights, and trying to arrange for duels to see if they would join the town's activity. I'd seen HughTower training before, and Kommodus agreed to fight a duel despite having low fighting ability. But there was absolutely nothing forthcoming from or about CR. I asked HughTower what it was that made them decide to protect CR, but there was no reply, and he's since left the game. CR has a reputation for honesty, but on logic and evidence alone, he screamed guilty.
This story was followed by a post from Redleg:
But his post got edited by Sasaki (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1549388&postcount=1064).
Sasaki's edit was on 4.52 am (GMT+1). Faust made this post at 4.53 am, so I take it he managed to quote Redleg and was making his post while Sasaki was editing Redleg's "inappropriate" post...
and from Redleg:
"Makes for a nice little story, however its not exactly true, I don't discuss the game in any other forum, only in the thread and via PM from the .org.."
I'm thinking, wouldn't Pann remember that Redleg was in the group especially if he died the next night?
So, apparently, Pannonian lied about this private forum.
He gives this explanation:
I remember wrongly - Redleg was mentioned as a protection candidate, but he wasn't actually linked to the forum. Actually, re-reading it, I'm not sure who actually got the protection from the group for the night - CR asked Redleg whether or not he had protection, but Kommodus also requested protection for Sapi's antidote that he was carrying.
But I am not convinced. Especially not after CR posted this:
You've got your information wrong. If you know the site, perhaps you ought to go back and have a look at what I told Redleg before that night. I know Kommodus is still alive and knowledgeable.
Or would the real facts not suit your agenda?
Personally, I can't believe that Omanes only has one vote.
FoS at Pannonian
Pann attacked CR but he leaves Kommodus in the clean...
FoS at Kommodus (who is itching me from the very start of the game)
Sasaki Kojiro
05-22-2007, 08:50
Those redleg/CR comments weren't quite what I intended with the dead talking rules, however I noticed it too late to edit. Just mentioning this for future reference.
Omanes Alexandrapolites
05-22-2007, 09:24
I love having a Kung Fu Score of four :beam:
Anyhow, immobilizing me, and Pan', did nothing for you guys, although it did something for Sigurd the suspected mafioso. I can almost guarantee that the kills will stop, unless it is a rule that the mafia must kill every night, but only to frame us as the mafia scum. Ah well, there is one thing reassured, the town is most certainly losing, and there is very little we can do to stop it from occurring since they are hiding .
BTW, the experiment was not controlled, this means that if Warluster was a mafioso, it could appear that either me or Pan' are instead.
Omanes Alexandrapolites
05-22-2007, 18:39
Tis a little quite in the temple this night.
pevergreen
05-22-2007, 23:52
Still waiting on Kommodus to give results.
if he has done it and i missed it, linky?
Sasaki Kojiro
05-23-2007, 00:45
Hsieh Mui limped down the steps of the temple,still in poor shape from his fight earlier that day. He was hoping to escape from the temple for the night, while he rested out in nature to heal until he could be fit to defend himself.
However, as he limped down to the bottom step, he heard a voice from behind him at the top of the steps. "Tsk, tsk, Hsieh Mui. You couldn't defend yourself if you tried with all of your might, could you?"
Hsieh Mui looked behind him, and at the top of the temple steps was a monk clothed in fine black robes wearing a hood to disguise his face. Hsieh Mui panicked and took off as fast as he could, trying to distance himself from the odd monk. However, in his poor state, the monk easily caught up to him and dropped him to the ground with a flying kick to Hsieh Mui's back. Hsieh Mui scrambled to his feet, flailing his arms. One of the arms caught the hood of the monk, revealing a grotesque mask underneath the hood.
"Who are you?!" Hsieh Mui wondered aloud as he scrambled backwards from the monk. "I am your judge, jury, and executioner," responded the monk. The monk lunged forward and delivered a knee to Hsieh Mui's stomach. Hsieh Mui collapsed on his knees. Taking the opportunity, the monk took Hsieh Mui head in his hands and snapped his neck, ending his life.
***************************************
Wang Fujian sat on a hill north of the temple, drinking in the spectacle of the moon reflecting upon the lake. He had been thinking all day about the tragedy that had befallen the temple and what to do about it, but out here he found his thoughts drifting to more soothing things. For the moment, the only things that irritated him were the mosquitoes trying to get a share of his blood. But given the circumstances, he considered that rather pleasant.
As Wang Fujian was lost in thought, a voice resounded behind him: “Up and prepare yourself, dawdler!” Wang Fujian turned to see a fellow monk illuminated by the moon, waiting to fight. Wang Fujian assented, and joined in an unarmed combat. Uncertain of the monk’s intention, Wang Fujian honorably held back with his strikes, refusing to harm one of his brothers. So the two monks continued their fluid dance. However, some of the unnamed monk’s strikes became rather damaging, and Wang Fujian’s patience left him. He attacked the monk with an uncharacteristic temper, raining blows to the monk’s left and right that drove him back until he parted and exposed his palms: “Be calm my friend… you know what they say: He who loses his head in battle cannot see his way to victory…”
Wang Fujian stood in front of him, awaiting an explanation.
“Please, come. You looked to be in another world, I just wanted to wake you up… we need to be thinking, not dreaming. Come, have a drink with me” said the monk, smiling, as he got hold of his canteen. “There’s nothing like sitting down in the evening with a fine spirit.”
Wang Fujian hesitated initially, but he sat down on the hill by the lake with the monk and took a couple swigs from the container. Wang Fujian enjoyed the drink, and offered some back to the monk.
“Oh no, I can’t, that stuff kills me” the monk said, waving away the canteen.
The mosquitoes grew thicker as the two talked about the situation at the temple. Soon the drinking Wang Fujian didn’t even bother swatting them away.
“So many little suckers out here” said the monk, gesturing. “Alright, give me that container, you’ve had quite enough. Time to close up shop.”
With that the monk got up. But v could not follow him. Strangely, he could not use the muscles in his legs.
“Alright, you just lay there then. It’s best that you relax.”
Confused, v started to crawl along the ground back toward the temple. Soon, however, he could not use his arms. He then lay alone, defeated by the unnamed monk, and died. The mosquitoes that perished with him from drinking his poisoned blood were little consolation.
**************************************
Hsu Fujian sat on the temple roof, waiting for the assassin. The stars above him had an enchanting atmosphere. He could almost feel the calm that the temple had before these assassins arrived.
'Well, Hsu Fujian. Here you are.'
Hsu Fujian spun around to see a familiar face, 'You?'
'You?'
'You're the murderer!'
'You're the murderer!'
Hsu Fujian drew the knife he'd had ready and rushed at the monk, but the monk was far too swift for him. He was knocked onto his back by a swift kick to the ribs. The monk lowered the crossbow, 'I suggest that you don't move. It wouldn't be good for your health.'
Hsu Fujian twisted around and the crossbow bolt punched a hole through his heart.
'Hang on to your ego.'
****************************
Killed (12):
Dutch_guy
ChuggtheSquirrel
Andres
discovery1
Redleg
GH
Roadkill
Caius
Sapi
Omanes
Stig
Pannonian
Lynched (5):
Tran
BlackAxe
doc_bean
Crazed Rabbit
Warluster
Expelled from Temple(8):
Ignoramus
Killfrenzy
Ultrawar
Xehh
Kagemusha
Beefy187
CountArach
WarmasterHorus
Left the temple(1):
HughTower
Living (11):
Ichigo
pevergreen
Faust|
Xdeathfire
Kommodus
Greaterkhaan
ByzantineKnight
Sigurd
Orb
TwilightBlade
The_Stranger
Little bit different lynching rules for this day. I'm driving cross country to start my internship and will likely be absent until this weekend (I'm taking my time on the way). When I get online again, the person with the most votes will be lynched.
pevergreen
05-23-2007, 01:07
Who killed someone, though it looks like it backfired.
Im calling for input from Twilightblade.
Pannonian
05-23-2007, 01:45
Well, Omanes and I are cleared. I can't reveal any more role-related information as I'm dead, but I urge you to look at the names of the dead, compare them with the fighting styles when they duelled, then compare with the given game-names of those fighting styles in post 1 of the Summary thread. In all cases, people who've fought using Dragon style are surnamed Mui, those who fought using Crane style are surnamed Fujian, while Mantis fighters were named Shui. All this can be found in the Summary thread.
All the dead are either surnamed Mui, Fujian, or Shui. Apart from Crazed Rabbit, who was Lao Zhi. Therefore he was mafia - he used a variety of ways to be able to maintain a claim of honesty for future games, but he was scum. I've said before that there were 4 mafia, and Rabbit's lynch means there are 3 left, among 11 players left alive. This may be why they did 3 kills last night - to speed-kill through the rest of the crowd and batter through a mafia win, whatever discussion may happen. So don't repeat round 5's mistake and let Orb and Sigurd off - lynch them now, town-kill them at night if necessary, and let the kill descriptions prove my point. Then hope you manage to find the last scum before he kills the remaining townies.
Note: the above information can all be found in the public thread.
You should have lynched Orb, considering his highly suspicious actions of late.
Both you and Omanes deserve to be lynched, regardless of innocence, for taking away our opportunity for discussion...
Oh yeah, that sounds really productive... regardless of innocence. :inquisitive:
I suppose I didn't consider others enough in that bit of executive action, but Pannonian seemed all too eager to encourage a challenge vs Warluster rather than a possible lynch. I just thought I had a good opportunity to help clarify some things. Well, obviously Pannonian is innocent... so there probably isn't a link between him and Warluster. Isn't this easy to say in retrospect though...
I just thought the situation offered an opportunity to make a potent move. I also did something similar in the one round I was alive in GH's VI, to the chagrin of Pannonian. Well, do you what you must... but I would only take such an action if I thought the payoff would be great. Maybe a bad decision though, I don't know.
And yes, I'll have to go back and reread last round's posts in a different light.
My sense told me that at least one of the people who bandwagonned Warluster is a temple impostor and therefore guilty...
Crazed Rabbit
05-23-2007, 02:17
Well, Omanes and I are cleared.
Looks like you were killed by a vigilante - how does that clear you? You could have been mafia.
All the dead are either surnamed Mui, Fujian, or Shui. Apart from Crazed Rabbit, who was Lao Zhi. Therefore he was mafia
Sighs. You know what they say about assuming, right? I find it funny you think there's no other way I could have a different last name, that my role must automatically be scummy.
- he used a variety of ways to be able to maintain a claim of honesty for future games, but he was scum.
I'll say it in any way anyone wants that I AM INNOCENT.
I've said before that there were 4 mafia, and Rabbit's lynch means there are 3 left, among 11 players left alive. This may be why they did 3 kills last night - to speed-kill through the rest of the crowd and batter through a mafia win, whatever discussion may happen. So don't repeat round 5's mistake and let Orb and Sigurd off - lynch them now, town-kill them at night if necessary, and let the kill descriptions prove my point. Then hope you manage to find the last scum before he kills the remaining townies.
Note: the above information can all be found in the public thread.
And is all wrong, because it's based on a terrible assumption. I will agree that Orb is suspicious.
CR
It was Pann, Omanes and Stig Vs Sigurd, Orb and Faust
there are too little alive to do frame ups. Just lynch Orb now and fast.
And CR your defense is weak, you are mafia, face it.
pevergreen
05-23-2007, 07:40
As others have said before, i doubt CR would give up his rep so easily. I dont trust Omanes. I asked him what i bought from the store on a night, and he has not replied...
Pannonian, Omanes was killed by a vigilante - his death does not prove his innocence.
Omanes Alexandrapolites
05-23-2007, 08:09
Omanes was killed by a vigilante - his death does not prove his innocence.That's highly debatable, I was killed by the robed Monk who has so far killed most nights.
"Who are you?!" Hsieh Mui wondered aloud as he scrambled backwards from the monk. "I am your judge, jury, and executioner," responded the monk. The monk lunged forward and delivered a knee to Hsieh Mui's stomach. Hsieh Mui collapsed on his knees. Taking the opportunity, the monk took Hsieh Mui head in his hands and snapped his neck, ending his life.
That hints to me that it was a vigilante.
There had to have been one vigilante kill that night, as there were three kills in total.
Pannonian
05-23-2007, 09:35
Pannonian, Omanes was killed by a vigilante - his death does not prove his innocence.
As others have said before, i doubt CR would give up his rep so easily. I dont trust Omanes. I asked him what i bought from the store on a night, and he has not replied...
I canb't believe people are still fooled by Orb-Sigurd-Rabbit-AN other. Combine all the clues in the thread, such as our reveals, the manner of our reveals, all the information we've posted in this thread wrt the reveals, etc. I referred in the 2nd round to the extent and limit of my role, refusing to reveal at the time what they were as I wanted to keep them back to check up any pro-town claims - I fully revealed the extent and limit yeaterday, which everyone can see isn't perfect on any one night, but builds up a picture over time. Then I vouchsafed for Omanes - put it bluntly, if people believe my word, then they'll have to accept Omanes as well.
As for Rabbit - Orb and lately Rabbit himself have hinted that his unusual name hints at a pro-town role. AFAIK Orb hasn't claimed a pro-town role, nor Sigurd, so why don't you lynch them to see what their names were? Test out my theory by getting their names. Don't be satisfied with merely asking - any fool, after reading my analysis, can make one up to satisfy the critieria. Ask them what their names are, then lynch them to check. If they too have special names, yet they don't have pro-town roles to account for them, that blows away yet another support pillar for Rabbit. All the evidence points to Rabbit being mafia - yet you rely on trust.
The Stranger
05-23-2007, 09:36
whatever... i was lynched for killing a potential mafia with vigilantes in CDCT, it was enough for the town to believe a couple of mafia to lynch me, while i practically gave you the game... so i say track the vigilante and at least find out why he did it...
Also, Pann is right about the name thing... i was quite stunned to say the least...
Challenge ORB, for being suspicious throughout the game but getting away with it... smells like SASAKI
Pannonian
05-23-2007, 10:02
From the townie PM (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?p=1523661#post1523661).
Each day you may challenge any one player to a duel. Three duels will be randomly selected from all the challenges. When you make a challenge, pm me which style of Kung Fu you use (at first you will have to use your starting style). Dragon (Mui) style beats White Crane (Fujian) style beats Praying Mantis (Shui) style beats Dragon Style.
Disco duelled in Mantis style on day 1, and he died the following night. Andres also duelled that day in Dragon style, and he also died the following night. If their names follow their styles, then they should have been named Shui and Mui. Their deaths were reported as those of Zhang Mui and Tseng Shui.
Sapi duelled in Dragon style on day 1. When he died with Caius Flaminius, the victims were named Kuo Mui and Zhi Mui.
Redleg and Roadkill duelled in Dragon style on day 2. When Redleg died with GH on night 3, their deaths were reported as those of Ma Mui and Tang Shui. Roadkill's death on night 4 was reported as that of Lo Mui.
I duelled in Crane style on day 3, and again on day 5, while Omanes duelled in Dragon style on day 5. The deaths of myself, Omanes and Stig were reported as Hsieh Mui, Wang Fujian and Hsu Fujian.
Then compare with Crazed Rabbit, who was named Lao Zhi. Look at the prepronderance of evidence, and set it against Rabbit's reputation for honesty. Now let's consider that he might not have said a single falsehood as long as he was still alive.
Lynch Orb and Sigurd and look at their names. If they're like the rest of the town, including those who've claimed roles, they should be surnamed Mui (Dragon) as they're thrown off the cliff. Let's see what story they give in the meantime to explain why this isn't going to be so.
Omanes didn't have a special name.
Therefore, either:
a) CR was guilty
or b) Omanes was lieing about having a role.
Lynch Orb :yes:
I don't believe the vigilante theory is correct.
The mafia have been killing on several nights getting lot's of gold.
I beleive they bought the crossbow from the shop and got an extra kill.
It is evident that our watchers only noticed half of the nightly activites going on.
My bet is that the mafia took the opertunity to buy it this night, since the watchers were obviously incapacitated.
If we are following this logic we are dealing with at least 3 mafia.
Pannonian claimed there are 4 mafia in this game. Something about it being in his PM.
As I see it Pann and Omanes are in the clear and spoke the truth.
That leaves me, Orb and Faust?
I know I am innocent but I can't vouch for Orb nor Faust.
We are however missing 3 mafia and we are down to 11 players.
I guess we have time to question them all.
BTW my ingame name is: Kao Mui
We the townies knows that:
Mui = Dragon style
Fujian = White Crane style
Shui = Praying Mantis style
pevergreen
05-23-2007, 10:25
I will not consider Omanes innocent unless he can tell me what i bought from the shop.
The mafia have been killing on several nights getting lot's of gold.
I beleive they bought the crossbow from the shop and got an extra kill.Good point - I forgot about that.
It is evident that our watchers only noticed half of the nightly activites going on.
My bet is that the mafia took the opertunity to buy it this night, since the watchers were obviously incapacitated.
iirc Omanes and Pannonian claimed that losing a duel wouldn't affect the results of their night actions
I will not consider Omanes innocent unless he can tell me what i bought from the shop.
He cannot, since that would break the rules...
So, we have:
- Mui = Dragon style
- Fujian = White Crane style
- Shui = Praying Mantis style
Pannonian : Crane
Omanes : Dragon
Apparantly there was one vigilante kill. If only we knew who the vigilante was and why he killed Hsu Fujian (which is not a "special name"). And when he's at it, maybe he can tell us which player was Hsu Fujian: Stig or Pannonian?
As a consequence, this means Omanes was not killed by the vigilante, and thus Omanes was innocent.
Another possibility is that Hsu Fujian was the vigilante and his (mafia) opponent was able to defend against the attack or to use his own weapon as well.
pevergreen
05-23-2007, 10:46
*Hides because he keeps forgetting who is alive and who isnt*
@Andres - I'm inclined to buy Sigurd's explanation that the 'vigilante' was simply a mafia who brought a weapon (and was free to do so by the reveal of the shop watcher, Omanes)
@Andres - I'm inclined to buy Sigurd's explanation that the 'vigilante' was simply a mafia who brought a weapon (and was free to do so by the reveal of the shop watcher, Omanes)
I'm not.
Night 3 : one kill with an arrow
Night 4 : one kill with an arrow
Night 5 : one kill with an arrow
Last night: one kill with Kung Fu, one kill with poison, one (and only one) kill with an arrow.
Seems like the mafia has been buying crossbows rather frequently or they had a crossbow at the start of the game and an infinite supply of arrows.
On night 4 there was only one kill.
Four players where incapacitated that night: Pannonian, Ichigo, pevergreen and Kommodus.
Maybe we need to take a closer look at Ichigo, pevergreen and Kommodus.
Both Ichigo and Kommodus have been acting differently this game.
I have suspicions about pever, as I've mentioned before...
If we assume we were extremely lucky on night 4 (and I don't see why the mafia would perform only 1 kill mid-game) and we incapacitated 3 of the 4 (according to Pannonian) mafiosi, this means pever, Ichigo and Kommodus are the three remaining mafiosi...
Why else would they restrict themselves to one kill mid-game if it wasn't because they weren't able to perform more than one?
I'm not.
Night 3 : one kill with an arrow
Night 4 : one kill with an arrow
Night 5 : one kill with an arrow
Last night: one kill with Kung Fu, one kill with poison, one (and only one) kill with an arrow.
Actually Andres... the earlier writeups spoke of a monk nocking an arrow to a bow. The last kill (Pannonian) spoke of a crossbow bolt.
It is also the extra kill for last night.
In the shop there was a crossbow + 1 bolt for 80 gold. My bet is that the mafia wanted to make up for the failed kill the previous night and bought the extra kill.
The shop doesn't list bolts as a buyable item and I think they have to buy another crossbow + bolt to repeat the deed.
We can agree that the mafia can kill using either a sword, a bow, Kung Fu and possibly poison (I could be wrong about poison) without buying stuff from the shop.
They are however limited to two kill attempts a night using these 'vanilla' methods. It was stated however that mafia or towns people could buy stuff and use it during a night. The mafia would get an extra chance at killing someone and a towns person could become a vigilante.
Two cenarios arise from this, either a towns person bought the crossbow or the mafia did.
I think however that a towns person wouldn't afford it at this time.
Money should not be a problem for the mafia as long as they kill the non active players. Every player gets 5 gold every night and if they are not spent... it is litterally a goldmine.
Well, two possibilities: three kills performed by the mafia, or two mafia kills + 1 vigilante who probably screwed up or got counter-attacked.
Anyway, that doesn't take away the fact that Pannonian, Ichigo, pevergreen and Kommodus got incapacitated preceding the night where we had only one kill.
This means imo that 3 of these 4 people are mafia. With Pannonian as innocent, that leaves us with Ichigo, pever and Kommodus. One of these three seems like the lynch for today.
If we assume we were extremely lucky on night 4 (and I don't see why the mafia would perform only 1 kill mid-game) and we incapacitated 3 of the 4 (according to Pannonian) mafiosi, this means pever, Ichigo and Kommodus are the three remaining mafiosi...
Why else would they restrict themselves to one kill mid-game if it wasn't because they weren't able to perform more than one?
I have to ask... were any of the remaining players joined in a protection group on night 4?
If there were as Pannonian claimed 4 mafiosi what Andres suggest is incredible. Why would the mafia agree to being blocked...
It also reveals another thing... Did you all notice that they used Kung Fu on Omanes? After he revealed that he had a 4? ...
The mafia have weak Kung Fu...
We are the shaolin munks and should be better than any upsurper thinking he knows the art of Kung Fu.
This is why I was after Orb earlier... it is obvious that the mafia goes for the weak when using Kung Fu to kill.
If my assumptions are correct Orb, myself and possibly The_Stranger are innocent masters.
pever claimed a score of 15 earlier... he should be up at around 20 by now if he is the mafia killer.
'Well, two possibilities: three kills performed by the mafia, or two mafia kills + 1 vigilante who probably screwed up or got counter-attacked.
Anyway, that doesn't take away the fact that Pannonian, Ichigo, pevergreen and Kommodus got incapacitated preceding the night where we had only one kill.
This means imo that 3 of these 4 people are mafia. With Pannonian as innocent, that leaves us with Ichigo, pever and Kommodus. One of these three seems like the lynch for today.'
There is the possibility (though I'm not optimistic on this, considering that BA, at least, was innocent [bought a prayer book]) that we might have lynched one (or even two) of them before that, so only one/two would be guilty.
I am suspicious of Kommodus particularly, myself, but he has done nothing *really* odd yet.
I honestly can't find a defence for myself, if someone wants to question the kills done, for all three of those who bit the proverbial dust tonight were gunning for me. Calling it a frame would be a little old, but it could be. I suspect our Mafia are lurking in the shadows.
'I have to ask... were any of the remaining players joined in a protection group on night 4?'
I guess yes, but I suspect anyone who ever formed a protection group is dead now, considering Pann's earlier information, and that neither Omanes nor Pann were protected last night, so we won't know.
'If there were as Pannonian claimed 4 mafiosi what Andres suggest is incredible. Why would the mafia agree to being blocked...'
To clear their names? There was a draw there, IIRC, which would clear both participants, as they would only want one knocked out and would know each other's Kung Fu if they were mafia.
'It also reveals another thing... Did you all notice that they used Kung Fu on Omanes? After he revealed that he had a 4? ...'
Could be that they simply don't want to reveal their Kung Fu power. Hitting a high Kung Fu target with Kung Fu would instantly place any openly skilled mafioso under suspicion.
'The mafia have weak Kung Fu...
We are the shaolin munks and should be better than any upsurper thinking he knows the art of Kung Fu.'
I think Sasaki stated earlier that the Kung Fu values were all randomly determined and disregard role.
'This is why I was after Orb earlier... it is obvious that the mafia goes for the weak when using Kung Fu to kill.'
I'm not exactly weak :)
'If my assumptions are correct Orb, myself and possibly The_Stranger are innocent masters.'
I think I agree there. TS has been away (though the third kill only happened after his return) for a while.
I suggest for this day:
Lynch:
pevergreen
Challenges:
Sigurd vs Kommodus
Orb or TheStranger vs. Ichigo
Kommodus
05-23-2007, 15:25
I believe Pannonian was indeed killed by a vigilante, for two reasons. First, as stated before, it was done with a crossbow. Second, the description contained the following exchange.
Hsu Fujian spun around to see a familiar face, 'You?'
'You?'
'You're the murderer!'
'You're the murderer!'
This suggests that the person who killed Pannonian did, in fact, believe him to be guilty. (Of course, it may have simply been placed there to confuse.) Obviously, the killer may or may not have been correct. Also, it's more likely that it was a townie who bought a crossbow than an actual vigilante role.
This late in the game, I'd suggest that Pannonian's killer step forward and identify himself. I can't think of any harm that can come of it.
Pannonian is wrong about Crazed Rabbit - there's no way CR would throw away his stainless rep after already having been lynched. Also, I had dealings with CR early on that suggested he did, in fact, have a unique role - but not mafia. He was in a protection group with GH and I, and at one point he offered to train GH, who had told us his score was 9. Since the game had just started and Sasaki had assigned scores of 1-10, I asked how this was possible - CR couldn't possibly have twice the score of GH's. CR responded this way:
My training is not of the usual kind. I don't think GH needs to tell Sasaki he's going to be trained, I just need to tell Sasaki who I'm going to train. I am double checking with Sasaki on the particulars, though.
So the assumption that CR is mafia simply because he has a different name is simply not true.
Pannonian sent me a PM during the night detailing his analysis of the names of dead players. He urged me to lynch Orb this round. The way in which Orb went after Omanes (now a confirmed innocent) makes be inclined to follow this advice. However, Pannonian's faulty logic gives me pause. He could simply be mistaken, but in my experience, using faulty logic can be a mafia tell. Still, I have a hard time believing he'd go after CR like this if he were guilty - that's simply a dangerous strategy for the mafia.
For now, therefore, I will:
Vote: Orb
Kommodus
05-23-2007, 15:37
Couple quick addendums:
1. I doubt the mafia would be given special names simply because they are mafia. That would make things too obvious, I think - if they ever tried to participate in a protection group or train someone else, they'd be exposed too quickly.
2. I'm also suspicious of Orb since he clobbered Pannonian earlier (independent of his style advantage). He said he only trained on one night and has no special role, yet he has a very high rating? We know the mafia have been killing people using Kung Fu, boosing their ratings. We can't verify any of Orb's night activities (how convenient).
3. Sigurd's claim that the mafia are weak is, as others have pointed out, not true. Sasaki explicitly stated that everyone started out with a random rating. Since several mafia kills have used Kung Fu (giving them a +2 bonus each time), I suspect they are, on average, stronger than the rest of us by now.
3. Sigurd's claim that the mafia are weak is, as others have pointed out, not true. Sasaki explicitly stated that everyone started out with a random rating. Since several mafia kills have used Kung Fu (giving them a +2 bonus each time), I suspect they are, on average, stronger than the rest of us by now.
They started with weak scores or better: some of them started with weaker scores...
The Kung Fu kills were performed by the powerfull one(s), probably pevergreen.
The other kills by the less powerfull ones: Kommodus and Ichigo
Challenge: Kommodus
So how do you explain a townie getting enough gold for this crossbow (80, considering that any individual townie, by not spending anything, could only have (if we're on day 6, as I think) a maximum of 50 gold? and how do we know that it was Pannonian, and not Stig, who was killed by it?
I just checked the information summary thread, and the draw was Ichigo vs. Pannonian, which doesn't definitely clear Ichigo, since Pann is probably innocent. However, I doubt that Ichigo would accept a challenge if he were mafia and two of his buddies' night actions were threatened.
but I doubt he'd have risked his night action if he knew that two others were under threat. So that leaves KOMMODUS and PEVERGREEN
'2. I'm also suspicious of Orb since he clobbered Pannonian earlier (independent of his style advantage). He said he only trained on one night and has no special role, yet he has a very high rating? We know the mafia have been killing people using Kung Fu, boosing their ratings. We can't verify any of Orb's night activities (how convenient).'
'I doubt the mafia would be given special names simply because they are mafia. That would make things too obvious, I think - if they ever tried to participate in a protection group or train someone else, they'd be exposed too quickly.'
Which is exactly why I think CR was innocent, despite Pann's claims.
I started out with KF 9, I then won 3 duels, which gives a substantial increase to my Kung Fu score. I have also bought lessons from the master every, single day, which Pannonian could not do, because he couldn't possess any gold (according to him). That gives me a total of at least 12 points that Pannonian couldn't have had. Assuming that his starting score was lowish, he would be *utterly* trounced.
Pannonian's reasoning is simply faulty here. If he wanted to accuse me by saying 'all those voting for Orb are dead. He must be guilty!' I would have to defend against that. Currently he's saying that 'CR had an odd name! As I believe Ifirst pointed out. Thus we should lynch Orb and Sigurd and see if they have odd names too!'
He's also saying that Me, Sigurd and CR are in league together, which is completely ridiculous.
'This late in the game, I'd suggest that Pannonian's killer step forward and identify himself. I can't think of any harm that can come of it.'
Vigilante gets lynched. Mafia get another turn.
I have also bought lessons from the master every, single day
Don't they cost 10 gold each? Where did you get the money from?
Kommodus
05-23-2007, 15:59
They started with weak scores or better: some of them started with weaker scores...
The Kung Fu kills were performed by the powerfull one(s), probably pevergreen.
The other kills by the less powerfull ones: Kommodus and Ichigo
That's why I said they are probably stronger than the rest of us on average. They aren't all necessarily stronger, but some of them are.
My rating is still rather low - I think it's up to 6 now since I asked Stig to train me last night and he said he would (though I never got any sort of confirmation from Sasaki). If the town is suspicious of me and Ichigo, perhaps it would be best to immobilize the two of us for the night - I myself am still suspicious of Ichigo and would like to see the mafia slowed down a bit.
EDIT: I just realized Stig's training of me may have failed, since he was killed.
Don't they cost 10 gold each? Where did you get the money from?
Starting gold (20). Gold per day (30 total). Blackaxe, who left his estates (20) and prayer book to me after he was lynched.
I myself am still suspicious of Ichigo and would like to see the mafia slowed down a bit.
EDIT: I just realized Stig's training of me may have failed, since he was killed.
Oh, before I forget: why are you evading/ignoring questions about 'holmes' ? And don't tell me you haven't been home for the whole duration of this game until now.
And why are you suspicious of Ichigo?
Kommodus
05-23-2007, 16:20
So how do you explain a townie getting enough gold for this crossbow (80, considering that any individual townie, by not spending anything, could only have (if we're on day 6, as I think) a maximum of 50 gold? and how do we know that it was Pannonian, and not Stig, who was killed by it?
Townies can pool their money to buy the more expensive items.
Of course, my theory (which is that a townie bought a crossbow and killed Pannonian) is not necessarily correct. If it is correct, I ask the individual(s) responsible to please identify themselves. If it's not, this request is withdrawn: a role-based vigilante should remain hidden, and a mafioso who bought a crossbow for this purpose would of course not say anything.
I will concede that you've adequately answered my concerns about your high Kung Fu rating. Your victories in duels alone would certainly have given you a large advantage over Pannonian.
However, my vote against you stands, simply because of the way in which you have attacked innocent players (and continue to do so).
Oh, before I forget: why are you evading/ignoring questions about 'holmes' ? And don't tell me you haven't been home for the whole duration of this game until now.
And why are you suspicious of Ichigo?
I'm suspicious of Ichigo for the following reasons:
1. The same reason you are; that is, there was only one kill on the night he was blocked.
2. He didn't respond to CR's initial request to join a protection group on night 1. He's explained this to some extent, but I still find it a bit odd that he didn't respond at all.
Regarding Holmes, it's been a combination of laziness and busyness on my end. As I said earlier, I've been significantly occupied by some personal matters which are vastly more important than mafia. I have a little time now but I can't guarantee it will last. I'll do my best - that's all I can promise.
The Stranger
05-23-2007, 16:32
allright :
unchallenge: Challenge: Ichigo
i already beat him once :P
I'd prefer Sigurd to fight Kommodus because I trust him more then I do Orb.
When are you guys going to vote pevergreen?
'However, my vote against you stands, simply because of the way in which you have attacked innocent players (and continue to do so).'
Who hasn't attacked innocent players? My reasoning was valid (You yourself have said that Omanes put up an awful defence). Attacking innocent players is a way to get them to defend themselves, and allow people to judge by the defence whether or not they are actually innocent.
Omanes put up a very weak defence, while Warluster had not been Wogged (and reappeared) under *very* suspicious circumstances. Noone gave a convincing argument why he shouldn't be lynched. Pannonian argued that he could be blocked and I could be lynched instead (whereas he seemed to skip over the fact that Sigurd could block me instead, and we could still string up the lurker). How about Blackaxe, whom the town threw off the cliff for buying a damn prayer book? (I can hand this to you, if you want it)
'I'm suspicious of Ichigo for the following reasons:
1. The same reason you are; that is, there was only one kill on the night he was blocked.'
Who else was blocked on that night? Let me think... Pevergreen and Kommodus.
Where is Twilightblade? Lurking too?
I'll beat Kommodus as convincingly as Sigurd would, but if you want that...
Unchallenge, challenge: Pevergreen
Vote: TwilightBlade A good response from him will merit an unvote.
The Stranger
05-23-2007, 16:48
:O why does everybody get a raise from a challenge... I DID NOT A RAISE, atleast not a 4 point raise... a 2 point raise atmost... but i doubt that...
I'm suspicious of Ichigo for the following reasons:
1. The same reason you are; that is, there was only one kill on the night he was blocked.
2. He didn't respond to CR's initial request to join a protection group on night 1. He's explained this to some extent, but I still find it a bit odd that he didn't respond at all.
1. why only Ichigo and not pevergreen (and yourself, but I assume you don't think about yourself as being suspicious)? One out of four mafiosi incapacitated doesn't hold them from performing two kills during the night. Why would they perform only one kill if not three out of four where incapacitated?
2. I cannot ordeal about that since I wasn't allowed to work behind the scenes this game (got killed night 1)
2 points bonus from winning a challenge. I happen to have won 4 challenges now, so I have a +8 bonus to my Kung Fu.
Unchallenge, challenge: Pevergreen
No more free training for you nor pevergreen, you're both powerfull enough.
Lynch pevergreen. I prefer a dead mafioso over an incapacitated one anyway.
Lynch Orb, Sigurd and Faust you idiots!!! :furious3:
The three are working together, and are active, as the mafia should be.
So, Andres, why do you want to lynch pevergreen and not Ichigo or Kommodus?
Stig, Sigurd and I are quite obviously not mafia working together. Mafiosi don't try to lynch other mafiosi because of unclear rules points.
The Stranger
05-23-2007, 17:03
ORB
Oke, i shut up... i think i did got my 2 p raise eventually...
Sorry Sasaki :P dont WOG me!!
The Stranger
05-23-2007, 17:07
im lost with this game... i have no ties, no connections, no leads and no partners...
who should i vote for?
VOTE SASAKI!!!
Kommodus
05-23-2007, 17:25
Who hasn't attacked innocent players? My reasoning was valid (You yourself have said that Omanes put up an awful defence). Attacking innocent players is a way to get them to defend themselves, and allow people to judge by the defence whether or not they are actually innocent.
True... heck, I've gone after more innocent players in this game than I care to admit (Tran and BlackAxe were both probably innocent). :shame: Still... I dunno, there was something about the way you went after Omanes that twigged me. I'll reread when I have a chance (don't worry, it'll be before Sasaki returns) and re-evaluate.
1. why only Ichigo and not pevergreen (and yourself, but I assume you don't think about yourself as being suspicious)? One out of four mafiosi incapacitated doesn't hold them from performing two kills during the night. Why would they perform only one kill if not three out of four where incapacitated?
I'm less suspicious of pevergreen because AFAIK there's nothing else against him besides the fact that he was incapacitated that night. I'm not yet ready to conclude along with you that there were three mafiosi among the four blocked players that night - there are other potential explanations for the single kill, and we'd have to be extremely lucky to incapacitate three. It's more likely that we have (or had) a doctor or role-blocker among us.
seireikhaan
05-23-2007, 20:38
Pannonian is wrong about Crazed Rabbit - there's no way CR would throw away his stainless rep after already having been lynched. Also, I had dealings with CR early on that suggested he did, in fact, have a unique role - but not mafia. He was in a protection group with GH and I, and at one point he offered to train GH, who had told us his score was 9. Since the game had just started and Sasaki had assigned scores of 1-10, I asked how this was possible - CR couldn't possibly have twice the score of GH's. CR responded this way:
So the assumption that CR is mafia simply because he has a different name is simply not true.
That's interesting regarding rabbit. It seemed odd that he would get a different name. Looks to me like CR was the 'master' of the temple, perhaps. I had been wondering a little bit if perhaps Sasaki gave rabbit a different name just to mess with us.
Anyways, my strongest suspicions are of The Stranger. You're trying a little too hard to act as though you're lost, imo. You're pulling a very similar stunt to what Warluster did. How convenient of an excuse, after all, of why Pann wouldn't have ever been able to see you train? You went inactive for a while to give an excuse as to why you wouldn't be spotted training, when, in reality, you've been up to scummy activities for the last few nights. Plus it keeps the attention off of you.
Vote: The Stranger. Also, FoS on Orb, you're next on my list.
Interesting points, GK, but I don't agree with you. This is how TS operates normally. He'd done enough to survive the WoGs rightly. Warluster hadn't.
That's interesting regarding rabbit. It seemed odd that he would get a different name. Looks to me like CR was the 'master' of the temple, perhaps. I had been wondering a little bit if perhaps Sasaki gave rabbit a different name just to mess with us.
Anyways, my strongest suspicions are of The Stranger. You're trying a little too hard to act as though you're lost, imo. You're pulling a very similar stunt to what Warluster did. How convenient of an excuse, after all, of why Pann wouldn't have ever been able to see you train? You went inactive for a while to give an excuse as to why you wouldn't be spotted training, when, in reality, you've been up to scummy activities for the last few nights. Plus it keeps the attention off of you.
Vote: The Stranger. Also, FoS on Orb, you're next on my list.
TS was also playing in Stig's latest mini mafia. There he announced he would be off line for a couple of days since he went to France. He hasn't been posting in that period, so I'm pretty sure his claim is genuine.
seireikhaan
05-24-2007, 01:29
TS was also playing in Stig's latest mini mafia. There he announced he would be off line for a couple of days since he went to France. He hasn't been posting in that period, so I'm pretty sure his claim is genuine.
Alright, unvote: The Stranger. You've both given him alibis, so I don't really have much for a case against him anymore. I would appreciate a little less spam, though.
I'm going to withhold my vote for a day or two to see what happens with discussion. Right now my vote is with Orb, but I'll wait to see if anything comes up that might change my mind. He's been acting suspicious for most of the game, especially the way he went after Omanes. The only thing gnawing at the back of my mind is that a mafioso would surely have tried being a little less obtuse about their posting style.
pevergreen
05-24-2007, 01:41
havent read the last 15 posts or so no time. I am not mafia. Im trying to build up a rep like CR has or had.
TevashSzat
05-24-2007, 03:33
Hmm....Lots of accusations here, but I will not vote for anyone accused yet. I will however Vote: ByzantineKnight. He has not been posting much at all yet he has not been woged suggesting that he may have a role.
Omanes Alexandrapolites
05-24-2007, 07:31
Yes, some old very early on suspicions about him regarding his "shop-requests" are yet to be cleared. He has neither issued a statement, not has he said anything to defend himself.
The evidence mostly lies here (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?p=1526170#post1526170) - posted by Redleg, confirmed innocent due to his death.
In the shop there was a crossbow + 1 bolt for 80 gold. My bet is that the mafia wanted to make up for the failed kill the previous night and bought the extra kill.
The shop doesn't list bolts as a buyable item and I think they have to buy another crossbow + bolt to repeat the deed.
We can agree that the mafia can kill using either a sword, a bow, Kung Fu and possibly poison (I could be wrong about poison) without buying stuff from the shop.
They are however limited to two kill attempts a night using these 'vanilla' methods. It was stated however that mafia or towns people could buy stuff and use it during a night. The mafia would get an extra chance at killing someone and a towns person could become a vigilante.No townie has ever suggested that the kill failed (because of a role blocker, item or anything else), and yet you state that it did with such certainty....
My bet is on Sigurd and Orb with either pever, faust or byz as the last mafia.
Twilightblade
05-24-2007, 08:57
Its a sound theroy but if your wrong and we spend the next 3 or 4 day phases lynching them and the mafia get two kills a night there will be no town/temple left
Im withholding my vote until I see more evidence
No townie has ever suggested that the kill failed (because of a role blocker, item or anything else), and yet you state that it did with such certainty....
My bet is on Sigurd and Orb with either pever, faust or byz as the last mafia.
Don't read in too much of how I said it... The goal for any mafia is to get rid of as many as they can in the shortest time possible.
I don't think any mafia has succeeded using the strategy of withholding a kill to fool the town. Hence my statement that is was a failed kill. Whether it was a blocked Mafioso or a protection of a townie matters little. The fact is the mafia lost a kill that night and it is a costly matter.
Most hosts narrate such a failure - what makes you think that this time is any different?
Twilightblade
05-24-2007, 10:15
It could be that the Mafia didnt send in orders on time
There's 4 of them :inquisitive:
pevergreen
05-24-2007, 10:26
Mafia are active, TB, if they are not, their partners send stuff in.
Twilightblade
05-24-2007, 10:29
Its just another possibility, all Im doing is throwing ideas around
Most hosts narrate such a failure - what makes you think that this time is any different?
Oh, I have been mafia in two previous games hosted by Sasaki. He never narrated faulty kills.
All quiet on the western front?
All quiet on the western front?
Good book
Pannonian
05-25-2007, 02:15
Orb (1) - Kommodus
Twilightblade (2) - Orb, Ichigo
ByzantineKnight (1) - Xdeathfire
The Stranger v Ichigo
Orb v pevergreen
4 votes from 11 players still alive. Poor show.
TevashSzat
05-25-2007, 02:25
I would also like to Challenge: ByzantineKnight
Orb (1) - Kommodus
Twilightblade (2) - Orb, Ichigo
ByzantineKnight (1) - Xdeathfire
The Stranger v Ichigo
Orb v pevergreen
Xdeathfire v ByzantineKnight
pevergreen
05-25-2007, 05:24
Why BZK? Challange Xdeathfire as retaliation.
Vote: Orb
Best lynch at this point.
I think I can very well vouch for BZK
Why BZK? Challange Xdeathfire as retaliation.
Vote: Orb
Best lynch at this point.
hmmm... A little afraid to be blocked this night?
@Stig: why can you vouch for BZK?
No answer to my question regarding someone being protected night 4...
Seeing the names of the people we lynhced only CR stand out.
If it is correct as we think, that the mafia might have other last names, there are still 4 mafia among us.
[If CR has not forsaken his integrity].
How can we foil the mafia?
We have 3 known Kung Fu Masters [Orb, myself and The Stranger(in that order)] with one coming up [Pever].
The mafia's chances of winning would have been greater if they have taken us out instead of Omanes or Pannonian.
We need to block as many of them as we can this night... that is what we need to discuss in addition of removing one of them through this lynch.
Pannonian
05-25-2007, 10:59
hmmm... A little afraid to be blocked this night?
@Stig: why can you vouch for BZK?
No answer to my question regarding someone being protected night 4...
Seeing the names of the people we lynhced only CR stand out.
If it is correct as we think, that the mafia might have other last names, there are still 4 mafia among us.
[If CR has not forsaken his integrity].
How can we foil the mafia?
We have 3 known Kung Fu Masters [Orb, myself and The Stranger(in that order)] with one coming up [Pever].
The mafia's chances of winning would have been greater if they have taken us out instead of Omanes or Pannonian.
We need to block as many of them as we can this night... that is what we need to discuss in addition of removing one of them through this lynch.
What a wonderfully confusing mixture of premises. First you accept that mafia may have different names, then you say that the only player so far with a different name must be innocent, and therefore there are still 4 mafia remaining.
Not only do you have that contradictory jumble of reasoning and conclusions, you then place emphasis upon emphasis on your towniness - as with Orb, you are hoping to convince people you are innocent by constantly repeating that claim. Nowhere else do we see this "anyone but me" approach.
People, lynch Orb today, then Sigurd tomorrow. Get your votes in, as Sasaki has promised to lynch whoever has the most votes when he returns.
Orb (2) - Kommodus, pevergreen
Twilightblade (2) - Orb, Ichigo
ByzantineKnight (1) - Xdeathfire
Not voted (6) - Faust, greaterkhaan, ByzantineKnight, Sigurd, Twilightblade, The Stranger
The Stranger v Ichigo
Orb v pevergreen
Xdeathfire v ByzantineKnight
pevergreen v Xdeathfire
What a wonderfully confusing mixture of premises. First you accept that mafia may have different names, then you say that the only player so far with a different name must be innocent, and therefore there are still 4 mafia remaining.
Not only do you have that contradictory jumble of reasoning and conclusions, you then place emphasis upon emphasis on your towniness - as with Orb, you are hoping to convince people you are innocent by constantly repeating that claim. Nowhere else do we see this "anyone but me" approach.
This is a stretch Pann... I am perfectly sound in my reasoning.
I take it you believe CR has forsaken his perfect reputation of being honest?
I am however a little reluctant towards such a conclusion.
It is you who claimed that there were 4 mafiosi in this game. Do you stand by this claim?
It would be a seriously unbalanced game if there were 4 mafiosi and not 4 pro town roles.
If we believe you and Omanes were pro town we should be at leastl 2 short. And watching the shop and the training grounds strikes me as being rather weak roles. There is just no way you can identify which players are pro town and which players are not... Even better: You guys only saw a little fraction of what went on.
Considering the Kung Fu scores being handed out randomly, it strikes me as another unbalanced feature. What if the 4 mafiosi got all the top fighters? This game would be impossible.
There is something buried here and I am not in on it.
(I don't need to vote yet as there is a tie)
pevergreen
05-25-2007, 11:41
Twilightblade is innocent guys. Dont question that.
Why not? He's been suspiciously lurkery, and he hasn't even bothered to post a defence after my vote in his general direction.
So, what argument do you have for proving his innocence?
TevashSzat
05-25-2007, 12:44
pevergreen, why are you and stig vouching for bzk? Do you have any proof of his innocence. For me, all I have noticed is that he has been lurking for basically the whole game but still has not been wogged meaning either he is a pro town role or mafia. If he is pro town, by all means speak up and help us, but seeing how he is not, one can only assume he is mafia.
Personally, I think that pevergreen, stig, bzk, and maybe twilightblade may be the mafias in this game given pever and stig's rush to vouch for other people without any adequete evidence.
pevergreen, why are you and stig vouching for bzk? Do you have any proof of his innocence. For me, all I have noticed is that he has been lurking for basically the whole game but still has not been wogged meaning either he is a pro town role or mafia. If he is pro town, by all means speak up and help us, but seeing how he is not, one can only assume he is mafia.
Personally, I think that pevergreen, stig, bzk, and maybe twilightblade may be the mafias in this game given pever and stig's rush to vouch for other people without any adequete evidence.
BZK has 28 posts in this thread thus far. You have 20.
If "he is lurking" is your motivation for voting, you should better vote yourself.
Ok, I'm going to
Vote: Twilight Blade
pevergreen's "defense" of him is basically nothing but, "trust me guys". That defense cannot be allowed to fly at this point, that is certain. Why can't Twilight Blade defend himself?
and @ pevergreen: I'm not going to buy this:
"havent read the last 15 posts or so no time. I am not mafia. Im trying to build up a rep like CR has or had"
I'd also like to hear from BZK, although right now he has no incentive to do so.
The Stranger
05-25-2007, 16:17
Pever: You should build a rep like mine!!
How much to vote?
Right so our 3 mafia have voted for Twilight
Right so our 3 mafia have voted for Twilight
What are your thoughts on Kommodus?
And why can you vouch for BZK?
Kommodus is clean, as I know his name (and Pann didn't tell him about the names).
BZK is mostlikely innocent as he came to me round 2 asking to form a protection group
BZK is mostlikely innocent as he came to me round 2 asking to form a protection group
That's not cleaning his name. IIRC (it's been a while), BZK joined protection groups in CDTC as well (where he was a member of the Tataglia family).
Stig, as much as this sounds like a mafia dodge, those posts are violating the no discussion of PMs by the dead rule.
I don't believe that asking to form a protection group categorically clears someone of guilt, either...
And more noticeably, how does not having a silly name make you innocent?
This is a completely ridiculous argument. Sasaki has said that someone's innocence or guilt will not be revealed by the write-up, so it seems implausible that he would just give the mafia condemning names.
Pannonian
05-25-2007, 17:15
Dead may not pm, may not discuss anything they ever pm’d or were pm’d, may not discuss night actions in any way.
If the material is not in the public thread (find the specific post to be sure), do not discuss it.
Pannonian
05-25-2007, 17:25
Ok, I'm going to
Vote: Twilight Blade
pevergreen's "defense" of him is basically nothing but, "trust me guys". That defense cannot be allowed to fly at this point, that is certain. Why can't Twilight Blade defend himself?
and @ pevergreen: I'm not going to buy this:
"havent read the last 15 posts or so no time. I am not mafia. Im trying to build up a rep like CR has or had"
I'd also like to hear from BZK, although right now he has no incentive to do so.
Orb and Faust have voted for TB, now Sigurd is going to hold his fire until Orb is tied once more and Sasaki's return is close. THEN he'll cast his vote for TB.
Orb (2) - Kommodus, pevergreen
Twilightblade (3) - Orb, Ichigo, Faust
ByzantineKnight (1) - Xdeathfire
Not voted (5) - greaterkhaan, ByzantineKnight, Sigurd, Twilightblade, The Stranger
The Stranger v Ichigo
Orb v pevergreen
Xdeathfire v ByzantineKnight
pevergreen v Xdeathfire
Orb and Faust have voted for TB, now Sigurd is going to hold his fire until Orb is tied once more and Sasaki's return is close. THEN he'll cast his vote for TB.
Yeah right...
vote: Orb
Orb 3 (Kommodus, pevergreen, Sigurd)
Twilightblade 3 (Orb, Ichigo, Faust)
ByzantineKnight 1 (Xdeathfire)
Not voted 4 (greaterkhaan, ByzantineKnight, Twilightblade, The Stranger)
Challenge: Faust
The Stranger vs. Ichigo
Orb vs pevergreen
Xdeathfire vs. ByzantineKnight
pevergreen vs. Xdeathfire
Sigurd vs. Faust
Orb and Faust have voted for TB, now Sigurd is going to hold his fire until Orb is tied once more and Sasaki's return is close. THEN he'll cast his vote for TB.
Orb (2) - Kommodus, pevergreen
Twilightblade (3) - Orb, Ichigo, Faust
ByzantineKnight (1) - Xdeathfire
Not voted (5) - greaterkhaan, ByzantineKnight, Sigurd, Twilightblade, The Stranger
The Stranger v Ichigo
Orb v pevergreen
Xdeathfire v ByzantineKnight
pevergreen v Xdeathfire
I still don't understand where you got the idea that Sigurd and I are working together from.
Enlighten me.
Yeah right...
vote: Orb
Oh, now we are convinced, because we all know it takes ages to unvote and vote TB...
:inquisitive:
Orb and Faust have voted for TB, now Sigurd is going to hold his fire until Orb is tied once more and Sasaki's return is close. THEN he'll cast his vote for TB.
Orb (2) - Kommodus, pevergreen
Twilightblade (3) - Orb, Ichigo, Faust
ByzantineKnight (1) - Xdeathfire
Not voted (5) - greaterkhaan, ByzantineKnight, Sigurd, Twilightblade, The Stranger
The Stranger v Ichigo
Orb v pevergreen
Xdeathfire v ByzantineKnight
pevergreen v Xdeathfire
My vote is by no means set in stone. It is obviously a pressure vote... and now it's less effective since you've made me put it so plainly (again... exactly as you did in GH VI :furious3: ) I'm not going to withdraw it because of your statement though. So are you allergic to aggressiveness? But look at this:
"4 votes from 11 players still alive. Poor show." - Pannonian
Obviously there's no pleasing you except to do exactly as you suggest.
Crazed Rabbit
05-25-2007, 18:01
For what it's worth, if I were alive, I'd vote Orb. Probably a good idea to stack up a good majority of votes on him so no one can switch at the last minute.
CR
Omanes Alexandrapolites
05-25-2007, 18:26
Regarding suspitions over CR - perhaps names change when somebody learns a new form of Kung Fu. I believe that one's starting name is based upon their almighty, or in my case pathetic, Kung Fu style.
Pannonian
05-25-2007, 18:37
Regarding suspitions over CR - perhaps names change when somebody learns a new form of Kung Fu. I believe that one's starting name is based upon their almighty, or in my case pathetic, Kung Fu style.
Speculation, but perhaps Rabbit is the only one who can answer that.
Omanes Alexandrapolites
05-25-2007, 18:53
Speculation, but perhaps Rabbit is the only one who can answer that.That's a very valid point - if that was the case, then may I ask him why has he not said that in his defence previously?
BECAUSE YOU LYNCHED HIM!!!
And because we only found out the odd name *after* his death.
Now, if Twilightblade himself can put up any half-decent defence, I'm happy to unvote him. But Pevergreen is just saying 'he's innocent. trust me'
perhaps names change when somebody learns a new form of Kung Fu.
This is not so...
Omanes Alexandrapolites
05-25-2007, 21:12
Ok then, that's that hypothesis rendered useless. Although, thinking about it, perhaps some "special" players start with the ability to perform two styles of Kung Fu - maybe Rabbit had a special role?
Crazed Rabbit
05-25-2007, 21:46
Being dead, I can't talk about my name.
When the game's over, you'll find out.
It's not really important.
CR
pevergreen
05-26-2007, 01:01
This is not so...
Thats true, i would know.
Me, Twilightblade and Killfr3nzy did a protection group night 2.
I have been asked by BZK and The Stranger to set up groups, but nothing has happened...
TevashSzat
05-26-2007, 12:58
So thats your proof that twilight and bzk are innocent. Since you want to lync orb so badly, would you accept his innocence if he just randomly came to you for a protection group?
Also, someone earlier said that there were about 4 mafia, but there were only 2 killings previously meaning that some mafia wasn't able to murder such as being in a protection group perhaps??
Unvote, Vote: Twilightblade
Twilightblade 4 (Orb, Ichigo, Faust, Xdeathfire)
Orb 3 (Kommodus, pevergreen, Sigurd)
Not voted 4 (greaterkhaan, ByzantineKnight, Twilightblade, The Stranger)
The Stranger vs. Ichigo
Orb vs pevergreen
Xdeathfire vs. ByzantineKnight
pevergreen vs. Xdeathfire
Sigurd vs. Faust
Since Sasaki isn't comming back for a while, I will change vote if you can come up with some better proof
I think you've accidentally copied Sigurd's challenge.
pevergreen
05-26-2007, 13:12
I am not saying BZK is innocent. Im saying that he asks for a protection group and then does nothing...
Bets on mafia: Xdeathfire, Orb, BZK and the stranger.
TevashSzat
05-26-2007, 13:44
pevergreen, just earlier, you challenged me because I voted for BZK saying that there is nothing to say that he is mafia.
Now however, he claim that BZK is mafia without any new evidence popping up. Isn't that a bit contradictory????
Also, btw, couldn't find anywhere where Sigurd rescinded challenge so im keeping it as such
pevergreen
05-26-2007, 14:09
So thats your proof that twilight and bzk are innocent. Since you want to lync orb so badly, would you accept his innocence if he just randomly came to you for a protection group?
Also, someone earlier said that there were about 4 mafia, but there were only 2 killings previously meaning that some mafia wasn't able to murder such as being in a protection group perhaps??
Unvote, Vote: Twilightblade
Challenge: Faust
The Stranger vs. Ichigo
Orb vs pevergreen
Xdeathfire vs. ByzantineKnight
pevergreen vs. Xdeathfire
Sigurd vs. Faust
You challnged/voted BZK with providing no reason, and you now assume me of defending him. I do not think he is innocent.
no, what I meant was that you copied the text of his challenge outside quote tags, which could be misinterpreted as you challenging Faust
So thats your proof that twilight and bzk are innocent. Since you want to lync orb so badly, would you accept his innocence if he just randomly came to you for a protection group?
And what's your proof against BZK and TB, except the fact that "they are lurking". Like I said before, if that's the reason why you are voting those two particular players, you might as well vote yourself.
Now that the game enters his end phase, it's a bit odd that you lurked throughout the game to pop up now and make some random accusations to players who are "lurking", something you have been guilty off yourself until last round. What's the matter, did you feel the need to participate because your mafia buddies are feeling some heat?
Also, someone earlier said that there were about 4 mafia, but there were only 2 killings previously meaning that some mafia wasn't able to murder such as being in a protection group perhaps??
This isn't your first mafia game, so you should be well aware of the fact the number of mafiosi still alive is seldom equal to the numbers of kills during the night.
Since Sasaki isn't comming back for a while, I will change vote if you can come up with some better proof
Eh, he would be back in the week-end. It's Saturday now...
:inquisitive:
Pannonian
05-26-2007, 16:23
And what's your proof against BZK and TB, except the fact that "they are lurking". Like I said before, if that's the reason why you are voting those two particular players, you might as well vote yourself.
Now that the game enters his end phase, it's a bit odd that you lurked throughout the game to pop up now and make some random accusations to players who are "lurking", something you have been guilty off yourself until last round. What's the matter, did you feel the need to participate because your mafia buddies are feeling some heat?
It's a tad suspicious that Xdeathfire should have a flurry activity right at the end, after having lurked for so long. Rather reminiscent of Dutch Guy in M6, who was warned he'd be wogged if he didn't stop abstaining.
Will someone get their vote on Orb to lynch him? If TB is still leading when Sasaki returns, it'll be at most 8 players left after tonight, with 3 mafia remaining, 2 of them unblockable. After tomorrow (when Orb is lynched at long last), it'll be 5 players and 2 mafia, then the day after that it'll be 2 players and 1 mafia, which is a mafia win. The game may continue due to the nominal chance of a townie victory through night-kills, but realistically this is the last chance for the town.
Guys, ignore TB, who may or may not be innocent, and lynch Orb, who has a mountain of evidence pointing to his guilt...
TevashSzat
05-27-2007, 03:05
First of all, I know I have been lurking and have mostly done so because I started the game with AP exams to study for in the first 2 weeks and didn't do much then. As for why I went for BZK and Twilightblade, I just randomly picked someone that wasn't too active and just put a vote on them seeing if they will do anything suspicious. Think of who I have voted for in the past, everyone of them not very active such as Xehh II which was wogged.
What made me go for BZK and Twilight aggressively this time was how quick pevergreen was to defend them without any real proof other than they were in a protection group or attempted to form one.
Andres, me saying that there being like 4 mafias and only 2 kills was an attempt to show pever that just because someone was in a protection group with him doesn't necessarily mean he is innocent.
People, read what I post in context.
Seeing as how all of you don't want Twilight to be lynched and Orb instead, I will Unvote, Vote: pevergreen.
Twilightblade 4 (Orb, Ichigo, Faust)
Orb 3 (Kommodus, pevergreen, Sigurd)
pevergreen 1 (Xdeathfire)
Not voted 4 (greaterkhaan, ByzantineKnight, Twilightblade, The Stranger)
The Stranger vs. Ichigo
Orb vs pevergreen
Xdeathfire vs. ByzantineKnight
pevergreen vs. Xdeathfire
Sigurd vs. Faust
Guys, ignore TB, who may or may not be innocent, and lynch Orb, who has a mountain of evidence pointing to his guilt...
Great, well we had a chance to make someone speak up even if they would not be lynched. It's been more than 24 hours... why hasn't TB spoken up? Lurking into the final rounds having not been WOG'ed simply cannot be allowed to happen. I don't want to hold my vote on you this long TB, but you should either participate here or suicide. I'm also going to challenge you so this has not come to a total waste:
Challenge: Twilight Blade
EDIT: why aren't the others participating (besides BZK)?
Twilightblade
05-27-2007, 03:56
It's been more than 24 hours... why hasn't TB spoken up? ?
Because Twilightblade is addicted to playing games such as KotOR and DoW Dark Crusade and when he does he forgets to log on and post 90% of the time.
oh and he has stuff like soccer, homework etc when he is not playing games.
Now in my defense
I have a low kung fu score which doesn't make me instantly innocent but it increases the chance I am
If anyone has watched me they would see that I rarely do much at night so that would point to my innocence as well
seireikhaan
05-27-2007, 04:07
After looking over the thread, I have a couple of comments.
Certainly, one could say that Orb has made himself suspicious. A couple of things are bothering me, though. Why would a mafioso stick his head so far out where everyone could see it? Why would a mafioso be making challenges every round, when there's the possibility someone could defeat him and take away his night action? Orb's been making challenges from the beginning, when any such action would be dangereous for a mafioso. Basically what I'm saying is that it just seems too obvious for Orb to be mafia, no mafioso would make himself such a target. My guess is that the Mafia's been using Orb as a shield, letting him take the punishment.
Meanwhile, where's Tblade been? He's been doing little of consequence the entire game. I realise he seem to do this, but that in itself doesn't prove his innocence. He kept up the same act as a mafioso in CNII after he was converted to the mafia. Right now the only "proof" of his innocence is Pevergreen saying he's innocence, which is, of course, meaningless.
Lastly, Xdeathfire, you've been hopping your vote a lot. Most often, it seems to change to try and suit other people. May I make a suggestion and try to read the thread yourself, figure out who you think is supsicious, and vote for them, instead of voting to please everyone else. Certainly we need to work together, but just voting and unvoting based on the crowd's wave at the moment is scummy. Also, your suspicions of BK were totally unfounded if you had read the thread. I myself had asked where he was and Ichigo answered with a post saying that BK hasn't been on the Org in about a week or so.
Right now, I think Xdeathfire is most suspicious, followed by Tblade and Kommodus, with Orb bringing up the rear.
Vote: TwilightBlade.
Challenge: Kommodus, for lurking.(e.g.-trying to stay under the radar)
Tally:
Twilightblade-4(Orb, Ichigo, Faust, Greaterkhaan)
Orb-3(Kommodus, Sigurd, Pevergreen)
Pevergreen-1(Xdeathfire)
Not voted-3(The Stranger,ByzantineKnight,TwilightBlade)
The Stranger vs. Ichigo
Orb vs Pevergreen
Xdeathfire vs. ByzantineKnight
Pevergreen vs. Xdeathfire
Sigurd vs Faust
Greaterkhaan vs Kommodus
Twilightblade
05-27-2007, 04:28
I explained my reasons above
Twilightblade
05-27-2007, 04:32
Oh and Vote: Orb
Tally:
Twilightblade-4(Orb, Ichigo, Faust, Greaterkhaan)
Orb-4(Kommodus, Sigurd, Pevergreen,TwilightBlade)
Pevergreen-1(Xdeathfire)
Not voted-2(The Stranger,ByzantineKnight)
The Stranger vs. Ichigo
Orb vs Pevergreen
Xdeathfire vs. ByzantineKnight
Pevergreen vs. Xdeathfire
Sigurd vs Faust
Greaterkhaan vs Kommodus
It evens the board a bit don't you think?
seireikhaan
05-27-2007, 04:43
Yes, I see your reasons now, that post took a while and you finished yours before I did.
First of all, a low kung fu score doens't mean diddly, as there have been plenty of non kung fu kills as well as kung fu. And I have things to do as well, that doesn't mean I can't squeeze in some time for mafia. If your too busy to participate in a mafia game, then don't sign up. And like I said, you didn't suddenly change your posting style when you became mafia in CN II, so just because you haven't been on a lot doesn't mean your innocent. My biggest problem is that whenever you do post, its always along the lines of, "Well, I'm innocent. I don't really want to read the thread, so I'll just vote for the last person who got a vote. Or I'll just waffle over the decision and do nothing."
Also, I noticed that I messed up the challenge tally.
The Stranger vs. Ichigo
Orb vs. Pevergreen
Xdeathfire vs. ByzantineKnight
Pevergreen vs. Xdeathfire
Sigurd vs. Faust
Faust vs. TwilightBlade
Greaterkhaan vs. Kommodus
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