Star Wars: Fall of the Order [Concluded]

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Originally Posted by YLC

Vote: Ignoramus

14/13, Iggy.

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LOL,
whatever ends up happening, you have style YLC, I like that.

Haven't we gone over this before. A TIE ONLY BENEFITS THE SITH. How does a tie benefit us in this situation? Both here are reasonable lynches, both are good choices, pick one ore the other.

FoS: God Emperor, Frozen In Ice and Seon ~;p.

:wall:

C'mon people, what'd I just say? Tie it up again, and make YLC make a choice.

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Originally Posted by Yaseikhaan

:wall:

C'mon people, what'd I just say? Tie it up again, and make YLC make a choice.

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:laugh4:

You're not very subtle are you Khaan? If you want me dead, then say so, stop trying to hide it under the guise of achieving a tie.

Considering what you have just said prior to your sudden vote switch YLC, I will take this sudden move to kill off Ignoramus instead of letting yourself die as you mentioned previously as a strong indication of guilt.

I recommend more votes be piled on YLC rather than a tie with Ignoramus, the sudden change of heart considering his prior "oh noes I rather let myself die because I'm just a lowly initiate" is just eyebrow raising.

Unless you'd care to explain YLC?

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Originally Posted by Yaseikhaan

C'mon people, what'd I just say? Tie it up again, and make YLC make a choice.

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Wait, didn't you say don't tie originally? Or was it don't change the tie?

unFOS: Frozen and God Emperor, reading their posts again, they're misguided, but not scummy.

MASSIVE FOS: dcmort93 Holy smokes, scummier than a pond full of dead fish, green algae and a family of toads.

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Originally Posted by YLC

Because I'll lose? I have no idea as to Iggy's role, I just know it is better then mine, because why other would he care? Honestly, really giving up would be simply walking away - I'm not, I'll be here when I'm dead and contribute after.

I've explained myself repeatedly, again, and again. No one is satisfied with what I have to say and is actively against my opinion. I've said I am doomed no matter what I do, at least that is what I believe in. I'd rather go with the least damage done to the town.

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Originally Posted by YLC

Behavior - he may claim otherwise, but He's virtually absent from mafia until this game and now clings to it. He is doing something or believes he is going to do something - so I suspect whatever rank obtains a lightsaber. I'm an initiate, with 2 avoidance abilities, and no lightsaber skill. The tally is against me anyway period, so there isn't much I can do about - for instance, I can't seem to satisfy Zack with any answer I give him, who doesn't seem to get that I am doing what I think is best for the town based upon what I believe.

Let me put in caps - IGGY IS NOT GETTING LYNCHED, AND I WILL LOSE IN A DUEL, WHICH WILL REVEAL INFORMATION TO THE MAFIA. THE BEST OPTION, DESPITE THE FACT I DO NOT LIKE IT, SO JUST OUTRIGHT DIE. LESSER OF TWO EVILS!

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Originally Posted by YLC

I don't like duels. I honestly think they hurt the town. I am going to lose to Iggy, so unless Iggy is outright lynched, he goes free. I can prefer myself as much as I want, but if I am to choose between revealing Iggy's fighting style and possible abilities AND dying, or just simply dying, the choice is rather logical, don't you think.

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mmm... YLC :stare:

Edit:

To sum it up, YLC basically says that he'd rather die than Ignoramus because he knows that he himself is but a lowly initiate, and that Ignoramus's commitment level which is unusual to him speaks of a possibly pro-town role (without mentioning that it could be a sith role which is one of the cases on him) and that between the two of them, YLC would rather die because he can still contribute to the town, and Ignoramus will be safe and sound.

His sudden change of heart away from this reasoning is highly disconcerting and troubling.

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Originally Posted by Psychonaut

Wait, didn't you say don't tie originally? Or was it don't change the tie?

unFOS: Frozen and God Emperor, reading their posts again, they're misguided, but not scummy.

MASSIVE FOS: dcmort93 Holy smokes, scummier than a pond full of dead fish, green algae and a family of toads.

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Well, the original point was to keep it not a tie, since YLC had taken his vote off. Basically, if YLC has his vote on Iggy, keep it a tie, if he takes it anywhere else, keep YLC at one more than Iggy. Since YLC has his vote on Iggy now, tie it up. Both have acted very scummy, and its annoying, because it keeps attention off Dcmort.

So yeah, ummmm

The day ends in slightly over 24 hours from now, lest we forget this day started 12 hours ago. :laugh4:

look if you want me dead you'll need to vig me because I have force breath. Chances are I'll die the next night unless the sith just suck hardcore

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Originally Posted by Yaseikhaan

Well, the original point was to keep it not a tie, since YLC had taken his vote off. Basically, if YLC has his vote on Iggy, keep it a tie, if he takes it anywhere else, keep YLC at one more than Iggy. Since YLC has his vote on Iggy now, tie it up. Both have acted very scummy, and its annoying, because it keeps attention off Dcmort.

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To sum it up, YLC basically says that he'd rather die than Ignoramus because he knows that he himself is but a lowly initiate, and that Ignoramus's commitment level which is unusual to him speaks of a possibly pro-town role (without mentioning that it could be a sith role which is one of the cases on him) and that between the two of them, YLC would rather die because he can still contribute to the town, and Ignoramus will be safe and sound.

His sudden change of heart away from this reasoning is highly disconcerting and troubling.

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Actually makes, a boatload and a half of sense. I have glandular fever, so my brain is fried, trying to follow logic unless it is 150% clear is pretty much impossible. =(

Unvote; Vote: YLC.

I don't like ties, but, I'm willing to make a compromise here.

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Originally Posted by Psychonaut

unFOS: Frozen and God Emperor, reading their posts again, they're misguided, but not scummy.

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I might have missed something since you can point the wish for a tie down as misguided. Could you tell me why it is that town has NO gain of a tie in this situation?

In this situation we have two people; one who will be lynched today, and one who will be lynched tomorrow, if we look at the number of votes they have. If a duel suggest that Ignoramus is an important Jedi, well then he will end up dead, slain by the mafia. If the duel does not suggest this, then he will be lynched.
In other words, a duel could in theory save the life of an important power role, for some days perhaps. So why is it so absurd to wish for a tie?

Edit: or perhaps I am wrong? it's getting very late... Yes I am wrong.. please disregard this. If he is an important role he would claim his abilities before a grand bandwagon on him alone occured. . .

Ignoring me is a bad idea. :sad: You will soon realise I am the towns greatest asset.

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Originally Posted by dcmort

look if you want me dead you'll need to vig me because I have force breath. Chances are I'll die the next night unless the sith just suck hardcore

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Force Breath means they will keep you alive to waste two lynches. Not helpful at all. NOT HELPFUL.

PEOPLE. IF YOU HAVE FORCE BREATH KEEP IT TO YOURSELF.

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Originally Posted by Death is yonder

mmm... YLC :stare:

Edit:

To sum it up, YLC basically says that he'd rather die than Ignoramus because he knows that he himself is but a lowly initiate, and that Ignoramus's commitment level which is unusual to him speaks of a possibly pro-town role (without mentioning that it could be a sith role which is one of the cases on him) and that between the two of them, YLC would rather die because he can still contribute to the town, and Ignoramus will be safe and sound.

His sudden change of heart away from this reasoning is highly disconcerting and troubling.

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I thought I explained this...I do not know Iggys' role, but I know mine, and thus I put my life abve his and if given the opportunity will vote for Iggy if Iggy is to be lynched. My reasoning for insuring that I die instead of tying it up is because that'd reveal more information to the Sith, which I do not want to do, and in which a duel I know Iggy will win.

Also, HoS: DIY, for calling me an Initiate. I'd like to show me where I called myself an initiate.

so then you either believe I'm innocent or you wast to lynches and get what the mafia wants

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Originally Posted by Beskar

Ignoring me is a bad idea. :sad: You will soon realise I am the towns greatest asset.

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No, I am the towns greatest asset.

I think YLC has shown he's a better lynch than Ignoramus. :)

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Originally Posted by dcmort93

so then you either believe I'm innocent or you wast to lynches and get what the mafia wants

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No. You are acting scummy. Therefore likely Sith. But, now you've revealed you have force breath, if I'm infact wrong and you are Jedi it isn't helpful at all to have revealed that information because you will be left around until the end game as lynchbait, muddying the water and making harder to find the real Sith. What is called an unhelpful townie.

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Originally Posted by Psychonaut

No. You are acting scummy. Therefore likely Sith. But, now you've revealed you have force breath, if I'm infact wrong and you are Jedi it isn't helpful at all to have revealed that information because you will be left around until the end game as lynchbait, muddying the water and making harder to find the real Sith. What is called an unhelpful townie.

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my firend you are looking at this with the glass half empty. I may stick around till the end giving the town and extra vote when the time comes

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Originally Posted by YLC

Also, HoS: DIY, for calling me an Initiate. I'd like to show me where I called myself an initiate.

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Originally Posted by YLC

Behavior - he may claim otherwise, but He's virtually absent from mafia until this game and now clings to it. He is doing something or believes he is going to do something - so I suspect whatever rank obtains a lightsaber. I'm an initiate, with 2 avoidance abilities, and no lightsaber skill. The tally is against me anyway period, so there isn't much I can do about - for instance, I can't seem to satisfy Zack with any answer I give him, who doesn't seem to get that I am doing what I think is best for the town based upon what I believe.

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Gone, YLC.

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Originally Posted by dcmort93

look if you want me dead you'll need to vig me because I have force breath. Chances are I'll die the next night unless the sith just suck hardcore

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What do you mean by "unless the sith just suck hardcore"?

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Originally Posted by Renata

I have no issue with you anymore Diamondeye. I took your comment about having the feeling to defend TinCow as defensive of a position you had taken the previous day when actually you'd made no comment on Rebel Jeb/TinCow at all. You skimmed/I took your comment as referring to a previous post that never existed, and never bothered to check up. We're even.

For your last question, I speculated that *maybe* he would get an unusual result on non-top-dog Siths and possibly third parties -- something like "not recruitable, but stinks of the Dark Side". If he ever does, I'd suggest making such results public.

For the other possible results, I expect "not recuitable/light side" to indicate an incorruptible townie, possibly high level Siths with some sort of godfather-ish power, possibly third parties with the same. I'd expect "recruitable/dark side" to indicate corruptible townies and possibly some third parties, and even potentially ALSO some Sith, depending on to what extent they are able to fool investigations.

Finally, given the fluidity of powers in this game, I'd suggest that repeat scans on suspects might occasionally be useful -- if the result ever changes on someone, that should be reason to suspect they might have been recruited, or upgraded their anti-investigator powers in the interim.

And of course, pevergreen could keep track of who's been scanned as corruptible or not (and who the investigator is, in each case).

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Yeah i'm pretty much doing that. I believe there is a number of different levels of scans, each more effective. However, there is (was last game) a way to be invisible to them, and it was a pro town and sith ability.

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Originally Posted by Sasaki Kojiro

:mellow:

vote:Ignoramus

(checks role pm)

You can congratulate me for killing pevergreen last night.

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...

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Originally Posted by Diamondeye

Congratulations, Sasaki. Someone had to do it... :thumbsup:

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:smoking:

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Originally Posted by dcmort93

my firend you are looking at this with the glass half empty. I may stick around till the end giving the town and extra vote when the time comes

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My experience with townies like you is you stick around, then vote wrong.
Kinda like the Caius effect or something.

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Originally Posted by Sasaki Kojiro

What do you mean by "unless the sith just suck hardcore"?

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as in suck @ dueling

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Originally Posted by Ignoramus

Gone, YLC.

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Oi, forgot I had actually said that :embarassed: I retract my suspicion of DIY, I jut wish now he had included it in his statement about me.

Either or Unvote:Ignoramus

I win no matter what you guys do, you're just making this too fun.

EDIT: Gah, it was in the post - I just skimmed it because since I write it, I didn't think I needed to read it again, lol.

Ok. I'm busy this weekend and will not have a whole lot of time to contribute to discussion, but rest assured I am at least reading it.

Personally, I think this tie is a bad idea, because in a tie it is possible that neither one of them dies (due to Force Alter Damage), and clearly we wouldn't be voting for them if we wanted them to survive. In the (admittedly rare) case that they are both Sith- and YLC certainly seems like a suicidal apprentice trying to save the master- then one or both of them can use Alter Damage and keep both of them alive.

So, these duels are a bad idea unless we KNOW that:
-Our target has Force Breath (presumably it will kill through that).
-We have a strong fighter to duel this suspect and win.

NEVER try to duel two suspected Sith.

Vote: Ignoramus

I'm breaking the tie. Personally I don't think it's a good idea. We will have vigilantes and other days to get rid of YLC.

EDIT: Not cool, YLC.

Well we have 24 hours to pile votes on ignoramus.

Unvote, Vote: YLC

Doesn't matter which one we get rid of as long as there's no tie.

Ignoramus- You had BETTER reveal to pevergreen ASAP or else you're still under major suspicion.

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Originally Posted by Chaotix

Unvote, Vote: YLC

Doesn't matter which one we get rid of as long as there's no tie.

Ignoramus- You had BETTER reveal to pevergreen ASAP or else you're still under major suspicion.

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Can I reveal my role to him?

Yes.

P.S.: Don't send the Role PM though.

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Originally Posted by Ignoramus

Can I reveal my role to him?

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Yes, he's for all intents and purposes a living character, only he can't be lynched/killed/acted upon- he can send and receive PMs.

:laugh4::laugh4:

So we have agreed, no tie, I die? Can we please get these proceedings over? You can all call me a terrible townie afterward, I've had my fun in just these last few pages. I've stated my case, my opinions, and the reasons for what I am doing - all of you are simply ignoring it, so there is no reasoning with any of you.

Meh. You're not a joker, so either you're a Sith who wants to save his Sith Master or a townie who wants to save someone who he believes is a stronger role. Or, you have Force Breath and are screwing with us.

Whatever the case, you won't last much longer.

Master Sky has been informed.

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Originally Posted by dcmort93

look if you want me dead you'll need to vig me because I have force breath. Chances are I'll die the next night unless the sith just suck hardcore

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I'm sorry but this post just strikes me as so scummy that I must unvote: vote:dcmort93

This post is jumping to defend himself from the mere suggestion that he is scum, while at the same time claiming votes against him will not work, AND revealing himself as a power role. Either this was a very very silly post on his part, or he is absolute sith scum.

He has absolutely no reason to need to make this reveal, he is hardly being voted for and was mearly mentioned as a possible candidate for tomorrow.

Plus, he has been posting pond scum all night.

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Originally Posted by dcmort93

Ok so first off Vote Abstain I see no point in choosing a distinct canidate yet
secondly what is the case against me exactly and is it still valid

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voting abstain? why would he do this, unless he is just waiting to see what will make him look better. plus he is already preoccupied with people suspecting him, this amount of paranoia would be unwarrented for a mere town role.

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Originally Posted by Chaotix

Meh. You're not a joker, so either you're a Sith who wants to save his Sith Master or a townie who wants to save someone who he believes is a stronger role. Or, you have Force Breath and are screwing with us.

Whatever the case, you won't last much longer.

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I'm not Sith, that will be confirmed if I do die, and I do believe Iggy has an IMPORTANT role, from what I can gather of his behavior - whether it is outright better then mine, I have no clue. All I know, is that I am innocent, I'd prefer to live, prefer Iggy to die, and prefer it if a duel was not conducted. If the town attempts to enforce a duel, I will go out of my way to insure that there is no duel, because I believe doing so is detrimental to the town, something that has been echoed REPEATEDLY, and not just by me.

Seriously people, do you just put me on ignore and then vote me based on what everyone else says?

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Originally Posted by YLC

I'm not Sith, that will be confirmed if I do die, and I do believe Iggy has an IMPORTANT role, from what I can gather of his behavior - whether it is outright better then mine, I have no clue. All I know, is that I am innocent, I'd prefer to live, prefer Iggy to die, and prefer it if a duel was not conducted. If the town attempts to enforce a duel, I will go out of my way to insure that there is no duel, because I believe doing so is detrimental to the town, something that has been echoed REPEATEDLY, and not just by me.

Seriously people, do you just put me on ignore and then vote me based on what everyone else says?

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Hes given me his role, I'm waiting on his response to my question.

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Originally Posted by God Emperor

In this situation we have two people; one who will be lynched today, and one who will be lynched tomorrow, if we look at the number of votes they have.

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Do not assume that you will get a second lynch vote. It's impossible to predict what will happen as a result of this lynch and the next night's results. There are plenty of things that could pop up between now and then that would distract the voting to a different person. So, it's important to pick the person that you suspect the most each round, because no matter how scummy they may seem at this moment, you may not get another shot at that person for a long time, if ever. Ties almost never work out well for the town. When they do, it's due to luck, not planning. Pick a single person and pile votes on them so that they cannot wiggle out of it with last minute vote changes.

Ig seems ok.

Others have revealed to me, I'd suggest if you have any active force powers, you do the same. I'm not cross-revealing nor am I revealing info to the town.

If Ignoramus seems okay, than that leaves vote:YLC

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Originally Posted by God Emperor

We will learn what fighting stances they use. If the winner of a duel use the exact same stance as a night killing sith, then we could say BINGO

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There are only 7 fighting stances, and no guarantee that people don't have more than one of them. So no, that wouldn't work.

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Originally Posted by dcmort93

look if you want me dead you'll need to vig me because I have force breath. Chances are I'll die the next night unless the sith just suck hardcore

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Arm of Suspicion: dcmort

Because that's way to scummy for a finger, or even a hand to provide a measure of the scuminess of this post.

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Originally Posted by Psychonaut

Force Breath means they will keep you alive to waste two lynches. Not helpful at all. NOT HELPFUL.

PEOPLE. IF YOU HAVE FORCE BREATH KEEP IT TO YOURSELF.

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Well, if you're on the receiving end of a bandwagon, it's helpful to tell us you have force breath so we know that we'll be wasting a lynch by lynching you. Other than that, keep it, and most other powers, to yourself.

It has already been revealed that sith have fakeclaims...

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Originally Posted by Sasaki Kojiro

It has already been revealed that sith have fakeclaims...

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I thought mafia games required rationality to be thrown out the window? Also, I sent pever my name, and both abilities I have - if he ever gets back on, maybe he could make a more educated decision.

Honestly, I don't want to pull the vote away to much...but anyone find it odd several people find dcmort suspicious yet have not voted for him? I find it odd that the town needs people killed off to concentrate - what's the issue? If you find someone scummy, then vote for them, just keep everything else in the background. It's not like you have mafia ADD, right?

Here - Vote: dcmort.

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Originally Posted by YLC

I thought I explained this...I do not know Iggys' role, but I know mine, and thus I put my life abve his and if given the opportunity will vote for Iggy if Iggy is to be lynched. My reasoning for insuring that I die instead of tying it up is because that'd reveal more information to the Sith, which I do not want to do, and in which a duel I know Iggy will win.

Also, HoS: DIY, for calling me an Initiate. I'd like to show me where I called myself an initiate.

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The way you referred to yourself in a demeaning fashion and downplaying what you could possibly offer in your current situation leads me to believe you are an initiate.

If you were a knight, you WOULD not be acting like this, because you are one of those who are in line to become a Jedi Master.

Needless to say, anything higher than an initiate would not have downplayed himself as much as you did, saying "oh I should die because Ignoramus is obviously in possession of a role greater than mine".

Only an initiate would be so confident in making that bold statement, especially if he does not know who Ignoramus is.

I believe my presumption to be legit, unless you would care to counter my reasoning.

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Oh nevermind, this what I get for not refreshing the page, going off to do things, and then pressing preview to a post I typed.

In any event, I agree that dcmort is a very suspicious character, his move is just downright silly for a townie because as Tincow had mentioned, he's just going to be left as lynch bait if he's innocent. Someone needs to vig him to avoid wasting lynches.

On the subject of people revealing to pever:

Sasaki is right

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It has already been revealed that sith have fakeclaims...

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Beskar DID have a cover role. I fail to see the point in revealing to pever in order to determine innocence, but rather to cross-reference abilities and all that so pever can highlight any issues or errors that don't tally with what he knows about the game.

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Originally Posted by dcmort93

so then you either believe I'm innocent or you wast to lynches and get what the mafia wants

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This is an extremely poor move dcmort, you should not have revealed that in the first place. Right now you have merely performed an action that has hindered the town effort, I see little reason to grant you what you wish, which is to just leave you alive all game in hopes that you were just a silly townie who accidentally revealed himself to have force breath.

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Originally Posted by Death is yonder

Beskar DID have a cover role. I fail to see the point in revealing to pever in order to determine innocence, but rather to cross-reference abilities and all that so pever can highlight any issues or errors that don't tally with what he knows about the game.

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Correct, anyone sending me anything is not being determined as innocent, I just have a note of what powers they have. Names are helpful, as I can then learn more from the night results, as certain attacks fail to certain defences.

Still a little peeved I'm getting knocked out so early, wish I had been lucky enough to get force breath - I think I fear the overzealousness of the town compared to night kills of the mafia.

I'd cry though if I could win the duel ;_; - I'd feel betrayed by my own principles.

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Originally Posted by Yaseikhaan

For multiple reasons, Ignoramus should be the lynch target today.

However, I'd like people to remember dcmort and lynch him asap after Iggy.

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Agreed vote:Ignoramus

Unvote:, Vote:pever

Vote: Ignoramus

Can someone do an updated tally?

They both look scummy. It's hard to chose :stupido3:

This is getting confusing. Vote: YLC

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Originally Posted by Csargo

Unvote:, Vote:pever

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Really?

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Originally Posted by Andres

They both look scummy. It's hard to chose :stupido3:

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New choice: Ichigo

Okay why is it no-one understands what the :daisy: YLC is saying/doing. I makes me :daisy:ing frustrated to read since he's acting completely logical.
unvote; vote: Zack. I can't decide who of YLC and Ignoramus I want lynched - an initiate striking me as town, or something stronger that I am as convinced about? So I'm taking the third option and loding my vote on Zack as he's either playing stupid or he's really, really deft when it comes to YLC's reasoning. Perhaps he has a reason to let the case on YLC continue despite being outargued?
Same about HoS: Nightbringer...

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Originally Posted by Diamondeye

an initiate striking me as town, or something stronger that I am not as convinced about?

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Fixxed in seperate post to avoid editing a post with a vote (YLC, you edited your last vote post, you might want to repost your vote as well)

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Originally Posted by Diamondeye

Okay why is it no-one understands what the :daisy: YLC is saying/doing. I makes me :daisy:ing frustrated to read since he's acting completely logical.
unvote; vote: Zack. I can't decide who of YLC and Ignoramus I want lynched - an initiate striking me as town, or something stronger that I am as convinced about? So I'm taking the third option and loding my vote on Zack as he's either playing stupid or he's really, really deft when it comes to YLC's reasoning. Perhaps he has a reason to let the case on YLC continue despite being outargued?
Same about HoS: Nightbringer...

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Neutral behavior is scummy in my book.
FoS: Diamondeye!

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Originally Posted by Csargo

Unvote:, Vote:pever

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What?

Sticking with my vote.

And for the sake of important iterations. Be careful of what you reveal. Powers are likely tiered.
The Sith will have knowledge of which power belongs in which tier. Saying you have force breath and it is a Jedi Master power, you just revealed to the Sith that you are at least a Jedi Master.

Sigurd, I'm sure pever isn't simply handing out any information he gathers...

@DE - thanks, at least I make sense to someone.

Unvote, Vote:Dcmort for now. I'd build up some reasoning for everyone to vote for him NOW, instead of LATER, but I'm a bit tired. Suffice it to say that if you find him scummy now, with the possibility of Force Breath, best to get it done and over with before it turns into an issue. I'd also say it's unfair to Iggy to outright kill him based upon previous games, as IMHO it borders on metagaming (as first protown zerg rushes on ATPG, Beskar, TC, Khann, etc are).

Me? Well, I just really don't want to die because for once in awhile I lack a completely insane role and am having fun at the same time. Any additional attempt to defend myself either brings up the apparently both sane yet utterly distasteful idea of roleblocking the Sith into non-recruiting submission (if possible - if not possible, then alternatives abound and we know better, sooner), or what I've already stated for the I think the 9th or 10th time.

Sigurd,
ATPG informed us that some characters start with powers from higher levels, presumably also powers like force breath.
Of course, it would not be a good idea to publicly reveal such informations anyway

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Originally Posted by Jarema

Sigurd,
ATPG informed us that some characters start with powers from higher levels, presumably also powers like force breath.
Of course, it would not be a good idea to publicly reveal such informations anyway

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You could be right, as I have probably missed this tidbit of information. It could also be a cover for Sith having a Jedi Initiate cover role and being caught using say a Jedi Master power.

https://i156.photobucket.com/albums/...g/Evidence.jpg

Djeez, how could we possibly miss that?

Unvote; Vote : Sigurd

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Originally Posted by Andres

https://i156.photobucket.com/albums/...g/Evidence.jpg

Djeez, how could we possibly miss that?

Unvote; Vote : Sigurd

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:stare: Sigurd, explain yourself :tongue:

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Originally Posted by pevergreen

Really?

New choice: Ichigo

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Yes. You should die. Again.

Vote: Sigurd

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

https://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y2...resisaSith.png

You are looking kinda cloaked and mysterious Andres!!!

Besides, I think Andres is pulling a mind trick on you all. I suspect he is using the anagram trick. The real title says: Dotard Hither Folks. I can only imagine what Andres makes it say.

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Originally Posted by Diamondeye

Okay why is it no-one understands what the :daisy: YLC is saying/doing. I makes me :daisy:ing frustrated to read since he's acting completely logical.
unvote; vote: Zack. I can't decide who of YLC and Ignoramus I want lynched - an initiate striking me as town, or something stronger that I am as convinced about? So I'm taking the third option and loding my vote on Zack as he's either playing stupid or he's really, really deft when it comes to YLC's reasoning. Perhaps he has a reason to let the case on YLC continue despite being outargued?

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What? He plays the "woe is me, lynch me instead of powerful Ignoramus" then goes back and votes Iggy.

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Originally Posted by dcmort93

Ok so first off Vote Abstain I see no point in choosing a distinct canidate yet

secondly what is the case against me exactly and is it still valid

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Oh my good lord. Almost I begin to believe you town -- scumminess at this insane level is almost always a town province, you know? But then you have to go claim force breath.

Please to be providing your role name to pevergreen, dcmort. If someone tries to vig you tonight and fails, it would be good to have that on the record ahead of time.

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Originally Posted by Sigurd

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

https://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y2...resisaSith.png

You are looking kinda cloaked and mysterious Andres!!!

Besides, I think Andres is pulling a mind trick on you all. I suspect he is using the anagram trick. The real title says: Dotard Hither Folks. I can only imagine what Andres makes it say.

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Sigurd used a nice neat oval shape, while Andres used a scraggly pencil tool. Hence, Sigurd is scum, because good is scruffy and evil is neat. QED.

unvote, vote Sigurd

No, just kidding.

unvote, vote YLC

Diamondeye, you wanna come have *another* chat with me? I'm still waiting for the coffee to kick in, but maybe you can explain your take on YLC while that is happening.

YLC and Ignoramus need to die. Do not let them off the hook. Let's take a look at their defense in some detail.

First, we have YLC's old statement before the current lynch vote, about not trusting Rebel Jeb until he was dead:

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Originally Posted by YLC

Kind of pointless if the recruiting mechanic is automatic or based on a living Sith Master. I'm not sure about anyone else here, but I'm not trusting Jeb until he's dead.

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In his first defense post, YLC explains this further:

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Originally Posted by YLC

Vote: Ignoramus

I honestly suggested what I did because I thought it best. I'm not going to trust power roles just because - anyone is susceptible to the darkside as far as I know, so anything anyone says could be motivated by it, unless they are proven innocent by lynch, hence why I would only finally trust RJ when he was dead. I didn't advocate for his death, and would only vote for him if the town was for it - it was my personal feelings and I wasn't going to lynch him over it unless it was a done deal.

...

As for now, I am sticking to my guns and I disagree with duels entirely, so I am voting for Iggy. If the town really wants me to duel, then just even up again - just making my displeasure with it known.

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The basic point is that he doesn't trust power roles, and will never trust them until they are proven innocent by death. At this point, he is perfectly happy voting for Ignoramus to save himself. However, he suddenly changes his mind:

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Originally Posted by YLC

Unvote:Ignoramus

I again, do not codone ties. I am positive I will lose, and even if I do win, I'll be killed during the night. This way the mafia will know nothing of Iggy's abilities.

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He concludes (without ANY intervening information from Ignoramus) that Ignoramus is more powerful than him and will win the duel. Note that he says he's "positive" he will lose a duel. That's not a term for someone who's unsure, that's a term indicating that he knows he will lose. In addition, despite suddenly concluding, totally spontaneously, that Ignoramus (1) is stronger than him and (2) has abilities that will be shown in a duel, he decides that Ignoramus needs to be defended. Just a few posts before, YLC was saying he wasn't going to trust any power role until it was proven innocent by death. Only a few posts later he's willing to sacrifice himself to keep Ignoramus' info secret? That doesn't make any sense.

After this point, he makes a few posts where he tries to explain that he's voting to avoid dueling, not because he wants Ignoramus dead. YLC then makes another comment about how Ignoramus is more powerful than him:

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Originally Posted by YLC

I don't like duels. I honestly think they hurt the town. I am going to lose to Iggy, so unless Iggy is outright lynched, he goes free. I can prefer myself as much as I want, but if I am to choose between revealing Iggy's fighting style and possible abilities AND dying, or just simply dying, the choice is rather logical, don't you think.

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This post very clearly indicates that he believes he will lose a duel to Ignoramus and that the duel will reveal useful information about Ignoramus' fighting ability. Again, Ignoramus has not made any posts about himself in this manner to justify this belief. Sasaki probes him on his beliefs about Ignoramus, and he responds with:

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Originally Posted by YLC

Behavior - he may claim otherwise, but He's virtually absent from mafia until this game and now clings to it. He is doing something or believes he is going to do something - so I suspect whatever rank obtains a lightsaber. I'm an initiate, with 2 avoidance abilities, and no lightsaber skill. The tally is against me anyway period, so there isn't much I can do about - for instance, I can't seem to satisfy Zack with any answer I give him, who doesn't seem to get that I am doing what I think is best for the town based upon what I believe.

Let me put in caps - IGGY IS NOT GETTING LYNCHED, AND I WILL LOSE IN A DUEL, WHICH WILL REVEAL INFORMATION TO THE MAFIA. THE BEST OPTION, DESPITE THE FACT I DO NOT LIKE IT, SO JUST OUTRIGHT DIE. LESSER OF TWO EVILS!

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So, YLC believes Ignoramus is high-ranking, and YLC does not trust power roles, but YLC is determined to keep Ignoramus' abilities from being demonstrated to the rest of us. This isn't consistent. If YLC doesn't trust power roles, why is he going out of his way to keep secrets for someone he believes is a power role, particularly when he claims he is going to die either way? The townie movie in that situation is to actually work FOR the duel, so that YLC's death has meaning... providing useful information on Ignoramus as he goes out. Townies exist to die, that's our job. A useful death is the best possible death for a townie.

In addition, the all caps bit is totally weird. Iggy is not getting lynched? Why not? Sounds like YLC thinks he has Force Breath, but no one has said that in the thread.

YLC then makes more comments about Ignoramus' role:

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Originally Posted by YLC

Because I'll lose? I have no idea as to Iggy's role, I just know it is better then mine, because why other would he care? Honestly, really giving up would be simply walking away - I'm not, I'll be here when I'm dead and contribute after.

I've explained myself repeatedly, again, and again. No one is satisfied with what I have to say and is actively against my opinion. I've said I am doomed no matter what I do, at least that is what I believe in. I'd rather go with the least damage done to the town.

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In this post we see a few things. First, further affirmation that (1) YLC has no idea what role Ignoramus has, but (2) YLC knows he will lose a duel (no maybes in this statement, it's very certain), (3) Ignoramus has a strong role because of his interest in remaining in the game, and (4) Ignoramus is pro-town. That's a ton of information to know about Ignoramus, for someone who doesn't know his role. This last one is also new. Why doesn't YLC find Ignoramus' desire to keep the game going as suspicious as the rest of us? He's interpreting Ignoramus' post as proof that he is pro-town, as demonstrated by the statement that if Ignoramus' ability are shown in the duel it will "damage . . . the town." Despite these very specific statements and heavy defense of Ignoramus, he then does a 180 and goes after him again:

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Originally Posted by YLC

Vote: Ignoramus

14/13, Iggy.

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He then flips back to being an altruist and tried to defend Ignoramus again:

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Originally Posted by YLC

I thought I explained this...I do not know Iggys' role, but I know mine, and thus I put my life abve his and if given the opportunity will vote for Iggy if Iggy is to be lynched. My reasoning for insuring that I die instead of tying it up is because that'd reveal more information to the Sith, which I do not want to do, and in which a duel I know Iggy will win.

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Again, he claims he doesn't know Ignoramus' role, but knows he will lose. He's way too certain about this for someone who has no idea about Ignoramus' role. In addition, he's once again trying to 'sacrifice' himself for the sake of someone he believes to be a strong role... even though he doesn't trust pro-town roles?

At this point, Ignoramus re-appears and claims to have a power role. This confirms YLC's totally random guess that Ignoramus was stronger and had a power role of some sort. This is Perfect Information Syndrome.

So, in summary:
1) YLC appears to have Perfect Information Syndrome with regard to Ignoramus' role (belief that he is strong, and that he has Force Breath)
2) YLC contradicts himself by stating repeatedly that he does not trust power roles, but then goes far, far out of his way to defend Ignoramus
3) YLC does not find anything suspicious about Ignoramus whatsoever, and accepts (without any proof) that Ignoramus is not only powerful, but pro-town.
4) YLC waffles on his votes between sparing Ignoramus and sparing himself.

Conclusion: YLC is scum and is likely defending his scum partner.

@ Renata, Sigurd, and Andres: XD.

pever would prefer YLC die over Ig.

Vote: YLC

In case my vote isn't currently on YLC

Unvote; Vote: YLC

For now vote: dcmort93. Im not sure if either of the top candidates is guilty. The current situation is too chaotic for my tastes. We have to rally around pevergreen and start making informed decisions, instead of shooting at the dark randomly.

I'd rather shoot at pever randomly

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Originally Posted by Csargo

I'd rather shoot at pever randomly

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Whats your beef with him?~;p

I don't like the situation we are in with him. He holds all the information, which is annoying.

Sith Lord: "Hi, I'm an evil Sith and I'm going to kill you and that guy with SITH written all over him is my master. Lynch me or you're doomed!"
Jedi: "No! We're going to lynch that guy over there!"
Sith Lord: "But he's but a simple Jedi Initiate, surely you wish to lynch ME, who is here to cut you in little pieces..."
Jedi: "Nope, we're going to lynch the Jedi Initiate because he said something and now he says something that seems different."
Sith Lord: But I'm evil and I want to be lynched :bigcry:


So, the general consensus is to leave Sigurd, who is dressed like a Sith, has Sith eyes and who has "Dark Lord of the Sith" written above his evil looking avatar and his apprentice Andres, who looks as evil as his master, with his Sith costume and Sith eyes, off the hook, and to lynch some poor guy based on the combination of a few vague asumptions and "analysis"?

Who am I to disagree :shrug:

Unvote ; Vote : YLC

Assuming TinCow is spot on in his analysis we should lynch Ignoramus who is the Dark Lord of the Sith and has not Force Breath to save him another day. While his new apprentice YLC does have force breath and will live yet another day. Lynch Ignoramus and then block/vig YLC.

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Originally Posted by Sigurd

Assuming TinCow is spot on in his analysis we should lynch Ignoramus who is the Dark Lord of the Sith and has not Force Breath to save him another day. While his new apprentice YLC does have force breath and will live yet another day. Lynch Ignoramus and then block/wig YLC.

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I didn't know YLC was bald.