The Midgard Saga II [Concluded]

**Andres** · 08-13-2008, 08:26

Hmmmm...

The Jotun have to kill the lords, don't they?

So a Jotun taking the risk of exposing himself by pressing for the lynching of a Lord is a possibility.

Let's see, GeneralHankerchief wants us to lynch Lord A, but not Lord B. When Lord A dies, it becomes clear that GeneralHankerchief was wrong. If we therefore assume he is Jotun, we assume that Lord B is a fake and lynch him.

Could it be that GH is a Jotun with a masterplan, sacrifycing himself to take down two Lords?

I have a pretty decent Holmgang score. Do we really want Motep, a possible Lord, to fight GH? If not, I can challenge GH to narrow down the odds of Motep actually having to fight.

On the other hand, Motep's role pm looks far less genuine than the one Tratorix posted.

And in the worst case, we are losing our time by focusing on both GH and Motep...

Gah, gah, gah! Where's Kommodus when you need him?

**pevergreen** · 08-13-2008, 09:06

We all know its not a great idea to rely on Kommo.

I don't really suspect GH, not as much as KK and them Motep.

While im here, can I get a reply to that unrelated PM Andres?

**Kagemusha** · 08-13-2008, 09:23

Originally Posted by Andres

Hmmmm...

The Jotun have to kill the lords, don't they?

So a Jotun taking the risk of exposing himself by pressing for the lynching of a Lord is a possibility.

Let's see, GeneralHankerchief wants us to lynch Lord A, but not Lord B. When Lord A dies, it becomes clear that GeneralHankerchief was wrong. If we therefore assume he is Jotun, we assume that Lord B is a fake and lynch him.

Could it be that GH is a Jotun with a masterplan, sacrifycing himself to take down two Lords?

I have a pretty decent Holmgang score. Do we really want Motep, a possible Lord, to fight GH? If not, I can challenge GH to narrow down the odds of Motep actually having to fight.

On the other hand, Motep's role pm looks far less genuine than the one Tratorix posted.

And in the worst case, we are losing our time by focusing on both GH and Motep...

Gah, gah, gah! Where's Kommodus when you need him?

Calm down good man.

The beaty of the plan is that if Motep is indeed a king, he wont fight GH himself, but his champion will take on GH, also proving simultaneosly that Motep is indeed a king. If no Champion will emerge, we can judge that Motep is a fake and lynch him if he kills GH.

**Craterus** · 08-13-2008, 09:28

That's not strictly true though, is it Kage?

The PM clearly states that Sigurd will PM Motep to ask if he wishes his champion to take his place. Now that he has revealed, what would be the point in hiding behind his champion?

**Gaius Scribonius Curio** · 08-13-2008, 09:31

Furthermore as far as I understand it, kings are stronger than champions, seen as he has been revealed. There would be little point in switching in.

**Kagemusha** · 08-13-2008, 09:35

Originally Posted by Craterus

That's not strictly true though, is it Kage?

The PM clearly states that Sigurd will PM Motep to ask if he wishes his champion to take his place. Now that he has revealed, what would be the point in hiding behind his champion?

Well the point being that otherwise we will hang him high the next day. On the other hand if he comes through ok.Thor knows who to protect. By using his champion he can clear himself in the eyes of the town.Dont you guys see the forest from the trees?

**Gaius Scribonius Curio** · 08-13-2008, 09:42

Its quite possible, indeed likely, that the Jotun will have targeted Motep tonight anyway, why would they not target him (unless he is Jotun), when he has revealed a PM, even at the risk it is fake? In other words Thor should protect Motep tonight anyway, just in case.

**Kagemusha** · 08-13-2008, 09:45

Originally Posted by Gaius Scribonius Curio

Its quite possible, indeed likely, that the Jotun will have targeted Motep tonight anyway, why would they not target him (unless he is Jotun), when he has revealed a PM, even at the risk it is fake? In other words Thor should protect Motep tonight anyway, just in case.

agreed.

**Sarathos** · 08-13-2008, 09:55

Originally Posted by GSC

Its quite possible, indeed likely, that the Jotun will have targeted Motep tonight anyway, why would they not target him (unless he is Jotun), when he has revealed a PM, even at the risk it is fake? In other words Thor should protect Motep tonight anyway, just in case.

But what if Motep's reveal is fake? Then you are protecting a Jotun with a God whilst giving them the freedom to kill, do know absurd that is....

**Andres** · 08-13-2008, 10:13

Originally Posted by Kagemusha

Calm down good man.

The beaty of the plan is that if Motep is indeed a king, he wont fight GH himself, but his champion will take on GH, also proving simultaneosly that Motep is indeed a king. If no Champion will emerge, we can judge that Motep is a fake and lynch him if he kills GH.

Well, it's still early in the game isn't it?

We already managed to lynch one King, do we really want to lose a second one in Holmgang?

His Champion will have to pm Sigurd to take his place. What if his champion isn't online? Also, what's the point in having the Champion reveal as well, since his King has already been exposed?

If we assume that GeneralHankerchief is a clever player and Jotun, than he has wonderfully manipulated us to take down two Kings + reveal another Champion + surviving himself.

Don't you think there's something fishy going on?

Tratorix' reveal mentioned a confirmed innocent as his champion. Why did GH insist on lynching Tratorix while we could have easily checked the validity of his claim? GH is more than clever enough to have realised that himself.

Why did GH vigorously defend Motep, who posted almost the exact same role pm, without mentioning the Champion, ergo no confirmed innocent to vouch for him?

The claim by Motep is most likely genuine as well, but it seemed far less genuine than Tratorix' claim, which could have been easily counterclaimed once TB got online, yet GH decided to go after Tratorix and to believe Motep.

Why was lynching Tratorix so urgent? You were all yelling for Sigurd to extend the round, while you could have easily waited for another turn before lynching Tratorix.

I'm pointing fingers at all those who were yelling "there's not enough time, please extend the round", while you could have easily argued: "unvote Motep and Tratorix, we can't risk to lynch a possible Lord this early in the game, so we'll wait for another round."

Anyway, GeneralHankerchief, imo used bad logic to lynch a Lord and to raise suspicion towards another King.

I have pretty high stats and I'm willing to test my luck against that Jotun scumbag who already gave me bad vibes in the previous round:

Challenge : GeneralHankerchief

**Craterus** · 08-13-2008, 10:18

Why is GH so eager to be in a Holmgang? Surely he's running the risk of being revealed as a Jotun by doing so?

No, it doesn't make sense to me.

**Andres** · 08-13-2008, 10:32

Originally Posted by Craterus

Why is GH so eager to be in a Holmgang? Surely he's running the risk of being revealed as a Jotun by doing so?

No, it doesn't make sense to me.

He won't be revealed as Jotun during the Holmgang. In Midgard I, all assumptions based on the write-ups of the Holmgang mislead the town.

Ignore Holmgang write-ups, they were misleading in Midgard I and I don't think Sigurd will make it easier for the town in this game.

Look at how I, a townie with a score of 2 easily defeated sapi, who was a King with a score of 5 or 6 in Midgard I. This was used against me and when I got lynched, I didn't go to valhalla and everybody assumed I was Jotun.

Use the Holmgang to try to kill suspects. Don't expect more from it.

**Craterus** · 08-13-2008, 10:38

Originally Posted by Andres

Use the Holmgang to try to kill suspects. Don't expect more from it.

I feel you may already be expecting too much.

If the Jotun have the best Holmgang ratings in the game, then what use is giving them the opportunity to (probably) kill you? Surely just helps them along?

Especially if they're not going to be revealed by it.

Where did pever reveal? Privately?

**Andres** · 08-13-2008, 10:43

Originally Posted by Craterus

I feel you may already be expecting too much.

If the Jotun have the best Holmgang ratings in the game, then what use is giving them the opportunity to (probably) kill you? Surely just helps them along?

Especially if they're not going to be revealed by it.

Where did pever reveal? Privately?

Ha!

What are the options?

a) wait until the Jotun kills me at night;
b) fight the Jotun with a high probability of dieing during the attempt, but with a real chance of actually killing one of them. If a peasant was able to kill a King in Midgard I, then surely I must now be able to kill a Jotun.

I prefer to die while trying to kill a Jotun like a real warrior, than dieing in my sleep!