New factions?

[Mithridates VI Eupator]

As a matter of fact, his son, Pharnakes, made a brief attempt to reestablish the Pontic kingdom, with some initial success, until he recieved a royal spanking by good ol' Julius Ceaesar, prompting him to utter the famous words "Veni, vidi, vici". But I guess that doesn't count...

[Oqlanth]

About 'Last King' I mean this:

http://www.michaelcurtisford.com/boo...#The_Last_King

For "Veni, vidi, vici" you are right, Ceaser said that after when he crushed traitorous son of Mithridates VI Eupator, Pharnaces II (he betrayed his father ) at countryside of Tokat' town Zile -Modern Turkey's city- (hehehe...If you some how can visit there you may understand what made Ceaser to say that :D )

And about Odrysai, there are great works on them especially by Bulgarian Thracologists... Unfortunately most of them are Bulgarian if you are interested take a look at them.

[paullus]

The Odrysai were not nearly significant enough in our time period to be worth including in-game. They were almost certainly subjugated to the Celts at Tylis in 272, and remained so until about 212, when they benefited most from the overthrow of Tylis. Only after 212 do we really find them engaging in much activity. So they're not good faction material. Tylis would be a better consideration, and the Scordisci or Galatian tribes would be a better faction than Tylis.

[Oqlanth]

As I said before I do not speak much about Odrysai till I finish my study but you are not right about their 'inactivity' between 272(Well truely they were crushed at 279) - 212 BE. For just little two examples:
If they were inactive how they manage to achive to rebuilt their kingdom.
if they were inactive how they fight for or against Seleucid Empire and Ptolemic Empire (i.e Siege of Thracian city Kypsela -nowaday İpsala at European penninsula of modern Turkey- against Seleucid Empire nowaday İpsala at European penninsula of modern Turkey)

Well my last opinion about Odrysai till this damm work (I can only make search brief time of a day) complete;
With Pleuratus Dynasty of Illyria Odrysains will be a good struggling factions in South Eastern Europe from 3rd century BC to 1 century BC and also will be good additions as seperate factions to EB II.

[Oqlanth]

Yes, they did reestabilsh themselves shortly after the Celtic invasion, that's what I meant. Didn't know they were as old as 5:th century, though.
I found a book in the library about the Odrysians some time ago, but didn't have time to read it thoroughly then. However, from what I gather, they were a rather warlike people, and an interesting Helleno-Thraikian mix, so though I still have my doubts, I guess they could be an Interesting faction.

Meanwhile I forgot to ask...what is the name of the book and who is it's author?

[Mithridates VI Eupator]

It was actually about thraikians in general, not only odrysians, but there seemed to be quite a lot of info in it. Though I', afraid I don't remember who wrote it, or its name. I think it was just called "Thrace" or "The Thracians", or something like that. I think its cover was red, if that can be any help. I can check it out some time when I go to the that library.
Sorry that I can't be of any more help...

[Oqlanth]

Ok...Thanks anyway :D

[Mithridates VI Eupator]

I checked out the library website today, and in a twist of irony, though I couldn't find the book I read first, I stumbled upon one called "The Odrysian Kingdom of Thrace", by one Z. H. Archibald. Don't know if it's any good, though.
Anyway, good luck with your research

[Oqlanth]

Thank you Bassileus Mithridates VI Eupator :D
I am going to check that book.

And thanks again ;)

Cihan

[Mithridates VI Eupator]

Glad I could help!

[Cyrus]

I was thinking maybe they could include another anatolian faction,like the kingdom of Paphlagonia to help pontus and the other "minor" factions get rid of the seleucids.Also a faction north of the gaeti would be nice to kinda limit sauromatae expansion in that area,something like another steppe faction.
Since i dont know much about that area i cant say what faction could be there......

[ziegenpeter]

Scythians I guess...

[Mithridates VI Eupator]

I was thinking maybe they could include another anatolian faction,like the kingdom of Paphlagonia to help pontus and the other "minor" factions get rid of the seleucids.Also a faction north of the gaeti would be nice to kinda limit sauromatae expansion in that area,something like another steppe faction.
Since i dont know much about that area i cant say what faction could be there......

They've already added Pergamon in that area, so there will be more minor factions there. If yet another were to be added, I think the kingdom of Bithynia or the kingdom of Cappadocia are better candidates, as their position would not be as locked as the Paphlagonians, and they were far more historically significant.

The Scythians are quite unlikely, they were in decline. The possabilities I see in that are are either the Bosphoran kingdom, or possably the Bastarnoz, however the bastarnoz were probably not that united, and not enough is known about them, to make them a likely candidate for a faction.

[Cyrus]

Yeah your probably right,paphlagonia would however be a very very difficult campaign right?
Plus what is the bosphoran kingdom? also i thought of another faction id like to see,the scandinavians.
i know they were just a bunch of little villages but they'd make an awesome campaign on very hard\very hard.I'd also like to see an other nomad faction.something like the schytians(yes i now they had already been whiped out by the sarmatians but something similar to them).

[General Appo]

[QUOTE=Cyrus;2044222] also i thought of another faction id like to see,the scandinavians.
i know they were just a bunch of little villages but they'd make an awesome campaign on very hard\very hard.[/QOUTE]

As a fellow scandinvian I can say that I would be horribly depressed if some sort of generic scandinavian faction was included.
Firstly, there is about no evidence what so ever of what was going on in scandinavia at the time.
Second, the little evidence there is all makes it very clear that there was nothing even resembling some sort of unity.
Third, there was just never even any half-assed attempts at any sorts of expansion in any way. Fourth, it wouldn´t be a good campaign at all. Getting a half-decent economy would take about 200 years, you would probably one have like 2 or 3 units, and you´ll be lucky if the Sweboz don´t wipe you out in the first couple of years.

[MeinPanzer]

Plus what is the bosphoran kingdom?

I'd think that the most likely candidate for inclusion in the northern Pontic littoral would definitely be the Bosporans. The Bosporan kingdom was basically a group of Greek cities in what is today the Crimea which were united under a king. They were a major force in the northern Black Sea from the Archaic period, and were still quite strong in the EB timeframe. The inhabitants were culturally mixed, and they possessed aspects of both Iranian steppe culture (such as costume and arms) and Greek culture (Greek language, gods, etc.). Dio Chrusostom writes about visiting a Greek city on the norther Black sea coast in the first century AD (Borysthenes, which was actually a city located by a Getic hinterland, but that's beside the point) and he comments on the peculiar mixture of these cultures he found there:

Well, as I was saying, I chanced to be strolling outside the city, and there came to meet me from within the walls some of the people of Borysthenes, as was their custom. Thereupon Callistratus at first came riding by us on horseback on his way from somewhere outside of town, but when he had gone a short distance beyond us, he dismounted, and, entrusting his horse to his attendant, he himself drew near in very proper fashion, having drawn his arm beneath his mantle. Suspended from his girdle he had a great cavalry sabre, and he was wearing trousers and all the rest of the Scythian costume, and from his shoulders there hung a small black cape of thin material, as is usual with the people of Borysthenes. In fact the rest of their apparel in general is regularly black, through the influence of a certain tribe of Scythians, the Blackcloaks, so named by the Greeks doubtless for that very reason.

...Knowing, then, that Callistratus was fond of Homer, I immediately began to question him about the poet. And practically all the people of Borysthenes also have cultivated an interest in Homer, possibly because of their still being a warlike people, although it may also be due to their regard for Achilles, for they honour him exceedingly, and they have actually established two temples for his worship, one on the island that bears his name and one in their city; and so they do not wish even to hear about any other poet than Homer. And although in general they no longer speak Greek distinctly, because they live in the midst of barbarians, still almost all at least know the Iliad by heart.

It's interesting to note the dichotomies presented here: a man who customarily rides a horse around the city, carries a sidearm, and wears garb like a nomad, but carries his cloak about himself as is good Greek custom and knows the Iliad by heart. The Bosporan kingdom is interesting for this reason - the military especially included, as you'd imagine, a mixture of steppe troops and also Greek troop types.

[keravnos]

MeinPanzer, thank you for that excerpt. About the Bosporikoi I would also add Thraikians and Celts (The Keltoskythai that Strabo speaks of) to that mix. Protoslavs also.

Bastarnae, deffinitely so, add them in, but I am not certain of their exact nationality, as they probably were a mix themselves. Germanic with some Celt admixture and armed "with a white thureos, romphaia or sica and two javelins".

Some reading for those inclined...

http://www.mlahanas.de/Greeks/LX/Sarmatians.html

[MeinPanzer]

MeinPanzer, thank you for that excerpt. About the Bosporikoi I would also add Thraikians and Celts (The Keltoskythai that Strabo speaks of) to that mix. Protoslavs also.

I'm skeptical about the Protoslavs (I've read many hypotheses about the genesis of the Slavic people, but I've not seen much solid evidence for where they can be placed in the EB timeframe), but you're absolutely right abou, after all, the Spartocids, who were directly related to the royal house of Thrace, and Celtic influence is quite evident in the archaeology of the northern Black Sea littoral as well.

Bastarnae, deffinitely so, add them in, but I am not certain of their exact nationality, as they probably were a mix themselves. Germanic with some Celt admixture and armed "with a white thureos, romphaia or sica and two javelins".

Some reading for those inclined...

http://www.mlahanas.de/Greeks/LX/Sarmatians.html

The problem with the Bastarnae is that so little is known about them and their societal structure, who they were, or even whether they were a unified front at all. Also, your description of armaments postdates the EB timeframe by at least a century and probably reflects the Bastarnae after extensive Dacian influence - keep in mind that they didn't even move into the northwestern Black Sea region until the late third century BC.

[Majd il-Romani]

I think either Basternae, Skythians, or Bosphorus oughta be in to balance out the sauros and to populate the NE map. People are pushing for cappadocia and aechean/aetolians but those areas have enough factions already

[General Appo]

I think either Basternae, Skythians, or Bosphorus oughta be in to balance out the sauros and to populate the NE map.

Why not all three?
Seriously, Boshporus I can almost bet will be. Bastarnae...I think the EB wants them in, the only question is if they can find enough info to actually make a half-decent representation of them.
Skythians in say Olbia...it´s a possibility, but I´m not sure.
One or two Numidian faction will be in, this I can almost guarantee. Numidia was after all this close to making it into EB1, so not having them now with 10 extra faction slots would just be wierd.

[Majd il-Romani]

yeah i'm almost certain that 1 or 2 Numidian factions will make it in, plus Bosporos, Belgae, and a Celtiberian Tribe

I am absolutley sure that Pergamon isn't gonna be in.

[General Appo]

Yeah, me too. That would be just like Foot.

[Majd il-Romani]

I mean where does everybody get this crazy notion that Pergoman is going to be included?

[Ibrahim]

I mean where does everybody get this crazy notion that Pergoman is going to be included?

there si a stele up there you know

[General Appo]

There is this thing called jesting you know. But I´m sure someone like Ibra would never have heard of it.

[Foot]

I think that the clown smiley at the end of his post suggests that Ibrahim has heard of it and was just joking on Majd's joke. Jenga joke's in fact.

Foot

[Cyrus]

Ok so jokes aside,would it be possible to have an other eastern faction.I dunno maybe the corasms(population more or less between baktria and pahlava)?or even a proto indian faction?maybe a small northern kingdom?

[Foytaz]

More than new factions I'd glad to see more diversity to already existed ones. Civic wars and revolts would be nice and exciting for gameplay. Big facions such as Seleucids, Ptolemaics should be threaten by such events quite often. Same standards should be applied to SPQR\Empire. What I like about EB is concern for the details and I hope next release will keep that way too.

[Ibrahim]

@Appo: I was kidding?

as for new factions in the east: why not elevate a client kingdom/satrapy the seleukids had into a faction? Baktria is already that way...

[Cyrus]

Yes that i think is a good idea.cicil wars however would require some stuff like non playable factions or something(and in the faq it says there will be no such thing) but im shure there can be a way to arrange it,maybe with a huge civil revolt of (like for caesar's civil war) all greece,and some italy settelments become rebel. just an idea of course.
ps foytaz if you dont mind answering where are u from?