Capo di Tutti Capi IV [Concluded]

[Riedquat]

Can we please have links to all day/night etc posts placed in the first post? Many players do not have the time to look for the updates which get lost in the arguments/discussion/spam

There is a separate thread with that info ;)

https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...Summary-Thread.

[shlin28]

Can we please have links to all day/night etc posts placed in the first post? Many players do not have the time to look for the updates which get lost in the arguments/discussion/spam

Just look a few threads down and you'll see this: https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...Summary-Thread. :)

[Krill]

It's more that I want to see what gets posted after the summary posts. Consider this as a method of bookmarking the change between days and nights.

[gibsonsg91921]

EDIT: I didn't see that you had been answered ;)

[The Stranger]

i have found a couple of ways to prove once and for all the subotan is lying about the date but im not sure wether they are allowed... ill keep u guys updated.

[TheLastDays]

This is the last time I am repeating myself. I removed one sentence, of my own, from that conversation, and I am happy to reveal it to any who requests me over pm. The Director already knows what that sentence is.

I'd like this confirmed by GH. Don't tell us the sentence, if it makes sense to keep it secret but I'd like to know if Subotan told you about the missing sentence and if it makes sense in the course of the PM discussion. Does it fit? Does it make sense that he doesn't want to reveal it?

Other than that the whole discussion is pure WIFOM. Why would Subotan ever do that if he was scum? Why would he risk so much attention to get a basic townie lynched? On the other hand, why would a third party role blindly message anyone with the question if they are their secret leader? At the moment I'm inclined to lynch both of you because it is almost impossibe to solve this riddle, there's evidence on both sides, nothing 100% proof.

Also, are you both in the same timezone? Someone has to check how that affects the discussion about the timing of the first PM and TS' alleged AoE3 Game.

[The Stranger]

ok heres my update.

ive found a way to prove that subotan is lying about the date of our conversation. for this i need someone the town trusts to pass a verdict, but not GH since subotan has been way to close with GH knowing who he was intending to lynch in a case of a tie between ACIN and Earthling, and since he would pick Earthling over ACIN according to subotan there might just be a risk that they are in the same league.

To this person I will email my proof (it has to be emailed tho rest assured its not a screenshot or something) and I will also explain my actions to that person. he can then pass the verdict on to the town and i wont put anymore energy into this.

[TheLastDays]

You can trust me

But even if not everyone trusts me, and, trust me ( ), you won't find anyone who has everyone's trust, I'd still like to see that evidence for myself.

[Montmorency]

Oh god, they're zombies.

If you have any opposition to successful attempts to create doctors, that makes you a scumbag.

For the love of neutrality!

Again, I am happy to share this if asked.

If you're willing to give it to anyone via PM, why not just post it here?

[Subotan]

you didnt make any sense and still do not make sense on that part.

Not if we hold your account to be true, of course not. That is the very proof that you are lying.

In fact, let's go further, as if we need to. By your account, you open the conversation saying:

Do you want to form some protection groups?

I later respond saying:

I'm thinking of us joining in a protection group for the next few nights, so we can get some alibis for later in the game.

Now, why would I say that, given what you say you said? It's a redundant memo from the Department of Redundancy. You've been sloppy in covering up your tracks, Stranger.

no the specifics are very relevant because you lie about the time and exactly the chronology is what the credibility of your story rests on and its clearly not valid.

Um, OK. Lets assume that I am the one is lying - what facts about the rest of my argument must be changed to reflect this?

...

None, as it happens. You acknowledge that there were PM conversations between us, your PMs are blatantly fraudulent, and you have not provided any evidence to refute my allegation that you are third party scum. Please point out where your word against mine about this silly time issue invalidates one or more of those three parts of my argument.

bs. prove that i sent it on the 12th.

Can't - just as you can't prove your version. In any case, it's irrelevant - see above.

and also show my role because clearly ACIN is stating he has info about my role which i messed up sending to seamus...

I am getting tired of repeating myself - I have already pointed out numerous times that ACIN made stuff up in order to prevent you from catching on that I had leaked your alignment to him.

he never needed to convince me because i wasnt talking to him?

It was in the main thread >_>

according to your story i only talked to you, you revealed to acin, acin then revealed in thread through cryptic message but never contacted me.

See above.

nor do you say that anywhere. the story you tell and the story acin is telling is conflicting.

Lol, no it doesn't. Why does it conflict?

i actually have. i have proven that you are lying about the date of me contacting you which is very fishy, because you and acin are trying to make me look to be something im not.

all you have are accusations. there is no real proof and there never will be because im not mafia nor 3rd party role.

Hey guys, can we add this to the glossary? " Very Fishy Tactics - An argument against a case with solid proof that denies the very existence of said proof"

EDIT:

ive found a way to prove that subotan is lying about the date of our conversation. for this i need someone the town trusts to pass a verdict, but not GH since subotan has been way to close with GH knowing who he was intending to lynch in a case of a tie between ACIN and Earthling, and since he would pick Earthling over ACIN according to subotan there might just be a risk that they are in the same league.

So basically, somebody who is the Director, but who isn't GH? How do we know the good townie who volunteers isn't just your third party don?

If you're willing to give it to anyone via PM, why not just post it here?

Because I don't want to.

[Zack]

There is just no way I can keep up with this thread. I give up on reading it.

[Xenoneb]

There is just no way I can keep up with this thread. I give up on reading it.

Just skip the text walls. They aren't very important. :)

[The Stranger]

Um, OK. Lets assume that I am the one is lying - what facts about the rest of my argument must be changed to reflect this?

...

None, as it happens. You acknowledge that there were PM conversations between us, your PMs are blatantly fraudulent, and you have not provided any evidence to refute my allegation that you are third party scum. Please point out where your word against mine about this silly time issue invalidates one or more of those three parts of my argument.

how about the entire part where you claim that you are the one who revealed to ACIN who then revealed in thread? which is another lie then, 2 in a row, which then leads to a 3rd because you are then obviously trying to cover for ACIN who tried to cover himself with another fake reveal.

It was in the main thread >_>

but it wasnt aimed at me... it was in general. how do you convince someone that doesnt know you are talking to him?

anyway, ive already informed one person. im going to email several more to insure that i get a fair trial. add me on msn if u want to be a candidate.

[Sasaki Kojiro]

how about the entire part where you claim that you are the one who revealed to ACIN who then revealed in thread? which is another lie then, 2 in a row, which then leads to a 3rd because you are then obviously trying to cover for ACIN who tried to cover himself with another fake reveal.

Ok, so why did they lie about it? I tend to believe you that they are lying, because you sound like mafia picking out the one false detail from an accusation and making a big fuss about it.

[Montmorency]

Nothing.

[The Stranger]

Ok, so why did they lie about it? I tend to believe you that they are lying, because you sound like mafia picking out the one false detail from an accusation and making a big fuss about it.

well its not a detail... if subo is lying about the dates which he is and if im right then i didnt contact him untill yesterday.

which means that ACIN made a reveal about a role on the 14t. Later on the 16th in a 2nd reveal ACIN says he has lied about the first reveal but he is now coming forward with the real one.

but according to subos story it was subo who told ACIN of my role and then ACIN made up the reveal. however if me and subo hadnt talked to ACIN prior to his reveal then obviously ACINs reveal is fake or regarding someone else. either way they are lying about me.

[Cahoma]

I've read everything and I'm still confused... Can someone make a summery or something?

[SisterCoyote]

Nevermind. I post slow.

[Cahoma]

I was thinking someone could explain all this drama with Subotan and The Stranger.

[Subotan]

but it wasnt aimed at me... it was in general. how do you convince someone that doesnt know you are talking to him?

ACIN considered you bright enough to recognise he would be talking about you if he had revealed someone with the exact information that you had leaked to me.

anyway, ive already informed one person. im going to email several more to insure that i get a fair trial. add me on msn if u want to be a candidate.

Fair trials are conducted in public, FYI.

well its not a detail... if subo is lying about the dates which he is and if im right then i didnt contact him untill yesterday.

which means that ACIN made a reveal about a role on the 14t. Later on the 16th in a 2nd reveal ACIN says he has lied about the first reveal but he is now coming forward with the real one.


but according to subos story it was subo who told ACIN of my role and then ACIN made up the reveal. however if me and subo hadnt talked to ACIN prior to his reveal then obviously ACINs reveal is fake or regarding someone else. either way they are lying about me.
.

Let's rephrase that end sentence to reflect reality:

but according to subos story it was subo who told ACIN of my role and then ACIN made up the reveal. however if me and subo hadnt talked to ACIN prior to his reveal then obviously ACINs reveal is fake or regarding someone else either way this says nothing about whether The Stranger is scum or not

I was thinking someone could explain all this drama with Subotan and The Stranger.

Stranger contacted me asking if I was his "hub" he was supposed to contact. I led him on for a bit, then tried to blackmail him to get more info about him and his faction out of him. Stranger says he just contacted me asking to joina vig group; this has been proven to be false by the fact that I would not try to blackmail him if he had done so as he would not have revealed any dirt.

[thefluffyone93]

Just skip the text walls. They aren't very important. :)

Giant obnoxious pictures, on the other hand, are extremely important, and should never be skipped.

[GamezRule]

Giant obnoxious pictures, on the other hand, are extremely important, and should never be skipped.

For the love of monkey, could you please stop posting memes?

[Xenoneb]

To true, Fluffy.

[Xenoneb]

Deleted

[Riedquat]

I was thinking someone could explain all this drama with Subotan and The Stranger.

And... not forget ACIN!

ACIN comes day 1 and says a mafioso revealed accidentally to him via pm...
Sometime in day 2 The Stanger contact Subotan asking for doing some action at night (if you believe Subotan, The stanger slips some info compromising him as a third party mafioso)
Sometime in same day 2 Subotan say it to ACIN
Sometime in same day 2 ACIN uses his time machine and goes back on time to day 1 and invent the thing about the pm...

Now they are discussing how that was possible and if it was possible... bleh!

[Sasaki Kojiro]

So, ACIN made up the story about the mafioso contacting him (my initial impression) just for fun.

Later, The stranger contacts Subotan asking about the hub.

Subotan tells ACIN about it.

ACIN comes under heavy pressure, and decides to act like his story was real all along by saying it was the stranger. Subotan goes along because they are buds.

Thus our current scenario where the stranger is clearly scum of some kind but knows that subotan is lying about part of the story and trying to exploit that.

[The Stranger]

So, ACIN made up the story about the mafioso contacting him (my initial impression) just for fun.

Later, The stranger contacts Subotan asking about the hub.

Subotan tells ACIN about it.

ACIN comes under heavy pressure, and decides to act like his story was real all along by saying it was the stranger. Subotan goes along because they are buds.

Thus our current scenario where the stranger is clearly scum of some kind but knows that subotan is lying about part of the story and trying to exploit that.

so wait. let me get this right: ACIN can make stuff up for fun and later use it in some scummy attempt to save himself from getting lynched

but TS cant pm someone for fun and when he later gets sandwiched by some scum, ofcourse only for fun, he is scum even tho the ppl that accuse him are clearly lying and hiding stuff?

really sound reasoning.

[The Stranger]

Ok anyway here is the truth. I can prove the dates of our conversation and that it was on the 15th and not the 12th like Subo says, and also that the importance of this is much more significant than Sasaki makes it look like. However i have to wait for seamus his confirmation to prove the dates. its not important however for the rest of the story so here it goes.

this is the true version of our pms including the bit subo left out which i bolded.

Are you the hub I'm supposed to link up with?

Yeaup, and you're not the first to link up with me. Did you pick up on the SSV code in some of my posts?

I've already had some ideas about longer term strategy, but I'm not sure what to do tonight. Thoughts?

I'm rather clueless and I thought that you would provide me with orders and also brief me about our current situation.

Oh of course, I just wanted to see how much you already knew. What do you want to know about?

I'm thinking of us joining in a protection group for the next few nights, so we can get some alibis for later in the game.

Is there a way that we could speak more directly? Through skype or msn?

I knew only to look out for certain keywords, but for example I don't know our numbers or other names. You are the first I've contacted. I don't want to know more than I need to actually.

Alright, that's enough information to get you lynched.

Start talking. What is your role? What does CDTC mean? What is this "hub"? What are these code words? What are these numbers/other names?

I'm not going to spill the beans on you - there is absolutely no incentive for me to do so. I am however going to blackmail you. If you don't answer my questions and keep me informed as to the developments of your faction, then I will of course reveal you to be a scum of whatever kind.

Oh, and one last thing - if you try to kill me, I guarantee that you will be lynched the following day. This is not an idle threat or a bluff, and you will treat as such at your peril.

Explanation of my actions

I've PM'd Subotan randomly, that is to say, I knew what I was going to PM but I PM'd it randomly to Subotan. I don't know why I picked him, it was an impulsive act. I PM'd what I PM'd because I was bored and didn't have any contacts. I've done this many times during most mafia games I played, I do stuff like this when the game is moving to slow for me.

My PM was intended as a prope to see if I'd get any type of response, and yes, I did. Subotan responded to me about some code. Eager but also naively and at the same time, oddly weary, I replied back to Subotan's code. I didn't directly refer to it as so that the code might not be pinned on me, in case he might want to do what he's doing now.

I didn't post anything about this until now that I realized that SSV might be a symbol for the USA and have something to do with the Commies groups. The SSV being a symbol for the States, I searched the thread and found 2 more instances of him referring to this code.

When he threatened me I didn't think he was going to do anything serious so I insisted on talking to him on skype to see how he would react. But it turned out to be a boring conversation and pretty fruitless.

I think I do have hit on scum here now that ACIN has been trying to use my stupid probe born out of boredom to cover for his even more stupid but in retrospect lucky reveal about some mafia role. The way they jumped on this to save ACIN from getting lynched is just too scummy. And also he didn't want to say anything about the code in public.

I lied about the PM's because I did make a stupid move but since Subotan tampered with them I thought i could just do the same. I shouldn't have done that, and for that I'm sincerely sorry.

So then we come to the part where we count the lies.

TS: 1 lie (about the PM's)
ACIN: 2 lies (he made 2 fake reveals)
Subotan: 2 lies (he lied about the date of our PM's and he lied about the content of our PM's)

[ While emotions may be running high, you still need to mind your language, TS - Sec ]

[Xenoneb]

That's according to you. This is what we know for sure
TS: 1 lie (about the PM's)
ACIN: 1 lies (he made a fake reveals)
Subotan: 0 lies

[The Stranger]

no subotan lied took stuff out of the pm. and hes obviously lying about the date. my alibi of aoe3 should cover that but since he claims i can alt tab, which i cant but cant prove either im waiting for seamus to aprove of my method. if he doesnt i forfeit this game anyway because he leaves me no way to prove my innocence.