Does a corporation have 1st Amendment religious rights?

[Montmorency]

Just a tollbooth.

That would severely exacerbate traffic, I bet. A tollbooth at every exit onto a highway?

If you'll have PAYG, it just makes a lot more sense to turn the automobile into a super-surveillance device that the government has total control (at its discretion) over, so that whatever fees or tolls are assigned can be deducted automatically.

Any way you look at it, it's either a phenomenal increase in either bureaucracy or surveillance - likely both.

[Papewaio]

Tollbooths are expensive to operate. Sydney has plenty and the most expensive toll road per meter.

How would you use them on every street? Not all streets even have traffic lights.

[rvg]

That would severely exacerbate traffic, I bet. A tollbooth at every exit onto a highway?

Chicago tollways work quite well. The booths are on the expressway itself, not at the ramps.

If you'll have PAYG, it just makes a lot more sense to turn the automobile into a super-surveillance device that the government has total control (at its discretion) over, so that whatever fees or tolls are assigned can be deducted automatically. Any way you look at it, it's either a phenomenal increase in either bureaucracy or surveillance - likely both.

There's absolutely no reason to needlessly complicate this process when a simple tollbooth solves the problem.

Tollbooths are expensive to operate. Sydney has plenty and the most expensive toll road per meter.
How would you use them on every street? Not all streets even have traffic lights.

Urban driving permit. Purchased from the company that would maintain the city roads. Simple.

[Montmorency]

Chicago tollways work quite well. The booths are on the expressway itself, not at the ramps.

Toll roads are a very small minority of the roads in the country. We're talking about every inch of the numbered highways being covered, as well as all other marked roads.

Urban driving permit. Purchased from the company that would maintain the city roads. Simple.

So someone who drives five miles a week to the nearest Costco pays as much as, say, a taxicab?

[rvg]

Toll roads are a very small minority of the roads in the country. We're talking about every inch of the numbered highways being covered, as well as all other marked roads.

Not every inch. Unprofitable roads will be abandoned, fall into disrepair and ultimately vanish.

So someone who drives five miles a week to the nearest Costco pays as much as, say, a taxicab?

Or a taxicab pays as much as someone who drives five miles a week to the nearest Costco. Whatever ends up being more feasible. Walking and breathing will remain free of charge.

[Montmorency]

Not every inch. Unprofitable roads will be abandoned, fall into disrepair and ultimately vanish.

Unprofitable because they're not hooked into the system because the system is too expensive and bulky to proliferate? Anyway, the state itself needs all of these roads, so they would never just let a highway vanish into wilderness. Also, what the actual ?

Or a taxicab pays as much as someone who drives five miles a week to the nearest Costco. Whatever ends up being more feasible.

You think people would vote for that nonsense? I thought the point of this exercise was to link actual usage with payment: "Pay as you go". If the object is to everything for no discernible advantage, well, just go ahead and run for office I suppose. You'll have company.

[rvg]

Unprofitable because they're not hooked into the system because the system is too expensive and bulky to proliferate? Anyway, the state itself needs all of these roads, so they would never just let a highway vanish into wilderness. Also, what the actual ?

What state? I specifically stipulated the point about nation states being replaced by corporations.

You think people would vote for that nonsense? I thought the point of this exercise was to link actual usage with payment: "Pay as you go". If the object is to everything for no discernible advantage, well, just go ahead and run for office I suppose. You'll have company.

In a world run by corporations people don't get to vote.

[Montmorency]

Now, I'm not advocating that system, but it's definitely feasible, and in a few decades/centuries when the nation-states vanish and get replaced by corporations

Oh, I see. You meant that seriously? Without the state, there can not be corporations. In fact, without the state you've basically got only localized barter within kinship groups and maybe one yearly caravan to the valley over the mountain.

[rvg]

Oh, I see. You meant that seriously? Without the state, there can not be corporations. In fact, without the state you've basically got only localized barter within kinship groups and maybe one yearly caravan to the valley over the mountain.

It's hard to predict what will happen. My scenario is just one of a myriad of scenarios that can happen. It doesn't mean that I endorse it, it merely means that I acknowledge the possibility.

[Lemur]

It doesn't mean that I endorse it, it merely means that I acknowledge the possibility.

I don't think you would much like living in the world you ... acknowledge.

[rvg]

I don't think you would much like living in the world you ... acknowledge.

That very well may be, but that's irrelevant as far as this discussion is concerned.

[drone]

In a world run by corporations people don't get to vote.

They do if they own shares.

Can a corporation be saved? Does it have a soul?

[rvg]

Can a corporation be saved? Does it have a soul?

Don't know, don't care. I don't have a horse in that race.

[a completely inoffensive name]

Pay as you go is in the exactly the same boat as implementing a flat-tax. It's an option that seems to be a good idea because it has not been widely done on the level people are advocating. But if you take 10 minutes to look at the math and logistics of it all, it is evident that it is a failure from the word go.

I actually had a conversation about flat taxes with someone, and I pointed out the overwhelming problems with it that would ensure it's failure. The only real reply I got back consisted of "Let's just try it out and see." Very odd to treat an economy with the same attitude as you would your appetite in a new restaurant.

[drone]

Don't know, don't care. I don't have a horse in that race.

But it seems a little pointless discussing corporate freedom of religion if corporations are incapable of being spiritually affiliated.

We have an decent pay-as-you-go system for roads already in place, it's called the gasoline tax. Apart from hybrids and electrics, it's a fairly accurate method of taxing road wear.

[a completely inoffensive name]

We have an decent pay-as-you-go system for roads already in place, it's called the gasoline tax. Apart from hybrids and electrics, it's a fairly accurate method of taxing road wear.

From the condition of the roads I drive on, it doesn't seem like that gasoline tax is going back into the infrastructure.

[Brenus]

"In a world run by corporations people don't get to vote" Did you read Robert Heinlein? I think it is "Friday". The book describes a world like this, where corporations kill and rule the World. Good book, one of my favourite Heinlein.

[rvg]

But it seems a little pointless discussing corporate freedom of religion if corporations are incapable of being spiritually affiliated.

Not really, considering that we can't prove that even humans have souls. That doesn't prevent humans from being religious/spiritual/whatever.

Did you read Robert Heinlein? I think it is "Friday". The book describes a world like this, where corporations kill and rule the World. Good book, one of my favourite Heinlein.

Haven't read him, but he sounds like the kind of author I might enjoy reading.

[drone]

From the condition of the roads I drive on, it doesn't seem like that gasoline tax is going back into the infrastructure.

You live in Cali, so this surprises me not one bit.

Road wear is a 4th power function of axle weight, an axle supporting 2X pounds damages the road 16 times as much as an axle supporting X pounds. Heavier vehicle use more gas per mile, and therefore pay more tax. It's not a perfect solution, but it's pretty fair. Where the state government decides to apply the money is another matter entirely.

Not really, considering that we can't prove that even humans have souls. That doesn't prevent humans from being religious/spiritual/whatever.

Humans may or may not have souls, we don't know for sure. Corporations are government created entities, I would love to hear arguments about humans creating souls through paperwork.

[rvg]

Humans may or may not have souls, we don't know for sure...

Exactly, so as far as the law is concerned there's no such thing as a soul, not in humans, not in corporations, not in anything. It's irrelevant for the legal purposes.

[Beskar]

Haven't read him, but he sounds like the kind of author I might enjoy reading.

Read 'Jennifer Government' too, that is about a world made up of corporate cartels running everything, a republican libertarian wet dream with government vastly underfunded and basically non-existing.