Ukraine Thread

[Gilrandir]

I recommend that you read the material provided for you. Your English is excellent, so I know you can read it.

I would like to add that, as always, everything is England and France's fault.

Here is a more scholarly report detailing military outputs before and during the war:

http://www2.warwick.ac.uk/fac/soc/ec...8postprint.pdf

Here is a book: https://books.google.com/books?id=NH...Banner&f=false

Check the first four or five pages of "4. The Shock of Surprise Attack". Basically, it states that Stalin was aware of the attack, but misjudged the timing badly.

Thank you for the sources. I cursorily looked them through, yet I didn't find anything new that I hadn't known before. Indeed I studied it all at school and university. And I don't see how it gainsays my view that Stalin and Hitler started WWII by partitioning Poland and that until June 1941 they stayed in close cooperation. I heard (don't know if this information is well grounded) that Britain contemplated bombing Baku oil extraction and refinery facilities to prevent gasoline suppies from the USSR to Germany.
http://orientalreview.org/2010/04/22...o-attack-ussr/
And I know that the USSR kept sending wheat to Germany up to June 1941.
The fact that Stalin didn't expect the assault on June 22 and didn't believe any reports confirming that was bored into the conciousness of all Soviet schollchildren.
Don't see why is it all qualified as revisionism. I was trying to show that myths and facts don't coincide. One of such myths is that any fighting side during WWII was allied either with Germany or with the Western allies and/or the USSR. There were numerous armies fighting against both. Another myth is that Russia could have won the war without any help - either from the West or from other Soviet republics. The third one is that all Russians fought against nazis, while other nations (Ukrainians, Tatars, Chechens) had a significant percentage of traitors. This myth chooses to disregard the existence of Vlasov's army (numbering from a million to 1,5 million). So every nation had traitors or those stigmatized as traitors. Perhaps others are aware of Chrlemagne SS division (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/33rd_Wa...81st_French%29).
So the bottomline I tried to make:
it is time to stop arguing who was more traitor/collaborator than others and reconcile.

I would like to add that, as always, everything is England and France's fault.

You mean "Why die for Danzig" attitude?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Why_Die_for_Danzig%3F
I hope I didn't link to any revisionist site.