Statements like this before roles are sent, are, IME, town. After roles sent out; Scummy.
[Apologies if the coding doesn't work out]
@: Champ Day 1 (most, but not all posts, plus some interactions to give context)
What's most telling to me is that he says there is no substance to Khaan, yet has no substance himself. Votes for Manasi with what, at first glance, appears to be his second largest post of the game, after his opening post.
I will post more as my time is available.
Aliases Yakostovian
OK, I tried a mention of Novice, and it didn't work. What did I do wrong?
Aliases Yakostovian
I believe Champ went over this already, with Choxorn (?). Champ was saying that there was no substance to Khaan when arguing that the Khaan votes were stupid. There's no hypocricy here - even if we stipulate that Champ had no substance himself. So I'm not sure what the point is, what is this "telling" you?
From your previous statement that ISO'ing Champ made him look worse, I thought you had already ISO'ed him? Give us your cliff notes.
Let me ISO Champ to get a bead on him, brb.
"I'm going to die anyway, and therefore have nothing more to do except deliberately annoy Lemur." -Orb, in the chat
"Lemur. Even if he's innocent, he's a pain; so kill him." -Ignoramus
"I'm going to need to collect all of the rants about the guilty lemur, and put them in a pretty box with ponies and pink bows. Then I'm going to sprinkle sparkly magic dust on the box, and kiss it." -Lemur
Mafia: Promoting peace and love since June 2006
That's a derp. I was thinking everyone is town before roles are sent out.
What is tells me is that it is an easy way to clear himself because he appears similar to someone that he knows is going to flip town.
I had ISO'd Champ already. I shared his day 1 posts to give you examples of what looks bad to me. And the rest of his posts for follow-on days are just as bad.
I won't have time to post anything of substance today. I'll lurk as time is available. If you want to convince me to move my vote, that is probably the only thing I will be able to accomplish today with the free time I have before EOD.
Aliases Yakostovian
Okay, read it. I'll put my conclusions under spoiler so hopefully Logic won't piggyback.
Spoiler Alert, click show to read:
"I'm going to die anyway, and therefore have nothing more to do except deliberately annoy Lemur." -Orb, in the chat
"Lemur. Even if he's innocent, he's a pain; so kill him." -Ignoramus
"I'm going to need to collect all of the rants about the guilty lemur, and put them in a pretty box with ponies and pink bows. Then I'm going to sprinkle sparkly magic dust on the box, and kiss it." -Lemur
Mafia: Promoting peace and love since June 2006
Here's what I wrote earlier but didn't post:
Spoiler Alert, click show to read:
I don't like that novice, Logic, and I have come to three completely different conclusions after reading the same ISO.
"I'm going to die anyway, and therefore have nothing more to do except deliberately annoy Lemur." -Orb, in the chat
"Lemur. Even if he's innocent, he's a pain; so kill him." -Ignoramus
"I'm going to need to collect all of the rants about the guilty lemur, and put them in a pretty box with ponies and pink bows. Then I'm going to sprinkle sparkly magic dust on the box, and kiss it." -Lemur
Mafia: Promoting peace and love since June 2006
I agree that a declining level of contribution is in general a scumtell, but I'm not sure about the "town taking a beating" connection. Couldn't townies lose heart and stop participating? Or feel that they've lost control and simply stick with tunneling their main suspect?
I am becoming convinced that it must be 2 of novice, GH, Logic, Manasi.
Breadth and superficiality.
No original cases, no commitment to pushes, just light questioning and the appearance of engagement. It's not that this is anti-town per se, but that it specifically figures in what I know of his scum play.
I have finally begun to reread Confections.
All his best moments were in fact piggybacked off Zack's activity. Nothing has reallychanged from D2, when I suspected him.
GH and novice can't be partners, because Csargo, GH, and novice voted Khaan D1, and there was no need to all pile on a single wagon as a team.
There's a question of a GH-Logic pairing. On D2 (Raith lynch), he spent much time on Choxorn wagon with novice and Barto (and Csargo), but jumped to Raith at the end, where Logic and Manasi were. GH-Barto has always been a plausible team, and Logic-GH could be too, but on D4, Viper vs Barto, GH was solid on Viper with Logic, Barto, and Manasi (and Csargo). Novice was of course on Barto wagon at the time. Assuming Barto was scum, GH-Barto follows most naturally, but Barto-Manasi, Barto-Logic, GH-Manasi, and GH-Logic are all possible.
As always, Champ is a wildcard.
And to answer Zack's question of why Csargo decided to vote auto instead of me D3: spread town wagons = spread scum votes, ideally. Novice was already voting me at the time, and having Csargo-novice partners securing my lynch wasn't worth the connection between the two when it didn't really matter who got lynched between lynchbait auto and fall guy Monty.
So it has to be novice or Barto for lynch today. Barto scum clears novice (and Jabbz). Novice scum clears GH and boosts Jabbz.
WE MUST CHOOSE
Vitiate Man.
History repeats the old conceits
The glib replies, the same defeats
Spoiler Alert, click show to read:
Well as for you and I our approaches differ, but we both come out pretty null on him it seems?
I mean for me I don't like Champ from a macro perspective, but when I ISO'ed him I doubted his being scum. Whereas Logic says that ISO'ing him makes him look worse, which was what raised my eyebrows in the first place.
In general Logic seems to be on a different page from the rest of us, having me as his second suspect and focusing on his own things. I agree with Monty in that from my perspective it's frankly a bit underwhelming. Maybe his process doesn't work with this game pace.
"I'm going to die anyway, and therefore have nothing more to do except deliberately annoy Lemur." -Orb, in the chat
"Lemur. Even if he's innocent, he's a pain; so kill him." -Ignoramus
"I'm going to need to collect all of the rants about the guilty lemur, and put them in a pretty box with ponies and pink bows. Then I'm going to sprinkle sparkly magic dust on the box, and kiss it." -Lemur
Mafia: Promoting peace and love since June 2006
In what world do Mafia kill BSmith N3 instead of novice?
You two are the top suspects, flipping you puts other pieces into place, and you are relatively-unlikely to be partnered.
I am not lynching Jabbz, and confound-posters Manasi and Champ can wait.
Vitiate Man.
History repeats the old conceits
The glib replies, the same defeats
Spoiler Alert, click show to read:
I have no idea, but "paranoia" had better not be more than a supplementary part of your case here.
I was one of the first to suspect novice back on D1, but he's fine now. He's had a strong tone and no agenda in his posts other than a desire to solve. The lack of pushing, etc, doesn't really work as an excuse here, because we've only had one person flip scum and that was handed to us on a silver platter.
You say you've started to reread Tokens - pull quotes. It's way too late in the game for us to being around with this.
And why is Jabbz off the table for you?
"I'm going to die anyway, and therefore have nothing more to do except deliberately annoy Lemur." -Orb, in the chat
"Lemur. Even if he's innocent, he's a pain; so kill him." -Ignoramus
"I'm going to need to collect all of the rants about the guilty lemur, and put them in a pretty box with ponies and pink bows. Then I'm going to sprinkle sparkly magic dust on the box, and kiss it." -Lemur
Mafia: Promoting peace and love since June 2006
You've got it the other way around - pushing is how you flip scum, you don't just wait for scum "on a silver platter" to begin pushing.
Pulling quotes from another game isn't useful since it's a pattern, not a smoking gun. More productive showing how the pattern applies in this game.
Jabbz has behaved like a standard townie, and he does not fit in well for Mafioso scenarios. The game only begins to make sense once you are prepared to factor in novice as scum.
Vitiate Man.
History repeats the old conceits
The glib replies, the same defeats
Spoiler Alert, click show to read:
Novice re GH: 'He had a scummy response to Zack's block-baiting D5'.
Pocket-work? Novice's reaction of 'huh ho I totes get it vote csargo' falls in the same category.
Of the people who responded to me frustrations about Zack's tactic - GH, novice, Logic - GH and novice stood by having immediately recognized it for what it was, while Logic claimed it went over his head.
But the fact that you impressed upon us immediate recognition was the essence of Zack's genius: scum would be expecting that exact reveal, and so would present both sensitized and unmoved.
And Zack blocked someone last night, I'm sure. He didn't reveal it so he could have a chance at stopping his own kill. He failed of course, probably blocking Jabbz or Manasi. Meanwhile: novice kills unopposed!!
Vitiate Man.
History repeats the old conceits
The glib replies, the same defeats
Spoiler Alert, click show to read:
Monty, I'm not scum.
If I were scum, there's no way Csargo would be doing the kills.
Hi friends.
Just finished my first day of real people work.
Eeeeee.
WHAT'D I MISS
*catch up time*
Monty I'm about to leave work, not sure if I'll be back in time for EOD, but your case on novice is bad and it is a very bad idea to lynch him today.
"I'm going to die anyway, and therefore have nothing more to do except deliberately annoy Lemur." -Orb, in the chat
"Lemur. Even if he's innocent, he's a pain; so kill him." -Ignoramus
"I'm going to need to collect all of the rants about the guilty lemur, and put them in a pretty box with ponies and pink bows. Then I'm going to sprinkle sparkly magic dust on the box, and kiss it." -Lemur
Mafia: Promoting peace and love since June 2006
wtf monty thinks novice is scum
ok
no
but ok
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