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  1. #25
    Coffee farmer extraordinaire Member spmetla's Avatar
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    Default Re: 17 More Dead Kids

    Quote Originally Posted by Seamus Fermanagh View Post
    Such weapons have been available for the last 50-60 years. But only in the last 30 or so do we see these kinds of events becoming comparatively frequent.

    Why now and not in the turbulent 60s? Why is 2001-2018 so much more rife with such events than was 1972 - 1990? Even if I grant that semi-automatic weapons are more accessible now than a century ago, it still does not address why it is more common now than it was in the 1980s? Your position on gun control cannot be the sole answer (setting aside the Constitutional issues currently under debate). There is more to it than that.
    They've been available but not in the same quantity. If you went back in time to the average gun shop in the 50s and 60s they'd be stocking primarily hunting rifles and shotguns because that was the market. People didn't buy military weapons for hunting and there wasn't this cult following for military weapons that buy them for home defense or to resist the government. ARs and other mid caliber semi autos are actually far more dangerous for home defense than pistols or shotguns because such fast yet light bullets pierce walls more easily.
    People buy a lot of AR-15s now just because it's a fad rifle with lots of accessories, there's really zero purpose to owning them. I understand the appeal for collectors and sports shooters but there are too many that truly 'love' the AR15. The vietnam era M16A1s were such crap that even former servicemen didn't like them due to unreliability, poor ammo, and that it craps carbon all over the bolt with each shot. From a gun lovers point of view the rise of popularity of the AR15 as opposed to far better and more reliable assault rifles is unusual and probably tied more to the being seen on TV in the hands of American Servicemen fighting the GWOT. Some people are stocking up for the fight against the islamist hordes that they think are coming.

    These guns have been available for decades but not available in every gun store as it is now. The gun-lobby campaigns that the M4/AR-15 variants are the modern day equivalent to the musket don't help dispel the cultish love for the ARs.
    As for the gun regulation aspect. If these kids had access to shotguns, hunting rifles, and pistols instead they'd still be able to inflict plenty of damage and carnage but just because these are less capable weapons there would be far fewer wounded and dead. Rapid fire, low recoil, weapons with large magazine capacity and quick reload just make it very very easy for anyone to cause a lot of carnage. SMGs, pistols, and manual action rifles/shotguns are just no where near as capable of shooting a lot of people in short order.

    As for why now and not the turbulent 60s? Well there were plenty of assassinations, lynchings, and wars going on for people to 'partake in'. Every racist that just wanted to fight blacks or communists could go to Africa and join one of many European led mercenary groups. Every militant anarchist could do the same in africa or in latin America. Our mass murderers and psychopaths had an outlet in an 'acceptable' environment.

    One thing that might help is if we stop just calling these school shootings and consider them acts of terrorism. If Timothy McVeigh has used an assault rifle instead of a bomb would he be less of a terrorist? I know that typically you need political motives for it to be terrorism but isn't just instilling fear and terror into teachers, students, and parents terrorism? I do know on the racial/religious side that if these shooters doing it were muslim we'd all label it terrorism. Being labeled a terrorist over a school shooter might not seem like much but it might help.

    Back to the 'joiner' issue, it's also part of our lack of any real sense of community. I'm not a christian man but I see the value that was to be had in everyone going to church or some sort of event every week in the way it built a sense of community. Do people really engage like that anymore? Company picnics and sporting events are uncommon for getting to know your colleagues out of work. Teachers generally don't engage parents and students outside of work or extracurricular activities. Everything has become far more insular. Go to school or work, do your tasks, then go home and either hang out with friends or binge on social media. People feel less and less inclined to talk about their problems in general to folks that are not immediate family.
    Last edited by spmetla; 02-22-2018 at 21:37.

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